I am convinced I read this somewhere but I might be mixing up two products. Is it possible to use Poser Dynamic Cloth with VWD in DAZ Studio (using the Bridge, of course)? I notice that many of the dynamic clothing says "for V4" so is it figure dependent?

Biscuits has one that actually has a VWD preset but it says it is for V4 and Poser is a requirement. So perhaps I am mistaken.

https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/biscuits-love-fashion/119131/

Hi,

You will need both the Poser version, which this is built for and then the bridge for DAZ Studio in order for it to work.

The product works with ALL figures. I use Dusk and Dawn from Hivewire almost exclusively and have had no issues.

Enjoy!

---Wolff On The Prowl---

My Store is HERE

My Freebies are HERE  

I think I'm with you. The Poser version is the only version, right? And the Bridge is what I have too so I can use VWD with DAZ Studio. Glad to know it works with all figures but my question was specifically about whether I can use Poser Dynamic Cloth with VWD in DAZ Studio. The question arose in my mind because of the thread you started in the DAZ forum :)

Yes you can. I have done it.

Thanks for confirming that, I was sure I had read it somewhere.

Dynamic clothe can be used in VWD (either Poser dynamic clothes or Daz Dynamic clothes). When vendor talk about a figure it means that the dynamic clothe, before simulation, is "fitted" on a zero pose/zero shape character (V4 for example). You can use a dynamic clothe in VWD on whatever character you want (genesis,...). But if you want a dynamic simulation of a V4 tee-shirt on a mouse (for example :-)) you might make some adjustments (sometimes with a dynamic simulation as VWD explained in one video tutorial, can't remember the one). Remember VWD use exported object coming from Poser or Daz so you can simulate whatever you want, imagination is the limit!

When you want to simulate a Dynamic clothe in VWD. You can simulate it directly, sometimes using a scale value, but, it is often better to make a first simulation to perfectly adjust the clothe to the character. The result of this first simulation will be a mesh you can save as props and it will be easily usable in all the future simulations you will do, that will use this clothe and this character.

____________________________________________

Follow me on Twitter : @VWDynamics

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Thumbs up VWD for popping in. Hope your still working on that update I keep hearing about.

---Wolff On The Prowl---

My Store is HERE

My Freebies are HERE  

VirtualWorldDynamics posted at 6:54PM Sun, 12 February 2017 - #4297214

When you want to simulate a Dynamic clothe in VWD. You can simulate it directly, sometimes using a scale value, but, it is often better to make a first simulation to perfectly adjust the clothe to the character. The result of this first simulation will be a mesh you can save as props and it will be easily usable in all the future simulations you will do, that will use this clothe and this character.

That's a good tip, thank you. I'll give it a try. I notice that the Poser dynamic clothing in this store seems to be less expensive than the conforming garments. I guess that's because they rely on dynamics for fit, but it is a saving and I imagine that the polycount is lower too, which helps with faster draping. As well as dynamics, there are lots of free items here and at ShareCG which I have rarely used but might make good candidates for VWD.

If you have some problems using the rigidification by neighbourhood which generates a memory error when some parts of the clothe have a very small mesh structure, you can use the rigidification by extension during the mesh generation and then apply a rigidification by neighbourhood for only some parts that need to be linked (buttons, pockets, etc...).

Associated to the springs reduction and the distance min functions, I think you can simulate all kinds of clothes.

I want to write one or two decimator(s). One for the clothes and perhaps another one for the hair. These mesh structures are very different and perhaps they will need two methods to be decimated.

Currently, I work on the GPU conversion. Not so easy to do but this is in progress.

____________________________________________

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I was watching the Sickleyield tutorial for using VWD in DAZ Studio last night: https://youtu.be/yHY6xBi3Hgc ... and she was saying how she runs out of RAM with Genesis 3 hair and clothing in VWD. I know she has a pro-level PC with huge amounts of RAM (I have 32GB but that is small compared to hers). Even in the video she was unable to load a Genesis 3 hair (Wildling hair, if I remember correctly). She even had a couple of crashes during the recording of the video.

So I'm wondering what your advice is regarding what kind of clothing/hair to use. Should we avoid Genesis 3 products? What about G2? I notice that most of your own demo videos use V4 character, hair and clothes. I do have the DAZ Decimator plugin so what level of decimation should be applied? Should I reduce by 20%, 50% or maybe 70%?

No trouble for me and I use mainly G3F. As example, for my current project I have: Genesis3 (Collision), Season dress for G3F (clothe simulation) , Legacie Hair for G3F (hair simulation) and some high resolution props (collide objects). The VWD simu worked well (will post a render soon I hope)

As you, I have 32 gig of mem and never reached the limit . My computer is 3 years old

It did seem odd to me that she should have troubles with all that RAM. I'm just about to play a little more with it so I'll push it a bit and see what gives. By the way, apart from the Biscuits tutorials, are there any others? I'd like to know more about what all those parameters mean. I'm not very far into it yet so I'm just leaving them all at default.

Render posted in the dedicated VWD topic.

My main sources are :

-first the manual (old version but plenty of informations, I don't count the readings I have done) and waiting for the new version.

-then VWD, Biscuit,... video tutorials.

-Last: try and error! It's so easy to try new things in VWD.

For example, in my last project I improved my use of the inertia parameter

Well, my first attempt today is not encouraging. loaded a G3F character and the Uniform Dress from the DAZ Store. Did all the usual steps and started the simulation. It sat there without moving for about a minute. reported 20 million springs at the bottom of the panel, then crashed. I have to say that my experience so far with this software is not a happy one. I've never known anything crash so often.

Then I tried VWD again and DAZ Studio hung ... had to stop it from Task Manager.

Sorry but don't have the dress to make a test.

Rebooted and restarted from scratch. Deleted all exchange files and loaded G3F with a different dress. Decimated that by 50% and tried a simple sitting pose. The simulation ran to a point where one leg was draped and the dress over the other leg floated up towards her chest and then stuck there. I tried dragging that part of the dress down and holding Shift to continue but, to be honest, I could create a morph in Blender quicker than watching this work. It is just refusing to drape anywhere near the leg.

If that's what happens with a simple pose I hate to think of what happens when the cloth is colliding with itself. I'm sorry to be so negative but, so far, it is a total waste of my time and money.

What dress?

Cailin Dress from OutofTouch. http://www.daz3d.com/cailin-dress-for-genesis-3-female-s

So now I started again. Loaded G3F unmodified - just the base figure. Loaded Cailin dress and set it to base resolution then decimated by 50%. Chose a different sitting pose. Ran VWD with all the usual (as per Biscuits) parameters. The dress did not move during the simulation. There was some odd activity in the groin area but no draping.

By the way - I'm doing a static simulation. This is not for an animation and it is a fully rigged dress so, as I understand it, static is what I should be using.

I have this one!!

Here is a quick test (the time to create the scene). Result is quick and dirty but give an idea (blender would be longer at least for me :-)) : 15 sec simu

Sorry but it's late for me. You can send me a message if you want more informations.

Please have a look at my parameters and see if you can see anything glaringly wrong?

Sorry, that wasn't for Cailin dress, I was trying another. But the params should be the same, I think.

Yes, sorry to keep you up. I'm in New Zealand so it is my morning. I appreciate you taking the time and putting up with my frustration.

Number of sub samples is too much: I used 4 (default value) Same for number of iterations: I used 2 (default value) Times of simu will be exponential with your parameters

Inertia activated

Gravity perhaps too important: I used 0.5

What selection did you use for vertices group?

Last message for me, must go to work tomorrow

Smaker1 posted at 10:57PM Mon, 13 February 2017 - #4297383

Number of sub samples is too much: I used 4 (default value) Same for number of iterations: I used 2 (default value) Times of simu will be exponential with your parameters

Inertia activated

Gravity perhaps too important: I used 0.5

What selection did you use for vertices group?

Last message for me, must go to work tomorrow

Thanks - I'll give it a rest for today. I followed the Biscuits video and she said 10 sub samples, Gravity at 1.0.

Not sure which selections in the Vertices Group you need. I only click on Simple, I think. Anyway, perhaps we can revisit at another time.

Thanks again.

Although i use Poser, i can answer a few of the questions raised. They should be the same for Poser or DS.

Poser dynamic dresses can be used in DS - just load the prop or import the obj itself.

If it has been made for another figure, zero the figure, then scale, translate the cloth and if needed pose the figure to match the cloth until it more or less fits (ignore the small poke troughs). Then do a static simulation with all external forces off (inertia, gravity, collide to floor, air resistance). The cloth will now fit to the figure. If needed decrease the collision distance in the collision actor. After that send the pose to the host, and rename the new simulated cloth (something like dress_WVD to dress_NEW). After this you can use the new cloth for a new simulation with a posed figure.

Turning inertia On speeds up simulation, but is less accurate. You can turn it on (or off) during simulation.

Memory requirements for springs generation depends on the mesh density. Apart from decreasing density, you can also decrease the rigidify size (nr. of vertices or distance). Do not decrease the resolution too low because that will create unwanted wrinkles in the cloth. Also use a subdivided genesis as a collision actor (subdiv 1 should be ok). The reduce springs option reduces the number of springs as well, so turn that on as well in case of a high density mesh.

The number of sub samples defines how many steps between each frame it should calculate. The number of iterations is how accurate the calculations have to be. The Fast move will increase the distance of how far ahead it will look for collisions.

Thank you for a very helpful post. I wonder whether an initial static drape - without the inertia, gravity, etc.) for any garment might be a good idea - just to get it in the general shape. Then again with everything set. I guess that would also need to be a renamed VWD_cloth.

I ask because most of my attempts seem to have a portion of the cloth floating up and away instead of towards the body.

VWD deletes any previous prop of the same simulation, that is why you have to rename it.

Normally you do not have to do an initial drape unless the cloth itself needs a drape (when the skirt is high up and needs to fall down). In these case you can either increase the frames in the Poser or DS to let it drape (set a key frame at frame 30 or later), or simulate twice.

My initial guess for portion of the cloth floating up is that inertia is ON. Inertia cause the cloth to bounce back. There are several way to prevent that - Turn inertia off, increase ridigity, increase gravity or increase weight (new updated version). But the easiest thing to do is to let the simulation run longer. In case of a dynamic simulation, add a number of settle frames (set keyframe at last frame, then add 10-30 frames where figure does not move)

I've never tried an animated drape so I don't work with frames. All I have tried so far is a static drape. When should I use each?

Yes, I think you are right, I think that inertia has been on. I've been trying to bump up gravity with little success.

Often it just sits there with a small portion of the cloth "twitching". Nothing else moves. I'm sure this is a collision problem because it also happens when I enable collision with the floor.

With dynamic clothes you have to use dynamic simulations (to go from zero pose to actual pose).

If you interact with a prop you have to use dynamic simulations as well - to have the cloth collide with the prop

In these case you may need settle frames to let gravity do its work.

With conforming clothes without props you use a static frame. This will run until you stop it, so it will settle itself.

So my guess is that it is inertia which bounces the cloth and you have to let the static simulation run longer.

Yep, I've been trying conforming clothes so far, so static would be right. As I said, sometimes it just goes into a loop of some sort and never gets out of it.

When you say props, I take it you mean a chair or something else to collide with? I haven't even got that far yet. In fact I don't have a single decent drape to show for my time so far.

@marble : you say you have problems with Cailin dress. I made many tests on this dress and they worked very well. Do you want I make a simple tutorial showing a simulation using this dress?

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VirtualWorldDynamics posted at 7:21AM Tue, 14 February 2017 - #4297429

@marble : you say you have problems with Cailin dress. I made many tests on this dress and they worked very well. Do you want I make a simple tutorial showing a simulation using this dress?

I would very much appreciate that, yes. I might even pick up from your tutorial what I am doing wrong. So many people seem to be having success with your product that I must be doing something different if I'm only getting failures. Anything that would indicate what is wrong with my settings or procedures would be a great help.

Thank you.

@marble : do you want I do a static simulation or a catwalk simulation to show the behaviour of the dress. I can also do a simulation of hair. Tell me what would be the more useful to you. I will do these simulations using G3F.

____________________________________________

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Watch demo videos on Youtube

As I said above, I am not doing animations. All I need VWD for right now is to drape clothing on a figure for a still image. I don't have any aniblocks for G3 or any other pre-packages animations so static images are all that I will be concerned with for some time. Hair would be useful too but I have not progressed to hair yet - I am completely lost with the cloth simulation so hair will have to wait.

I have some G3 clothing but I would also like to use G2, Genesis and V4 clothes on G3F if possible (this is another reason that I bought it - I have lots of clothing for those older generations).

Thank you again for your kind offer. I really do appreciate it.

Hello marble,

Here is a link to a video tutorial showing a simulation for Cailin dress.

My english is not better as before but the goal is to show how works VWD.

Here is the link : https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9c39Rz2Ec-JZ1F5czYxZlFJLUE

____________________________________________

Follow me on Twitter : @VWDynamics

Watch demo videos on Youtube

Well, thank you for the video but you did, after all, show the catwalk animation and I am not doing animations. As I said above - I am trying to do a single pose static drape. I notice that all your demo videos and tutorials are for animations so perhaps I have not understood the purpose of the software. But you did ask whether I wanted an example of the catwalk or the static drape and, as you can see above, I said static so I'm a little confused why you did the catwalk animation.

Hello,

I see that the experts Wimvdb and of course VWD are here, they will be far more efficent than me ! :-)

As you Marble, I only do still render but, in the dynamic world, sometimes animation is required. My skills in animation are limited to basics. For example in my test for Cailin dress in my previous post. I made a little animation

• Frame 0: G3F zero pose + the chair
• Frame 20 : G3F seated on the chair
• and then 10 more frames to let the drape adjust (as Wimvdb suggested).

The animation let the simulation move the clothe between the character and the chair as it will do in the real world.

I didn't export the animation from VWD only the last frame showed on the picture.

Beware today is Valentine's day and my wife will not accept that I stay in front of my computer

Smaker1 posted at 6:35PM Tue, 14 February 2017 - #4297479

Hello,

I see that the experts Wimvdb and of course VWD are here, they will be far more efficent than me ! :-)

As you Marble, I only do still render but, in the dynamic world, sometimes animation is required. My skills in animation are limited to basics. For example in my test for Cailin dress in my previous post. I made a little animation

• Frame 0: G3F zero pose + the chair
• Frame 20 : G3F seated on the chair
• and then 10 more frames to let the drape adjust (as Wimvdb suggested).

The animation let the simulation move the clothe between the character and the chair as it will do in the real world.

I didn't export the animation from VWD only the last frame showed on the picture.

Beware today is Valentine's day and my wife will not accept that I stay in front of my computer

Valentine's was yesterday where I am but I'll try not to keep you.

Ok, I understand that animation might be a way of doing a static drape - I think I tried that with Optitex too. But it that is better, then why include a Static drape? I'm just trying to choose the right tool for the job. All I want is a G3F in a sitting pose with a dress on.

However, I did notice that Gerald's parameters in the video were somewhat different to those I had been using so I'll give that a try.

Static drape is interesting for example: a long dress autofitted for the character on a seated pose:you have often what I call a "tube effect" . With a static simu you can have a better result and you can drag vertices to have the perfect drape you want

And that dragging vertices was one of the things that really impressed me about VWD and one that I'd like to use once I can get it to perform a simple drape. Believe it or not, for most of my working life I was in computer support: hardware, operating systems and networks. Now I have a hobby using computers and I'm completely at a loss to understand what I'm doing wrong. I know this is a complicated bit of software and maybe that's the point: we are awaiting a new user guide and the video tutorials are either in French or do not address the various parameters in any detail.

VirtualWorldDynamics posted at 7:45PM Tue, 14 February 2017 - #4297451

Hello marble,

Here is a link to a video tutorial showing a simulation for Cailin dress.

My english is not better as before but the goal is to show how works VWD.

Here is the link : https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9c39Rz2Ec-JZ1F5czYxZlFJLUE

A few other things I notice about the video. Firstly you have parameters such as Node Weight that I don't have. Secondly, when I import cloth I get two DAZ Studio Import windows pop up - one after the other - and I have to confirm these to continue (if I cancel them the original dress is deleted from the scene). That does not happen with yours. All this makes me wonder whether I still have an old version.

I have Version 1.0.408.2976

Oh damn. I just give up on this. I am following the video step by step and this happens:

I'm sorry to have wasted everyone's time and I'm sorry to have wasted my money on this software.

marble posted at 11:04PM Tue, 14 February 2017 - #4297494

VirtualWorldDynamics posted at 7:45PM Tue, 14 February 2017 - #4297451

Hello marble,

Here is a link to a video tutorial showing a simulation for Cailin dress.

My english is not better as before but the goal is to show how works VWD.

Here is the link : https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9c39Rz2Ec-JZ1F5czYxZlFJLUE

A few other things I notice about the video. Firstly you have parameters such as Node Weight that I don't have. Secondly, when I import cloth I get two DAZ Studio Import windows pop up - one after the other - and I have to confirm these to continue (if I cancel them the original dress is deleted from the scene). That does not happen with yours. All this makes me wonder whether I still have an old version.

I have Version 1.0.408.2976

VWD is working on a new version that's why it's different from ours.

The two pop-up are coming from a DS4 parameter that I forgot. Since my last complete reinstal I can't remember where it is located.

marble posted at 11:09PM Tue, 14 February 2017 - #4297496

Oh damn. I just give up on this. I am following the video step by step and this happens:

I'm sorry to have wasted everyone's time and I'm sorry to have wasted my money on this software.

Must say you have no luck. I had this error a long time ago. If I remember well I deleted all exchange files. Quit VWD and DS4 and start again.

Just saw some BlueRay Hobbit bonus tonight: I want to go to New Zealand! :-)

NZ is a lovely place. I only arrived here a few months ago but I love it.

As for my bad luck with VWD - I can't explain it. Please excuse my frustration but constant crashes and the inability to produce a single usable drape has got me wanting to throw my screen across the room. A while ago I took a holiday from this hobby because DAZ Studio was crashing at least once a day. I returned to it after about a year and was happy to see that the crashing mainly in the past. I hope that might happen with VWD but, for now, I'm dropping it in the corner along with Optitex, Garibaldi Hair and a number of other expensive mistakes. I'm going back to making clothes sort of drape using morphs.

Marble, I too have been having difficulty getting VWD working for me the way I want it to and have been frustrated and sorry that I "wasted my money". But if you stick with it, the forum members and Gerald will eventually get you up and running (personally, this is where I believe the value for money is; not so much in the program, but in the help you receive from others to get you going [sorry, Gerald, I know you have worked for many, many months on VWD and it is worth the money when considering the time you have invested in its creation. BUT, I think the help received is worth even more]). If you get super-frustrated, leave it for a while (a fortnight or so) and perhaps work on another project and then come back to it. Or you could also just forget about the project for now and try to get VWD to do anything for you - you know; the KISS principle (Keep it simple, stupid). I guess what I am saying is, don't give up; with effort, you will get it to do what you want. Many of the forum members have been using the software for over a year in Poser so it takes time. The software is sold as being a tool for the advanced [digital] artist which most of us are far from. But still we try and results will come........ As for Garibadi Hair; now there is an example of a content provider that provides no help whatsoever. Look at my Hair costs a similar amount but the content provider is really helpful and responds to pm's and questions in the forums and is basically a nice guy (help provided by others makes all the difference). BTW; I have both hair systems............. As you can probably read, I tend to waffle on; but there are some good bits of info here and there :). Other than the Biscuits videos, there is also a set of 3 videos by Nico T and he uses DS and the Bridge (he has a video on that too). Although he only demonstrates hair, there is still lots of useful info there. Here is the link to the first video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jjh-uiv4UM Good luck.

One thing I forgot to mention; Gerald, watching the video you made for Marble, I can hear your frustration in narrating in English. However, I can also tell you, that for 95% of the time, I can understand fully what you are talking about. No, your English isn't perfect; but it is quite understandable and the more tutorials you create in English, the happier I will be (and I'm sure I speak for many others here also) and the better your English will become. To me, for whom English is my only language, your English-narrated tutorial is 100 times more useful than any of your French-narrated ones [no offense intended towards those lucky enough to have a second language in French]. Gerald, please know that your English is quite good enough for narrating video tutorials and the more you produce, the better!

Thanks for taking the time to comment, I do appreciate the advice. It isn't anything to do with a lack of support that frustrates me. It isn't even that it is technically difficult - I am technical by occupation and nature so I know I can learn it eventually. It is the fact that every time I take a step further it crashes on me. I've noted the warnings about remembering to delete the exchange files so I do that obsessively now.

I think you mentioned something important when you pointed out that most of the users here are working in Poser. Perhaps that version doesn't crash as much as the DAZ Studio version. I don't believe it only crashes for me - it has been mentioned in the DAZ forums and even SickleYield - who recommends VWD and has made a 20 minute video tutorial about it - says that it crashes a lot. It crashes a couple of times during the video!

You are probably right to say that I should leave it alone for a while. A new version might bring more stability - who knows. As I said above, that's what I did with DAZ Studio when it was crashing a lot for me. Now it is stable and I enjoy the hobby again.

I 'spoke' with Gerald yesterday [ie. email] and he said that there was a new user guide {written by wimvdb so the translation from French to English isn't just "Googleised"} and also a new version of VWD coming "soon" (we all know that word can be so subjective - but I imagine it'll be within the month or so).... When that is released, perhaps you can have another go then....... BTW, do you have any CPU/RAM monitoring software? - even just using the inbuilt Task Manager (I assume you're on a PC as I don't think VWD is available for MAC] Performance tab may give you some extra info; perhaps you're running out of RAM, although I think you mentioned you had 32GB of RAM(?), which is the same as me as well as SickleYield, I believe......... Just another thought. Ultimately, as you mention; us hobbyists do this for fun and when it's no longer fun - go onto something else; at least for a while (I jump back and forth between 5 or so different softwares for my art - ultimately hoping to be good enough at each to be able to use all of them in a workflow to create my art. And then learn some more...).

marble posted at 5:05AM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297529

Thanks for taking the time to comment, I do appreciate the advice. It isn't anything to do with a lack of support that frustrates me. It isn't even that it is technically difficult - I am technical by occupation and nature so I know I can learn it eventually. It is the fact that every time I take a step further it crashes on me. I've noted the warnings about remembering to delete the exchange files so I do that obsessively now.

I think you mentioned something important when you pointed out that most of the users here are working in Poser. Perhaps that version doesn't crash as much as the DAZ Studio version. I don't believe it only crashes for me - it has been mentioned in the DAZ forums and even SickleYield - who recommends VWD and has made a 20 minute video tutorial about it - says that it crashes a lot. It crashes a couple of times during the video!

You are probably right to say that I should leave it alone for a while. A new version might bring more stability - who knows. As I said above, that's what I did with DAZ Studio when it was crashing a lot for me. Now it is stable and I enjoy the hobby again.

VWD itself is the same for both Poser and DS. I don't think that is the problem here. I use a static simulation for a conforming cloth where the cloth follows the pose. VWD will add the the realistic draping. For a pose where the figure is seated or lying on the floor, you have to use a dynamic pose. You will need this to have the cloth collide properly to a chair or the floor. In such a case you would go from zero pose to final pose in the simulation. Since this is a fluid movement, you will need to add extra frames at the end to let the cloth come to a rest (settle poses) after the movement has finished.

You did not say when you got the error, but from what i saw in Geralds video, the dress has a pretty high density. So reduce the value of Use vertices extension to a lower value to compensate (this will create less springs).

As a general remark for using VWD - start simple to get familiar on how VWD works. Once you have done that, go to more complex poses where you interact with other objects such as other clothing, floor, props, wind, etc.

I don't think there was a crash during the video. Gerald once stopped and resumed the recording to skip some of the simulation to shorten the video.

Quote: "I don't think there was a crash during the video. Gerald once stopped and resumed the recording to skip some of the simulation to shorten the video."

Sorry, I didn't mean Gerald's video, I meant the video tutorial SickleYield made for DAZ Studio users of VWD. If you watch that you will see VWD crash.

Gerald made his video to show me that this particular dress works fine with VWD. This was because I thought there might be a need to decimate it as I thought it might be high density.

As I am currently stuck myself with a simulation of a skirt, I thought I may as well ask here. The skirt in question is Daemon skirt for G3F and there are three separate pieces that each requires it's own sim; the main skirt (which is pretty much a rectangle of cloth at the front and another at the back) as well as a left and right sash. http://www.daz3d.com/daemon-outfit-for-genesis-3-female-s I am wanting the skirt to appear stiffer, like leather whereas the sim make it look more like silk or polyester. How can I make the material simulate as being thicker/stiffer? I'm thinking I need to play with the rigidity setting but I have no idea where to start. Oh, and just to make it more interesting (aka. difficult), the sashes are too short to collide with the floor but the main skirt will as my pose for G3F is kneeling on one knee. Suggestions, magical incantations, recipes, anything else that may help - all welcome....................;)

Agree with Erwin: somedays nothing works (even without any crash) some other everything works. Funny to talk about Lamh because with my last project I used the Alessandro fox and had plenty of crash ! But I'm stubborn and found another strategy after a good night sleep

@Erwin: why are are you making 3 simu for the skirt? I would not use stifness by neighborough but by extension (with a very low softness parameter) for the clothe. And then select the belt and some vertices near and use stiffness by neighborough to keep pieces together. Don't understand the knee trouble!

@marble : I have rarely crashes with the program. If you want, I can send you the version I used in the demo, but I am not sure this will solve the problem. I just need an email to send you the program.

I understand I don't make enough tutorials. My English is not good at all, but I reach a level that allows me to make these tutorials directly in English. Video tutorials in French are not useful to you and Subtitles ask me a lot of time.

My goal is to improve VWD to be able to adapt a simulation for a clothe or hair in real time and then be able to do a simulation that fit perfectly to the needs. This project is a long time work and I need you help and your patience to reach this goal.

____________________________________________

Follow me on Twitter : @VWDynamics

Watch demo videos on Youtube

VirtualWorldDynamics posted at 5:04PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297549

@marble : I have rarely crashes with the program. If you want, I can send you the version I used in the demo, but I am not sure this will solve the problem. I just need an email to send you the program.

I understand I don't make enough tutorials. My English is not good at all, but I reach a level that allows me to make these tutorials directly in English. Video tutorials in French are not useful to you and Subtitles ask me a lot of time.

My goal is to improve VWD to be able to adapt a simulation for a clothe or hair in real time and then be able to do a simulation that fit perfectly to the needs. This project is a long time work and I need you help and your patience to reach this goal.

Perhaps it doesn't crash for you because you know how to avoid doing things that cause a crash. Or perhaps you use it with Poser mostly? I don't know why it crashes for me but it does often.

I'll happily send you my email but I'd rather wait for a fully tested and released update. I think your goals for the program are excellent and I am sure you will keep improving it. I will start using it again - perhaps after I have had a chance to read the new user guide so that I understand all the parameters better. If I could get it to work for me I am sure I would use it every day - especially when it starts to work with the GPU, then you will be approaching real-time.

By the way, I think your English is pretty good. Much better than my French, c'est vrai.

I'm between two projects. Let's take a character (G3F) a standard pose for G3F (your choice) and a dress (your choice but simple) and I may show you how I do it in detail. If you want!

Smaker1 posted at 8:05PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297582

I'm between two projects. Let's take a character (G3F) a standard pose for G3F (your choice) and a dress (your choice but simple) and I may show you how I do it in detail. If you want!

Deal - but if it crashes I'm outta here. ;)

G3F and, take your pick (all G2F dresses): X Skirt, W Skirt or Beautiful Skirt (all Cute3D) or La Llorona's Frock for Genesis 2 Female. They all have plenty of scope for draping.

Poses: either Fashion Model Pose 10 or any of the Capsces Fun & Flirty sitting poses.

This mostly represents the tries I've been attempting all week.

Bad luck for the clothe, another one? Ok for the pose (victoria 7 sit A?)

Lucid Dream Dress? Surely everyone has that - it's a PC item.

OK give me a few minutes

This one?

Ok here is my result (quick and dirty)

Is it Ok for you? You need a little animation

The bottom of the dress don't follow (manual adjustment with morph) that's why I used an anim. Do you want the detail?

Yes please ... step by step if possible. I want to isolate where I'm going wrong.

By the way, I've never tried an animated drape.

OK new ds4 scene frame 0: load G3F and conform the dress I change the Y postion of G3F to -58.16 because if it goes down to quickly the dress will come under her arms!!

I didn't lower more because I don't want the dress to go through the floor because the VWD floor will be used as collision in VWD

step2

frame 20 I applied the flirty pose Check the Y pose to be sure if it's zero (not an animation specialist)

Save the scene!!

Smaker1 posted at 9:03PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297598

I didn't lower more because I don't want the dress to go through the floor because the VWD floor will be used as collision in VWD

Ok - you keep going and assume I'm following. I'll ask questions if I need to.

Step 3

start VWD delete all exchange files and restore default parameters (utilities)

G3F: collision (2 click: default parameters) LD Dress: clothe (2 click: default parameters)

Step 4

click on "force and spring" Tab the "vertice selection" tab will also open selection by material: select Skirt-ld-dress-VWD: the skirt will be red

Sorry I also have a beta version but it's the same for you

I don't have a Forces and Springs Tab

Ok - found it

Step5 click on INV: now it's the upper of the dress which is red click on neighbours one time click on Nail to collision: VWD will calculate the springs (I have memory usage: 615 m). I used nail to collision to be sure the clothe follow the G3F body.

Now let's simulate!

Step 6 Simulate tab

Keep all parameter by default, I lowered the gravity to 0.5

Click "Start dynamic simulation"

I have 704 Mb but ok, what next?

My Multithread reads 4 by default

at the end VWD will run the anim click on esc key

frame 10, 20 and 30

Finish !!

at the bottom you can move the cursor to the frame you want

between frame 20 and 30 (where G3F is in it's final pose) you choose what you want to send to DS4 as you do still render

Apply a smooth modifer to the VWD object in DS4 to have a better result

ta daaa!! The parameters are far from perfects but it's to show the process.

last:

(I spend more time to explain than to do it!) .

So, your result ?

Well, thank you. That's the first time I've completed a drape (only by following you, of course). Still, it didn't crash or get hung up working on a small area.

Next question is - how to drag the cloth while it is draping? I guess that can only be done with a static drape, right? Could a static drape be run from this point?

marble posted at 10:34PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297378

Please have a look at my parameters and see if you can see anything glaringly wrong?

I came back to your post : the floor have a value of 0.1. That mean that the VWD floor will go upper. When I see the pose you want to use the VWD: floor goes through G3F that could be a reason of simulation problem (even VWD is robust!).

I thought I had been sticking to defaults except the parameters suggested by the Biscuits video.

marble posted at 10:37PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297615

Next question is - how to drag the cloth while it is draping? I guess that can only be done with a static drape, right? Could a static drape be run from this point?

I use dragging at the end of simulation on the last frame (shift key) .

Read the actual manual (even if it's old there are plenty of informations) . Remember: dynamic simulation recreate real life so if you create something absurd (floor going through the body for example) It will be hard for VWD!

Hope you more confident to use VWD now

marble posted at 10:41PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297617

I thought I had been sticking to defaults except the parameters suggested by the Biscuits video.

Different cases, different parameters: I often reset when I create a new project. It"s up to you now to improve the simulation parameters to get better results

So after it has finished you can go to the last frame and start dragging the cloth?

I think the new manual is ready now so I'll dive into that as soon as it is released. But thanks for your help - it does look like doing an animated drape is the way to go. I wonder if there's a situation when a static drape would be more suitable?

marble posted at 10:44PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297615

Next question is - how to drag the cloth while it is draping? I guess that can only be done with a static drape, right? Could a static drape be run from this point?

You can drag even with animation. It's not something to do when you want to do animation render because there will be too much differences between the frames (that's the purpose of the warning). but for still render you can do it : use the frame corresponding to the final pose (between 20 or 30). You can send pose to host (not the animation because it close VWD) to see what's the result without closing VWD and go back to VWD and make more adjustments

No VWD is clearly not a waste!

marble posted at 10:47PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297620

So after it has finished you can go to the last frame and start dragging the cloth?

I think the new manual is ready now so I'll dive into that as soon as it is released. But thanks for your help - it does look like doing an animated drape is the way to go. I wonder if there's a situation when a static drape would be more suitable?

yes! for example, autofit (V4 T shirt on G3F for example) can create bad shape (around the breasts). You can do a static simu to get a better clothe shape.

Smaker1 posted at 9:50PM Wed, 15 February 2017 - #4297621

No VWD is clearly not a waste!

You are starting to convince me.

I will ask VWD to pay me now !

Time to go to bed for me. Have fun!

Thanks so much. Sleep well.

Just an update. I tried it on my own after this, with a different dress (G2F Allure Chemise) and it crashed again following the same procedure as above. This time the error was Memory Insufficient. And here was I thinking 32GB should be enough.

And to be precise: this was a clean new scene, after a reboot and I did delete exchange files. A single G3F character for collision and a simple dress as cloth.

And the next attempt, again a new scene (different dress - the G2F Seana Dress). Again I deleted the exchange files. Again it crashed. No, sorry, I'm not wasting any more time on this. I'll try again in 6 months - maybe the crashing will have been solved by then.

marble posted at 8:56AM Thu, 16 February 2017 - #4297640

Just an update. I tried it on my own after this, with a different dress (G2F Allure Chemise) and it crashed again following the same procedure as above. This time the error was Memory Insufficient. And here was I thinking 32GB should be enough.

And to be precise: this was a clean new scene, after a reboot and I did delete exchange files. A single G3F character for collision and a simple dress as cloth.

Memory insufficient is not linked to your 32 GB of Memory. I have also this error (with the same amount of memory) depending of the clothe (especially for the last clothes made for G3 which have an important number of polygons). The limitation is linked to the number of springs generated and to keep dynamic simulation calculation time reasonable. So it's quite "normal".

There are many solutions to prevent this, at least two:

• a parameter in VWD when you create the clothe, can't remember the one (and not in front of my home computer!). Can give it later
• decimator in DS4

Bugger! Marble, you are having the worst luck! I have NEVER cleared any cache (guess I should learn how to), I use DAZ Studio (I started using VWD in Poser just so I could use the program - this was before the bridges were created) and I can recall only ever having had one crash. Have you used the Task Manager to see if you are running out of RAM or CPU (ie. at 100% - though many rendering programs also run at the full 100%; so it's not a definite "this is the problem", but it may give you some more info..........)? I understand your giving up (for now); wait and see what the next release brings (like an updated user guide)............ All the best.

Smaker1, Regarding the dress sim I'm playing with, I'm doing 3 sims because each of the sashes in the dress are physically separate pieces and show up separately in the host list. I've gotten some advice from Gerald (via email) and was already working with the settings he recommended (so I was happy about that); so far, the separate sashes have been done to my satisfaction (ie. the sashes aren't just a pile on the ground, so I'm happy...lol) and I have yet to play with the front and back pieces of the main skirt. As for the kneeling part; all I meant was that the skirt would be colliding with the floor as well as G3F. It shouldn't be a problem but as I haven't yet had a successful simulation that I could use in a finished artwork, I am still very much learning (but getting there)............! I've attached a few screencaps; I hope [only using the camera headlamp - no lighting done yet], so you can see where I'm at. I think I will need to "pose" the skirt panels so that they are above the floor, rather than sticking through it, before setting up a sim, but I can do that using the rotate for each piece (for a brand new piece of clothing for G3F, I am amazed that there are virtually no posing morphs other than moving the pieces slightly left or right -basically only standing poses. DAZ 3D should be more stringent in their vetting of content for sale - especially in a pro bundle)....

Sashes draped - time to sim the skirt.png

I don't know why, but one image was uploaded as a link; the other as the actual image but untitled ["Looking at the right sash"]

Erwin0265 posted at 10:57AM Thu, 16 February 2017 - #4297668

Bugger! Marble, you are having the worst luck! I have NEVER cleared any cache (guess I should learn how to), I use DAZ Studio (I started using VWD in Poser just so I could use the program - this was before the bridges were created) and I can recall only ever having had one crash. Have you used the Task Manager to see if you are running out of RAM or CPU (ie. at 100% - though many rendering programs also run at the full 100%; so it's not a definite "this is the problem", but it may give you some more info..........)? I understand your giving up (for now); wait and see what the next release brings (like an updated user guide)............ All the best.

Here's the thing. I have a one year old, custom built PC which I only use for DAZ Studio. I have an iMac for other computing needs. The PC has a Skylake i7, 32 GB Ram and a GTX 1070 GPU. Not a professional rendering machine but pretty high spec for a hobby. If VWD needs more than that then I don't want VWD.

Yes I do monitor the performance. I have an app that sits in the task area and monitors all manner of system parameters, including CPU use, temperatures, RAM use, GPU load - you name it, it monitors it. Not only that, I can actually hear the fans come on when the CPU is working hard. VWD doesn't even cause an increase in fan speed.

If I were the only one getting crashes, I'd be worried about the PC but I'm not. Apart from what SicklYied says in her tutorial, others on the DAZ forums have also commented about how crash prone it is. Why some don't get crashes is interesting but I can only speak of my own experiences. I've attempted probably 20 or 30 simulations by now and most have exited with some kind of error. The exercise earlier with Smaker1 was actually the first time I've had a success and I was very optimistic that I now had a correct procedure. But then I tried 2 or 3 more and they all stopped on errors. Enough is enough.

Erwin0265 posted at 12:12PM Thu, 16 February 2017 - #4297668

Bugger! Marble, you are having the worst luck! I have NEVER cleared any cache (guess I should learn how to), I use DAZ Studio (I started using VWD in Poser just so I could use the program - this was before the bridges were created) and I can recall only ever having had one crash. Have you used the Task Manager to see if you are running out of RAM or CPU (ie. at 100% - though many rendering programs also run at the full 100%; so it's not a definite "this is the problem", but it may give you some more info..........)? I understand your giving up (for now); wait and see what the next release brings (like an updated user guide)............ All the best.

Smaker1, Regarding the dress sim I'm playing with, I'm doing 3 sims because each of the sashes in the dress are physically separate pieces and show up separately in the host list. I've gotten some advice from Gerald (via email) and was already working with the settings he recommended (so I was happy about that); so far, the separate sashes have been done to my satisfaction (ie. the sashes aren't just a pile on the ground, so I'm happy...lol) and I have yet to play with the front and back pieces of the main skirt. As for the kneeling part; all I meant was that the skirt would be colliding with the floor as well as G3F. It shouldn't be a problem but as I haven't yet had a successful simulation that I could use in a finished artwork, I am still very much learning (but getting there)............! I've attached a few screencaps; I hope [only using the camera headlamp - no lighting done yet], so you can see where I'm at. I think I will need to "pose" the skirt panels so that they are above the floor, rather than sticking through it, before setting up a sim, but I can do that using the rotate for each piece (for a brand new piece of clothing for G3F, I am amazed that there are virtually no posing morphs other than moving the pieces slightly left or right -basically only standing poses. DAZ 3D should be more stringent in their vetting of content for sale - especially in a pro bundle)....

Sashes draped - time to sim the skirt.png

I don't know why, but one image was uploaded as a link; the other as the actual image but untitled ["Looking at the right sash"]

Ok I understand and I agree with you , very often clothes have minimal morphs to adjust movement but now we have VWD :-)

@marble: one last remarks. At least for me: each project is different and sometimes the same parameters of a previous project doesn't works for a new one. It depends of the clothe, what character it was made, the character, the pose, the setting, the result I want.... After a few month and some tries and errors, I have now a list of workflows to cover most of the cases I have today. Very often I found that: if it doesn't work it means that I don't use the right workflow and if I don't have the workflow, let's create a new one. That's why VWD is a "big beast" but like all dynamic simulators. Clearly not a one click solution ! Sorry you have no luck I know it's frustrating.

@Smaker; "After a few month and some tries and errors, I have now a list of workflows to cover most of the cases I have today. "

OK, hand them over; me want.................... ;) AND more seriously, I have to agree with you regarding what you just said to Marbles; it is frustrating and, at times, downright depressing. But I think Marbles is doing the right thing; leave it for now and come back to it in a few months. That's what I did and now there's more information around than there was before - in a few months there will be even more. In a year, with more refinement, bug fixes, etc - it will only get better and Gerald seems like a very determined guy; I really don't think he'll chuck it in (like so many content providers do........). One thing that has stuck in my mind, Marbles - you mentioned that you had 4 threads ("My Multithread reads 4 by default") - I have 16; could this be an issue (anyone who knows something about hyperthreading CPU's)? What do other people have? Sorry, I'm just thinking out loud and thought I'd ask because even my "really old general-purpose" PC runs 8.............. Last thing, for Marbles; as you know, VWD came out for Poser first and there is a 26 page post in the Poser forum discussing the plugin/program. You may find it interesting to see the struggling that some of the "now-experts" had when they first started (you can even read all about my lack of Poser skills...lol that starts on page 10). Link - https://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/?thread_id=2891120 Cheers [I've spent too much time reading the forums and now it's time for bed - guess I'll sim the skirt tomorrow.....]

@marble : I will send a new version at Renderosity with the documentation written by WimVDB. If you want, I can send you this version. Many bugs has been corrected and you certainly will prefer this one. If you want to receive it, send me an email where I can send it to you.

____________________________________________

Follow me on Twitter : @VWDynamics

Watch demo videos on Youtube

I've sent you a message on sitemail.

Thank you again.

@Gerald, does that mean the documentation written by WimVDB and the latest version of VWD is ready for us all or is "a new version" not the one you want to release to everyone (ie. an "interim" version, if you will)? I'm sure everyone is keen for new documentation and a VWD update. I just thought I'd ask what others also, may be thinking/wondering. I'm not trying to "incite a riot" or anything (lol), just askin'............ Just for the record; I appreciate all that you do and am content to wait until you are happy with what is to be released to "the general public".

OK, looks like I'm double posting again; but it's to ask a different, simulation related, question. I have attached an image to show my problem; despite nailing certain parts of the Daemon skirt to G3F (collision), I'm finding some of the nailed parts still moving and distorting in the process. I am thinking it's due to the fact that nailed parts very close to G3F are nailed nice and solidly, but other parts (that I don't want to move at all) that are slightly further away from G3F are still being slightly effected by the simulation. The attached screencap shows 2 renders; one which shows the entire skirt in its post-simulation stage; the other where I deleted all the geometry of the skirt, except for the skirt front/back panels and added a new, unsimulated Daemon skirt with only the skirt front/back panels' geometry deleted (so as to bypass the problem but also to show the difference in certain parts that have become distorted, albeit only slightly). So my question is, how can I make sure certain parts a bit further away from the collision object (in this case, G3F) remain unaffected (ie. fully nailed) by the simulation?

Erwin0265 posted at 5:26PM Fri, 17 February 2017 - #4297749

OK, looks like I'm double posting again; but it's to ask a different, simulation related, question. I have attached an image to show my problem; despite nailing certain parts of the Daemon skirt to G3F (collision), I'm finding some of the nailed parts still moving and distorting in the process. I am thinking it's due to the fact that nailed parts very close to G3F are nailed nice and solidly, but other parts (that I don't want to move at all) that are slightly further away from G3F are still being slightly effected by the simulation. The attached screencap shows 2 renders; one which shows the entire skirt in its post-simulation stage; the other where I deleted all the geometry of the skirt, except for the skirt front/back panels and added a new, unsimulated Daemon skirt with only the skirt front/back panels' geometry deleted (so as to bypass the problem but also to show the difference in certain parts that have become distorted, albeit only slightly). So my question is, how can I make sure certain parts a bit further away from the collision object (in this case, G3F) remain unaffected (ie. fully nailed) by the simulation?

Nail to collision doesn't prevent deformations, you must select the vertices and apply rigidity

I've been using rigidify to stiffen the fabric parts in an attempt to give it a leather look. So do I need to nail to collision AND rigidify or only rigidify? I think I need to watch Biscuits' videos again....................

For me: high rigidity to rigidify AND Bail to collision if you want the rigid part to follow the body but....

Are you doing animation or still render ? If it's the last don't make complicate scenario to do all in VWD, you can cheat!

I know I can cheat; hell, I may nor even have much of the skirt showing in my final image (dependent on framing which I sometimes do very late in the process); but I'm back to giving VWD more time for learning whilst I also create what I want to create. To be honest, I'm more interested in what it can do for hair (although I often repaint that in the final anyway............). But it's all with the goal of learning more. Oh, btw, I only do still images - I have zero interest in animation (although I am often amazed at what others can create in animations in all sorts of software - I'm just not interested in doing it myself. That being said, sometimes I know that I will need to do dynamic simulations (not too sure about what situation does/doesn't demand a dynamic sim, however). I even sometimes use the Poser cloth room to pose the wing membranes of any of Swidhelm's dragon models (his are THE best - absolutely craps on DAZ Dragon 3; and probably 4, 5 & 6) - doing cloth sims for the wing membranes gives really great results.... Anyway, I'm rambling again (don't I always). Whilst I'm posting, I have a 2-part question. Currently, I'm doing a hair sim and there is more than one collision object. I know I can add more to the list by selecting and hitting the collision button twice (same as for the character); but if you do that, you always get the popup where you have to verify the collision object anyway - so what's the point of selecting more than one collision object when you end up being able to select only one collision object later on in the simulation setup? The second part of the question:- the character has a quiver parented to her upper chest (it's located on her back) but it doesn't even show up in the Host List. Is there anything you can do in this situation (other than set up the pose so you can't see the quiver/hair intersections in the final render)?

My point was : VWD is for dynamic simulations of "soft parts". Personnally, I often manage hard parts without VWD but that's my personnal way! For your scene, that what I would do

I can have a look at the quiver as I have the clothe but later this WE

Don't understand the collision topic, are you talking about "nail to collision" where it asks for the collision object?

Yeah, it would be cool if you could have a look at the quiver but the quiver isn't part of the 'cloth'. The skirt I'm using is from the Daemon outfit, but the top is from the Evil Shadow outfit and the quiver is from the "Elven Weapon Bundle" by Polish. I tend to dress my characters in bits and pieces from numerous clothes packages as it makes it feel at least a bit more my creation; I also then re-texture everything to match............ The collision I was referring to is when you first set up your simulation; Click on "Host List" and select Genesis # Female (in my case) and click on the collision button twice; then, if that's the only collision object, you would go on to select your cloth or hair (depending on the sim); but if there are more collision objects (like a top and quiver when simulating hair), you need to select them also, one-by-one and click twice on the collision button - only then can you go on to select your hair object (in my case) and click on the hair button once or twice (dependent on whether you changed any of the parameters). As you go through this process, you will get a popup asking you to Validate your collision object (so you only get to choose one object). My question is, what's the point of selecting more than one collision object when you're going to have to choose only one later on in the sim set up? I hope that makes more sense. If not, watch Biscuits' video, "Static Hair Simulation VWD Cloth & Hair" (the second video - not the one showing a workaround for another issue); at approx 1:25, she mentions adding the dress as a second collision object and at approx. 6:25, the "Validate" button pops up..............

Marble:

I hope the new version will help you along with your issues. You guys need to get out of your head about the whole "I have 100 Gigs of RAM" thing (exaggeration). VWD is only a 32 bit software, and is not even LAA (Large Address Aware), nor can it be rectified as such with LAA software (as Hexagon could to reduce crashing). So, you are not even using above 2 Gigs ever... end of story. If we could LAA VWD we could use up to 4 Gigs of RAM max.

The CPU (multi-threading) is the workhorse of VWD, and why some have it better than others in regard to running VWD. On my laptop, I only have a single core, so I max out at CPU multi-threads at 2. On my Windows 7 PC, I have four cores, so I max out at 8. Some people (such as Gerald) have 16 physical cores, and have use of 32 threads. This is where the power for VWD comes in, and the more physical cores you have, the better off you will be.

This might soon be a moot point though, as Gerald is working on a GPU version, so only time will tell. Maybe, I will finally be able to use all those Cuda cores I purchased my nVidia card for, but who knows?

Regardless, it is an awesome piece of coded software, and I hope you don't give up on it.

OK you are talking about hair simu for the hair: you must choose the "main" collision object to attach hair (usually the character) and then you have to select vertices of the scalp of this character to attach the hair (with templates: V4,....). For a standing character and short hair you usually don't need other collision objects But you may need to add other collision objects (sets, clothes,...). For example, in my last render in the "share your VWD render": the hair is attached to the "main object": G3F but I also defined branches and ground as collision objects. Hope I'm clear

@DaremoK3 "VWD is only a 32 bit software, and is not even LAA (Large Address Aware), nor can it be rectified as such with LAA software (as Hexagon could to reduce crashing). So, you are not even using above 2 Gigs ever... end of story. If we could LAA VWD we could use up to 4 Gigs of RAM max." Well, that explains why I couldn't get the LAA to work for VWD. It's funny though, that, being only 32-bit, when I run a sim, my RAM usage jumps up to 7 or 8 gig (but the CPU is doing the main job running around 70 - 75%; multithreading its li'l heart out....). @Smaker1, I understand what you are saying, but when there are multiple collision objects and you validate your character object as "THE" collision object; does VWD still keep the other collision objects "in mind"? I noticed that when you added multiple collision objects and you validated your character object as the main collision object, once in the Scene viewer, the other collision items are visible, so I guess VWD must keep the other collision objects "in mind" (sorry, I can't think of a more appropriate term)............

Erwin0265:

Un-parent the quiver, and you will have access to it for secondary collisions. If un-parenting the quiver puts the quiver in a state of original imported world coordinates, then export the quiver out as OBJ, and import that quiver in for the secondary collision object (while parented, but everything else in scene hidden). Export/Import will solidify the mesh's translations that match your posed figure. A quick way is by use of the Hexagon bridge, and renaming the mesh, so it comes back as a prop, and does not try to append as a morph target. If un-parenting the quiver retains posed transforms, then disregard need for above.

I am like you, and I have no use for animation, but sometimes animated drapes are necessary for end results of a static image. For your loin-cloth above, my work-flow would have been to import the final frame only to VWD, and perform a static drape on the cloth while all hard parts were set as "fixed" vertices (not nailed to collision) not allowing them to move at all. I would turn off all simulation settings, including floor collisions, and use Dynamic Deformation to pull the cloth up in a horizontal plane above the floor plane. Then I would turn the simulation settings back on, including floor collision, and start a static simulation that collides with the floor as well as the collision figure. I would finish with using the DD to push/pull the draping to my liking, and send back to host.

You can see an example of what I mean by this work-flow in this post here:

[Post: @4296101](https://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/?thread_id=2902807&page_number=5#msg4296101)

Addendum to post above (editing failed)...

• EDIT: The second image inside of VWD shows my last frame posed figure/clothes, and my parented bokken prop using technique described above.

Erwin0265 posted at 11:39AM Sat, 18 February 2017 - #4297802

@DaremoK3 "VWD is only a 32 bit software, and is not even LAA (Large Address Aware), nor can it be rectified as such with LAA software (as Hexagon could to reduce crashing). So, you are not even using above 2 Gigs ever... end of story. If we could LAA VWD we could use up to 4 Gigs of RAM max." Well, that explains why I couldn't get the LAA to work for VWD. It's funny though, that, being only 32-bit, when I run a sim, my RAM usage jumps up to 7 or 8 gig (but the CPU is doing the main job running around 70 - 75%; multithreading its li'l heart out....). @Smaker1, I understand what you are saying, but when there are multiple collision objects and you validate your character object as "THE" collision object; does VWD still keep the other collision objects "in mind"? I noticed that when you added multiple collision objects and you validated your character object as the main collision object, once in the Scene viewer, the other collision items are visible, so I guess VWD must keep the other collision objects "in mind" (sorry, I can't think of a more appropriate term)............

Yes: I usually select all my collisions object first. Then the clothe or the hair. For the hair I choose my character and do the usual WF. Of course all collision objects will be "used" during the simulation. Thats why the hair from my last render collides on the ground and branches.

Erwin0265:

Yes, you can set up multiple collision settings. There are two primary settings for VWD; Initial parameter/collision settings set at beggining of VWD usage (can not be amended), and then secondary settings inside of VWD that can be applied on a per collision/cloth_hair usage. That is why VWD is asking you which collision object you would like to attribute whatever settings you just made to. You can repeat the exact same setting process, and then attribute them to the other/another collision object. You just have to work with it one at time.

Arrgghhh.... My brain is starting to hurt. I am starting to think it may be wise to wait until Gerald has released the new user guide............ DaremoK3 - I went to the thread you indicated, but there is so much information on that one page (probably starting on previous pages) that I really can't work out what it is that I am looking for... Also, whilst I am posting again, it has become quite obvious to me that there are quite a few "new" people who are far more knowledgeable than I when it comes to using VWD (them's the breaks when you have a crappy, unhealthy, genetically fudged body and you spend more time in and out of hospital and at home recuperating from this issue and that issue, etc, yada, yada, yada.... did I mention yada?). But to get to the point; knowledgeable people that want to create written tutorials for VWD and don't know how/where to start - I am offering to help you to create a tutorial/s that will be clear and easy to understand. I was a high school teacher for 25 odd years and writing tutorials is second nature for me (I actually write myself tutorials once I have developed a workflow I am happy with; in any given program I use).... I think there are some good video tutorials available but actual written tutorials - I have yet to see one. People all learn in different ways; some by watching/following a video tute, some by following a PDF tutorial, some by trial and error; or even a combination of any of these (and many other ways I have not mentioned)... I personally would love to be able to contribute to this forum and VWD in general. I'll be honest with you, DaremoK3, most of what you wrote in advice to me I have no idea what you mean and I'm sure I'm not alone. Lastly; to all members posting in the VWD forums, I would ask that if there is an issue you ask for, and receive, help with and there end up being quite a few posts back and forth [Like what we read on the second and third page of this thread between Marble and Smaker1], that you please provide feedback to the forum. By this, I mean - there is nothing worse than reading several pages in a thread the ends with the person who had asked for help no longer responding once their problem is solved, OR responding back with something like, "Oh, I think I've just worked it out - thanks." ANYONE reading a thread like that would pull their hair out (that's why I'm bald) as the "lesson" is incomplete. It's like watching a thrilling movie with the last 5 minutes missing at the end. I hope that makes sense. Please feel free to ask if I've waffled on again and said nothing.......... Personally, I copy and pasted the entire tutorial that Smaker1 and Marble wrote on pages 2 & 3. I did a bit of editing and now I have a tutorial teaching me how to sim a dress for a seated character................. In case anyone is wondering why I would offer to help others to write tutorials; what's in it for me? I get to learn from others more knowledgeable at the same time I'm helping them; that's the great thing about teaching - it's often difficult to work out who's the student and who's the teacher.............. OK, waffling done.

wimvdb posted at 12:40PM Sat, 18 February 2017 - #4297421

VWD deletes any previous prop of the same simulation, that is why you have to rename it.

Normally you do not have to do an initial drape unless the cloth itself needs a drape (when the skirt is high up and needs to fall down). In these case you can either increase the frames in the Poser or DS to let it drape (set a key frame at frame 30 or later), or simulate twice.

My initial guess for portion of the cloth floating up is that inertia is ON. Inertia cause the cloth to bounce back. There are several way to prevent that - Turn inertia off, increase ridigity, increase gravity or** increase weight (new updated version)**. But the easiest thing to do is to let the simulation run longer. In case of a dynamic simulation, add a number of settle frames (set keyframe at last frame, then add 10-30 frames where figure does not move)

I'm not seeing that; what version is now the newest? I'm on V1.0.408.2976

Erwin0265 posted at 12:45PM Sat, 18 February 2017 - #4297749

OK, looks like I'm double posting again; but it's to ask a different, simulation related, question. I have attached an image to show my problem; despite nailing certain parts of the Daemon skirt to G3F (collision), I'm finding some of the nailed parts still moving and distorting in the process. I am thinking it's due to the fact that nailed parts very close to G3F are nailed nice and solidly, but other parts (that I don't want to move at all) that are slightly further away from G3F are still being slightly effected by the simulation. The attached screencap shows 2 renders; one which shows the entire skirt in its post-simulation stage; the other where I deleted all the geometry of the skirt, except for the skirt front/back panels and added a new, unsimulated Daemon skirt with only the skirt front/back panels' geometry deleted (so as to bypass the problem but also to show the difference in certain parts that have become distorted, albeit only slightly). So my question is, how can I make sure certain parts a bit further away from the collision object (in this case, G3F) remain unaffected (ie. fully nailed) by the simulation?

If it's a static simulation, don't nail etc (just use Fixed Vertices and Clear Fixed); it's quick and simple to do. If I think i might want to fix and clear a few times I save the verts to memory.

Thanks, Writers Block, but I'm going to wait (somewhat patiently) for the new user guide to come out and slowly work through it and then (hopefully) I'll know how to do the things some of you far more knowledgeable guys are suggesting. If you want to write a tutorial about what you are suggesting, I am happy to give you a hand to set it out and make it clear so anyone can follow it (and I'll learn new tricks also) - as I mentioned in my last post. Even with a newly re-written user guide, we can use clearly written tutorials for us beginners and those coming in, brand new to the software........ Just a thought. I know most artists dread writing a tutorial but it makes any software so much more accessible to new and beginner users alike; which is why I'm offering to help anyone brave enough to give it a go............ No pressure, of course; we all have our own busy lives and simply may not have the time. Thanks again for your suggestion; I've added it to my "learn how to do" list..............

Writers_Block posted at 5:20PM Sun, 19 February 2017 - #4297813

Erwin0265 posted at 12:45PM Sat, 18 February 2017 - #4297749

OK, looks like I'm double posting again; but it's to ask a different, simulation related, question. I have attached an image to show my problem; despite nailing certain parts of the Daemon skirt to G3F (collision), I'm finding some of the nailed parts still moving and distorting in the process. I am thinking it's due to the fact that nailed parts very close to G3F are nailed nice and solidly, but other parts (that I don't want to move at all) that are slightly further away from G3F are still being slightly effected by the simulation. The attached screencap shows 2 renders; one which shows the entire skirt in its post-simulation stage; the other where I deleted all the geometry of the skirt, except for the skirt front/back panels and added a new, unsimulated Daemon skirt with only the skirt front/back panels' geometry deleted (so as to bypass the problem but also to show the difference in certain parts that have become distorted, albeit only slightly). So my question is, how can I make sure certain parts a bit further away from the collision object (in this case, G3F) remain unaffected (ie. fully nailed) by the simulation?

If it's a static simulation, don't nail etc (just use Fixed Vertices and Clear Fixed); it's quick and simple to do. If I think i might want to fix and clear a few times I save the verts to memory.

Here is a test with another clothe (V4 Elven Arcana on G3F) with animation. I used rigidify for the metallic parts and they are not deformed. Didn't use self collision for the test that's why there are a lot of inter-penetration

Oh believe me, I know the power of VWD; but I also know how slow I am to understand certain concepts (perhaps that's why I was a good teacher, according to most of the kids I taught; I could understand why they couldn't and so I'd try as many different ways to explain it that I could think of - even letting kids that did understand have a go at explaining in their own way). And with a recorded IQ of 196 (on par with Einstein, apparently) - so much for IQ tests (all they show is how good you are at taking IQ tests..............lol). Rather than fill 5 - 10 pages of this forum thread with people trying to explain (for which I am grateful - the people on this forum are great), I'll wait for the new user guide and work from there - it will give me a sound base from where to start and will help me to understand when I need others' help. Thanks again for the effort, guys & gals............. But, don't forget - anyone wanting to write a tutorial; I'm at your disposal (but hope not to be disposed of.........).

Erwin0265 posted at 3:35PM Mon, 20 February 2017 - #4297894

Oh believe me, I know the power of VWD; but I also know how slow I am to understand certain concepts (perhaps that's why I was a good teacher, according to most of the kids I taught; I could understand why they couldn't and so I'd try as many different ways to explain it that I could think of - even letting kids that did understand have a go at explaining in their own way). And with a recorded IQ of 196 (on par with Einstein, apparently) - so much for IQ tests (all they show is how good you are at taking IQ tests..............lol). Rather than fill 5 - 10 pages of this forum thread with people trying to explain (for which I am grateful - the people on this forum are great), I'll wait for the new user guide and work from there - it will give me a sound base from where to start and will help me to understand when I need others' help. Thanks again for the effort, guys & gals............. But, don't forget - anyone wanting to write a tutorial; I'm at your disposal (but hope not to be disposed of.........).

Perfect!

@Erwin0265 : I am sure you will love the new documentation. This documentation, written by WimVDB is mainly for Poser because Wim is a Poser user. If you accept to improve this documentation for Daz Studio, this would be a great help for all Daz Studio users.

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Gerald, I will do my best to contribute towards improving the manual for DS users; and I am happy to help anyone else wanting to do so; especially those that know more about using VWD in DS (which would be everyone on this forum...lol). Waiting patiently for the new user guide..... Looks like I'll just have to do pictures of bald, naked women for now............or, similarly (?)... dinosaurs.......Yay.... They say that insanity and genius are often the same thing.........well, I've got the insanity bit down, so......

Has the ability to grab the cloth and hair whilst holding the shift key been removed (Dynamic Simulation)?

EDIT: It only works for me now when the simulation is already running; previously, pressing the shift key would start the dynamic simulation.

I too have been missing the Shift-key grabber during the Dynamic Simulation with the new release of VWD. I used to use it (with the previous release) to adjust the cloth after Stopping the first run of the simulation to try to keep the cloth fitting nicely. But it doesn't seem to be working like it used to.

I haven't tried to use it while the simulation is actually running. Only after I've stopped it.

Iliked the fact that pressing the shift would make tiny adjustments, if released quickly; Just relaxing a some verts a little is very useful.

It's still available so not a huge issue, but slightly less versatile.

... And the manual seems to indicate that it should still work like it did in the previous version.

Yes, both the "new" and the "old" manuals describe it functioning just like in the previous release of VWD.

So far, I've only gotten it to work after the first dynamic simulation run is complete and only on specific frames after I stop the loop by pressing escape.

I hope somebody sees our remarks soon and comments one way or the other. I don't want to double post so I'll wait a bit before bringing it up in the Bug thread.

... agreed, I'd like to know it is a bug first.

In my mind, the shift key must work when a static simulation is running and when a dynamic simulation is finished, to correct some frames. Would you like to modify a frame during the simulation? ie to modify the latest simulated frame. I will make some tests with the old version.

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To clarify how it used to work.

Before starting the simulation, with the Start button, it was possible to use the Shift key, and it would start the simulation. It was useful.

After stopping the simulation (with the Stop button), it was possible to use the Shift to continue the simulation.

Pressing the Shift whilst the simulation was running would move to the mode that allowed the dragging of the simulate (item being simulated). The simulation would always stop when releasing the Shift key, although it would still say it was running, and the button to stop the simulation was still active. It was definitely not running though.

At any time, obviously, one could grab some part of the simulate and drag it about.

Now, the only way to drag the simulate is while the simulation is running; releasing the Shift key no longer turns off the simulation; it seemed to be a bug, the fact the simulation stopped, and the buttons didn't change to reflect that - I remember posting about this weeks or months ago.

I think it is useful to start a thread concerning the use of the shift key.

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So if I buy WVD and the DS bridge, do I need to have Poser installed to use it? I have most Poser versions upto Poser 2012, but I don't have any of them installed.

WVD lists Poser 9 as a requirement.

Thanks.

Hello MeInOhio,

No, you don't need any Poser version.

At first, VWD has been written for Poser and it directly works with it. Philemot made a great work by transforming the communication between VWD and Poser, in Python, to a direct communication with Daz Studio.

If you buy VWD and the bridge for Daz Studio the two programs will communicate directly, without other needs.

Have a great day.

 Gérald

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Thanks. I just picked up VWD and the Daz bridge.