Sixus1 announced on the Runtime DNA forums today that the HumanZ figures are almost ready to go and they would be posting pictures soon.  I've been eagerly awaiting these and can't wait.

While I like Les immensely, I don't care for his figures. Just a personal preference...lol. I can't get excited ;). But I hope I'm proved wrong :). For some applications, a Sixus figure is just the thing.

Laurie

I love the sixus figures.

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I'm not too into their monsters, but I really like Behemoth and Behemoth 2, and what I've seen of the male figure he will have a lot of characteristics I love in a heroic male figure.   The preview I saw showed him with body hair and a beard--if that's the default look I'm loving it already--and he's anatomically endowed--no shelling out extra cash for a willie.

I use Behemoth 2 for a character in my current comics.

3D Digital Comics & Art/My homepage
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Maybe it's a guy thing...hehe.

Laurie

I am hoping these new figures will be more human looking.  I'm quite excited to see.

Love esther

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Also did you see that michelle by Tait is also well on the way!

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Quote - Also did you see that michelle by Tait is also well on the way!

Link, please :)

Attached Link: http://forum.runtimedna.com/showthread.php?31983-What-s-everyone-been-working-on&p=680571#post680571

here you go.

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Female looks cute, she needs immediately an iris smaller morph lol

Any pics of the male figure?

I'm also curious to see a wireframe of the mesh, previous Sixus1 figures were quite heavy and that was the only reason I've never used them much...

My FreeStuff

Yeah, heavy and wrong Poly distribution.
That is why I never used them either.
Hope these are lighter and have better poly distribution.
Can not wait to see a wireframe. (as for any figure BTW)

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

The woman is cute, she has big expressive eyes.  I think these people are more stylized looking rather than being the type of things you'd use in the "realistic" render portraits.  I'm okay with stylized characters.  The original Freak was my favorite male model for a long time (although I loathed the unscalable hands and feet).

Cool. Aside from the eyes, the Sixus female looks like it could be used in a more "realistic" context.

The Michelle figure definitely does...

Both look very interesting - thanks for the heads up Tomsde

"  The original Freak was my favorite male model for a long time (although I loathed the unscalable hands and feet)."  me too!!

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I don't have The Freak, in any incarnation... but seeing this render by photobear77 made me want to get it...

wow, that is supurb!  which freak did he use and how did he do the clothes I wonder.

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From the gallery notes... he's used Freak 4 and Marvelous Designer 2.

wow, what a shame people aren't allowed to sell the clothes they make.

Love esther

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Quote - wow, what a shame people aren't allowed to sell the clothes they make.

Love esther

Can they not be sold (or given away) via the MD web store, if you only have the personal license? Think that's what I'd understood reading the license...

...not much for actual sale in that store currently though certainly...?

do you think he started from scratch or did he somehow modify some other clothes he already had to make the shirt?

Love esther

PS the shirt is truly marvellous I must say.  Hard to get clothes to fit that sort of body habitus and look good like that.

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No idea! I guess I would just go trying to use the cloth room for something like this... and most probably fail to get anything near as good :crying:

It could be done by converting a regular shirt to dynamic cloth.  I have a lot of uniforms, but I kind of doubt the Wardrobe Wizard would be able to do that much conversion without some serious distortions.

The Freak 4 does not have the hand/feet issues that the original model had.  I bought the Freak 3 shape for Genesis, with the Genesis figure it's possible to scale the hands and feet to more realistic (and human) proportions--I thought finally!  Unfortunately I'm kind of over the Freak 3 now--I'm ready to move on to other things.  I will say that he was the first massively muscled figure that Daz had produced.  When David came out his muscularture was something special too.

I'm not so sure how good the pockets would look in the cloth room.  that has to be the best 3D shirt I have ever seen.

Love esther

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A great render..

ha-ha-ha-, I want to be a bad boy in his city :-) :-) :-)

I wanna see him run 50 meters :-) :-) :-)

But a great shirt it is, beautiful folds, exactly as it would be in "real life".

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

It's amazing how realistic these figures can look if people would "ugly" them up a bit.  Sometimes people say that certain figures are too good looking--but as long as they have a good selection of morphs they need not be pretty at all.

Quote - I'm not so sure how good the pockets would look in the cloth room.  that has to be the best 3D shirt I have ever seen.

Love esther

Oh, pockets are fine esther, so long as you make them part of the soft-decorated group :). Same goes for belt loops, belts and other things that need to bend but still follow the cloth.

Laurie

well I may give it a try with one of my police uniforms.  thanks for the suggestion LaurieA.

As for "

I wanna see him run 50 meters :-) :-) :-)" He's carrying a gun isn't he?  why would he need to run?  Go ahead, make his day.

Love esther

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well he does look like a heart attack waiting to happen I have to admit.

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"Do you feel lucky punk? Well? Do ya?"

LMAO

Thanks for the smiles girls :-)

Oh! Another new one: Do cops have hearts?
Sorry, could not resist that one.. :-)

See, good figures do not have to be anorexic bidy bolders. Euh, body builders :-)

Just like the best girls are not anorexic size 34 ladies with size E balloons on their collars.
But size 36-38 with B size normal gravity breasts are way more atractive.

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"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Oh I see.  You live in the real world.  I spend a little time there too sometimes.  (when I have to)

Love esther

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seriously I agree, and I do sometimes buy non-idealic looking figures, like rikishi for example.  they are handy.

Love esther

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I hide in the real world but live in my dreams my dear.

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"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Och, when I look at Poser/DS people I jump into my hiding place.
And dream, that once in a distant future, Poser/DS will come with some real people.

I dream, I can stop morphing.
I have nightmares about, pfft, again having to lower breast for 4-5 inch. Again. and again, and again. And again all over again.

I have nightmares about, again having to dirty up the next bidy bolder = wanna be body builder.

I have nightmares about the next bad poly distribution mesh.

I have nightmares about the next set of 10.000 poly inner mouths.

I have nightmares about the next mosquito net. Sorry, the latest meshes are not wireframes, or meshes, they are mosquito nets.

Perhaps, some day, who knows...... in a distant future.

I will not feel the need to start morphing, again, and again, and again. 

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"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

All  he would have to do is sit on someone and it would be all over.

Ha-ha- Tom, :-), he'll have to catch me first :-)

But then, at 53 and 50 kg, (100 lbs), I can hide behind a lantirn pole :-)

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Quote - Ha-ha- Tom, :-), he'll have to catch me first :-)

But then, at 53 and 50 kg, (100 lbs), I can hide behind a lantirn pole :-)

 

As long as he didn't happen to lean on the lantern pole to catch his breath... you'd probably be okay then

Support is always a major issue with new human figures but I buy them anyway in the hope and because what I crave is a variety that morphs alone can seldom provide (unless they are very dramatic - such as Blackhearted's morphs, both body and face).

Sixus1 figures always tend to have a certain something that marks them out as Sixus1 but never so much that I've felt it intrudes on the image, instead it serves to enrich it. I don't do a great deal of fantasy, so I don't have all that many of the fantasy figures - but I do dabble in horror images now and then, so I do have a fair number the others and based on those alone, the HumanZ development is something that I'm looking forward and feel I can buy into with confidence.

I use the B2 figure in my comics.

http://www.edgeversemedia.com/comic/

He fits the character perfectly.

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Quote - Och, when I look at Poser/DS people I jump into my hiding place.
And dream, that once in a distant future, Poser/DS will come with some real people.

I dream, I can stop morphing.
I have nightmares about, pfft, again having to lower breast for 4-5 inch. Again. and again, and again. And again all over again.

I have nightmares about, again having to dirty up the next bidy bolder = wanna be body builder.

I have nightmares about the next bad poly distribution mesh.

I have nightmares about the next set of 10.000 poly inner mouths.

I have nightmares about the next mosquito net. Sorry, the latest meshes are not wireframes, or meshes, they are mosquito nets.

Perhaps, some day, who knows...... in a distant future.

I will not feel the need to start morphing, again, and again, and again. 

 

so when are you releasing your own original figure?

But Allison and Ryan are Smith Micro's answer to average looking people (pardon me while a gag up a fur ball).  I don't know, there is just something subtly wrong about them.  I've said it on other threads and I'll say it again--for the most part people don't want ordinary looking people. 

Quote - But Allison and Ryan are Smith Micro's answer to average looking people (pardon me while a gag up a fur ball).  I don't know, there is just something subtly wrong about them.  I've said it on other threads and I'll say it again--for the most part people don't want ordinary looking people. 

I am not most people, (thank goodness)  I like normal sized people.  Which V4 certainly isn't, no matter which of the Poser scales one uses.

As far as Alyson & Ryan the issues boil down to 2 items:  Arms & Head

Arms - they are much too short - this applies to ALL SM characters. Allow me to explain.

Stand up and place your feet shoulder-width apart.  Place your hands at your sides.

Where is the tip of your middle finger?

Halfway down the thigh.

Do the same with any SM human figure.

Where is the tip of the middle finger?

It is on the hip.

The arms are too *%$&(#^ short.  I fix this by lengthing the forearm & shoulder to 1.1

Head - Then there is the face - she is off-putting out of the box, just like P6 Jessi.  Go into the face shapes and make a few minor adjustments.  It doesn't take very much to make her more attractive. 

You are going to spin the dials anyway, start with the face shapes.

I'll admit, the poser 8 people (Ryan/Alyson), are kinda plain and arms are really short. I prefer the G2 people. And Poser 6 Jessi is a nice looking figure.

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None of them have breasts.

Some, I could call helium filled balloons.
Some.

All are made of solid rock, do not move a milimeter when the arms come down.

I think in the USA everybody walks around in a "T" pose.
Must be a funny sight over there.

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"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Vilters, your dead horse is in the lobby. please commence beating it before it stinks up the place... oh. to late...

@Khai,
good evening to you too.

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T?

LOL

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maybe you'll get the message. we know. you think most poser figures are wrong. stop telling us all the time. we get it. you've told us. repeatedly. we are not stupid, we get it. you don't have to keep repeating it over and over and over and over and.... and if this annoys you, tough. think how anboying it is for the rest of us, everytime you go on about this.

Poser 2 people = vertices outside of the mesh.
Poser 4 People = welding problems head/neck, hands and feet.
Poser 8 People = welding problems on the back side of the head/neck.

Just to name a few of the more obvious ones.

When I say something, I can prove it.

Ugly faces and wrong breasts are open to subjectivity. I agree

Mesh errors are not open for discussion.
They are errors.

Genesis having serious uv map issues between her collars and her arms.

Need more proof?

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"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

YOU'VE PROVED IT - REPEATEDLY

for godsake man. you missed my point completely...! WE KNOW. YOU'VE TOLD US AND PROVED IT. YOU KEEP TELLING US.

*please for the love of god, stop telling us!

since youre obviously quite passionate about these issues, how about funneling all that energy that you expend bitching about it in the forums into either fixes for the existing figures, or an original figure of your own? 

I love the new figure from Sixus1! She is really gourgeous and I think Les has gone beyond my personal expectations.

But I have always loved Les's figures from Trixie on up because of their very different looks and also the support given by the creator.

Vilters, you think all the commercial poser/ds figures are wrong??

so, build and make your own, there are plenty of free modelling apps out there.

one other point, make your normal figure, try and make it a commercial success.

if you succeed, then you can belittle other peoples efforts as much as you like. but until that happens.....................

a figure developer is not going to spend time making a normal ( to your aesthete), when they know full well they would not get a worthwhile return on their time and effort.

a large majority of users WANT the 'ideal' in their figures

 @ 3anson

YES, up to the point I thought there was some volontary bad will involved.

YES, I am morphing my own.

YES, they are more normal looking.

NO, I do not sell, Poser is my hobby, not my living.

YES, I hope the new HumanZ are error free figures.

Happy Posering to you all.

@ Khai

Yes, I know.
And I will continue to do so with the single purpose of getting better and error free meshes and figures in Poser/DS.

And if you do know?
Then do something about it too.

In the end?
All we all want are good figures/characters.

But OK, I will stop repeating myself.
Untill the next trigger. :-)

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

"Yes, I know.
And I will continue to do so with the single purpose of getting better and error free meshes and figures in Poser/DS."

And when you finally get the *"perfect ",error free"*poser/DS figure you will do what exactly?
 
Create some naked renders to show how great the joints and non balloon breast are.

Finally post something in your little internet user profile gallery,
perhaps complain about the lack of content for it
etc etc etc .

Were sorry that  the  inexcusable ncompetence  of the rest of the Poser /DAZ creative class has frustrated you so much.

But there is a solution to rescue you from this artistic abyss
but sadly it would require a little more effort ,on your part, than typing the same old gripes and hitting the "post reply" button.

Cheers

My website

YouTube Channel

Hey, lets keep it friendly here.  He is passionate about poser as we all are.  He is frustrated by what he sees as things that could be fixed which are impeding us from making our artwork being better.  He's trying to help.  Not everyone here can or wants to make their own models, but we can still give opinions, and sometimes it helps our frustrations to vent a little when triggered.

Love esther

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I echo that. Wether I agree with Vilters or not, he's a right to his opinion and a right to voice it in a public forum.  

That said, I'm looking forward to seeing the figures released. More models for Poser are a welcome thing in my book.

I'm sorry that I brought up the native Poser folks--but to redirect, I can't wait to see the pictures of the new male figure.  I'd use Behemoth 2 more if he had any clothes--I could WW them, but I'm lazy that way I confess and perfer content created for that specific figure.  Above Behemoth 1 and 2.

I agree with you Tomside.  It's not so much the converting (although it never quite looks as good), it's the adjusting joint zones that I really dont like.

those renders look really good.  particularly the one in teh shorts.  He would almost be useable for me.  I didn't realize he could look that human.

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edgverse - your comic looks really good!

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"He is frustrated by what he sees as things that could be fixed which are impeding us from making our artwork being better.'

Hi using poser itself and expecting "perfect figures"  is not a logical pursuit
and will only lead to endless frustration IMHO.

And it would help ones credibility of one had some posted renders to show what efforts one has made to get the best results with what is available.

I am the biggest critic of posers decrepid animation tools but at least I can show that I have actually pushed them to their woeful limits
and do not simply come into every thread and slam the programs animation tools from some theoretical fever swamp.   

You get what you pay for and what you all are paying for poser and its figures is not going to get this elusive "perfection" some seem to be chasing.

No amount of complaining is going to really change the brutal economics of this fact I am afraid.

Thats the reality of it.

P.S. on the new Sixus figure they will run their usual course:

Release

A few clothing items from the originator,

one maybe two third party offerings.

some posted renders,

some polite praise of the renders,

within six months they will take their place in the forgotten
depths of hoarded content that are the runtimes of the average poser user

 

Cheers

My website

YouTube Channel

Quote - But Allison and Ryan are Smith Micro's answer to average looking people (pardon me while a gag up a fur ball).  I don't know, there is just something subtly wrong about them.  I've said it on other threads and I'll say it again--for the most part people don't want ordinary looking people. 

You know, they did a study of attractiveness which shows that the more "average" a person is, the more attractive they are.  We don't really describe beauty, but rather the absence of imperfection.  We notice eyes that are too close together or too far apart, chins that are too shallow, pointy or broad, cheeks that are too fat or too gaunt...  It's harder to describe a person that is totally average, but most would agree that such a person is indeed attractive. 

Personally, I like a face that is "mathematically" average but also has one "flaw" to give it character.  A nose that is too big, or teeth with a gap, can be quite attractive on an otherwise "average" face, and the overall appearance is IMHO more attactive than the same face with the "flaw" corrected.

So, something tells me that Allison and Ryan probably aren't average enough but rather have specific features that many people don't like and which also make them very recognisable.

I will say I do prefer figures that look more like the actual (attractive) people I see daily, and less like the Holywood/comic book ideals, but then I'm used to being an oddball around here.

 

Yes, Behemoth 2 has a more human look for sure.

Quote "

You get what you pay for and what you all are paying for poser and its figures is not going to get this elusive "perfection" some seem to be chasing.

No amount of complaining is going to really change the brutal economics of this fact I am afraid."

I disagree. I  think complaining may motivate people who make things take their views into consideration and although of course we won't ever achieve perfection there is certainly nothing wrong with striving towards it.  of course one person's perfect is another persons too many polygons etc.

Love esther

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Sorry Anabran, but it shouldn't be too hard even for someone developing for a low end program like Poser to load a few reference photographs into his modeller to get at least the basic human proportions right.

Or look up some studys about human atractiveness on the web.

Yes, 99% of the Poser models available are done by eyeballing, which is especially tragic when you see an otherwise beautifully detailed car or plane where not a single proportion is correct. But those models were done by hobbyists, so asking perfection from them would be a little excessive.

 

The models shipping as the default figures with Poser I hold to a higher standard, though.

They are the face(s) of Poser, they are the virtual friends and family we spend our Poser time with. We cloth them, we pose them, they are in the center of the storys we tell.

Noone expects them to be as photorealistically perfect as what some CGI masters can do with high end software like MAX or MAYA.

But they shouldn't be so full of errors and sloppy design and general crappyness that they are completely unuseable.

I don't think my standards are higher than most, but I just want my virtual Poser people to look like real people. Nothing more, nothing less.

And I showed already years ago it's not Poser's "ancient" technology that is the limiting factor here.

Alyson and Ryan and all the other failed Poser meshes are just bad craftsmanship. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

I don't think Smith Micro will ever care as long as sales are not drastically plummeting.

But I still think it doesn't hurt pointing out once in a while that crappy Poser figures are not something we have to live with just because we are hobbyists.

 

 

There is the new Poser man coming out soon that is supposed to address some issues, I'm hoping for the best.

some of those figures look pretty good to me Vilters.

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Can anyone link to where I can see images of these Humanz?

@Daz3d
@ShareCG

Quote - Can anyone link to where I can see images of these Humanz?

Yeah, I was wondering too....

Laurie

Quote -
within six months they will take their place in the forgotten
depths of hoarded content that are the runtimes of the average poser user

 

Cheers

That is an interesting arguement & perhaps it was true in the past.  Clothes content is only a problem if the user is aggressively uninterested in availing themselves of solutions that for the most part, only take a few clicks of a mouse button.

Nowadays, the rules have changed from what they were in Poser 5.

Native content is prefered, but today other options are available.  If I wasn't using those programs, M4 would still be waiting on a good business suit.

All of my characters have access to all of my clothing content via WW or Xdresser.

All character morphs can be added to clothing via Morphing clothes.

In the scenes I am working on I use the following caracters:

Vicky 2,3,& 4, Michael 2,3, & 4, David, SP3, Luke & Laura,  Mill kids, Aiko3 & Hiro 3 from DAZ.

Don & Judy, P6 James & Jessi, Sydney, Jessi, Olivia, James, Simon, Koji, Kelvin, Miki 1,2, & 3, Ryan, Alyson, Ryan 2 & Alyson 2 from SM

Antonia, Apollo Maximus, FemaSu, Kez (successor to K),Maya Doll, Rikishi, & TY2. I'll be adding the Sanctum Art figures in the near future.

The only character I have that I am not using is Mariko (PhilC needs to get cracking on a WW plug-in for her.)

Due to that grey "thing that shall not be named" people are having to look over what they have & what they are going to do going forward.

I am looking forward to the new and/or upgraded characters, but I am not waiting on anyone anymore.  I am going back & pulling out old figures & going to town with them.  I have weight-mapped a couple already (Luke - Laura - Rikishi)

Photoshop Elements & Hexagon are getting a workout also.  I may be spending less, but I am rendering more - and that is why I got into this madness in the first place.

Quote - > Quote - Can anyone link to where I can see images of these Humanz?

Yeah, I was wondering too....

Laurie

 

There's some images here:

Humanz Update

 

Les said he was going to be posting some pictures of the male figure.  There was one earlier in the thread, but I've sure it's evolved somewhat since then.  Sixus said there will be clothing available for them--a lot of it I take it will be in a fantasy vien, but not all of it, and Phil C has promised Wardrobe Wizard support.

Wow, better than I expected (but not crazy at all about the hair). Hope there is a morph to shrink the eyes - they're way too big. I was envisioning another HER (who I think is fugly...lol). But, it's been a long time since he modeled that figure and has grown in his technique ;).

Hope he does well with em.

Thanks toastie :)

Laurie

The female Humanz figure looks amazing.

3D Digital Comics & Art/My homepage
http://www.edgeversemedia.com

I think the eyes are very expressive and cool.  It will be interesting to see what options these figures have.

Quote - Hey, lets keep it friendly here.  He is passionate about poser as we all are.  He is frustrated by what he sees as things that could be fixed which are impeding us from making our artwork being better.  He's trying to help.  Not everyone here can or wants to make their own models, but we can still give opinions, and sometimes it helps our frustrations to vent a little when triggered.

Love esther

Happy to see someone here that isn't completely rude to someone stating their opinion. As I recall that was one of the things that sent me away before.  The community had gotten so rude.  For me if I don't agree in a public place, it's pretty easy to just scroll past.  Even easier than walking away irl.

I am:  aka Velocity3d 

BTW, I love the outfit the character is wearing. Did he make that for the figure or is it a fit of another figure's clothing? I don't remember having ever seen it before (which in no way means it's new...I miss a lot...lol). It reminds me a lot of the kind of stuff francis used to do.

Laurie

Quote - within six months they will take their place in the forgotten
depths of hoarded content that are the runtimes of the average poser user

 

I don't think that will necessarily be the case moving forward. 

I think the reason that's happened in the past is in large part due to everyone using V4 and M4, and all their predecessors. But now, V4 and M4's poser days are numbered. There won't be a new generation of Daz figures to fall back on, and people want new figures. A handful of artists are trying to deliver on that. The positive side of that is that multiple artsts creating new figures breeds diversity, more selection for the users to choose from, and more styles rendered, giving the users more freedom to express their own vision. 

Personally, I've never been a fan of Sixus1's human figures, but I love a lot of his monsters and creatures. They have a very Giger/Wellian feel to them, especially his older stuff. If he studied human anatomy a bit more, I think he could make some pretty awesome humans. But every artist has their strengths and weaknesses.

 

~Shane

There are more pictures of the lady up.  The eyes can be normal human scale from the pictures posted.  I view these people as being more stylised, which i think is fine.  I am very much looking forward to seeing some promos with the male character.

Quote - > Quote - within six months they will take their place in the forgotten

depths of hoarded content that are the runtimes of the average poser user

 

I don't think that will necessarily be the case moving forward. 

I think the reason that's happened in the past is in large part due to everyone using V4 and M4, and all their predecessors. But now, V4 and M4's poser days are numbered. There won't be a new generation of Daz figures to fall back on, and people want new figures. A handful of artists are trying to deliver on that. The positive side of that is that multiple artsts creating new figures breeds diversity, more selection for the users to choose from, and more styles rendered, giving the users more freedom to express their own vision. 

 

~Shane

I think part of this argument centers on what one may consider to be the best approach to figure design to allow users to 'express their own vision'.

Over the time I've been using Poser there seem to have been two main approaches:

• Single figures with lots of body morphs to shape individual characters and looks. 

• Multiple figures with very limited morphs out of the box.

I get the idea of diversity with the multi-figure/mesh approach - a wealth of possible mesh designs, rigs and shapes from different creators. That's great. But it's always struck me that this has certain disadvantages for the end user specifically, most prominently that it means they have to buy lots of different figures to achieve a variety of looks. I tend to notice that many of the less mainstream figures lack details like decent expression morphs (or shaping morphs of any kind), rendering them pretty useless to me. Content is less of an issue these days with various clothing converters, but there is still an additional cost that can spiral for example in the case of having to purchase multiple support packages for Wardrobe-Wizard. Textures are also a problem in a similar way. I'm certainly not poor by any standard but my resources are limited for any given project, and I'm guessing that many Poser users have even tighter purse-strings.

I've typically found it harder to break the specific look of any given figure that has less shaping morphs included with it to achieve the variations I've wanted. This usually results in spending much more time with the morph brush or magnets etc than I'd have liked, where with a figure like V4 I can achieve very different looks very quickly with a combination of included face morphs. I can get to know that figure and its morphs in depth, learning how to get the looks I really want.

Although I'd concede that there are limitations to what you can do with any given mesh, the main disadvantage of the single figure approach in my mind is to the creator - a much greater investment of time to design and craft a well balanced mesh with enough included morphs to make it a viable option, especially if you want any of those elements to be of a quality that will bear the test of use. 

My understanding is that with the inclusion of animatable joint centers in Poser we now have a viable route to achieving flexible rigs to accommodate big changes in morphed body shapes, much as genesis works. This may well need further development and my knowledge is as a non-creator, but the possibilities for making a decent all-in-one figure seems much more viable.

My preference will always be to use a single figure with lots of morphs that I can freely shape and refine - this to me is how you as a creator can deliver the means for the end user to 'express their own vision'. Just because Daz may not be putting out a Poser version of the unimesh concept we shouldn't necessarily give up on that formula, one that has proven very sucessful in the marketplace. Maybe it's just too big an investment of development time for any one individual.

But this is just my take on the issue.

 

PoserPro2014(Sr4), Win7 x64, display units set to inches.

                                      www.danielroseartnew.weebly.com

Back in time where V4-M4 came out, there was no competition.
V4-M4 where it, or you where stuck.

Back then 1.000 clients had only one product to choose from. V4-M4, and that was it.
They all had to buy the same thing.

And V4-M4 generated some nice income for the content builders.

---

These days, the same 1.000 clients have lots of options. Lots of figures to choose from.
And all being equal???? Each new figure will get 10% of the market at most.

Resulting in the content creators also "only" selling 10% if they build for that one particular figure.

---

And V4-M4 's days are not over yet.

---

THE figure that will put V4-M4 aside has not been born yet.
THAT figure really will have to be special, more then special.
And only the creators of that figure can make it popular enough for the content creators to kick in.

If the creator can not make his/her figure performant/popular enough to push V4-M4 of their thrones, V4-M4 will continue to be the most used figures and content creators will continue to build for the figures that bring the most money.

It is not enough to build the best figure and put it out on the market.
The creator HAS to start a marketing/hype to get his/her figures popular enough to get the momentum going.

---

I admire all efforts, I humbly kneel down for all figure creators. It is a damm tough job to build a new good figure.

But even the best efforts will need “a hype” to get off the ground.

You do not make/build 2.000 support items overnight to get your new creation attractive to users/content creators.

And it will take a lot more, to push V4-M4 aside.

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

But ?? I do see a change over time.

Some years ago, when a new figure came out, the first question in the forums was: "How many poly's does she have?"

These days the first question seems to be; "How does she bend".

Perhaps in the future that question will change again to:

"How user friendly is that new figure".

And secondly:

"How content creator friendly is that new figure."

Let us all hope so.

---

A "user friendly" figure will be used.
A "content creator" friendly figure will be build for.

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Vilters-

I know this may sound a pedantic point, but V4/M4 did have competition, just not viable enough competition as it turned out. I think Daz got their specific formula with V4/M4 just right enough for the time and marketplace conditions that existed (and perhaps that still exist) at the time. There were figures that had some features that far excelled V4/M4 that were released before them, and that in some ways may even have inspired the form that they took. But in their entirety as figure packages they weren't good enough to compete in the final analysis.

I agree with much of the rest of your post though, particularly the market analysis. It's a reality that sometimes quickly released products (relative to the time it takes to produce any kind of figure) tend to dilute rather than enrich a market and the resulting competition of this nature doesn't always provide the end user with what they really need or want. I think this has long been the case with Poser native figures.

 

 

PoserPro2014(Sr4), Win7 x64, display units set to inches.

                                      www.danielroseartnew.weebly.com

@Corodan
We fully agree then.
Lets lift a glass to: "The user firendly figure".

Like you, I prefer a single mesh, with exelent poly distribution, making it very morphable.

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Pretty much I think, although I prefer higher poly figures and I'm very demanding when it comes to morphs these days - they have to be realistic, well referenced (JoePublics point). And how many expression morphs have I seen lately that have been little more than an after-thought.

 

PoserPro2014(Sr4), Win7 x64, display units set to inches.

                                      www.danielroseartnew.weebly.com

Yes, I prefer lower poly but with good poly distrubution and topology.

With weightmapped re-rigging and Smoothing ON, Lower Poly figures have become very usable not needing high poly figures to get soft skinned, well bending body's any more .

In my case anyway.

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

its in pretty poor taste to have a discussion like this in someone's figure announcement thread. whether you like Sixus1's figures or not, they represent a lot of hard work on his part. if you want to have a long philosophical discussion on the failings of Poser figures and how you think they should be done, start a new thread and show the guy some respect.

 

Disagree.  I've seen many threads in the past about specific figures turn into discussions about all figures.  If I were the creator I'd be happy that the post stating 'HumanZ Are Coming' was staying at the top of the forum.  I'd be happy as well that the content of the thread hadn't petered out to kitten discussion.  As much as I love 3d - the community is a difficult lot.

Now about that figure.  I liked it a lot too.  I remember when he first started working on that stuff, impressive how far he has come.  I agree with others about the Iris, to me that is not useable.  I do like the rest of the face.

I am:  aka Velocity3d 

To be fair the thread was neither started by Sixus1 nor was it an official announcement of his figures here. I don't see anything poor in taste about anything we've been debating here.

 

PoserPro2014(Sr4), Win7 x64, display units set to inches.

                                      www.danielroseartnew.weebly.com

In fact, I don't even see a post made by Sixus1 in this thread.

 

PoserPro2014(Sr4), Win7 x64, display units set to inches.

                                      www.danielroseartnew.weebly.com

I don't think it's disrespectful. Especially since he's not even the one who started the thread. Does he even post here anymore?

Disrespectful would be bashing his figures without lending constructive criticism. 

I would welcome that sort of discussion in my own thread, as long as it stayed relatively on topic and provided an overall consensus of what people wanted in the figure(s). It helps to keep the thread alive and allows more people passing through to be aware of what is in development, etc. 

I like the most recent shots of the female compaired to the previous shots he posted. The eyes look better, even the overall shape of the face looks better.

 

~Shane

The latest pics of the Female figure look good, but I really don't see myself needing any more female human figures at the moment. With A3 and V4 and the several tons of kit I have for them and another few tons of stuff I've converted for them I'm not in any danger of wearing them out just yet. :)

I had a bit of an "Ooooh! Shiny!" moment with GND-Anastasia and I'm struggling a bit to find enough use for the poor lass so far.

I think I'm more interested in new figures sort of the other way round.... if a load of great stuff comes out for the figure then I'm likely to buy the figure to go with it. And I do like that witch hunter kit.

I see no problem in asking for, and discussing; "user friendly, or content builder friendly" figures in a polite, open and honest way.

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

There is a pletora of new female figures on the scene, I will probably get this one because I'd want the matched set--the male and the female.

Wow, I must have that witch hunter outfit :P

Laurie

Quote - I don't think it's disrespectful. Especially since he's not even the one who started the thread. Does he even post here anymore?

Disrespectful would be bashing his figures without lending constructive criticism. 

~Shane

Shane what good is lending constructive criticism to someone that you said does not even come here? I thought constructive criticism was suppose to help someone? If that was truly your intent why didn't you join in on the discussion on RuntimeDNA?

 

 

Les comes here. It's not like he never visits the place ;). He just hangs out at RDNA more since his stuff is in their store I guess. But he does post here.

Besides, there's critque and there's opinions and I guess opinions is more what we have here. Everybody's got one, good or bad...hehe.

BTW Lilwolff, I was just playing with your Koshini things the other day. I dug her out of my vault...lol.

Laurie

I agree on that score.  To me those would be the foremost things I'd like any figure creator to have in mind.  Passable modelling is actually not overly difficult from my experience, so a figure that is easier to take from modelling for to 'usable poser content for' is going to be very likely to get my support and I bet many others on the content side of things.

One thing where the Humanz will have a bit of extra help is that, from my understanding, sixus has more uses for the figures than just selling them to poser users, and as his other projects generate content he plans to release it to the poser crowd as well.  Having that established content support should help.  

I'm not 100% sold on the figure.. but I do quite like that outfit she is wearing 

 

Quote - I see no problem in asking for, and discussing; "user friendly, or content builder friendly" figures in a polite, open and honest way.

Quote - > Quote - I don't think it's disrespectful. Especially since he's not even the one who started the thread. Does he even post here anymore?

Disrespectful would be bashing his figures without lending constructive criticism. 

~Shane

Shane what good is lending constructive criticism to someone that you said does not even come here? I thought constructive criticism was suppose to help someone? If that was truly your intent why didn't you join in on the discussion on RuntimeDNA?

Uhm... what?

I didn't say he doesn't come here. I asked if he still posted here. Two different actions, and statements.

I was neither bashing his figures, nor attempting to lend any real constructive criticism. I simply expressed my own opinion - denoted by the word "personally" - in a thread of several others also expressing their opinions. And most of what I did say about his work in my two little posts was positive. 

I've never posted anything on rdna and only pop over there briefly when I come across something of interest.

 

~Shane

If another modeler told me I needed to study anatomy to improve my figures I would  appreciate them telling me just where, in their opinion, my figures were off. Then it would go from being an opinionated remark to being rather helpful....

But Hey that is just my opinon and as Laurie says everyone has one. 

Oh Gawd Laurie! I haven't looked at my Koshini in ages. But I can fondly remember how much fun she was!

Well to be brutally honest, I think some should look at anatomy too. Now, before you get offended, what I mean by that is if what the vendor is going for is realism ;) If not, well then anything goes, right? LOL.

I remember back in the day when I used to draw a lot. When I drew a figure from memory it just never looked quite right. Certainly not as good as the ones I did from a model ;). Human memory tends toward the individuals interpretations when drawing from memory. Since I seem drawn to eyes, I tended to make them more obvious and drew them too big..hehe. I'm aware of all the things required to keep a face in perspective too, like making sure the bottoms of the ears are even with the bottom of the nose, etc. and yet still ended up with a weird looking face ;). It happens. Also some people tend to pay attention to small details more than others. What one person sees right away another may miss entirely.

It's okay to have opinions. Some are helpful, some aren't, but people will continue to have them anyway ;). It's not necessarily a bad thing, especially if people are nice about it and don't dissolve into snarking.

Laurie

I'm actually looking forward to the HUmanz figures.

3D Digital Comics & Art/My homepage
http://www.edgeversemedia.com

Oh I am not offended by you or by Shane nor do I dispute that some people may need a good anatomy lesson, myself included.  BUT I still think it is better to address someone personally if our remarks are about them.  A general some is really not the same thing.

I actually feel the same way about those people that complain about a merchants product without having the curtosey of contacting the seller first. If they can't get a hold of the seller than that is a different story.

I would not get into a discussion of anatomy since I still make stick people and actually enjoy doing it.:-)

Of course photo realism isn't always the goal; if the figure is more fantasy oriented then I think it's okay for it not to be 100% anatomically perfect.  I think these figures are supposed to be more stylized than totally realistic.  I, for one, don't care if they are perfect text book anatomically correct figures as long as the total effect is appealing.  I guess the buyers will vote with their pocket books; it is quite posible if an artist goes on tweaking and tweaking then they will never complete a project, at some point one has to step back and leave it alone.

Tom, stylized isn't a term any artist should use to hide behind, but many do. A figure can be heavily stylized and still demonstrate the artist's knowledge of anatomical accuracy and solid form. Every figure out there, 2D or 3D, is stylized to some degree.  

 

Yes, Lilwolff, I agree, and you are correct.

I just think it would seem rather arrogant of me to pop into a forum that I've never posted in just to critique the guy's work, especially when it doesn't really seem that he really asks for critiques. I don't know if that's true, maybe he does. From my persepctive he has an established style that he sticks with and it works for him, obviously, as he has many fans. I think anything I say about it will just come off as insulting, and since that's not my intention at all, it's probably better just not to. 

 Nor was it my intention for this to devolve into any kind of debate.

 

~Shane

Oh, I hadn't meant to start a debate either--just saying what is important to me.  I'm just trying to be supportive.  I don't think you're trying to be insulting Shane.  I couldn't model any type of human being if I worked for 10 years on it; indeed texturing is even too much of a stretch for me for the most part except for adding some tattoos to an existing map.  At this point I wouldn't want to discourage any content creator from making any type of Poser only content as it seems that Daz is going full throttle towards Genesis/DS specific content and that I don't think we'll be seeing much in the way of Poser compatible content in the not too distant future.  Even 3D Universe seems to be getting out of the Poser specific content with their collection of toon characters.  

If Poser as a program is to survive it needs as much content support as it can get, as I've stated before.  I think we need to encourage content creators as much as possible to make Poser's future bright.

Quote - Oh, I hadn't meant to start a debate either--just saying what is important to me.  I'm just trying to be supportive.  I don't think you're trying to be insulting Shane.  I couldn't model any type of human being if I worked for 10 years on it; indeed texturing is even too much of a stretch for me for the most part except for adding some tattoos to an existing map.  At this point I wouldn't want to discourage any content creator from making any type of Poser only content as it seems that Daz is going full throttle towards Genesis/DS specific content and that I don't think we'll be seeing much in the way of Poser compatible content in the not too distant future.  Even 3D Universe seems to be getting out of the Poser specific content with their collection of toon characters.  

If Poser as a program is to survive it needs as much content support as it can get, as I've stated before.  I think we need to encourage content creators as much as possible to make Poser's future bright.

 

Agreed. But filling the void with multiple new figures with a limited lifespan is not the solution (no offense but it is the truth). Poser needs a unimesh base figure that all vendors can work on and develope for. No vendor wants to invest time on a figure that has limited support or a small userbase. Its not financially viable for them. A new unimesh, does it all figure like "genesis" is the only solution here. Instead of releaseing a stand alone figure, just create a morph for the unimesh figure. That way you already have a userbase installed instead of starting a new one with a new figure. I might be wrong here, but to me this makes sense.

My Renderosity Store

And who, pray tell, will make this monopolizing figure? :)

______________

Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM

Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3

Quote - And who, pray tell, will make this monopolizing figure? :)

Really. Certainly not Daz ;).

Laurie

Heh. Nope.

If we want a unimesh, we'll stick with DAZ and forget "Poser-only."

But if we've turned our backs on that (at least in a monopolizing sense), we're implicitly welcoming competition. Ultimately, healthy competition tends to weed things out.

Frustrating for vendors in the meantime, not knowing what's going to really "stick"? You bet. But guess what? That is the nature of doing business in almost any commercial venture out there. You make decisions and take risks and hope that either you'll have enough influence that people will follow you, or at least that you hopped on board the right bandwagon.

______________

Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM

Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3

Vendors already know what's going to stick: Genesis.

That's why all the good ones are over at DAZ making more $$$ than ever instead of wasting their time with pathetic "grassroots" figures noone really needs.

The Poser figure market has been a full fledged monopoly for a decade and DAZ pumped lots of money and time into Genesis.

Smith Micro has absolutely no chance to compete with that unless they can come up with a figure that is actually better than Genesis, because that would be the only way for them to win those top-tier merchants back.

Sorry folks, but stop dreaming.

A re-rigged this or a re-sculpted that simply isn't enough to keep Poser afloat.

The format wars are OVER and WE LOST.

 

 

Yeah, for as long as we will stay with that stupid high poly count, combined with horrible poly distribution,  we'r doomed.

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

I have no idea about "lost." I'm using the independently weightmapped figures (and sometimes, even the pre-weightmapped ones) and am perfectly content.

Anyway, we were talking about aside from Genesis and focused on Poser. If vendors are really making $$$$$ on Genesis support, more power to them. I have no axe to grind.

Meanwhile, I'm still looking forward to HumanZ as well as Lucas, although I don't have a lot of $$ for 3D expenditure right now.

______________

Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM

Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3

Smith Micro has opted out of Genesis; nor do I think Genesis needs to be emulated in order to be successful.  If a figure is versatile and attractive it will sell and get support.  Think of Apollo Maximus, he was immensely popular and highly supported by vendors, but due to problems with the figures creator he never reached his full potential.  Good content will have a market regardless of what Daz is doing. 

Antonia has achieved some degree of success.  What I think won't succeed is only greating content for Generation 4 of Daz figures as nice as they are.  People want new stuff.  The versatility of Genesis figure is wonderful, but most of it is marketed to the fantasy/scifi market.  Do I have need to change my Poser male into a Dog Creature--or Bull Thing?  No, although such shapes are great they have rather limited applications.  Nor do I think that the average user cares; they just want nice human figures with content support.  Humanz will have that and there are more figures in the wings.

Don't get me wrong I like the Genesis figure, but I still want to use Poser and have new content for it.  I will be buying and using these new Sixus1 people and from the responce here and on other threads other people will too.  The market will determine what content becomes available.  What would be gained if Smith Micro simply imitates Genesis?  If that's what folks really want they will switch completely over to Daz Studio.

Quote - Vendors already know what's going to stick: Genesis.

That's why all the good ones are over at DAZ 

 

Not all of them. There are still at least a couple doing just fine on this side of the tracks.

 

~Shane

> Quote - Smith Micro has opted out of Genesis; nor do I think Genesis needs to be emulated in order to be successful.  If a figure is versatile and attractive it will sell and get support.  Think of Apollo Maximus, he was immensely popular and highly supported by vendors, but due to problems with the figures creator he never reached his full potential.  Good content will have a market regardless of what Daz is doing.  > > Antonia has achieved some degree of success.  What I think won't succeed is only greating content for Generation 4 of Daz figures as nice as they are.  People want new stuff.  The versatility of Genesis figure is wonderful, but most of it is marketed to the fantasy/scifi market.  Do I have need to change my Poser male into a Dog Creature--or Bull Thing?  No, although such shapes are great they have rather limited applications.  Nor do I think that the average user cares; they just want nice human figures with content support.  Humanz will have that and there are more figures in the wings. > > Don't get me wrong I like the Genesis figure, but I still want to use Poser and have new content for it.  I will be buying and using these new Sixus1 people and from the responce here and on other threads other people will too.  The market will determine what content becomes available.  What would be gained if Smith Micro simply imitates Genesis?  If that's what folks really want they will switch completely over to Daz Studio.

 

Fair enough. But with an ass and thighs like this It aint entering my runtimes. Antonia and V4 Wm is the benchmark in Poser. Anything sub-par doesn't get a second glance from me. Its harsh, but thats just how I am. Why go backwards? I too want new content for Poser, But I'm not going to settle for just anything.

My Renderosity Store

Well only time will tell, I've been wrong before--but I'm eagerly awaiting Shane's people and the new male figure that Smith Micro will be releasing in the near future. 

Quote - Fair enough. But with an ass and thighs like this It aint entering my runtimes. Antonia and V4 Wm is the benchmark in Poser. Anything sub-par doesn't get a second glance from me. Its harsh, but thats just how I am. Why go backwards? I too want new content for Poser, But I'm not going to settle for just anything.

What figure is that in the image V01f?

Oh, and I agree Tomsde. I think Shane's peeps are gonna be the bomb ;). No pressure Shane, no pressure giggle.

Laurie

Well... maybe a little. ;)

______________

Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM

Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3

Quote - Vendors already know what's going to stick: Genesis. That's why all the good ones are over at DAZ making more $$$ than ever ...

diet coke spew

___
Renderosity Store  Personal nick: Conniekat8
Hi, my name is "No, Bad Kitteh, NOO", what's yours? 

Quote - > Quote - Fair enough. But with an ass and thighs like this It aint entering my runtimes. Antonia and V4 Wm is the benchmark in Poser. Anything sub-par doesn't get a second glance from me. Its harsh, but thats just how I am. Why go backwards? I too want new content for Poser, But I'm not going to settle for just anything.

What figure is that in the image V01f?

Oh, and I agree Tomsde. I think Shane's peeps are gonna be the bomb ;). No pressure Shane, no pressure giggle.

Laurie

 

That is the Humanz female from Sixus.

My Renderosity Store

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - Fair enough. But with an ass and thighs like this It aint entering my runtimes. Antonia and V4 Wm is the benchmark in Poser. Anything sub-par doesn't get a second glance from me. Its harsh, but thats just how I am. Why go backwards? I too want new content for Poser, But I'm not going to settle for just anything.

What figure is that in the image V01f?

Oh, and I agree Tomsde. I think Shane's peeps are gonna be the bomb ;). No pressure Shane, no pressure giggle.

Laurie

 

That is the Humanz female from Sixus.

Ohhh. :(

Quote - > Quote - Vendors already know what's going to stick: Genesis. That's why all the good ones are over at DAZ making more $$$ than ever ...

diet coke spew

LOL Connie.

cough JoePublic, I would think that if the Daz vendors were making "more money than ever" there wouldn't be so many leaving Daz...cough I think the number that may be making "more money than ever" may be...oh, three total? Who've you been talking too? Rawart? Luthbel? LOL

Just sayin ;)

Laurie

Who's on your list of vendors who are leaving? Only one I can think of is the Reality guy.

@Daz3d
@ShareCG

At first, I didn't understand what JoePublic was getting at with that stunning "True Believer" toned post on page 4.

Then friends explained that Joe is a good chap who has a reputation for employing reverse psychology, and that his main figures are V2 and V3.  :)

You will begin (in the coming months) to see more products coming with compatibility with Poser and DAZ Studio (read into this what you want…that’s all I’m going to say for now).

Just saw this little hint at DAZ from DAZ.

MY ONLINE COMIC IS NOW LIVE

I aim to update it about once a month.  Oh, and it's free!

"Reverse psychology is an awesome tool. I don't know if you guys know about it, but, basically, you make someone think the opposite of what you believe. And that tricks them into doing something stupid. Works like a charm."

• Steve Carell's character Michael Scott in The Office (U.S.)

Quote - > You will begin (in the coming months) to see more products coming with compatibility with Poser and DAZ Studio (read into this what you want…that’s all I’m going to say for now).

Just saw this little hint at DAZ from DAZ.

I hope this means loads more Stonemason stuff

Oh, whatever else too, of course...

ha-ha-ha- Esterau, thanks for the smile. :-)

Wanna bed they will launch a "new" box and a "new" ball?

You"l get about a hundred mails for that "new and game changing box and ball" . hype . . wanna bed? :-)

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

OMG..whenever they say something new and that everyone will like it these days, I cringe ;).

I'm sure we'll have it soonTM

Laurie