Constructive Criticism Wanted This is an image my GF recently did with our digi-cam. All the post work by me in Photoshop 6. The image was good, but the intent was to catch the dew on the flower. In full color, this just wasnt working. I had the old do it black and white to emphasize texture idea, but all attempts left it flat. So today I started messing around with the channel mixer, and this is the result. Would any of you have done this deferent? Let me know. Thanks

Well, I'm a contrast freak personally, always have been, so please dont take it as an insult to your image when I say "I'd like to see it contrastier". If you were able to get the texture of the dew on the flower (mainly the "outlines" of the dew drops themselves) separated, and have those "outlines" upped in the contrast department, it would emphasize the drops themselves, which in my eyes are begging to be the central focus of this image rather than the flower itself. That and maybe a nice yellow duotone to warm it up a bit. Nice focussing on the inner buds of the flower, those are a bitch to get right.

I've often found myself lately referring to points of an image 'confusing my eye' - I guess when I look at pictures now I don't concentrate on them I just 'see' them - I know, sounds wierd, but to me it's just my subconcious saying why it likes a picture or doesn't before I break that down into rational technical aspects. What my eye is saying here is that the petals behind the main flower create a bit too much of an extended 'whiteness' away from the middle of the flower you're concentrating on. With just that single flower by itself your eye would be left without anything else to distract it. Also, like Slynk, I'd love to see a little more contrast, but think without the back petals it wouldn't be necessary anyways as the flower would be standing out more. Hope this makes sense and is heading somewhere towards what you asked for..... cheers. (",) btw, sorry, I did neglect to say that I really do like the flower itself, and love the dof you've caught here!

This is the original

Slynky: This is what I was trying to do, just couldnt get their. I do agree that the dew drops are the focus of the image. I worked with duo tones and tri tones last night, trying to get the yellow cast, but wasnt working for me.

Alpha: No I dont mind at all. In this version I did not go for the levels at all, strate to the channel mixer, and it was the only tool I used. As I was responding to Slynky, last night I worked the levels, and then went to duo and tri tones, I dont remember if I worked the mid-tone slider though, I usually dont. What I didnt do was go back to levels after the conversion to grayscale/duotone, simply never occurred to me. As far as the curves, Im trying to learn this beast of a tool, and use the levels less. Never thought of using both.

JordyArt: And therein lies the art. The eye sees, and comprehends, trying to rationalize it, well that lessen it somehow. The two flowers together do cause a single field of white, I see what you mean. And it only abstracts the shape of the flower.

Now to all, in SueOs post, above mine, this is what I was referring to. I needed help, and asked for it specifically, and got it. Thank you. This is a great forum, and part of what makes it great is the sometimes, whimsical images and posts. The posting new stuff you had some fun with. I thought that by making another Critique it would make it easer for the folks to ask hey lam-blast my image, I need some help as well as I like this photo, but what can I do to make it better. Running such a forum would be a headache for the Mods though. Doing a separate forum would, I believe, after some thought, take away from this one. So now Im not sure if the best solution would be just to ask for help when you want it.

Thanks Alpha, Now to try it on my own. By the way the GF says she likes it.

Quinn that's a pretty flower, and I like Alpha's adjusted versions with the explainations of how he got there (I always like to know how its done). In reference to Sue's informal poll, I've always gotten constructive advice when asking for it, if I've posted an image just for fun, my friends here have always "humoured" me and laughed (so I don't feel too pathetic) lol...and if I've posted a truly fantastic image for everyone to go wow...oh hang on, that hasn't happened yet! I think this forum can encompass all of these functions and still keep chugging along rather well... Looking foward to seeing more of your posts so we can give them a spanking! ;-)>

Sorry, hang on, it was Randyrives that wanted the spanking...my apologies Quinn!

It is really difficult "critiqueing" as the critiquers and critiquees all have a wide level of experience and opinions. That is what can cause such critiquing to turn bad real fast. What you have done here is excellent; first offered a self-evaluation, and asked for specific guidance. Ultimately we are all dust struggling to improve, and critiquing the critiquer is a learning experience also. I can't claim to be more than just a beginner, so take this for what it is worth: First, Jordy's right about the overall confusion. Simplifying will force the viewer to look at what you want the viewer to look at. It is best if you can do this in camera, emphasizing the dew drops along the way with angle of the light. If you are forced to Photoshop, marvelous things can occur, depending on how much effort you want to put in. Here I brought out the dew by simply increasing contrast and brightness. This caused the yellow to become too saturated, so I then reduced the saturation. Then sharpened.

As for B&W, using the channel mixer is (my opinion) the best way to convert from color to B&W. It allows you all the control of using filters to emphasize or attenuate different image tones, (darken sky, bring out folliage...). Here 100% Green channel seemed to work the best.

funny how from the beginning of the thread the first pic started in b/w...then slowly gained color with alpha's sepia type tone..all the way to his sharp yellow, then went back down to misha's more natural color to b/w...anyway...so far I really enjoyed mishas version of the flower, she changed the color balance quite drastically to the point of it having a total different mood and the dews came out quite visible too...good one.

I like the images with the single flower much better than the double flower images. the details stand out better, it's eaiser to tell what i'm looking at. and of the black/white and color images Misha posted, i like the color best, just because it's much eaiser for me to glance at and get what feels like a complete impression where the black and white one, even after I study it for a bit i'm still not completely sure what i'm looking at (if that makes sense...probably not)

It seems to me that there's a problem with the angle of the
lighting on the flower itself. Was this taken with a flash
unit? Because the angle of the light is close to parallel
with the line of sight, it seems to be reflecting right
straight back through the water droplets, which tends to
illuminate them too much, so they don't stand out. Also,
since the petals of the flower have a sheen of their own
the bright reflection from them contributes to keeping
the droplets from standing out as well.

Would it be possible to reshoot this flower with a different
lighting angle? If you can do it with just natural light
you can use a white card (like you'd get from a package of
new t-shirts or undershorts) to brighten up the flower. Hold
it at different angles just out of the frame using the shiny
white side as a reflector. Take a bunch of shots with the
card at different agnles so you can choose the best one to
work with.

my 2. i'm a bit of a contrast freak myself.... the color version was done in Lab, the b&w was converted from Lab, and the weird one was done using a gradient map. All images have been sharpened and a magic contrast technique was applied to bring out the dew. BTW, if you havent used gradient mapping give it a shot. Its defintely the most interesting way to make a duotone, as it much more understandable and gives you easily controllable results. Duotone mode is great when you have to go on press, but it blows for just laying down color on an image.

my 3

my4

Ah, eartho! I was hoping you'd jump in here and give us a LAB demo. Thank you.

ya, i just couldnt help myself!
It was a welcome 10 min break from this @#$*ing project!
Soon, soon, i will be done, and then i can get back to my lazy ol' life.

a little contrast, intensity and saturation adjustment in photo-paint9 :)