Allow me to introduce Yayoi, a brand new character for Victoria 2.0! I've just uploaded her to testing so she should be in the store soon.

Yayoi has been faithfully shaped into a true anime/manga style character. And who better to do it then someone who actually knows their stuff? I absolutely love anime and I'm training myself to become a manga artist in the real world, so you can be sure I know the ins and outs of this style.

Big eyes, small mouth? Sorry, thats not all there is to making a great anime character! Believe it or not, the secret to developing her face was to watch her profile more then anything else! Its about the slope of the nose, the strength of the chin and how far forward the lower half of the face comes out. And when it comes down to it, after all that she's still got to be pretty too.

And you know, an anime character shouldn't have a realistic body - she should have an anime one! Yayoi sports an extremely compressed torso and small waist, with sensitively curved hips and long legs. I also slimmed down her neck and I gave her slightly bigger hands and feet. It might sound strange, but bigger hands and feet recalls how a child is disproportionate, and adds to the overall cuteness of the character.

Included in this package are 4 face files (.fc2), and one MOR (.pz2) file. I wanted to keep things simple! The four faces are basically the same except for some slight variations and I've included them to provide a starting point. The MOR file is for transforming the body.

she is very cute...do her breasts seem a bit far apart for being so plump? Or is that an anime trait...I don't have much experience with the tradition. Bia http://www.ileora.net

Very interesting character - I like these proportions very much and the face morph is lovely. Nice one!! :-) -dg

she does look a whole lot nicer thamn aiko.

WOW, I like her... any other pics you could show us...

beautiful, I love the figure! very good form. :)

I can certainly gather up a few more pictures. In fact, I'll take requests for what you'd like to see more of. :) Also, I forgot to mention this in the original post, but Yayoi will be about $15, pricing her UNDER Aiko. Plus she is for Victoria 2.0, not Stephanie like Aiko is. I'll get to work on making some more pictures now!

Of course in anime, the darker characters almost always turn out to be the coolest ones. And Yayoi has no problem stepping into that role!

How about a spunky cyberpunk bishoujo? (Bishoujo means 'pretty girl' in Japanese).

I'm actually really glad you guys wanted to see some more pictures, because I'm getting some great ideas for her promo images. :)

What I'd like to see is what is going to be included. I love her face...

I like her face very much from the front too! :-) At $15, I will definitely get her (in July - I spent all my money for June already!) I like her a lot. What hair is that lavender hair above there? -dg

The hair I've used is called 'surfer hair'. You can find it in free stuff, along with the anime eye textures I've used in some of the images. Definitely two free stuff items well worth picking up in preparation for Yayoi!

Thanks!! You're right - great hair for an Anime character!! :-) (I already have those eyes!) -dg

Got that hair download - thanks!! - dg

Speaking of great things to get... I've tried a couple of different textures on Yayoi, and the one that I've ended up liking the most is Blackhearted's Ki. Its an incrediably beautiful texture and well worth getting. Its the texture I've used on the last two images. :)

Jeez, what a diference a few more pics can make! At first, I thought she was, kinda, just OK...a bit wider in the hips than I'd prefer, but what do I know about Anime (I don't even know how to pronounce it!)? But then I saw the added pics you put up. Wow! 'Specially the metal shiny one.

Yeah... I wasn't feeling it with the first promo image. Both I definitely was in the last two. It happens I guess. I've redone that one to show the purple-haired version of Yayoi instead... :)

I just may have to get her. I plan to start on my website (one day) and I hadn't planned for any V2 or Stephie figures to "adorn" the different pages becuase the website isn't really devoted to artistry. Sort of an eclectic thingie I have in mind. Tho a lot of my photography and some Poser stuff will be there. But when I saw Aiko, I thought, "What a cute character (perhaps) to use on pages to "introduce" different subjects. Then I saw this one and thought, "Well, now, a few variations in anime characters would be even nicer!" So, I may just have to snap it up. But, someone out there still owes me a prononciation for "anime". I can't decide if it should be pronounced, "Ann-i-mee" or "Ay-nim".

Ann-eh-may :)

My friend who's a major fan says An-i-may. And Manga has a hard "g." Emily

Gonna give us any tips on how to dress her?? Like degrees to adjust the hips. I can get by on bodysuits for some, but not all. Emily

gorgeous work. I like the different images, it is amazing how the same character shows difference just by the positioning.

Summfox, nice character! Kudos to you! :) She really is a beauty! ChuckEvans, we've always pronounced it "ann eh may" with emphasis on the first syllable. :)

Cool, that tutorial will really help. I like her a lot. And that Surfer hair rocks. She definetely has that "I'm little and cute but I can take over the world" look. Your lavendar Yayoi is a killer image. But I like the first one too. It has that romantic soft quality. Emily

Thanks to all for help in saying it correctly! I was just talking with my wife and explaining to her why these kinds of characters didn't look, well, realistically human. I reminded her of the entire shelf of Anime movies for sale that I showed her at Media Play once. That it's a craze and it has gathered a niche here in Poser. I also remember falling in love with the art when I saw it on a computer game a few years ago and had to point it out to my wife. I forget the name, but they made several sequels to it. If it's catching on here in Poser (or maybe it already has and I am just late in realizing it), then it would seem the crowd would be crying out for clothes befitting the genre. Spacey-looking, outrageous-looking, tight-fitting clothing. I realize magnets used with small incanatations will get other clothing to fit, but for the stupid among us....hehe. Anyway, all I gotta do now is go talk to the procurement officer (my wife) and see what can be done...hehe.

I'd just like to thank everyone for such a great response!! Just as a warning though, Yayoi might be delayed just a little bit. I've been getting some great suggestions for some changes that I can make to her body to make it even more 'anime', and I thought it might be worthwhile to give them a try!

Delayed... OH! Well she looks great

Bah, you won't even notice. I'm almost done with the changes. :)

Myabe not me, since I am a dummy, but others will, I'm sure!

Here's a quickie shot of the new body... again I would like to thank all the people who had some great suggestions for the body! Seeing the new results, I feel that the changes were well worth doing. Yayoi now has slimmer hips, longer legs, and her breasts are a bit closer together now.

I'm thinking about making the neck a little longer and slimming it further... yes, no? :)

I'd like to see a longer more stem like neck with that face. :)

Consider it done. :) (And of course if its still not long and slim enough, thats easy enough to adjust to personal taste) :)

Is she made from custom morphs? Or is she just a face/MOR combo using Vickie 2?

She's a face/MOR combo for Victoria 2. So you definitely need to own Vicki 2 in order to use Yayoi.

this has gone on long enough without my comment. the body on the left is my Ki morph, released to the marketplace last weekend. the body on the right is yayoi. they look REMARKABLY similar to me. considering that i just sent you ki last week, summfox, this is a little too much to be a coincidence. now i dont expect everyone to spot this - but im sure people who deal in morphing and character creation will spot it right away, like traveler. all i DO is morph characters and texture. its what i practically spend all my time in poser on. my old free character, angelyna - i can spot her in a render if shes been rescaled, stretched, given biggerbreasts, smaller thighs, etc. i can spot her from a thumbnail, from an eye, the side of a breast, her hips, whatever. when you spend weeks working on a character, and truly create something youre proud of, you recognise it easily. the breasts are the same. sure, theres been some cleavage added. but the line of the breasts is identical. the unique hips are the same, as is the abdomen, except for some minor scaling (using my technique in the MOR file that you admittedly examined). the line from scaling the thigh in such a radically opposite way from the hip is there on BOTH characters - a faint diagonal line running parallell to her hip. i left it there because its only visible in some very rare lighting instances and i couldnt avoid it. the thighs look like theyve had the muscular morph turned down and have been stretched out a little along the y axis in the 'changed' version, although theyre near identical in the original promo image. arms, shoulders are identical, except for some X scaling. calves have the full morph turned down a bit but again are the same shape. and keep in mind this is the 'revised' version, with further changes added from the original. so while admittedly a MOR pose file that i created and sent to a 'friend' was analyzed, and within a couple of days this new character was 'created', i have no legal or copyright grounds to stand on. technically someone could buy ki, repackage her body morph, and resell it and there would be nothing i could do. ethically? i send someone who, until yesterday, i considered a good friend one of my characters for free - and within a week a remarkably similar character, also advertised with my uncredited Ki textures, is released to the marketplace. ethically? it turns my stomach. ive been here for a long time, at renderosity. ive learned to thicken my skin against people who will try to attack me, who try to discredit me and damage my reputation. its inevitable, and i thought i was doing well at coping. i had never expected to have to defend from my friends. and this is the second such incident. the first i had forgiven you. we were both in a chatroom, and i mentioned to you that i was working on a set of high resolution eye textures for the millennium characters because i was disappointed at the lack of realism - even in real eyes textures. i was going to release them in .PSD format, on transparent layers, so that my customers could adapt them to ANY texture - realeyes, vicky, mike, dina, whatever. some personal issues came up and i got delayed, and imagine my dismay when i logged in to see your new product. your 'eye textures', which were pretty much just like i had described my idea. i didnt say anything to you at the time, i backed up my textures on a cd and didnt release them because this was your first marketplace product and i didnt want to hurt your sales. i didnt confront you, i just silently vowed never to tell ANYONE what i was working on again. and i didnt. this is just too much - and beyond coincidence. so what am i going to do? bitch to the rosity admins? no. post any more threads about it? no. rant in chat and the forums about originality of ideas? no. im going to be issuing an update for ki. it will be an anime body and face morph. anyone who has already purchased ki will receive a link to download the new anime body/face morph for ki, and future purchasers will have it included in the package at the same price. where ki is a petite, curvy little thing, the anime character will be a tall, long-legged waiflike character, while still retaining ki's basic proportions. ive spoken to summfox about this, and she thinks 'sorry' simply cuts it. this isnt about money, or competition. its about the fact that i created something which i was damned proud of - a unique body type for vicky, something totally different from many marketplace vicky morphs. to have a friend capitalize on my weeks of hard work in a few days, rob me of my originality, my creativity, really hits hard, harder than anything. im seriously thinking about finding another line of work where i dont have to put up with this.

summfox's thing seems a tad more on the petite side, but thats easy to do. appearance wise, they are damn near identical. There are some ways for recourse, since she did know of yours before releasing her copy. reverse engineering is a corky no no if caught, especially if it is redone so similar as this is.

Hmmmmm... GEEEE! What an AMAZING coincidence!

i can say one thing if someone were to do that to me i wouldnt have handled it as well as black did i wouldve probably left the site altogether i hope all of this can be worked out ,black dont find another line of work i so love your products.

Way to close for comfort. Makes me NOT want to sell anything at all!

I am sick to my stomach sitting here and reading what happened to blackhearted. There are enough tutorials on this site as well as help in the forums to create an original piece of work. Black, you are a person of honor. I could see it in your response. Thank you for sharing your feelings.

Oh yes. Time to pick on Summfox because Blackhearted is a saint. Please allow me to defend myself. I will start from the beginning: 1) I absolutely never recall Blackhearted talking about creating a pack of eye textures. If he said I was there, I must have been there, but I also must have been doing something else because I don't remember it a single bit. 2) What DID inspire me to make my eye texture set was Curio's beautiful set of textures for real eyes. At the time they were the only thing around, also too expensive in my honest opinion. And when I came across some good source material, I thought: Why not? I could use some extra cash. So I developed an eye texture set. Originally they were only going to be for RealEyes, but being brand new to the merchanting scene, I decided to make them as good a value as I could. So I included them in lots of forms. The only time I EVER mentioned the .psd format was whether or not to include the highlights that way, so people could add them if they wanted them. Nothing else. In the end, someone told me that they thought it was a bad idea, perhaps even Blackhearted. End of story. I never even realized that I had 'stolen' any idea from Blackhearted because I do not recall him ever saying anything about it. I do recall him saying he didn't even like the RealEyes. (and initially that was what I was doing the textures for). End of story. 3) Ki versus Yayoi. Blackhearted for some reason seems to think that I took Ki and stretched her out. That I didn't start from a blank Victoria. I don't know how many times I have to tell him, but I DID start from a completely blank Victoria. I would NEVER start from someone else's creation, especially when I'm calling people on copying other people's work? I wasn't even looking at Ki as I was developing Yayoi, I was looking at anime images. In fact, I can show you the pictures I was using. You'll see where I developed every single curve from. Just ask and I will post them. I'm also sorry if Blackhearted seems to think that doing a decent morphing job is HARD, because its not. I'm also sorry that some of the angles happen to be similiar. Its purely coincidental. When it comes down to it, I WILL stand by my originality, I WILL stand by my product. I will not allow Blackhearted to use his popularity to get me down. My product was created from a blank Victoria. My .pz2 files will also stand up against his as completely different. I will gladly send my .pz2 to any administrator who decides to compare the two. I have complete faith in it. The only thing of Blackhearted's that I used was I took at look at his MOR file to see how he accomplished the scaling, because Xena's MOR tutorial didn't cover that aspect! All I can say is that this has been a very unfortunate situation. Oh and Blackhearted - I thought you said on ICQ that creating an anime figure and face to compete with mine was BENEATH you? Guess not anymore.

Are y'all just blind or so quick to jump on Summfox because of the post on the copyright violation thread? Yes, there are many similarities. However, there are many differences. The point of the breast is different. The size and stature. The curvature is all different. If you really believe that this is your Ki, Blackhearted, why don't you compare the files with Summfox? I doubt Summfox will publicly post it as this is a product, but if you look, you should see that Summ created this based on Victoria, not on your Ki. I'm sorry you've been burnt before, Blackhearted. I really, truely am. I know what it's like to be betrayed, and I can see how you thought that you were being betrayed by yet another friend. However, calmly and rationally check this out, discover all your facts and realize that Summ was not meaning to copy you, came across this form in a completely different way and is not violating the Ki you created at all. Please, I know Summ. Summfox wouldn't copy other people's work, especially not the work of one considered a friend.

Umm.. by the way.. I looked at Ki http://www.renderosity.com/softgood.ez?ViewSoftgood=10209 She.. uhh.. she looks completely different to me.

There is no doubt that these two figures share one originator, and that person is Blackhearted (Gabe). Summfox, make whatever claims you will, but the similarities, and the coincidence of your release with your receiving this file from Gabe is too much for you to argue against. I've never seen your file, and seen KI only in passing, and the similarities are overwhelming. You took his file, modified it, and released it as your own. That much is a given. But all is not lost. If you have one ounce of decency, or respect for Gabe's work, you'll stop offering this file as is, and re-release it as a morph to Gabe's KI. That would remedy the situation and also honor the originator of that figure. As an aside, and also as a reprimand, had you gone to Gabe and asked his help in preparing a morph, I have no doubt that he would have placed his considerable graphic design and modeling gifts at your disposal, and assisted you in any way possible. He has done so in many occasions as many on this board will attest. But this has happened before to him, and it's high time people started respecting Gabe and the other artists who make a living selling their skills on this board. Or else you run the risk of having the same done to you by others, and where does that leave us? Sincerely, Fredoman

Well as I see both together .. yes I see some differences .. but I also see a hell of alot of simularities. using someones methods, or modifying anothers work for self credit and profits is simply something wrong .. I tell ya seeing both of these together ... I am glad I am not into anime styled characters else I would e seriously pissed if I ended up buying something like this after buying something that it was copied and modified from. I agree with Black on this matter... His work and his time went into making something great only to have someone else walk over it and redistribute it with little changes. Especially someone that he thought of as a good friend. I have always wanted to get into modelling and etc.. for Poser and various other programs ..but now I am taking a serious second thought on is it worth it.

Hey, y'all. Did you ever consider something? Of course body curves are going to be similar. Do you know why? Well, I do. Because they're BOTH female and petite. Every single female has certain defining characteristics and curves. All I see here are two bodies being short. But y'all are truely sad if you really think that Summfox copied Ki. Have you even looked at Ki. No, not the Ki that Blackhearted posted but the Ki he has for sale. The two are not similar at all. Yayoi is slimmer in the hip with narrower contours. She is taller. Her eyes are larger. Her nose is different. Ki is short and realisticly plump. Her eyes are not large and animeish but small and realistic. How can there really be a comparison. One is based on REALITY, the other is based on anime. I personally think that you all need to stop attacking Summfox on this issue. Summfox is a talented artist and went through a lot to get this morph right. I was there to listen to Summfox develop Yayoi. I even know the problems Summfox had getting this particular morph to work. I assure you all, this IS Summfox's work. I personally will be buying this one and perhaps Ki as well as the two are very distinctly different to me. What really disgusts me here is that Blackhearted has really hijacked this forum to promote his own product. He uses the guise of Summfox allegidly stealing his work to show off his own product and use sympathy as a tactic towards generating sales. Everyone's so busy placating the 'wronged' Blackhearted that they fail to realize that he has completely abused this forum. It was for suggestion, not for your own means. Summfox is not to blame here. Of course bodies are going to be similar when they convey the same idea of shortening the feminine form while keeping the body slender. Blackhearted is simply overreacting. Do not fall for this feeble attempt to generate sales. It's sad.. really it is.

so this is a 'feeble attempt to generate sales', right myrrath? thats strange, because well before this entire thread ki was already one of the bestselling items at rosity. i dont need peoples 'sympathy' to purchase my items, they speak for themselves. thats why this is so disturbing - that someone is trying to capitalize on that. that it is a 'friend' makes it even worse. the image i posted above was actually rendered by summfox, not by myself. it was rendered AFTER her alterations - the 'original' yayoi posted earlier in this thread looked even MORE like ki - summfox has since lengthened the legs and added larger breasts. strange how if you leave people to their own devices, theyll do just fine at damning themselves without you having to help them along at all - i couldnt have rendered a better comparison pic myself. anyone whos done any morphing of characters can spot that they were adapted from the same character, with some minor changes. she went through a lot to get this morph right? thats strange.. because it took me a month to put together the Ki package, and she hacked hers together in under two days - including all the promotional images above... mere days after she received my Ki package. im showing off my own product? strange, i see not one render of my product or a link to it in this entire thread - other than the one you posted. i dont need to promote ki - she promotes herself. i could point out that summfox is promoting her product, which is based on ki, with my ki textures. she only credited them after i pointed out that it was obviously based on ki and she didnt even give me credit for my texture. ironic, isnt it? btw myrrath, your typing style and sentence structure look remarkably similar to that of summfox, and that message you just posted above is pretty much, word for word (including the little mannerisms) what she sent me over ICQ when i mentioned this to her. interesting indeed. i offerred a resolution to this entire situation. summfox offered me a cut of the profits, and credit in the product promotions, but thats not what im interested in. i offered to forget the entire incident, to devote my time to helping her create something totally new. i offered to do it for free, without credit. anything, a new body, a hair model, a male character, whatever. just so long as it wasnt a direct dirivative of one of my own products. it took a lot to swallow my pride and outrage, be willing to forgive again, and help resolve a situation and perhaps keep a friend. the comparison image above is the 'changed' character after this conversation. i pointed out that it was still near identical to ki, and was called a jerk and a psycho. fine. so be it. i was a fool to have been so reasonable, any other merchant would be screaming outrage in every single forum at renderosity, and mailing the store staff to have the product removed. "Oh and Blackhearted - I thought you said on ICQ that creating an anime figure and face to compete with mine was BENEATH you? Guess not anymore." yes, it was. but im learning fast, summ. im learning from the best. and in the end, ill know mine is original. and so will everyone else.

I would suggest that BlackHearted and Summfox swap product files with each other and compare them.. Would put all of this back and forth stuff to bed right away, wouldnt it? Just a thought. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

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All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

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Hey, that's what I suggested earlier. I guess Blackhearted is not willing to see how wrong he is. Oh, and to Blackheart and his posting: Perhaps my sentance structure and typing may look similar to Summfox's, but she's not going to say I copied her. It's called knowing how to communicate correctly. Please! Have you seen my work? It's no where near the caliber of Summfox's. Before pointing fingers, chill out. You sound stupid. As for the speed that Summ did her own morph and the speed that you did yours, did you think for one moment that different people work at different speeds? Summfox is gifted in art and computers. She has been fiddling around for longer than you think. So what if it took her 2 hours to create a morph where it took you 2 months. What are you? Jealouse? To everyone else: Sorry to have been blunt or rude. I normally am not, but I really feel Blackhearted is being foolish here. Yes, the bodies will look similar. They are both morphs of Vicki's form. I refuse to believe for one moment that Blackhearted is being anything but petty here. They are not the same file. Need I remind you.. innocent until proven guilty. Not the other way around. The files are not the same. I am certain of this.

I've looked at this from the beginning and my remark is this: the work is obviously based on Ki. That in and of itself is not a bad thing, BUT... summ should have given Black credit for his work (and percentage, probably). That said, I like anime and think both styles are nice and I hope this gets worked out.

Sorry myrrath..I didnt read all of the posts. :( But - From what I can tell it is all speculation at this point based on some renders. This issue could be resolved really fast with some cooperation between Summfox and Blackhearted. Seems logical to me. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

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All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

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clint, i have no doubt that its not a direct carbon copy of Ki. i dont have any friends or ex-friends that would be so stupid as to simply copy a MOR pose file and call it their own. the fact remains that in the images above, the characters are virtually identical. this isnt 'subjective' at all, its clearly visible to anyone familiar with morphing characters. she already has my product. this one was produced a couple of days after she received it, and in her own words 'examined' my MOR pose file. shes also had two days to make her 'revisions' to the product, and the original that was uploaded - the one depicted in the first image in this thread, is probably long lost. i would like to get my hands on that original MOR pose, the first one to be uploaded to the marketplace - id be able to tell right away if it was based on my character. like i said this isnt a legal issue. i dont hold the patent for a technique, for a 'look', for a morph, or for a style of character. its an issue of pure ethics. and i must admit id have been more prepared to deal with this if it came from anyone else, and not someone i considered a friend. i almost let it go, again. either way i consider this issue resolved already. i wont be posting here again. i dont care what summfox does with her 'product' - release it, give it away, i could care less. my ki package will be updated with an anime morph with the same slight modifications, and well let both products speak for themselves.

hmm.. cross-posted. myrrath, any more personal attacks or insinuations you want to add there?

BH - Ok - Thanks for the reply. If Summfox gives her permission I will get you the file you requested. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

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All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

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I do not wish to attack or insult or anything of the like. I wish for you to see this objectively and not so hastily. Are you reading your own word? I know I am. I know I came off as rude and obnoxious. The thing is, I know for a fact that this is not a copy of your morph. You cannot claim all feminine body forms as your own. If her face looked the same, I would agree with you, but here, I cannot. I did get angry when I posted the last reply, yes. That is because you insinuated that I was Summfox. Summfox is a friend, but I am not her. If you would like to continue that vein and flame the living daylights out of me, you can get me at pookathemighty@earthlink.net. If you could examine IP addresses, you would see that I am not even connected to the same ISP, in a completely different area (I'm talking 3 states away, not next door). I have been attacked and reacted accordingly. Yes, it was childish. But I really think you're being quite silly here.

i pointed out that your words were almost identical to a message that summfox sent me over icq. they were also in the same type of punctuation, and you even CAPITALISED the exact same words as she did. i did not say you were summfox. but the identical post leads me to believe that you are in communication with her right now and are discussing what you should post. theres nothing wrong with that - i would defend a friend as well - as i did her just two nights ago in another thread here. no, i cant claim all 'female body forms as my own'. but when i create a character thats unique, and someone to whome i JUST sent the file creates one virtually identical (i dont give a fuck about the face morph - i can make it with the stock anime face dials on vicky 2 in minutes) within a couple of days, it really gets to me. i dont want her item pulled, or her discredited as a merchant - im sure she recalls that ive tried to help her for months now, and give her suggestions. i even considered working together on some items with her before the eye texture thing. i simply wanted it clear as to what the original source of the body morph was - and this has been established with the help of summfox's own comparison pic and all of the other promotional images. now im busy creating my own anime character, which will be announced soon and will be free to those who have already purchased ki, since theyre so similar. i consider this matter finished, and the only one beating a dead horse here is you. i also dont like how you attempt to divert such a simple, straighforward thread with all the personal insults and nasty little remarks. "As for the speed that Summ did her own morph and the speed that you did yours, did you think for one moment that different people work at different speeds? Summfox is gifted in art and computers. She has been fiddling around for longer than you think. So what if it took her 2 hours to create a morph where it took you 2 months. What are you? Jealouse? " hmm.. perhaps. or perhaps its simply because original products generally take longer to create. im not ashamed to admit the amount of time i put into my products - and it has nothing to do with 'skill'. it has to do with coming up with original ideas and making sure everything is done right.

and he ALREADY sent Ki to summfox. That's how summfox can use Ki's textures in the promo renders...

No one tells me what to write or what to say. I come up with those little gems myself. The thing I don't understand is, you don't want her to be discredited, but you've succeeded in just that. People are leery of this product because you have wrongly marked it as stolen property. If you would speak to her sanely and look at a comparison of the two, you would realize that she did not steal from you. She is not that spiteful.

I am gonna step in here, because Ki is also partly my product. I did all the face morphs and the makeup textures, and took all the source photos for the skin texture. So I have quite a bit invested in Ki.

Gabriel and I work very hard to make sure that our products have a unique style and feel to them. ALL of our products have involved massive scaling in the MOR poses, which is a total pain in the ass to inject for each body part. However, Ki is the first product where we describe the scaling information in the readme, so that our customers could get clothing to work better. Anyone could examine our previous MOR poses that contain scaling info and figure it out from that easily enough--and I am sure others have figured out MOR pose scaling before this and since. The scaling info is not the issue. What is the issue is that this is the SECOND time that Summfox has built off of something Blackhearted has discussed or created, and that is simply not the action of someone who is a friend. It does take us awhile to make our products.. I don't whip out face morphs in 10 minutes and sell them. I spend hours tweaking poses, morphs, and such. It doesn't mean we are idiots.. it means we care about doing quality work for our customers. Maybe others feel ok about charging money for 10 minutes of work, but I don't. Sorry.

The sad thing is that Summfox has shown a lot of originality and talent with her male characters. She could make a killing off her incredible work with Michael. This whole thing upsets me very much, because I considered Summfox a friend.

This is going to be last thing I say in this matter, because I'm not going to waste my breath trying to defend myself when I know that it will be thrown back in my face as me just trying to 'justify' myself. I can assure you that what I say is honest and sincere.

Yayoi is an original body morph by me. End of story. ClintH has all the permission he wants to share the .pz2's with someone for comparison. I have complete faith in them. I back them totally and utterly. I will not waver in this no matter what is said, no matter how my product and I are threatened. I KNOW for sure with 100% accuracy I made them from a blank Victoria, no one else knows that one way or the other and until the .pz2's are compared, I would appreciate it if people would stop trying to crucify me. So please, ClintH... I BEG you to get someone to compare the two .pz2's side by side. The dial values will be significantly different. The only thing I ask is that it be done by an unbiased mediator.

I caught on quite a long time ago that there would not be a single thing I could do that would satisfy Blackhearted spare scraping this project all together. And I refuse to do that, because doing that is the same as admitting to doing something wrong. I maintain very firmly that this is not the case. This really is the last straw. Blackhearted can accuse Yayoi of looking 'similiar' to Ki until he is blue in the face, but he and others have MORE then accused me of not starting with a blank Victoria. I will not allow this to continue.

I will say anything else on this matter until I recieve an apology from Blackhearted, or at the least an agreement to cease and desist. It saddens me more then I can say to lose friends over this and I hope they believe me when I say that I am just as upset as they are. But it has to stop.

Bleh, typing too fast. That last paragraph should be: "I will NOT say anything else...", even. And I mean it this time. :)

I'd like to say, as a preface to anything, that for quite some times I've been friends with both Summfox and Gabriel. Close friends. I'm not going to get in the middle of this tangle, because quite frankly, I don't want to deal with the fallout from it. I will state a few things, objectively, for the record, and, as my friends, I hope neither of you take personal offense to this: 1. Summfox: You were in a chat session with Gabriel about the eye textures. In fact, I have it in a log on a backup disk, because it was at my site. If you like, I can take some time and dig up the exact logs and the date, but, really, I don't think that's the issue. People forget chats easily. At the time, you were even discussing an elf hair product, and the other site members were giving you advice on the model ( Myself, Gabriel, Valandar, ivyroses, and Kiera ). My sites have always been considered a place for people to freely discuss ideas without any fear of those ideas being stolen. I pride myself on that. If Gabriel had alerted to me to your product in late March, I probably would have banned you quick fast. He did not. The issue is now too long past for me to consider. I just wanted to set the record straight. 2. Gabriel: I think this matter should not be public. This dispute would not be at the point it is now were it handled directly through Renderosity administration. I know that it was not your intention to seek retribution against Summfox, but that's effectively the end result of your current course of action. Please quit before this gets even more bloody. You and I have both discussed the legal ramifications of MOR files insofar as copyright is concerned. The only proper recourse is to present your case to Rosity staff and let them either pull the product or leave it. If the product is pulled, then summfox's credibility is gone. This is the only effective change that could occur here. This thread will only serve to generate animosity towards all parties involved. Please stop. 3. Summfox: Yes, I am your friend. I am also Gabriel's friend. By pointing this thread out to me, you have compelled me to adress the issue. Please don't take personal umbrage at this, but I'm very disappointed at what I've been presented. As your friend, I ask you to please reconsider your current position with Gabriel, and to reopen communication in the hope of resolving this dispute away from public. Whatever the two of you decide from here, keep me the fuck out of it. As much as I'm your friend, I don't want to see anything else on this matter. I currently have my own fights to get back too... Paul

Blackhearted wrote: the image i posted above was actually rendered by summfox, not by myself. it was rendered AFTER her alterations - the 'original' yayoi posted earlier in this thread looked even MORE like ki - summfox has since lengthened the legs and added larger breasts. strange how if you leave people to their own devices, theyll do just fine at damning themselves without you having to help them along at all - * Eowyn nods. I usually prefer staying out of threads like this but I couldn't keep my nose out of this one. I showed the images to my friend who knows absolutely nothing about morphing at all and even he could spot all the similarities right away. Coincidence? I find it very hard to believe. And what does seem rather strange, like Gabriel pointed out, is the fact that the original body (seen in the first image in this thread) looks even more like Ki than what has been posted later. Why change it..? Keep your chin up, Gabriel. I am surely not the only one who is 100% behind you in this.

Putting aside the possible copying issue (which I would rather stay out of - though it is sad that issues like this arise) what I find saddening is that DAZ and others feel that making an emaciated woman with big eyes a small mouth and some funky colouredstyled hair makes an anime character. As a long standing fan of anime, Aiko et al make me cringe...Folks if you are going to make a anime character look beyond the dubbed exports sent to the USUK markets. Anime is a style, and doesnt just hinge upon the SEBM syndrome.

I find this all really sad... Since I started playing in Poser at the beginning of this year, I've found that I love morphing more than anything else. I don't think I've ever used a character straight out of the box - I always stick the textures on my own morphs to create something new. I've spent quite a bit on Blackhearted's packages, because his morphs always seemed unique - very realistic, very well thought-out and exectued. He has a signature style that just can't be denied. There are telltale signs in his work, and I find myself able to spot his morphs in renders without a second glance. Looking at the side by side comparison for a split second, I noticed the hip to waist ratio that usually alerts me to Gabriel's work, the breast shape, the toned abdomen drawing the eye down to a realistic tummy. But what struck me before any of those things was the pubic detail. It's something that all the Black morphs I own have, and that I have NEVER seen on any other morph. I'm not saying that they don't exist, just that in my stay here at Renderosity, and my experience with other vendors, I have not seeen. I guess it just strikes me as strange that this one possesses that quality, in addition to all the other remarkable coincidences. They say imitation is the sincerest form of flattery... If that's the case, Black should be very flattered right about now. It's sad that things had to be this way, and get ugly the way they did. But the render is damning... To me, someone who does spend hours morphing, and to an untrained eye sitting next to me, it looks like Ki shed a few pounds and had a little growth spurt.

Sorry - I don't see it. I think there is a lot more going on here. I love Blackhearteds work, and I am happy owner of "Ki" (I am using the texture, in the end I didn't like the body so much). That being said - I don't really thinkt here is much of an issue. So there are similarities... I ammissing the point/ The number of useful and attractive body shapes in Victoria are limited - and for petite volutuous charaters even moreso. Hell, I have a character here that I did after I got Ki that is also being used for Anime work (the purpose I purchased Ki for in fact) and I started with a blank viictoria as well. I am now fairly sure that if I posted her here hat it would look similar as well. Did I have the images of Ki in my mind as I worked? Yup. I also had about 25 other photgraphic and anime references in my mind. Shall I now make sure I never make a petite pretty character because somehow it is a copyright violation? Hell no. That is way, way over the top. So you mean two different artists playing with the built in morph dials made characters with similarities? I am not shocked. I know that Blackhearted is very sensative about his work, and he should be, but I think it gives him a little bit of a hair trigger on this sort of accusation (no offense intended). Someone compare the files - and if theya re different enough then thats the end of it for me... because I know I don't recognize a copyright on the concept of "short, cute and built". It will be easy enough to spot anyway - Ki's scaling and settings are fairly bizzare (though pretty) and any derived file will show them. Even if someone looked at a image of Ki and twiddled the dials of Victoria till they got one that matched I would think that was OK - the concept of "reverse engineering" is fairly well accepted. You cannot copyright a set of settings for the Vicky model any more than you can copyright a set of camera settings. The FILE can be protected, but a "clean room" reverse engineering will be legal and I think morally acceptable in most cases.

The FILE can be protected, but a "clean room" reverse engineering will be legal and I think morally acceptable in most cases. I have to agree about that statement. (I can't tell if the above is derived from Ki though, since I am not familiar enough with Vicki's body dials and don't have either character.) And though I agree about the statement, I personally wouldn't try to sell something that I reverse engineered. Play with it myself and maybe share it for free, but selling something that is too similar to someone else's idea, even if not derived, is not doing anyone a favour: The market already has one, so they don't benefit; The first vendor definitely doesn't benefit; And the copier wouldn't benefit from 100% sales either cos there's a closely competing product which is better established. Rather spend time developing something more different. What a pity such a well received item couldn't have avoided this mess. I hope you guys work it out. :)

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a sweet disorder in the dress kindles in clothes a wantoness,
do more bewitch me than when art is too precise in every part

Well I've read this whole thread and to me the similarities outweigh the differences. The main difference seems to be in the scaling of the models, such as in the hips and legs. However, the underlying morph structure looks very similar; the dimple above the navel and the line running up to the ribcage, the crease near the top of the thigh, and the "fattening" of the thigh near the knee are present in both models, just to differing degrees. Sure the breasts are different on Yayoi, but that just looks like a cleavage morph to me. These facts coupled with the very short development time make Summfox's claims hard to swallow. Just my 2p.

You know, while we are on the subject of petite characters and morphs, you don't see me moaning about the similarities of my Vicky Petite character which as been out for months, and the other recent additions to the Renderosity Marketplace which are almost identical (especially in the face morphs). Don't make me pull out my sample renders describing and illustrating similarities. I purposely keep a low profile here at Renderosity to avoid all the Political BS and EGOs that have come to exist here. I absolutely love my work and friends that I have met here at Renderosity, but these immature high-school popularity battles have to go. People need to grow up. People need to address issues discreetly with the admins and not make such a friggin public specticle of everything all the time.

care to be a little more specific there, magnet?

Do I need to be Gabe? The point is, is that witchhunting so passe. There are more descreet ways of dealing with a touchy subject like COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT. It doesn't need to be a public execution. I have seen this way too many times before. People have nothing better to do than spend the days starting gossip, and trashing people's reputations in a public forum. I choose not to participate in that venture, as I am not interested in popularity. My work speaks for itself and so long as all my customers continue to be happy... things are all good. enough said. Brandon "magnet"