Hi Gang, We are creating areas for most of the forums where we will store various resources and goodies. Please look through the New Poser area above. And If you feel you have something that you think we should host here. Please contact us. Thanks, ScottA

above where?

Ai!!! Button 1) Quick links to tutorials... subsections: a) BASIC interface of Poser and a Poser "dictionary". So many new terms... There are still terms I don't understand the meaning of. But as a newbie, - I pulled my hair over a lot of stuff... IK Chains Morph target. Spawn morps (remember a lot of the users have English as second language... I had to look up a lot of terms in the "normal" dictionary, - simply because Poser is a very different piece of software) button b) Poser render of the week (with previous weeks listed) I think this would be a good place to have renders that are "pure poser" renders. little post work ... etc. button c) Tips 'n Tricks (time savers, - neat short cuts for great effects) etc. Hmm.... I'm sure I can come up with a button D and E lol But what I do think is that the backroom should really put the poser technique in the center :) OK... that was my .02 Norwegian Kroner. :) Britt

maybe you should put up an L button for the good doctor?

Have you tested the page with different browsers? I don't see the text pop up when I mouse over the buttons. OS: XP. Browser: Netscape 6. It doesn't work well with IE 6, either. I do see the Alt tags if I keep the mouse still, but that's it.

I don't see any pop-up text. (Mac OS 9.1, browser=IE 5.0) - JimX

Crescent, What do you mean it doesn't work well What exactly about it doesn't work? Ron, It's empty until I get content from the members here. The text that pops up is simply the text that pops up, generated from the alt tags. I liked the look of the buttons without any text covering them. So I left them clean and added alt tag descriptions to them. It should only take a second or two before they pop up if you leave you mouse cursor over them. I was under the impression that alt tags work in all browsers. I'll add text to the buttons if I have to. But I was hoping I could leave them clean. They look much better that way. ScottA

alt does not always work with all browsers in all scenarios .. you can also use title in addition to alt(or is it 'name'?) but that, too, does not work with all browsers. As Crescent said, if i hold the mouse still over the image, i do see the alt tag(using IE 5.5), but i think since there are people from many countries who use this forum, with many levels of finances(who may be using older browsers) and skills, that a simple straightforward interface would be best. At the very least, have the buttons as you want them on the left but put text links at the bottom for those who cannot view the buttons on the left as you intend for them to. Namaste, odyssey

i think i should have been more clear. What i meant by alt tags not working in all scenarios .. alt tags do not always "pop up" for a viewer to read. They were not created for that purpose. They were created so that (one) people who have their graphics turned off could still follow navigation and see the general layout of the page and (2) the computer software of blind people navigating your pages would have some source of information to read. Also i was right the first time, though all browsers do not support it, it is the title="" attribute(not name) and not the alt="" attribute that was introduced in html 4.0 to provide information about any visible element. But if you decided to use the title attribute, which again does not work on all browsers, you would still need to keep the alt attributes in, for the browser readers and browser reading software. o.

One other thing about alt attributes .. they only work on mouseover so those restricted(because of a disability or for whatever reason) to keyboard control will never see them. Oh, also, it is not the alt attribute that causes the popup .. it is the browser itself(in IE it is called a tooltip) and not all browsers have them. i am not saying lose it if that is the way you want to go. i am just saying that it would be wise to add text links to the bottom of the page as well for those who cannot view the navigation as you wish for them to. Okay, i am finally done on that subject .. sorry i did not fit this into one post but i was doing three things at once(not wise for me) and i kept losing my train of thought.

Thanks for the title info. I added it to the code. ScottA

You're welcome .. but bottom text links in addition to the button navigation still gets my vote so that the page will be accessible to everyone who wants to learn, no matter their disability.

ok...I'll see what I can do. I like to be different. Maybe the world isn't ready for me yet ;-) ScottA

Oh, no it isn't that at all. i like different as well .. you should see some of the page designs i have made. i would just hate to be left out of the learning loop if i did not have the same physical or computer related capabilities as others did. .. perhaps you could have a link instead that said something to the effect that if you cannot see the mouseover text go "here" and link that to a plain page that just has text links on it .. that way your page is the way you want it and those who cannot 'read' the text on the navs have a place to go to get the info ..

Ron, The alt tags that Scott placed do tell the Jaws software .. though something a bit more descriptive might help like "to the tutorial page" instead of just "tutorials" though i imagine most who use such software are used to things like that. As far as there not being anything on the pages .. that was the whole purpose of Scott posting this this thread i would imagine. The pages will house the information that those who come to this forum turn in to Scott and Jeff, so there could not very well 'be' anything there until we are told about it and turn things in. At least this is my take on it.

sorry, i meant alt attributes, not alt tags .. there's no such thing as alt tags .. lol.

this is what i see... and i hate it when i have to touch the button first to see where it leads. i don't want to play games i want to be informed. winxp pro with ie 5.0

and btw, why not stick to renderosity's corporate design? i want also my colour preferences to show up if it's possible. the banner above (poser sprinter) reveals plain nothing! someone has to go there and click it to find out what it's all about? not very beginner friendly.

How many blind people render images in Poser, and why?

Just thought I'd ask.

-Jeff

btw2: i think it's a great idea! ;)

ron, no offense, but your lack of humour is just staggering :-)

aaargh... :-)

He's baaaaccck......

Good Lord. Ron, you should write a book: 1001 Ways to Massacre a Thread Publish it in Braille, too. Anyhow Scott, I gotta agree with the text deal. When I don't see words, I tend to expect ALT messages, tool tips, whatever, or maybe I go into the source to see what's goin on. I kinda like baffling web pages. Keeps me on my toes. ;) But for the maot part, simple is good. Easy is good. People in a hurry, or people who just want to get right at something probably prefer as much text as possible.

Works okay here (in both IE 6 and Netscape 6.2) - and if you wish, go ahead and add contact info for free stuff hosting... I don't mind a bit. That way, folks with free stuff but no host can find one. /P

Works fine with OS X (10.1.3 and the latest Java update) and Mozilla 0.9.8.

Attached Link: http://www.webpagesthatsuck.com/badnavigation.html

Not to offend you, ScottA, but you may want to read Vince Flanders' article on unlabelled buttons (a.k.a. "Mystery Meat Navagation".) http://www.webpagesthatsuck.com/badnavigation.html

Ah, there you go Crescent, I was just going to comment on mystery meat navigation. It is a poor design concept to say the least (no offense scott), frankly why not use text only links? This site is graphic intensive enough lol A little text won't ruin the buttons any, but mystery meat certainly does. - now if I can just find the buttons....

3-D Arena | Instagram | Facebook

I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.
-Galileo

Hey I found it! I didn't know the banner was the link, just thought it was a banner..... Geesh ron, with all that driving how do you find time to be online? I hate driving...

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I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.
-Galileo

The Banner? I get it now. I also went to WPTS. I haven't been there in a long time. Well, thanks, now I have to rethink some web pages. Ignorance was blissful.

Someone please fix this navigation! Between this and the Marketplace page, this site has fallen into the hands of poor designers. And i'm trying VERY hard to be polite about it. The banner at the top of the page here is jaggie & huge, and doesn't even clue you into it being a button, for cat's sake. i had to stumble over this thread to figure it out! The fact that so many people are confused should clue you in, designers. And that pop-up page--the content will be great, but the left-hand framed untitled buttons are just wrong--who would want to spend time waiting for the danged tool tips? Tool tips??? If you're going to be cute, you need better feedback--rollovers that light up & give text immediately. Better yet, just label the danged things. Why spend so much time being cutesy? AAARRRRGGGHHHH.

lol at nan! I have to agree with you 100% on this.

3-D Arena | Instagram | Facebook

I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.
-Galileo

OK, I'm weird, I didn't see anything wrong! lol There are only 5 things to click lol seems simple to me but, I'm weird! lol Does this mean we will soon have some challenges?

Poser 9 SR3  and 8 sr3
=================
Processor Type:  AMD Phenom II 830 Quad-Core
2.80GHz, 4000MHz System Bus, 2MB L2 Cache + 6MB Shared L3 Cache
Hard Drive Size:  1TB
Processor - Clock Speed:  2.8 GHz
Operating System:  Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit 
Graphics Type:  ATI Radeon HD 4200
•ATI Radeon HD 4200 integrated graphics 
System Ram:  8GB 

I don't see anything extra on the top of this page. There is the usual R'osity banner, MP banner and the regular 8 links. What am I missing here? I'm on a Mac using Netscape 4.7.8.

Aeriol

Getting back at ScottA's initial question about WHAT to host, I'd say that in the Poser Forum (and I guess in the other forums too) a lot of valuable information given in the postings disapear behind the horizon. This obviously results in people asking the same questions over and over again. One can spend hours of searching and reading posts online to find answers to (sometimes trivial) problems, often left with comments on comments which are commented by people who have been commented. I think it would be useful to create some base of posted information of Novice, Intermediate, Experienced and Guru info on the various subjects discussed: Texturing, Morphing, Character Creation, MAT/MOR creation, etc. This could be an online base, but also a monthly ZIP of posts in TXT or PDF format, this way useful info gets centralized. I know this entails quite some work, so, Im volunteering for the job... Maxx :-)

Pilot, seems they took it down last night. ((whew!)) No worries, you're not crazy.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/~pzr/PBackroom/Poser.html

HeHeHe. Yes...I took it down. I got beat up enough about it. ;-) You guys think this is design confusing? You should have seen my first idea. ;-) This backroom space is for you...the members. So I want it to be designed the way YOU like it. I've changed it to something more traditional using text. Like you asked for. Take a look and tell me if you like this better. ScottA

That looks good Scott. Just out of curiosity, why didn't you go with your original design which you previwed to us in the mod forum? I liked that one alot.

Thanks, Scott. Sorry for the bruises i caused. :^(

NP nfredman...this is for you.
I want you to like it.

Mike.
They would have skinned me alive. ;-)

ScottA

Ah yes, there is that, afterall. ;)

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/~pzr/PBackroom/Poser.html

Here's the link Ron. I don't have a banner here for it yet. I've got other plans for that. No buttons on the nav bar on this one. Just text links. If you prefer buttons with text on them. Let me know and I'll change it. ScottA

Scott, this looks good also :) I liked them both.

Poser 9 SR3  and 8 sr3
=================
Processor Type:  AMD Phenom II 830 Quad-Core
2.80GHz, 4000MHz System Bus, 2MB L2 Cache + 6MB Shared L3 Cache
Hard Drive Size:  1TB
Processor - Clock Speed:  2.8 GHz
Operating System:  Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit 
Graphics Type:  ATI Radeon HD 4200
•ATI Radeon HD 4200 integrated graphics 
System Ram:  8GB 

Thanks Ron. Taken care of. Yes, We would like people to send us the content for this on a voluntary basis. It's just something extra that Renderosity is offering to our members. Most of the forums have these backrooms. Take a look at them to see what they are all about and what's on them. It will probably evolve, and things will be added to it over time. We will probably also use it to handle things like challenges, contests, moderator announcements to the community, etc. ScottA

I'm glad you brought this up Ron, Currently we are thinking about how we want to handle the tutorials. They will be in .zip format and will not displayed through HTML here live. In order to keep the bandwidth usage down. We are working on a template for people to use when they submit a tutorial. We are still working on that part. Some people will not like having to use a template. So we are not sure if we will enforce this at this point. For now. We are just looking for people who already have tutorials (or are intersted in making one) and are interested in re-writing them in our format so we can post it here on our server. The Tips&Tricks thing is wide open. If anyone has something that would belong in there, wether it's a text tip, or a mini tutorial with some graphics. Please IM me and we'll talk about making it happen. The "Links" section will be dedicated to the messages that are posted here in the forum. Not people's web sites. If anyone feels that they know of some useful links that are here in our forum that belong in our backroom area so people will learn from them. Please either IM, Or e-mail them to me. There is no big rush for any of this stuff. We will play around with this whole thing and try to have some fun with it. ScottA

scott, this is better ;) if i may add another bruise, i'd like it black letters on white (or grey), it's easier to read. thanx for your flexibility!

oh, and concerning FAQs: you'll have to wait for a week or so, then you'll have the 95% of them asked: my favorites: - how do i delete xxx dots? - why is the texture not showing? - which is the right picture size for a print - where can i download vicky for free (ok, last one doesn't count ;]P i asked them ALL!! heh, heh...

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/~pzr/PBackroom/Poser.html

I've changed the colors to white with black letters. I'm not sure I like it this way. But I want to at least try everyones suggestions out as much as I can. Will everyone please take a look and let me know if this is better or worse? Thanks, ScottA

i'm a fan of sites with white backgrounds--easier to read, though not as pretty for pictures. The link text in the left frame could be a whole lot smaller--size=5 is rather too large--plain old default 2, bolded, would be fine, yes? Too bad we don't have a Renderosity logo thingum that goes the width of the column. :^) i'll try to stop now...

i like it :)

You're doing just fine nfredman. It was a good suggestion. Keep leading me in the right direction folks. ScottA

Gads, I hate to say this, Scott... but the black on white? Looks a little boring. I realize I'm looking at a WIP, but still, one of the things about Rsity as it stands now is the ability to customize what's a very nicely styled GUI. The small page we see at the link looks a little too retro. Maybe if we saw an expanded prototype so we could really see how it all looks with the bells and whistles? I'm sure that would make all the difference.

LOL. I had tons of bells and whistles VS. Everyone made me remove them. :-) This is going to evolve slowly. It will probably change a little as we go. I need content folks. A couple people sent me some ideas. But I need much more. Especially a bunch of forum links if anyone has them stored someplace. I'd love it if you e-mailed them to me. ScottA scottasba@aol.com

Attached Link: http://www.cooltuna.com/poser/index.html

Poor Scott! Torn between the Scylla and Charybdis of web design! (fancy vs. utilitarian) Oh, have i been *there*. If you scroll down on the link supplied, past the advert pics, there are links to two little tutorials, "Ten Steps to a Poser Render," and "A Short Hair Painting Tutorial." Beneath those on that page are some Q & A Faq things to pick and choose from.

Looks like I'm not the only one without ANY idea about what's going on, but it looks like they created something which is completely invisible on Mac. All IE, NN and iCab will not show anything, and I haven't found anything in the HTML pages as well - so I guess the board checks for our browser/platform and refuse to create the code for Macs. Under normal circumstances I guess someone would have answered to the (Mac) requests above, but since the C&D was closed they're all too busy fighting their little flame wars. I guess it doesn't make sense to ask again like... AHEM... IS THERE ANYBODY STILL LISTENING? No?... OK,... so the program now returns to the previous debate.

Just FYI Scott this Screen capture was taken at 4:58PM east coast time USA

On a Macintosh running MAC OSX with Microsoft Internet Explorer 5.5

My website

YouTube Channel

The clock says 4:49. ;)

Martin. The reason the previous MAC problem was never addressed was because I stopped using the code that was supposedly not working for MAC users. This new page layout is straight, No non-sense, no fancy pantsy, No pop-up, cutie pie HTML. I don't have a MAC to test it on. But I see that it does work for Wolf359. What OS version and web browser are you using? Help me to figure out why it's not working for you. ScottA

This is what it looks like on my screen - I can't find any extra buttons anywhere. I'm running OS 9.0.4 and IE 5.0 or iCab 4.7.1. Normally Java is turned off all of the time, but turning it on makes no difference. It looks like it only works under OS-X but not with any 9.x.

martin, follow the link in #58

OK that one is working - I guess it was a misunderstanding by me. The initial posts gave the impression that some new buttons appeared somewhere on the normal forum pages. So - you first included something that didn't work on Mac, then you removed it, and now we're only talking about the extra link in #58 - right?

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/~pzr/PBackroom/Poser.html

Lol. This is kinda fun. I don't think anyone has gone through designing a web site by listening to this many people. It's kinda like a team of live Beta testers. Martin, Here's the link again to that page we're talking about. Let me know if you can't see the page that this link takes you to. We will eventually have a banner link posted permanently on the top of the Poser forum so if you click on it. It will take you there. Take a look at the top of the MAX,Rhino,LW forums to see working examples that are already running. ScottA

Looks like I really created confusion... :-) Of course there is nothing wrong with this link on my Mac, after all it's a perfectly plain HTML page... In order to excuse myself... just look at the posts #1 and #3 - they imply that there should be some new "area" link somewhere "above" the page, and this mysterious "area" was missing on my Mac. It still is missing, if you're curious. However, the link that you started to give in #50, #58 and #72 works perfectly fine, although I still think it is not the same link that was mentioned in the very early posts...(?)

PS: And the Links in MAX & Co. exist and work as well... :-)

no, the banner with "poser" in it disappeared rather quickly :) scott, i was once developing an ci for a company with three equally powerfull (and with equally different taste regarding graphic design) bosses. AND IT WAS HELL ON EARTH, hehehe :) so i feel for you...