So far we have Natural Fractals as the most voted on.
If this is the one that becomes the challenge, then maybe a few explanations could be posted on the criteria for the photos needed. We have a couple more days to choose.
Then I will add all the other suggestions and use them for next month.

'Natural Fractals' is an interesting challenge although I have no idea how can I get any inspiration ..... :)

Congrats for the new 'window within window' feature.
It works great.
A fresh new start for the 'new' RR.

Let us hope that everything is within the photography subject (I do hope that side 'small talk' has less importance in the Forum).

Carlos.

LOL I just did this so that maybe anyone else adding to the choices would use the inset thread to keep it in one place. Should have mentioned that. Plus I wanted to bring this to the top..so I won't forget about it.

LOL, good choose ;) kiss Valou

Valerie is a kissing machine, isn't she?

LOL @ Fuzzy. So where are the other choices?What if I don't want natural fractals? Huh? Huh? ;^)

yes, i'm a kissing machine LOL.... make love not the war!!! KiSs KiSs KiSs KiSs KiSs KiSs KiSs KiSs KiSs Valou

I need more explanation of what a natural fractal might be. I have seen fractals on 'rosity..perhaps that is enough and the real challenge is finding natural forms. I am still a bit confused as to what a fractal actually is.

Hi Tom.Fractals are those mandala-type images,as far as I know,with repeating shapes,etc...They do occur in nature as well.But in all honesty,I don't see very many 'natural' ones presented here often,and I haven't a clue where I'd find one myself. Of course,that would make it quite a challenge!It appears that many have voted for it already,so what I'm about to say will probably have no bearing,but here goes. The last challenge was a wonderful success.It brought many new people to the forum...something it so desperately needs now,if you ask me.And one of the reasons for that,was because the challenge was indeed a challenge,but not an impossible one.It was something a lot of people could participate in. I think something as 'difficult' as 'natural fractals' may not be the best way to go at this time...if we want to keep the influx of new people here. Just my two cents. :^)

Attached Link: Natural Fractals

Great idea to provide a link. That may be necessary to keep handy,if it indeed becomes the challenge.I'm sure the question as to what it means will be asked over and over.Remember,there was even some question as to the meaning of 'liquid motion'! PS-I had no idea clouds were considered natural fractals.Not sure I get that one,but okay.That certainly makes it easy enough! ;^)

I think they explain it in there somewhere. I think most of the world is composed of fractal geometry, you just have to look at it from the right perspective. Re: clouds, think of a hurricane. It's spiral is a fractal pattern...just like the Great Red Spot on Jupiter.

Ah...the golden spiral...okie dokey. ;^) Pssst.I saw 'Pi'...loved it. :^)

So if we have natural fractals, then basically any shape taken in nature, any tree,river or land mass could be given as the challenge image. If I read that site correct. Maybe that's not such a challenge. Who will have to be the one to decide if it is indeed a fractal? I would see a snowflake being one, or the swirls on funghi.Perhaps ice crystal shapes. Ok just a few cents worth. I guess the idea of an i-frame did not work here. I figured everyone might put the replies in the inset. Kind of though it was a good idea to keep it up front, but then have comments contained in one thread.

Me too, great film...glad you finally saw it. =]

An i-frame?Is that a Mac product?Lol. Actually you lost me with that big thingy above.I didn't know why it was there.LOL!

hey that window is pretty freekn cool and it works awesome..=) ?? how does this site use link posting and image posting in the gallery?? is it basic HTML [img][/img] code?

fractals.. when the golden rule meets fractals...the fibonacci.. principle of spiralling of phyllotaxy.. example (the study of the arrangement of leaves on a stem). Starting from any leaf on a plant, a spiral is traced in an anti- clockwise direction from leaf to leaf. Upon reaching a leaf directly above the first, the number of leaves and turns around the stem within the spiral are constant, irrespective of the starting point.
Although the number of intervening leaves and turns around the stem varies for differing species, certain figures re-occur. It transpired that the whorls on a pine-cone, the petals on a sunflower, the pattern of snail shells and the genealogy of the male bee all follow a sequence of Fibonacci numbers.

then you have the chaos fractals.... study of poincare knows as the father of fractal chaos / mandelbrot..

also involves quantum mechanics....

here a link on http://www.fortunecity.com/emachines/e11/86/padovan.html#

there is a maths formula to fractals..

this link is the simplest to understand fractals...

http://www.fortunecity.com/emachines/e11/86/natsums.html#Fibonacci

but fractals are quite simple .. in nature every where common formula... hope this is welcomed... and of help ?

Message edited on: 03/30/2006 11:30

Message edited on: 03/30/2006 11:36

@dynazty.. yes.. in the gallery you have provide straight HTML in the text.. that could change when they do the new format @margana.. yes, always good to have new blood, but wouldn't write off the old so quickly.. natural fractals shouldn't be too difficult to figure out.. especially with the provided link to show examples even though i haven't participated in the last few challenges, i'll cast my choice in the i-frame box provided :]

well think fractals are challenging to some.. but then there are intelligent people with high IQ's in Renderosity .. and not to be under estimated the abilities of the new influx....:).. no hope us older one havnt been written off.. sighes

Oh...Was I writing anyone off?Funny.I didn't think so.I thought I was only seeking to encourage more positive activity here. An interesting CHALLENGE thread this is.

funny.. had been doing the same for quite some time

@Cynlee-maybe you could show me where I write off the 'old'.I'd like to see that. @Nikki-Now that it's been explained,I don't think anyone should have any difficulty with this particular challenge.In fact,it may ultimately be too easy.And I agree with you.There are many bright and well-educated people at RR.I never implied otherwise.

did i say that you did?.. i agreed with you & threw in the 2nd half.. now retract your claws.. & let's keep this to photography as carlos has suggested

Yes.Let's do that,shall we? :^)

actually this is a simplier example of fractal geometry.... The story of benoit b mendelbrot...and the geometry of chao's... he took the theory beyond newton and einstien... plus the fractal gallery in renderosity is full of inspiration.... this weblink gives examples...http://www.fractalwisdom.com/FractalWisdom/fractal.html hope this is welcomed and helpful

I've just posted my 'choice' on the i-frame :)

As for natural fractals all has been said.
Fractals are not a Mathematical 'invention'.
The Math formula is just an attempt to 'recreate' nature :)

Carlos.

My very limited knowledge of fractals is that I thought they had a symmetrical form to them, that just goes to show I know nothing about them. I used to make symmetry contact print using mirrors in the darkroom about 15-20 years ago, but these days that can be done in PS in a couple of minuets and without the stink lol

'The stink' literally and figuratively...if I remember my dark room experience correctly,lol. ;^)

I had a spiralgraph. LOL

Aw.And I remember all those nasty little green pins,too.Stepped on a few,lol! :^)

I looked at a "simple" definition of fractal..still not certain but get the idea. My concern is that the growth, movement, transition, repetition of form, whatever that makes a fractal in nature might easily go unseen as a "fractal" and look much more like a snowflake or pinecone that it is. Unless dramatic, will most folks see "fractal" at all? So much nature is sublime and minute in that generation of repeated form(or whatever it is!). I will try if this is chosen as a topic but believe it might be too wide spread in interpretation to be useful as a challenge... We will see. I still don't know what I am talking about. LOL

I have an idea, but I'm not sure it it is achivable within 30 days, not really being that scientifically minded, it will deffinatly be a challenge!

fractals are not a mathematic invention.. but a mathematic formula used to Fibonacci sequence (1,1,2,3,5,8,13,21,34,55...),in which the next number in the series is generated by adding the two previous numbers,ie 1+1=2 and 1+2=3,and so on. Lottery illusion From this point of view, mathematical patterns that arise in high-level descriptions of living organisms are evidence that biology, too, is mathematical at heart. For example, the number of petals in a flower tends to be one of the Fibonacci numbers - 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55 and so on, where each is the sum of the previous two. This strange numerology can be traced to the dynamical behaviour of the cells at the tip of a growing shoot. The "primordia"-tiny lumps of cells from which the interesting features of plants develop -become arranged in patterns like interpenetrating spirals, and the mathematics of such patterns leads inevitably to Fibonacci numbers. natures numbers.. basically pattern seeking in nature..!!. any way all on the link !!!! given...

IDEA: Someone who writes definitions better than I come up with a set of "characteristics" for display in the image. Those characteristics would be of fractal form and much simplified than the ever growing possibilities of unlimited and "visually" unrealted imagry. All character of a fractal would not have to be included, unless that is simple and visual. With a guide line such as: "Images need to contain some of all of the following characteristics...bla bla bla" might make it workable. Just my 1/10 cent worth. Tom. P>S>If this can be done, fine. If not, perhaps another choice for the challenge while this one has more time to be considered. I thought it a simple idea untill I began to see what fractals are..then my thoughts got complicated.

I found one simple definition of fractals: "A mathematically generated pattern that is reproducible at any magnification or reduction" Could this mean in a photo, the subject should show repetition of form, from the small to the large view? Clouds do that. Tiny clouds with swirls and whorls and large clouds with very similar swirls and whorls except for size. Perhaps a "repeated form or structure in the minute and the large scale" is a decent(?) definition for "fractal" which might work in finding an image for the camera. I am a simple person here..the math does not scare me at all but we need something more applicable to all than math to find and photograph natural fractals. This is my 1/15 cent. : ) Tom.

Tom, your 'cloud example' works fine for the Challenge theme in discussion here. It fits perfectly in the fractal structure that can be found in nature. Carlos.

Whew....*tom sighs and relaxes a bit. Thanks Carlos.