Hi,

being a Poser user since Poser 4, I always preferred the usability of Poser over DAZ Studio. But let's be honest: almost everyone used Victoria 1-4 because the models were so much better than the original Poser stuff, which was not a problem because it worked fine. When that functionality became more and more unuseable, Poser became less attractive - though the software itself still was much better than the awkward DAZ Studio.

WIth the latest updates, my Poser 11 got completely messed up, crashing every few minutes. Even completely deinstalling, wiping the HDD and reinstallation didn't solve the problem. So I'm more than eager to upgrade to version 12, hoping the new version works stable again. But I'm just not willing to spend money on a software that cannot process the most commonly used models, only to spend more money to run two parallel libraries. So the simple question is: do Poser 12 support the later and future Genesis models?

not right now. Maybe not ever. Who knows. I still load up V3, M3, V4, M4 on my system.

W10, Ryzen 5 1600x, 16Gb,RTX2060Super+GTX980, PP11, 11.3.740

Grrrr! Historically Poser has used DAZ content. Which has always been the better Figures, hands down. And Poser has historically been the better software (for a LOT of us!).
When someone asks the time, they sure don't want to have Building A Watch Factory explained to them. So with that, it is high time POSER is enabled to use the better content that is readily available. It IS past time to get off your high-horse, Poser Powers That BE. Get off or be knocked off by your very own snotty attitude.

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McG.

I don't think Poser will ever support Genesis. They've just become too different now.

I know better than that.

My 66th Birthday PC Build (July 1, 2020) :  named BadMoonRYZEN!, W10Pro x64, Octal Core RYZEN7 X3700 4.05 GHz, 64GB DDR4 RAM, GeForce RTX 3060 - 12GB GDDR6, PP2014, PP 11, P12, PS-CS4 Extended & Vue 2024.

McG.

Using Poser since its version 4, too. And I don't think I will ever switch to Genesis, whatever the version, not because of the character itself but because of Daz' marketing strategy. But the main reason is that I don't see any advantages over Vic4 when that latter is ported to Karina's excellent Sasha-16. Sometimes, a few clothes need an easy management (shoulders) but that's quite fast and sinmple.

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DAZ Studio is another programm and there is no reason to support DS Genesis 7 nand 8 Figures, just like there is no reason to support IClone figures or Mixamo Figures.Poser has tons of figures ready to use. If you want Genesis 7 or 8 figures go and use DAZ Studio for that.

The funny thing is, when I open this thread, on top is a advertising for Teffa, a Genesis 8 Figure! For me Poser 12 is useless (like Poser 11) when I can't use Genesis 2 figures without workaround, the moment I can use genesis 2 like in Poser 2014 I will buy this software, and if I can use Genesis 3 or 8 figures it would be even better

Advertising on this site is not connected to what thread you are browsing.

@ Rhia - Yeah but it sure introduces really sucky irony. @ wfbp1w - I agree about using those Genesis 2 thru 8 Figures, plus the Animals, Props and, yes, even the DUF format being directly readable (USABLE!) in Poser 12 as CAN be done thru Genesis 2 with PP 2014. I am not offering any hate. I will use POSER and ANY content I like, if at all possible. Even my own. Such as that is.

My 66th Birthday PC Build (July 1, 2020) :  named BadMoonRYZEN!, W10Pro x64, Octal Core RYZEN7 X3700 4.05 GHz, 64GB DDR4 RAM, GeForce RTX 3060 - 12GB GDDR6, PP2014, PP 11, P12, PS-CS4 Extended & Vue 2024.

McG.

@McGradnpa - I agree wholeheartedly. It is frustrating to see all the great contents available for Daz that I wish I could use with Poser -- not just Genesis, but also scenery, creatures, and different architectural structures

I'm still on Pro 2014, and I see zero reason to upgrade. Even less when I would have to pay full price for the newer version.It doesn't matter how much the program has been improved. All the new features are nearly useless without content to use it. Oh, sure... "La Femme" and "Le Homme". We have heard this before. "Dawn of a new era", anyone? Sure, I could use DS if I wanted, since it is free. But every time I try, it's not long before its clunky UI makes me scream and race back to Poser.

Renderosity used a picture of a muscle car when announcing Poser 12 was coming. Well, cars need roads. So, Renderosity, you better darned well make sure good quality contents is coming, or that shiny new car won't get very far.

Not going to happen - the code belongs to DAZ, and they have no reason to make it available. 'Rosity cannot force DAZ to make the code available, and it is illegal for 'Rosity to reverse engineer the code.

If you are hell-bent on getting DS content into Poser, you are going to actually have to do a little work. And it is just a little work, and it isn't even very hard.

But YOU have to do it.

I'm not smart enough to figure out things myself, and I have not found much online on how to do it. Maybe someone could come up with a script or tool to do so, and maybe have it in some place like Github or something.

D3D has a DSON script for DSON-formatted files. It didn't work perfectly all the time but it was available for free.

I don't think Genesis will ever be supported by Poser. I would say unfortunately. Still using V4 too. I've invested so much in that Figure I've got everything I need. But I feel it is time to move on to a more advanced Figure.

Yarp - author of P3DO Organizer for Poser

ssgbryan posted at 3:23AM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403166

Not going to happen - the code belongs to DAZ, and they have no reason to make it available. 'Rosity cannot force DAZ to make the code available, and it is illegal for 'Rosity to reverse engineer the code.

If you are hell-bent on getting DS content into Poser, you are going to actually have to do a little work. And it is just a little work, and it isn't even very hard.

But YOU have to do it.

This. Renderosity would probably need to pay Daz something for the rights to use the stuff natively within Poser because they have no reason to make them available for Poser just because. I mean, I don't know. With all these bridges Daz is making they might get up from their asses and make one for Poser. Honestly, Poser 12 piqued my interest quite a lot, I have never used Poser but the render engine is looking really good and it's extremely nice that it doesn't require a Nvidia card, which considering the new releases it might be a really good thing. The one reason I don't make the switch ASAP is that I have invested a TON of money on G3/G8 stuff, so even if La Femme/La Homme had as many options as those figures (and they don't), it would still be better just shelling whatever amount of money I have to for Nvidia cards than build my library from the ground up again. Still, going to keep an eye on this (and believe me when I say that the day there is official support for g3/g8 I will instabuy Poser 12 xD)

I would come back to Poser too if it had support for the new Daz stuff. However, I'm perfectly fine with using their software if I have to. But I did love Poser and I miss it sometimes :)

First there is no need for any bridges that transport DS files into Poser with a little experience you can get most stuff right into poser with a few klick even high complex environments. at first DS also used the Poser script versions later they just changed them to duf but basically the script remains the same unless there encrypted, decrypting gives agan the same structure like a Cr2 File so basically there both the same .

they would not have to pay daz to import Daz files as it already is possible and Ds gives full support for any Poser file version including Runtime import from Poser they also do not have to pay a fee to Bondware . Finaly it is just that the most experienced Creators Coders jumped over to DS and Poser has not many left that could offer a simple tool to impost any Daz model , in theory Poser would support the rigging system all the way. Also it will be hard to find someone of the few experienced to write a tutorial how to including me as it would be quiet some work so that most people can understand how to setup an Import. but to do it there is all you need built in both programs Poser and DS in both directions.

ssgbryan posted at 11:40AM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403166

Not going to happen - the code belongs to DAZ, and they have no reason to make it available. 'Rosity cannot force DAZ to make the code available, and it is illegal for 'Rosity to reverse engineer the code.

If you are hell-bent on getting DS content into Poser, you are going to actually have to do a little work. And it is just a little work, and it isn't even very hard.

But YOU have to do it.

Exactly damn it ! lol (Ive done 4 of mine since yesterday, all G8's inside of Poser 12 trial version, but actually a waste of time for me because I have no problem with Studio I actually like it for content creation, but then again I like everything PC -Mac, Max-Maya, Blender-Houdini, Up -Down, This-That , Left-Right...all the same to me when it comes to Art)

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Oh, I know you can get the figures in there, but I've also seen in those posts where people get g3/g8 in Poser 11 (I think it was that version) that bending is not the same and many other issues. I meant an officially supported way of using those figures in there pretty much as they would work in DS (rigging, morphing, fitting clothes). Which Azath apparently can't decide if it's something that needs just a little experience or if it's too hard to explain =P (just kidding, BTW, but this is the internet so I got to clarify that)

What I meant with having to pay money to Daz was related to this:

"...'DAZ has since changed their format substantially and the DSON importer plug-in has not been updated to support the newer generations of figures. Genesis 8 is the current figure, DSON only supports up to Genesis 2. It's been a long time since it was maintained,' Taylor said.

With the development of DAZ Studio, DAZ's stand-alone 3D rendering program, the plug-in was depreciated and is no longer supported by DAZ.

'Poser does not own the rights to this plug-in and therefore can not maintain it,' Taylor said, adding the plug-in 'contains parts of the DAZ Studio engine so even if we wanted we couldn't legally reproduce it. Further, We don't have any of the source code for the original plug-in making recreating it not only illegal but impractical as well'..."

From this article talking about the Python update for Poser 12, you can read the whole thing here: How Poser, Python and DSON work together

So I figured one of the "easiest" way for Poser to get better official support for those figures would be getting that plugin and update it themselves for Poser 12, but considering what's mentioned on the article I'd assume Daz would want money to share it, and that's even if they'd want to do that in the first place.

Having said that, I'm curious if you got the figure there and it's also working good for posing, fitting clothes and all that, CHK2033. Like you, I don't have an issue about using DS, but like I mentioned, the good thing about Poser is the render engine not needing Nvidia cards. Beyond that, I don't know, Poser 12 might have some other better things now or in the future, which is something I hope for. I've never understood those with the "get into this app's camp and hate the other" mentality. For me, Poser 12 catching up and even offering things Daz can't do or not very well, means healthy competition which will force Daz to improve as well. Honestly, if it weren't because I don't have time to play with everything I would also get every app and mess around with them, more so if I have to pay 200$+ and might never be able to use it with my library. I even got Carrara for like 5$ and messed around with it a bit with some G2 figures, it was nice but in the end dropped it because I can't properly use newer stuff, heh.

Clothes I used the fitting room. Posing manual (everything) I mean I could create a master dial's for parts (like eyes mouth close hands......) but I actually have too much on my plate with my own items to go all out on G8 inside of Poser .

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MazinkaiserDX posted at 2:09PM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403485

Oh .lol and my post wasn't against you, I just like responding to ssgbryan because he always seem angry too me :p

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Will V4 work with Poser 12?

Well the things I like in all these Programs is that each one has there strength and each one can have its unique stuff for it. I made the choice of preference with poser even if the Genesis are more ahead. I see in poser the strength having more Standalone figures witch might need a little more effort having in DS . But hey why have all in one sure sure more satisfaction if each has its own.

I get asked allot of times from DS users ( Can you make your figure work in DS they are so awesome ) Well I have to say no , I can't just like a genesis that could never get the same support in Poser and this is what is making it unique . So it is not only that allot of people wish having DS in Poser there are allot of Dazzies wishing having some poser in DS .

So I have to say sometimes it feels good when Dazzies tell me I wish your models would work in Daz Studio and it really happens often.

CHK2033 posted at 2:37PM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403496

MazinkaiserDX posted at 2:09PM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403485

Oh .lol and my post wasn't against you, I just like responding to ssgbryan because he always seem angry too me :p

Ah, don't worry, didn't take it against me, if anything it was helpful so I was curious about the details. xD You mention you posed it manually, which it's fine for me, even if I use a premade pose as a starting point in Daz, I like to do everything else manually for the fine tuning. What I'm curious about is if it bends correctly when you pose the character. That's the issue I usually see. Things like elbows looking like wet noodles because, sure, you get the rig, but you don't get all the correction morphs. Or at least that's what I understood from older threads I've read.

thasav posted at 2:42PM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403497

Will V4 work with Poser 12?

It works just like in Poser 11 no changes there , important is if you use Lail the Wm or automatically correct versions you can only create these in P11 due the Pyton support, so every Pyton modificated version needs to be made in Poser prior then 12. Note that you might loose the DzCreateExPFiles support on some versions once created and saved. These will just contain the already loaded morphs and not be able to be extended any further in Poser 12 so Poser 11 might be essential for these special V4 versions

just do not start thinking about how many "asstronomically" corrected V4 versions developed over the years will not work anymore , look into the future and hope there will be some for La Femme :)

MazinkaiserDX posted at 2:49PM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403500

CHK2033 posted at 2:37PM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403496

MazinkaiserDX posted at 2:09PM Thu, 05 November 2020 - #4403485

Oh .lol and my post wasn't against you, I just like responding to ssgbryan because he always seem angry too me :p

Ah, don't worry, didn't take it against me, if anything it was helpful so I was curious about the details. xD You mention you posed it manually, which it's fine for me, even if I use a premade pose as a starting point in Daz, I like to do everything else manually for the fine tuning. What I'm curious about is if it bends correctly when you pose the character. That's the issue I usually see. Things like elbows looking like wet noodles because, sure, you get the rig, but you don't get all the correction morphs. Or at least that's what I understood from older threads I've read. ..........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

Oh yeah , its not a simple thing, I myself went thru everything(body parts) so he ( Azath ) is correct you need to know what your doing, its not a simple export FBX save and your good theres a lot more to it than that. I like doing these things so it may have seem like I was saying its easy everyone can do it, but thats not the case I been doing this over 20 years ,if you do not have experience in creating figure from scratch (maybe rigged clothing as well) and its not worth it (for me anyway) as in I can place that much time and effort into my own items

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Ah, thanks for the clarification. Then I think the point stands when we say we'd like official support and it's kind of annoying when people come out saying stuff like "you can do it already". Sure, I can also just learn to make a whole figure from scratch and do everything myself in Blender but then what would be the point of apps like these? =P (the last bit not directed at you, btw xD)

Oh, I know you can get the figures in there, but I've also seen in those posts where people get g3/g8 in Poser 11 (I think it was that version) that bending is not the same and many other issues. I meant an officially supported >way of using those figures in there pretty much as they would work in DS >(rigging, morphing, fitting clothes). Which Azath apparently >can't decide

I am glad to see someone else acknowledge this.

There is a subjective ,floating standard for what various people consider having 'Genesis support" in another program (outside of Daz studio)

However the reality is this:

Genesis is only truly Genesis while residing inside Daz studio with its massive amount of JCM/HD etc morph data being live streamed into the Daz studio viewport from your Daz Data folder.

Everything else is just an approximation ,some debatably better/worse than others.?

Here are three quick renders of the same Daz genesis G3 female in three different programs.

Iclone/CC3 uses shape projection to make an Iclone Avatar mimic the appearance of any Daz figure from Millenium 4 to G8 imported into CC3 via FBX from DS.

Fully,posable animatable and can change clothing,skin,hair after import because it not actually genesis but an Iclone realtime impostor.?

"Diffeomorphic" is a free Blender Add-on that imports any G1-G8 figure with high subD levels and really good auto conversion of Iray skins to Blender Shaders it is Fully posable in Blender with some limited post import morphing options and can be converted to a Blender native rig for animation with one button.

You poser users have the Willdial script method and FBX/.obj ( such as they are)

However no matter what method you choose

the REAL 100% functioning Genesis is only Available inside Daz studio.?

My website

YouTube Channel

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My website

YouTube Channel

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My website

YouTube Channel

FWIW, and for others who might not know how to do this. I reproduced a scene with Gen 2 Male and ran through some shader experiments. In DAZ, export G2 Male, export jeans as conforming, export shoes as conforming. In P11, store character morphs and to a pose library. In P12, load G2. Apply stored pose. Load jeans and shoes, and confirm to figure. Copy morphs from G2 to jeans (wait for close to eternity for dialog to popup) and just select the morphs that apply to the lower body that are set on. (It would be nice to have a script help identify which morphs are set, to help with this process).

I used principled shader for skin and jeans, and for hair i used a 80/20 mix of principled hair shader /principled shader. Still tweaking here. Bump is too strong and I would prefer a little more specular for this scene. I am confused by SSS shaders and still looking for guidance here. Any pointers would be appreciated. I found one cycles tutorial with a complicated 3 SSS node setup representing the different layers of skin. In that tutorial he had an alpha map that affected the strength of SSS, and that worked well enough to paint a map for the ears to give them SSS strength.

The principled hair shader is producing strange reflection artifacts. It seems to be related to roughness, and requires more experimentation.

But... The point being it seems easy enough to be able to reproduce at least what I had. My next experiment is to work on a more complicated set of scenes with more complicated G2 bends. I can't stomach the DAZ interface enough to know what G2 bends/features I am missing using this workflow. I just like the variety of pre-built characters with easy customization morphs.

wolf359 posted at 4:24PM Fri, 06 November 2020 - #4403595

I am glad to see someone else acknowledge this.

There is a subjective ,floating standard for what various people consider having 'Genesis support" in another program (outside of Daz studio)

However the reality is this:

Genesis is only truly Genesis while residing inside Daz studio with its massive amount of JCM/HD etc morph data being live streamed into the Daz studio viewport from your Daz Data folder.

Everything else is just an approximation ,some debatably better/worse than others.?

Here are three quick renders of the same Daz genesis G3 female in three different programs.

Iclone/CC3 uses shape projection to make an Iclone Avatar mimic the appearance of any Daz figure from Millenium 4 to G8 imported into CC3 via FBX from DS.

Fully,posable animatable and can change clothing,skin,hair after import because it not actually genesis but an Iclone realtime impostor.?

"Diffeomorphic" is a free Blender Add-on that imports any G1-G8 figure with high subD levels and really good auto conversion of Iray skins to Blender Shaders it is Fully posable in Blender with some limited post import morphing options and can be converted to a Blender native rig for animation with one button.

You poser users have the Willdial script method and FBX/.obj ( such as they are)

However no matter what method you choose

the REAL 100% functioning Genesis is only Available inside Daz studio.?

I'm actually in the middle of deciding if getting CC3/iClone7 or not xD

Want to get into animation and seems like a great pipeline to make animations and render them inside Daz. Would even consider rendering in iClone7 for the speed but so far I can't find if it's possible to get figures with geografts from Daz into iClone7 without issues.

CC3 is also looking pretty good with all the SkinGen Pro and so on, but I did find out it has zero compatibility with grafts, sadly, so I can't use any of the stuff I already own in Daz to shape characters in CC3.

Anyway, Poser 12's best bet most likely is to get a system similar to CC3 that allows it to create "copies" of whatever Genesis figure you want but remain a La Femme/L'Homme figure and dress them up with all the stuff used for Genesis too. I'll still keep an eye on Poser 12, but for now it seems like a pass (especially if I get the iClone animation pipeline xD)

As an animated filmmaker I switched from Poser to Iclone several years ago and was retargeting Iclone motion to Daz Characters.

Since the advent of CC3 Pipeline, I have left the Daz genesis character eco system entirely and use Iclone/CC3 for Character animation and send to Blender for rendering.

https://youtu.be/igv--GMiUq4

I did copy my favorite genesis 1,2,3 shapes,skins &hairs over the CC3 Avatars and I have the facegen artist pro software for genesis and may occasionally use that to create likeness of real people from photos ,in Daz studio, before converting to CC3 avatars.

I model all of my own clothing directly for the CC3 bases as CC3 has a better clothing rigging system than Daz studio

Bondware has already stated that they will continue to support LF/LH so they are the defacto native poser figures going forward

A shape projection system to "copy" genesis 3-8 Characters onto LF/LH in poser would probably be the closest thing poser users would get to having "Genesis" 3-8 in poser.

Short of that ,(frankly unlikely event), it is FBX/.obj and the limitations they bring.

My website

YouTube Channel

Just out of curiosity does anybody ever ask Daz to make Studio work more like Poser?

EClark1894 posted at 3:37PM Sat, 07 November 2020 - #4403793

Just out of curiosity does anybody ever ask Daz to make Studio work more like Poser?

Maybe they have, features they miss from inside of Poser, just like some are asking for a feature inside of studio (G8 and the tech that makes her work in Studio)

People always want what they cant have. Human nature I guess, I want a black 911 GT3, but as much as I asked for it this year...I still don't think I'll see it under my tree this Christmas....sigh.

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CHK2033 posted at 6:09PM Sat, 07 November 2020 - #4403801

EClark1894 posted at 3:37PM Sat, 07 November 2020 - #4403793

Just out of curiosity does anybody ever ask Daz to make Studio work more like Poser?

Maybe they have, features they miss from inside of Poser, just like some are asking for a feature inside of studio (G8 and the tech that makes her work in Studio)

People always want what they cant have. Human nature I guess, I want a black 911 GT3, but as much as I asked for it this year...I still don't think I'll see it under my tree this Christmas....sigh.

Typically there are practical/tangible reasons why people are denied material things they covet such as the exclusionary monetary cost of a 911 GT3.?

My observation ,over these many years since"the split," would seem to indicate that for most, this Genesis obsession/frustration is purely a matter of refusal to venture outside of ones comfort bubble or other emotional, tribalist motivations.

And that is fine, just another aspect of human nature?

My website

YouTube Channel

I've put this in another thread, I'll put this here. Dawn 2 - built to work in Poser and Daz. In your Runtimes soonish.

qaz posted at 5:44AM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403819

I've put this in another thread, I'll put this here. Dawn 2 - built to work in Poser and Daz. In your Runtimes soonish.

I already love her. ?

La vie est éternelle. L'amour est immortel.

“Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them.”
― Marcus Aurelius,

TheAnimaGemini posted at 3:49PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403820

qaz posted at 5:44AM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403819

I've put this in another thread, I'll put this here. Dawn 2 - built to work in Poser and Daz. In your Runtimes soonish.

I already love her. ?

Gorgeous, indeed ?

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I think the solution to this is to forget all about DAZ and create some great new characters for Poser. Here's an example:

https://www.sharecg.com/v/94144/browse/11/Poser/Noname-Doll-by-Glidman

If I owned Poser I would hire Glidman to create a dozen brand new characters which would come with the next release of Poser. I'm admittedly no where near an expert, but his Noname Doll seemed like a professional creation to me. Everything you need all in one package, well organized, easy to install, easy to use.

For every new major version of Poser, let's see a dozen new characters built in to Poser created by artists the quality of Glidman. Stop investing in features that few people will use and pile on the quality characters, more and more and more, as fast as the budget will allow.

All conversation of DAZ should end. All DAZ products should be removed from this site. If Poser is to survive it needs to be filled to overflowing with Poser characters that are so satisfying that we lose all interest in DAZ.

@BabaBozo Why I love the idea of many new character for Poser, I personal would prefer one figure for all. Or in this case 2 .Dawn and LF. The rest morphs, sculpts. The possibilities are endless here. The reason why I would prefer morphs, instead of dozens of new figures is simple. Vendors can focus with rigging on 1 figure and not dozens ,where anyway only 1-2 will get strong support from the users. So instead to clutter the runtimes with new characters en mass , where users and vendors get confused, use strong base figures like LF and Dawn, improve them continuously and do sculpts and morphs for them. 1 rigging for all.

La vie est éternelle. L'amour est immortel.

“Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them.”
― Marcus Aurelius,

Ok, to each their own of course. Personally I think it's simpler, easier, and less confusing if each character is self contained.

If you wish, check out the Noname Doll. There's nothing confusing about it. It's a single folder, and everything you need is within that folder. I don't have to know anything else, find anything else, buy anything else, install anything else.

That said, I don't object to the method you prefer, so long as there is such a great wealth of Poser characters that we stop talking about DAZ.

As example, here are the new features of Poser 12.

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Poser 12.0 will update several core technologies that have evolved significantly over the five years since the last major Poser release. This includes the Cycles (Superfly) render engine and the Python embedded scripting language.

New features will include:

• Post Render Effects to speed or embellish renders for single frame or animation renders
• Integrated Download Manager for Included Content
• Improved Download Manager for Purchased Content
• FBX import/export improvements as this becomes primary method of exchanging content with other programs/tools
• Material Room overhaul with material assignment power tools
• Unimesh support features sprinkled throughout the code base
• Refactored Poser Reference Manual using RoboHelp to simplify localization and render to multiple formats (HTML, PDF, etc)

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What I'm suggesting is, forget about all this stuff that many users won't even understand.

Poser is about animating human characters. So job # 1 should be to load the program up with so many great characters that DAZ becomes irrelevant. People on the DAZ forum should be saying things like, "I'm just going to have to shell out the money for Poser because the characters are so much better." So long as Poser users are whining about an inability to use DAZ characters, Poser is in trouble.

1. DAZ is free. And it offers more popular content.

2. Poser costs money. And it offers less popular content.

(And, after you pay the money you don't actually own the software).

Until the above equation is substantially changed, people are going to keep chanting "Poser is dead" and vendors will keep bailing on Poser. That's a death spiral that will only end when Poser content is superior to DAZ content.

Forget about Python. Characters, characters, characters!

lol, do you know the person you are addressing go's way, way, back, Im sure you probably don't know this, but its just amusing to me to see you try and preach to her.

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BabaBozo posted at 6:41PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403863

1. DAZ is free. And it offers more popular content.

2. Poser costs money. And it offers less popular content.

(And, after you pay the money you don't actually own the software).

Just my two cents:

Ok, daz is free, but with less tools. And daz with Poser's equivalent tools costs money, too... it's all the same with their genesis families: a lot of options, to buy, buy and buy. I felt the same with Dawn: really interesting, but even with many, many and many options bought, still less possibilities as Vic4 + Morphs++. Put this Vic4 in sasha-16's world and it's enough to have more details to correct and truly decent bending.

I often see people starting with daz' free studio, and ending to pay as much as poser to get what they end up to need. And then staying with an old genesis family because of money (how I understand...), and that's something daz doesn't really like.

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Y-Phil posted at 6:53PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403877

BabaBozo posted at 6:41PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403863

1. DAZ is free. And it offers more popular content.

2. Poser costs money. And it offers less popular content.

(And, after you pay the money you don't actually own the software).

Just my two cents:

Ok, daz is free, but with less tools. And daz with Poser's equivalent tools costs money, too... it's all the same with their genesis families: a lot of options, to buy, buy and buy. I felt the same with Dawn: really interesting, but even with many, many and many options bought, still less possibilities as Vic4 + Morphs++. Put this Vic4 in the free sasha-16's world and it's enough to have even more details to correct and ways to move her, and a truly decent bending system.

I often see people starting with daz' free studio, and ending to pay as much as poser to get what they end up to need. And then staying with an old genesis family because of money (how I understand...), and that's something daz doesn't really like.

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Sasha ? Wait, you do know Vicky is property of Daz right ?

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CHK2033 posted at 7:53PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403885

Sasha ? Wait, you do know Vicky is property of Daz right ?

Yep! ? Sasha is a weight-mapped character, built to accept all the vic4-related morphologies: base, morphs++, aiko4, TG4, etc... There's absolutely nothing illegal, because Karina only provides sasha-16 + a lot of scripts, but you must own daz items.

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Y-Phil posted at 1:00PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403888

CHK2033 posted at 7:53PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403885

Sasha ? Wait, you do know Vicky is property of Daz right ?

Yep! ? Sasha is a weight-mapped character, built to accept all the vic4-related morphologies: base, morphs++, aiko4, TG4, etc... There's absolutely nothing illegal, because Karina only provides sasha-16 + a lot of scripts, but you must own daz items.

And every poser user who wanted to use her "if" she was placed in Poser would have to go over to Daz and purchase vicky she's not always free, from Daz and the morphs from Daz, how is that helping Bondware ? just saying I thought they would have learned their lesson about depending on another company's figures by know to do something like that. I have no issues with it just I like to look at things from both sides I mean what ever happens I'm still going to use who ever in whatever whenever I want. But it just would seem weird from their point to do that.

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CHK2033 posted at 8:05PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403890

Y-Phil posted at 1:00PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403888

CHK2033 posted at 7:53PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403885

Sasha ? Wait, you do know Vicky is property of Daz right ?

Yep! ? Sasha is a weight-mapped character, built to accept all the vic4-related morphologies: base, morphs++, aiko4, TG4, etc... There's absolutely nothing illegal, because Karina only provides sasha-16 + a lot of scripts, but you must own daz items.

And every poser user who wanted to use her "if" she was placed in Poser would have to go over to Daz and purchase vicky she's not always free, from Daz and the morphs from Daz, how is that helping Bondware ? just saying I thought they would have learned their lesson about depending on another company's figures by know to do something like that.

I help rendo by buying stuff for vic4, i've passed through every version of Poser and will continue. I've LF/LH pro as well, but I'm not using them as often as I'd like because of clothes (and money - lol), but I know that that'll come ?

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She's ok if it works for you then that's all that really matters anyway. just like any thing, the only thing that matters is that it works for you.

wait is she a morph or a complete character that still needs vicky (like a morph???) like the old one from RDNA (weightmapped Vicky)

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CHK2033 posted at 8:32PM Sun, 08 November 2020 - #4403892

She's ok if it works for you then that's all that really matters anyway. just like any thing, the only thing that matters is that it works for you.

wait is she a morph or a complete character that still needs vicky (like a morph???) like the old one from RDNA (weightmapped Vicky)

Basically, it's a full character, but with very few morphs (everything moves: arms, head, etc...), as it's designed to accept vic4 base morphs. And if you have morphs++, use them, but it's not mandatory. By the time, I bought rdna's wmm, but this weight-mapped version is the best i've found till now.

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Well now that Rendo is owner of the new Poser every little Production of Poser assets will be a gift for them, no matter where they are sold. the more stores support Poser assets the better for Poser, even better if Creators start to rebuild the little site stores with the Poser assets this will bring more versatility. Allot of stores closed and most small ones jumped to DAZ not selling any Poser assets anymore . So this would be the future to go , the way it is now not to mention any external store in the forums is sure the wrong way to Promote Poser as the small stores do Promote Rendo the do not censure there link. So the more the better to have new Creators and customers .

Right now the Poser section here is looking a little like CP did in times and there is allot to be done that it gets better.

Ok, to each their own of course. Personally I think it's simpler, easier, and less confusing if each character is self contained. If you wish, check out the Noname Doll. There's nothing confusing about it. It's a single folder, and everything you need is within that folder. I don't have to know anything else, find anything else, buy anything else, >install >anything else.

Are you a prolific content creator who will support all of those stand alone poser figures with new content when people want that one-off"Doll" to wear a different outfit or hair??

Please go read about the history of third party poser figures.

I develop for the CC3 bases I make one outfit and any Iclone avatar male or female can wear it.

A universal figure eco system where the base figures can share all content is the only way forward to get developers supporting your program.

Poser is about animating >human characters

What are ones options to make a poser figure speak alot of dialog for an animated film?

When poser 11 was released the erstwhile product manager("nerd") pubicly posted that the state of the poser animation tools "makes him sad"?

So job # 1 should be to load the program up with so many great characters >that DAZ becomes irrelevant..... So long as Poser users are whining about an >inability to use DAZ characters, >Poser is in trouble.

Well bondware has made it clear that LF/LH are the official poser figures going forward and people still have a new Dawn version coming it seems and thier massive hoards of DAZ vicky4 content, so don't dispair...there are options for you guys.?

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CHK2033, my business experience goes back to 1980. Forty years. Were any of you even alive back then? :-) I built a net startup from scratch by myself, sold it to a big dog, and retired at age 45. Which is why I have the time to fiddle around with silly stuff like Poser.

That said, of course anything I post can reasonably be debated.

Heres the thing, If I explain it to you then I would be doing the same thing you are doing,(derailing the thread with off topic nonsense)

So unless you have some way to help the OP get G8 inside of Poser or can explain to them why it cant be done, please go derail another thread

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@wolf359 What I said. No one vendor will support so many new figures. LF/LH and Dawn/Dusk should stay as base characters and just build an écosystème around them.

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I hate to break this news to users but SASHA-16 scripts don't work in Poser 12. If you have characters created pre-P12 then those characters will continue to work but converting clothing to fit SASHA-16. I hope Karina is able to make updates. This will delay any development on Michael 4 if that project is still viable.

hborre posted at 4:11PM Tue, 10 November 2020 - #4404065

I hate to break this news to users but SASHA-16 scripts don't work in Poser 12. If you have characters created pre-P12 then those characters will continue to work but converting clothing to fit SASHA-16. I hope Karina is able to make updates. This will delay any development on Michael 4 if that project is still viable.

Originally, it exists a folder, named "karina" in the program's ":Python:poserScripts" folder. In my case, it's still under SM's Poser 11 folder. So I've just moved it in the corresponding folder, but in my Sasha-16 runtime to make it works. Just to be sure, I've followed the steps for Sase's Nicole:

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I've already resolved the problem. I needed to copy the Python Script folder to the Poser 12 runtime. It works well now.

Just a quick side question.

I've used poser up through Poser Pro 2012, bought a copy of Poser pro 2014 whe it came out but Tried Daz studio and haven't gone back.

Now I own hundreds upon hundreds of $ worth of G8 resources.

Since I wasn't eligable for the discount price I would need to pay full price ( a heck of a lot of $ during pandemic for a hobbyist) and NOT be able to use any of my existing g8 resources, leaving me with whatevers included + some old V4 stuff (which still works under Pro 2012 or 2014 if I chose to install it I assume) so why should I ever even bother to pay all that up front $ for the program and then have to start building a whole new library of resources, for even more money?

It'd be a no brainer if I could just load up and use all my G8 stuff I've got and continue to buy more G8 stuff and if something new popped up for whatever character the new poser uses thats good add that to it.

But I can't see spending the up front cash for somethign that would basically require me to duplicate purchase new versions of much of what I already have for Daz & G8.

What am I missing?

What would ever make Poser worth the cost?

For you? Probably nothing. Like you said, you are invested in DAZ. And that's fine. For those of us who never jumped on genesis for one reason or other, a lot of reasons.

(I also typed a lot more here, but then I decided, that., after all, this has been hashed out so many times it's just not worth hashing it out again.)

Why would I ever go to the Daz3d forum and post about how I can't use poser native figures in Daz Studio? I mean, what's in it for me? They gonna pay me for that? You convince me that I should use Daz3d and pay for all that G8 stuff up front when I got $$$ invested in V4.

Do you see how stupid your post sounds now?

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I never had any problem with Sasha because she had a runtime of her own, and I just had to attach it to Poser 12.

But I wonder if there might be a problem if someone doesn't have Sasha, and has to install her from scratch. Do the scripts Karina wrote for that still work?

I think the only reason a DS user would want to buy Poser is if, for some reason, they wanted to use Poser-only figures like La Femme and L'Homme.

There's someone who has uploaded a bunch of La Femme freebies to Free Stuff in DS format. I really don't get that, but I guess he must love La Femme.

randym77 posted at 8:44PM Sat, 14 November 2020 - #4404610

I never had any problem with Sasha because she had a runtime of her own, and I just had to attach it to Poser 12.

But I wonder if there might be a problem if someone doesn't have Sasha, and has to install her from scratch. Do the scripts Karina wrote for that still work?

The Sasha-16 2019 edition installation will still work in Poser 12. I committed a blunder where I linked my Sasha runtime to P12 but failed to copy the Python Script folder from P11 to P12. As a result, I wasn't able to load the base figure nor any scripts from the Library. My savviness traced down the problem quickly and found the solution.

Interesting. I did not copy my Python folder over, but I do have both the Poser 11 and Poser 12 default runtimes attached to Poser 12. If I detach the Poser 11 runtime, will Sasha no longer work?

My assessment, Sasha-16 2019 Edition scripts will not work. It needs to find those scripts located in the default runtimes. Sasha-16, on the other hand, created prior to P12 and saved back to the Poser Library will retain all its functionality.

randym77 posted at 6:13AM Sun, 15 November 2020 - #4404646

Interesting. I did not copy my Python folder over, but I do have both the Poser 11 and Poser 12 default runtimes attached to Poser 12. If I detach the Poser 11 runtime, will Sasha no longer work?

Maybe move (or install) Sasha into the poser 12 runtime.

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I'm actually not having any problem with Sasha installed in her own runtime, which is attached to both Poser 11 and Poser 12. She works just fine in both, and I didn't have to move or copy any Python folders.

Do you have both versions of Sasha-16? The original release has no problems in P12, it's the 2019 Edition that seems to have objections. And this way on 2 different machines. Anyway, I am glad to report that everything has been straightened out and the scripts indeed are happy under both environments.

I only have the 2019 edition of Sasha. I could not get the earlier version installed.