I know it's all over the news, I just wanted to say a few words about a man who I respected. I'm hardly religious and certainly not Catholic, but I find it interesting because I still respected him as a good man. Most of you don't know what Communism really amounted to, the hardships of life, the countless anedcotal examples or interminable cues, gov't repression, etc. This man who was the Pope started his life in Poland and fully knew the evils of Communism, something the Western world has more or less brushed over in the past decade. He had a major impact on this regime and fought it with all his power. He was a catalyst that started the fall of Communism in Crackow and Berlin, who put down a regime that had tortured, maimed, starved and killed its citizens, regardless of the country or nationality. For that, and for the countless good he has done, I am sad today. Drac

Very Very possible he may be Known as a Saint. The first in centuries.

Sometimes people tend to forget that this pope was from 1920, born in Poland. It's not only communism he fought against, but he sure had his part in it. I would say (as i did in community center) a conservative revolutionary. A great man who will enter the history books and being remembered for a very long time. The first non-italian pope for 455 years, can anyone (without cheating) name 10 italian popes, i can't. I guess that is saying something about him.

err.. ignatius the 1st.. ignatius the 2nd... ignatius the 3rd? :) drac

" can anyone (without cheating) name 10 italian popes, i can't." Yes, you can some, even if not ten. Remember the Borgias. :-/ Remember the Urban II, who started the Crusades.

Yup, depressing news. I'm 100% homegrown non-observant Jewish, but I know a lot of people who are going to be sad today.

He was a great force for good in the world...for catholics and non-catholics alike. He will be sorely missed.

ICM: I think you'll find that Mother Theresa of Calcutta beat Pope John Paul II to it.

A sad loss indeed, even though I'm not a Catholic.
We all have our beliefs and I respected his.

Message edited on: 04/02/2005 16:50

A great Man, A great Pope. I miss him already.

Bryster: I was watching an interview with some high ranking Cardinal, they were talking about Popes that have been appointed Sainthood, and what actually constitutes that level of acknowledgement. It seems John Paul's life and accomplishments could very well make this possible. Mother Theresa definately lived that life. Sorry Chris, I should have given a bit more of the story.

There's been at least 12 Pius's..does that count? I actually saw him back in the 90's at the Wednesday audience (well, 50 yards away, but yep, that was him..)
It's sad to see, but the guy was 84..did a lot of good in the years he was there. Now the speculation about his successor begins..

I'm not a catholic but I thought sainthood required at least one documented miracle associated with the candidate, no? Just trying to think back to my Jesuit education.

claymore, you're right.

The acknowledgement doesn't happen until 3 years after death. I would imagine the considerations happen then. Conjecture though, been years for me. Only going on what I watch & read.

I am a Catholic and even though I found myself at odds with him many times,........I never failed to feel the sincerity and goodness of the man. I saw him on one of his trips to Washington many years ago,........there was a crowd of young people chanting "John Paul 2, we love you", prompting him to reply "John Paul 2, he loves you". At that time I was overcome by such an overwhelming feeling of pure joy and love that I was brought to tears. This is a memory I shall carry with me forever. John Paul 2, I'll miss you.

When I was a child I had the privilige of seeing him at close distance. Very certainly the most historically significant human being I have seen in person. I don't think one has to be Catholic, or even Christian to appreciate this man.

Pope John Paul lls birth name was Karol Jef Wojtyla born in the small town of Wadowice in Poland just outside of Cracow. During WWll under the yoke of Nazi occupation he persevered toward priesthood in a clandestine seminary run by the archbishop. While under Russian Communist occupation he went on to be ordained in 1946, appointed Auxiliary Bishop of Cracow by Pope Pius XII in 1958, In 1964, he was appointed Archbishop of Cracow by Pope Paul VI, and in 1967 he was appointed Cardinal, he was elected Pope in 1978. He followed Pope John Paul l who died 33 days after being elected Pope, September 1978, shortest papacy reign in history. He most certainly was a catalyst to the downfall of Communism. There is presently a movement to have Pope John Paul ll to be renamed Pope John Paul the Great. It is a tremendous and heartfelt loss to the 1.1 billion Roman Catholics around the world and a great loss to humanity in general.

Definatly the most influental pope of the modern age possibly the most influental pope ever. Those are some tough shoes to fill.

My apologies for misspelling Krakow in my previous post. Didnt pickup on it until well after it was posted.

I have always had a huge respect for this man in many ways. My sorrow for the world at large is very deep at this time.

as I understand it, it takes 3 miracles, based on praying to the subject in question, and then the Vatican investigates the situation with a fine-toothed comb. Before you get to sainthood, you usually go through Beatification, then Canonization, before becoming a saint. Why an Episcopalian knows all this, I dunno..;)

Attached Link: http://www.christianitytoday.com/history/newsletter/2003/oct24.html

P.S. If you go here you will see the names of all those Saints:

Saints proclaimed

Message edited on: 04/03/2005 00:45

Message edited on: 04/03/2005 00:53

While I disagreed with many of his policies of faith, I applauded his outreach to other faiths. On a more personal level, I give him all my respect for his determination and persistance in the face of his illnesses to do what he percieved as his duty to the end. For this if nothing else, I do truly salute him.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=924239&Start=1&Artist=BluePenguin&ByArtist=Yes

Something I put together in Bryce / Daz|Studio / Photoshop... thought I'd share with other people who are touched by his passing.