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Community Center F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2024 Nov 23 2:12 am)
Subject: Another good reason not to use Internet Explorer
JAVA SUCKS! You mean JavaScript. Java is a complete, object-oriented, cross-platform programming language. It can be used for web appications but it has far better uses. ;-) Javascript is basically just an extension of HTML (well, more or less), and that's what's used to carry out this exploit. bonni (sorry, it's just one of my "things" to point out that Java is not the same as Javascript ;-)
"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis
IE is currently the most popular browser and this is why its security flaws are targetted by these malicious programs. If Netscape increases in popularity, they will target Netscape too, with exactly the same results. It has nothing to do with IE being unsecure and Netscape being in any way better (Netscape is more bugged than IE for rendering HTML) From the article:- "NetSec's Houlahan advocated drastic action. "I told my wife, unless it is absolutely necessary and unless you are going to a site like our banking site, stay off the Internet right now," he said. " This guy sounds nuts to me. I just hope nobody's listening to him...
I don't recommend Netscape because it's too big and clumsy nowadays. Opera is also going to the wrong direction in my opinion. I just like the simplicity of Firefox. The problem with IE is that it's part of the OS and you can't un-install it from Windows. Microsoft likes to embed programs to their OS. Several months ago the EU court fined MS for 500 000 000 and gave them 90 days to remove Media Player from Windows. I'm not sure if the same goes for IE as well, but I hope so. Of course MS complained about the decision and now the fight will take a few more years. "JAVA SUCKS!" LOL I agree... and I do know what Java is.
Well, that's fair enough. :-) I just have this weird little quirk about the Java != Javascript thing. ;-P
======================================================I Honor those with having the "SPECIFIC CONFERMATION" Gene! You always learn something new from them! BTW Java-script is the BASTARRRD-CHILD of Java, And Java even tried to put the wretch up for adoption..Especially after Her Divorce from Acitve-X! 8^D
Message edited on: 06/27/2004 19:42
This is from an article I wrote for an e-zine a couple years ago: Java is a complete object-oriented programming language developed by Sun Microsystems. It can be used to create complete, complex, independent programs and applications. To use it on your computer, you may need a Java interpreter (which is available for free from Sun Microsystems). On the web, Java is used in the form of an actual program that is downloaded from the server and executed through the browser. Java "applets" do need a Java-capable browser to run, and if you turn off Java in your browser, you won't see or be affected by embedded Java applets in a website. Java is supposed to work across platforms, and in theory, it does (there can be problems with it in practice, but that's way beyond the scope of this little article). JavaScript's correct name is ECMAScript. It was originally developed by Netscape some years ago, when Netscape was still an independent company. JavaScript is not a programming languge, but rather is an extension of HTML, a "scripting language". JavaScript primarily responds to events (usually mouse actions, but other events can also trigger JavaScript actions and behaviors). JavaScript exists as text within the page (or in an external but linked page). It is not a program, and it always requires a browser or other HTML-capable device (such as some mail programs). You can turn off JavaScript in your browser, and you won't be affected by or see any JavaScript effects (such as pop-ups, certain kinds of forms, rollovers, and other special effects). JavaScript is also not universal, and may or may not work properly in your particular browser. The only thing that Java and JavaScript have in common is that the actual code looks similar on a superficial level, and their names are frustratingly, maddeningly similar. ----------------- :-) bonni
"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis
IE is currently the most popular browser and this is why its security flaws are targetted by these malicious programs. If Netscape increases in popularity, they will target Netscape too, with exactly the same results.
Well, no. Netscape does have its bugs, but it's not the security hole IE is. Listen to what scourge says: IE is part of the OS. Its "popularity" has very little to do with its quality and very much with the fact that it comes with Windows. Read what Tim Bray has to say. And use a better browser.
It has nothing to do with IE being unsecure and Netscape being in any way better (Netscape is more bugged than IE for rendering HTML).
Well, no. Even Netscape 4, which was worth bugger all when it came to CSS, was mainly intolerant of sloppy HTML. The current Netscape, 7.1, is better than IE in rendering both CSS and HTML. Still: Opera or Firefox. They, in addition, have pop-up control, which IE will have only in Service Pack 2.
Opera is also going to the wrong direction in my opinion.
Well, I installed 7.50 and have to say that I don't exactly disagree. (Why the hell System Tray?!) But you can participate in the shaping of future versions and it's still better browser overall. So I'll keep it.
The only thing that Java and JavaScript have in common is that the actual code looks similar on a superficial level, and their names are frustratingly, maddeningly similar.
Oh, that's marketing. Java was hot at the time and they decided to give the name JavaScript to the thingy. Now it officially goes under the name of ECMAScript. :-)
Message edited on: 06/28/2004 00:14
-- erlik
Oh, that's marketing. Java was hot at the time and they decided to give the name JavaScript to the thingy. Now it officially goes under the name of ECMAScript. :-) I know, but it doesn't stop people from calling ECMAscript Java. ;-) Also, and unrelated to Java OR Javascript/ECMAScript, I've finally downloaded Firefox from mozilla.org and I'm giving it a good test run. Very nice, very smooth, nice interface, skinnable, so far it's worked perfectly, and it's got built in popup control and other interesting features. Well worth investigating, IMHO. bonni
"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis
I downloaded it last night. So far, seems like a great little browser...
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"Well, no. Netscape does have its bugs, but it's not the security hole IE is. Listen to what scourge says: IE is part of the OS. Its "popularity" has very little to do with its quality and very much with the fact that it comes with Windows. Read what Tim Bray has to say. And use a better browser." I never suggested IE was popular because of its quality. The fact remains that IE's security issues have only come about because of people targetting it, and that is a result of its popularity. I use IE about 5 hours a day, and develop on it too, and I've found no problems with it. Patch your OS and everything will work just fine. Why would I want a "better" browser? I don't subscribe to the "slag-off Microsoft and be cool" brigade. I judge as I see it, and don't go off what other people day. "The current Netscape, 7.1, is better than IE in rendering both CSS and HTML." As a web developer I find that IE is currently the best at both CSS and HTML rendering, although it isn't perfect. Nowadays I only use CSS for formatting (and pretty much everything) and Netscape has some blatant bugs that should IMO have been fixed by now.
Attached Link: http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/28/1088274658575.html?oneclick=true&oneclick=true
*Patch your OS and everything will work just fine.*Except that this latest exploit has no patch, and it's happening on websites that ordinarily would be highly trusted, because they're running an insecure installation of Microsoft IIS.
By the way, I'm a web developer, too, and I tend to treat IE as "the lowest common denominator" as far as testing goes, but I don't develop "for" that browser, and I certainly don't use it myself (and haven't for years).
Naturally, your mileage may vary, and you're certainly welcome to use any browser you please. Personally, I don't like being just one of the crowd or part of the lowest common denominator... ;-)
That aside, the attached link is an interesting article I read today about Microsoft and their dodgy record in the area of computing security. It's a bit biased, but it's a good read if nothing else. (cut and paste the URL if it gets cut off by the forum software).
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/28/1088274658575.html?oneclick=true&oneclick=true
bonni Message edited on: 06/28/2004 07:59
"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis
Only a couple of weeks ago I switched from IE to Firefox, but not because of security issues. Though my hardware is up to date IE just was too slow and heavy. Apparently IE consists of parts scattered all over my C drive, which makes the damn browser respond slowly if the hd is a little fragmented. Also, the amount of RAM IE eats is horrible. I like to have multiple browser windows open simultaneously, which means multiple iexplore.exe applications running at the same time, reserving 17MB+ RAM each! Firefox on the other hand needs only one exe running. Too bad I only tested my personal web site with IE. When I switched to Firefox I noticed that the site doesn't look right with any other browser.
Attached Link: http://forums.garyzullo.com
What's best about firefox is the fact that it is open source. Find a bug? report it, and it gets fixed pretty fast. Or, if you're like me, you can become part of the developer team and check code out and fix bugs yourself. Now that's cool :) /gz/
But how do you import bookmarks, cookies etc. from Firebird to Firefox? When you install it does it for you. Tell it which browser to impoort from, and it does. Even most of my saved passwords (for sites and such) got converted. Totally painless. I was much impressed (and I've been on the net for ten years, so I don't impress easily ;-). I noticed that there's still no patch for that security flaw in IE... bonni
"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis
Great to hear ya like it Bonni and Judith :) Def. check out the little themes..I like the looks of 'SkyPilot Classic'....just looks so...clean :) {And I like the fact that you have the google search right there with the addy bar ;)}
~Jani
Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------
I use IE about 5 hours a day, and develop on it too, and I've found no problems with it. Patch your OS and everything will work just fine. Why would I want a "better" browser? I don't subscribe to the "slag-off Microsoft and be cool" brigade. I judge as I see it, and don't go off what other people day.
I'm not cool because I slag off Microsoft. :-) I use Opera for whatever page design and building I do. It's much less forgiving of errors.
As a web developer I find that IE is currently the best at both CSS and HTML rendering, although it isn't perfect. Nowadays I only use CSS for formatting (and pretty much everything) and Netscape has some blatant bugs that should IMO have been fixed by now.
Er, I've just did a small test of browsers and IE was the only one that had a blatant and glaring error with background-attachment: fixed. The others (Mozilla, Netscape, Firefox and Opera) had some problems with more obscure parts of CSS. Check richinstyle.com or meyerweb.com for CSS:edge.
PS Hey, where have you been? You don't come around Bryce forum anymore.
-- erlik
Attached Link: http://yayforgecko.net/article/3/ie7-and-the-box-model-hack
*I use Opera for whatever page design and building I do. It's much less forgiving of errors.* *makes a note* I do test sites/pages in Opera, but I wasn't using it to develop. I may switch now, though. An intolerent browser forces better coding. ;-) I believe that IE's box model is off, as well, but I can't remember off the top of my head where it was wrong (I've been concentrating on digital art rather than webdev lately and I'm slightly rusty on obscure facts and figures). I did know about the background-attachment: fixed thing, though. Very annoying. I believe that Firefox is actually CSS2 compatible, but I haven't done any serious testing. I just know that since I installed and have been using it, it's been very fast and very stable. So far I really like it. Attached link has some interesting information on IE's broken box model, FWIW. Apparently, IE7 has that fixed, but fat lot of good it does given how long it's going to take for the average person to dump IE6. People are still using generation 4 browsers, for pity's sake... Still no patch for that latest IE vulnerability/exploit... And no, I don't "hate" Microsoft. I just don't like poorly written software (which, of course, is why I use Poser, d'oh!!! ;-P ). bonni"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis
I don't think there's any browser that's really CSS2 compatible. They all do just a couple of features. But IE 7 will be out... who knows. The good thing is, Microsoft gave Explorer its own programming team back. Tuttle, now that Bryce was bouoght by DAZ, I think it's much closer than you think. And the forum is even livelier. :-) Just go to DAZ Bryce forum and see the wishlist. It's miles long. Even longer than the ones we had here.
-- erlik
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Attached Link: http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1105_2-5247187.html
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=562&e=6&u=/ap/20040625/ap_on_hi_te/internet_infectionhttp://zdnet.com.com/2100-1105_2-5247187.html
http://www.winnetmag.com/Windows/Article/ArticleID/43088/Windows_43088.html
Message edited on: 06/26/2004 12:04
"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis