Well not so much a complaint but a slight annoyance. Basically, I'm trying to use Poser to turn a buck. I've put some money into it, models, helper packages like photoshop etc. and am making some decent spending cash making online comics. My problem is I go to free stuff and see a cool model/character/prop that I'd love to use in a comic done for a paysite. I download the thing, read the readme file then slap my forehead after seeing "This item can only be used for non-profit work or for private work" Now, I'm not complaining about a person's choice to make something and not want it used for profit. If they want to spend time making a great prop or figure only to have it used for a private pic then that's their choice. Plus if its infeasible to track a profit based ont he use of the item then I can see not wanting it used in a profit work. I'd hate to post a prop only to find its the thing that sold a million dollars worth of online subscriptions and I got nothing for it. What I am bugged about is I have to download the thing to read the readme, only to then delete it cause I can't use it. Now I have been guilty of this myself at times but only for items or characters I know contain other peoples' stuff. What I was wondering is if there is some way we can either label the thumbnail or add a field to the system or split off the items so that a downloader knows the item can be used/not used for commercial use. It could be something as simple as a red square in the upper right corner of the thumbnail means no profit use while green means its ok or yellow means ok but with credit to the maker. This whole yes/no profit thing is getting to be a rather treacherous mine field. I do not want to profit off others hard work but my own personal philosphy is I'm not going to share a prop/figure unless it has free use. Why else make the darn thing? Why not instead just post a picture of it. The only thing I don't want is the thing collected onto a CD and sold as a poser package. Anyway, maybe a marker or seperate grouping would be a good ida for items that can be used for general consumption as opposed to items that can only be used for private use.

Why don't you contact the authors? They may change their mind and work something with you. good luck, FlyerX

I know some items may be used in any way but i think its best to work on the asumption that anything in fresstuff has a no comercial use clause so either buy or make everything you need to use or if its an especially nice item mail the maker and ask...i've done that a few times ans most time got a "sure no problem" reply and all the other times i paid a small percentage or did a deal on a PWCD but never have i been refused or been offered a ridiculous deal.....If your using a lot of one persons stuff it may be worth seeing if you can get a deal where for a fee you can use any of there stuff, thats what we do with the CD's........Steve

Sound like a good idea to me Mason. FlyerX: not all the authors give a means of contact, some don't even put in a readme file.

Ask when you can, I think that is what most want, the respect of knowing you acknowledge them for their hard work and you will not just forget them once you do happen to maybe make something using their work. I am sure there are exceptions, but most art people are not so unreasonable as to not be at least reasonable ;-) (problem is that it DOES take time, no offense to you mason, I am merely stating a fact I myself had to endure. Yes, many times it is hard to realize WHO did what, but it's worth it at the end when you find our how polite folks are when contacted politely and respectfully for their good work....be great if it were easier but good things take time I guess, I think sometimes it takes LONGER to do all the asking and contacting than any one, or two, or MANY pictures....in fact I'm certain!) Take care.

A simple (says one who has no clue how this site works) Check box 'Commercial or Non-Commercial' when submiting an item may solve that problem... We have a 'this thumbnail contains nudity' thing.

Thanks, Mason, for bringing this up. Especially mentioning that some downloads contain no readme file. The people who offer downloads with no readme file risk their stuff being used against their wishes because, with all the stuff we download (sometimes thousands of things), we have no idea who created it, especially if the item has since disappeared from any of the download sites and you can't even do a search for it. Many times I just wanted to give credit on my website for an object I used, but with no readme and no name I can't do that. I'm at a loss. The artist deserves recognition, but I can't give it because he or she is anonymous. Also, it would be nice if they could include their e-mail address for contact. I would love to see this area improved. Maybe even a category in the Free Stuff section for "Free Use" items, then all the other categories would be restricted to personal use only. Just an idea. Melanie

I am going to sound a note of discord here, but I find the whole notion that the renders of props or figures can somehow me controlled by the creator after release of the mesh, to be absurd. The mesh itself, certainly belongs to the person who made it and how it is distributed, is up to this person. But renders of this mesh? It is silly to entertain any ideas of control. Anyone, so hung up on notions of financial gain derived by others, should either sell the mesh or keep it to themselves.

Again I'm not talking about acknowledging a creator. Yes I assume nothing is for free unless it says so in the read me and I'm fully willing to acknowledge and contact the creators. My complaint is if there was an easier way to know something has a fair use disclaimer on it BEFORE I go through the trouble of downloading it. For example, Morph Targets. I've actually found MTs that say "Cannot be used for profit" in the read me. If that is included in a "morph man" or "morph woman" pack then I gotta rip those out? I can only use this "nose wide" mt for non-profit renders? Wow. Jaager - I agree. If my prop was put behind a paysite wall for download or put in a props pack for resale on a CD then I'd be pissed. This stuff happens to my artowrk all the time. If its used in a render that gets put on a paysite then I'm happy it at least got used. Again, any original stuff I make like my office cube prop is fair use or I wouldn't bother posting it. I only disclaimer my stuff if its a combination of others' work or based on someone else's meshes. My car mods for example have a non-profit disclaimer in the readme because I did not create the original mesh. I plan never to do that again. Heck you go over to 3dcc and about 75% of the figures have this no profit disclaimer on them. Well that's fine but then what can people use the thing for. You can only make so many private renders before they are otherwise useless. Why not just post a pic of this great figure if you don't want it used outside of private use.

I have been trying to think of analogies in other areas , but the easy of duplication of things digital makes this difficult. However, props, morphs, figures, textures are tools. They are not a recorded performance, or a book, or a painting (a render is). Trying to control how a tool is used, is like Thomasville trying to say that a chair they sold or gave to Goodwill can not be used in the background of a picture. If the photgrapher claimed to have built the chair himself, this s something else.

I agree with Jaager and anything of mine in free stuff can be used as long as the original file is not redistributed as your own, in any rendered image as the artists see fit, if its something you worked on and rendered its yours then, not mine.

Use of an item in a rendered image is a fuzzy area. There are a number of good references on the various applications of copyright laws posted, I believe one is still posted at Vision Graphics [sidebar link on right]. As a general rule o thumb, stuff at the 3DCC has to contain that disclaimer because Marvel and DC, Image etc own the trademarks to the likenesses of those characters and names. If you do a profit render or comic using Spiderman or Batman, it's not the model creator you have to worry about - it's the lawyers of DC and Marvel. ;] Same goes for likenesses of StarTrek, StarWars and Babylon 5 characters. Use of props and freestuff caracters owned solely by the creator, that are not trademark registered is a bit grayer. Best suggestion is to look up the pertinent copyright code... and contact the author of the item to ask on use. Possibly, if they want to see some return for your use of the item in a commercial project, offer/negotiate a standard limited use, multiple use or full use conrtact with them in which they recieve a lump fee and possibly a percentage. The graphics arts guild has reams of info on the various standard use agreements and contracts. As far as contacting... even if they don't have a readme, one can generally browse freestuff to re locate the item, then contact them via site mail or private message.

yeah I kind of figured the DC stuff was an issue. Marvel doesn't seem to care but DC is a real stickler.

That's interesting... of course, that last time I kept close track was in the early 90's. Marvel used to be every bit much a stickler as DC. Guess they must have relaxed a bit. Image is pretty strict on likenesses and tradmarks being used commercially - considering how and why McFarlane started Image in the first place, I can't really blame him for protecting his copyrights zealously. On the other hand, he's one of the nicest people, and he's usually responsive to inquiry's on use of his characters. [According to trade rumour at least] Still seems to come down to that in the use of a non trademarked free item [clothes, hair, props] in a rendered image for a project, asking permission is more courtesy than requirement. It's the redistribution or resale of the item itself as part of a commercial collection that falls well out of the gray and into the red zone. Giving away a prop and saying it can't be used in images make the item about useless.