I recently posted this image, Peter Peter Pumpkin Eater , in my gallery. I have to warn you before looking, this is a dark version of the rhyme and is a bit bloody. I've been doing a series of Dark Tales and Twisted Rhymes in my gallery and they are a bit morbid.

Anyway, I was tickled by the wonderful coments I received on this series and especially on Peter. They've been very encouraging and I really appreciate the response. Then someone wrote this about the Peter image:

"That's really sick humor, sorry someone has to say this-but this is pretty sick."

I felt stunned when I read this. At first I thought it was meant to be a joke, but the more I read it, the more I understood it not to be. I felt as if this person was attacking me. It made me want to shrink into a corner as if I had posted some sleezy porn. I admit the image is morbid as is the humor in it. Call it dark, call it grotesque, call it black, call it grim or twisted, but sick?

You can see a pair female legs in fetsh boots, a hint of stain, and a bit of pumpkin in the thumbnail of the image, and it's clearly marked as containing violence. So it's not like you don't get a warning that this is not a pinup image. I don't mind that he didn't like the subject matter of the image, but I don't see the point in posting a rude remark. It certainly wasn't any kind of constructive criticism.

I took a peek at the gallery of the person that posted the image. The person is talented. This person seems to like to do scantily clad women, often large breasted, pinup type images. Who the hell is he to pass judgement and insinuate that I am some kind of sick person for having a sense of humor that he doesn't appreciate. If he had something to say about my lighting or posing or a way to improve the image it would have been fine. Why not just say that my technique was good but the subject matter wasn't his cup of tea would have been ok. But to just post a snide remark because he didn't approve of the subject matter serves no purpose except to be insulting.

I'm not going to ask the mods to remove the comment. I'm not like that. All I ask is that everyone stop and think when they are commenting on an image. If what you have to say is not constructive, helpful, or encouraging and serves no purpose but to cast judgement or be insulting...better to not say anything at all.

well with a image like that :}

You have the freedom to put it online ..others have the freedom of speech...

And to me the comment was not that hard ... the image itself is a lot harder...

There is always the option uncheck comments ....

when you posted this image you asked for "both critical and non-critical comments" if you select this then i think you have to expect some critism, i always select this but as yet have never had a critism, but would welcome them!. maybe you are reading something else into the comments, because i don't see them as being that harsh, "sick" means just a bad joke where i come from.

Quote - well with a image like that :}

You have the freedom to put it online ..others have the freedom of speech...

And to me the comment was not that hard ... the image itself is a lot harder...

There is always the option uncheck comments ....

An image like what? What's "sick" about the image? It's dark humor and even thought the image is quite vivid, there is no gore and I left quite a bit to the imagination. There has been a view for ages that the original rhyme was about a man that killed his wife. My image may be irreverent but it's in no way "sick". There is certainly freedom of speech here, but not the freedom to be insulting, and the comment that was made was basically an insult.

vince wrote: i always select this but as yet have never had a critism

Haha thats funny i get IM because i do give it to images :}

But i also have people asking me to keep doing the critics on there work. because im honnest

and think that a bit of critic gives more then "wow" or "nice work"

Chris

it's usually best to disable comments and ratings if they are found to be disturbing.

Quote - when you posted this image you asked for "both critical and non-critical comments" if you select this then i think you have to expect some critism, i always select this but as yet have never had a critism, but would welcome them!

I don't mind criticism at all, as long as it's constructive. I don't expect all syrupy praise either. If there is something techincally wrong with the image say so. Maybe I'm wrong, but somehow saying something is "sick" hardly seems to qualify as constructive criticism.

What's "sick" about the image?

HAHAHA dont ask me IM DUTCH we have  a kind of humor the people in the US whould take you to the judge :}

So for i think its funny but then we like dark'hard humor... so dont be mad at me

with a image like that i just wanna say there is a love and peace and god loving ambiance on this site. .. when you go out of that box your getting comments like that...

Me i dont care i like the image... and if you dont know what our kind of humor is i tell you a joke:

George W bush and his army went to the east to bring democracy and freedom of choice.. and no more terrorists

The sayed in the palastines should have free elections ... and who won the first free elections yep the terrorists :}

Chris

Quote - it's usually best to disable comments and ratings if they are found to be disturbing.

I don't see a need to do that. It's one rude comment out of many constructive comments I receive. 

Quote - So for i think its funny but then we like dark'hard humor... so dont be mad at me

Sorry BAR-CODE, I'm not mad at you.  I was just asking you to elaborate on your response. I've got a pretty thick skin and I'm not really upset...it just boggles my mind when people make comments that aren't in the least bit constructive. I've been involved in the art world for a long time and I'm more concerned about other's getting those kinds of comments, especially newbee's and people that are new to Poser and art and are trying hard to do presentable work.

sorry tainted heart, i don't know what country you are from, but i am English, and anytime i have encountered the word "sick" would be in that i may have made a joke, and then a mate may reply "that is sick" which just means that the thought of whatever i said grossed them out a bit, like maybe it gave them an imaginary visual they didn't quite like(feel comfortable with) it isn't a harsh insult, it would just mean it was a bad joke!! maybe you could contact the person in a friendly manner and just ask what they mean. e.g did your image actually offend them, or was it just they found it a distastefull joke, if it upsets you though, i think you should ask a mod to remove the comments.

another thing sprang to mind if you look at "hunter and hunted" in my gallery, you will see a comment by me mate Glen(Danceswithroos) in there he describes my image as "a bit sick maybe" but that just means a bad joke, the image was posted with a bit of a twist to it, different to what i would normally post. but i could never take his comment to be a serious attack at me, he is an Aussie and i'm an Pomme, we have a very similar sense of humour, so i know he just understood it was just a bad taste joke, and that his comments were not an insult aimed at me. hope that is a good example of how the word "sick" gets used in a friendly manner.

I'm in America and something phrased like that could be meant as an insult. If it's meant to be funny it's usually phrased a bit differently. I have done as you suggested though vince3, I sent a PM to the person that wrote to find out what they meant. If I'm wrong, I will humbly eat crow.

i think it could be just a translation thing tainted heart, now i know you are American, another example is the word "nasty" in your country there is probally not much worse a word to describe someone, if you describe someone in American english as "nasty" that is meant to be a major insult, whereas in England it would just mean there not very nice(not nearly as harsh) and not really a mojor insult, we tend to turn to swear words to actually insult someone. hope you don't let it get to you, and that you get it confirmed that it wasn't meant as an insult.

Tainted, forget what those sensitive people say, that picture is great. There is NOTHING sick about it at all. Dark yes but sick no. It just isnt the pretty flowers and faries and love hearts a lot of people seem to adore. Keep up the good work and never be afraid to express yourself in whatever way you feel.

I would take it with a grain of salt and move on. Sometimes you cant make everyone happy. The image, although slightly disturbing to me (I don't do blood very well, I cant even watch ER on TV with all that blood splattering around), is very creative and shows you to have a very imaginative mind. Regards, E

People who think that this picture is "sick" probably have other issues in their lives that is of no concern of ours. Don't be angry with them. I feel sorry for them because they are living such blinkered, humourless lives.

Well.. I think it's sick. And I LOVE it! Coz I have a sick sense of humor!

So.. I do think it's partially a language/cultural thing here.

From one who enjoys the dark, morbid and macabre I see no problem with any of your twisted images.

Cheers,
Micheál

You shouldn't take comments quite so to heart, it will consume too much of your energy.

--Rebekah--

Quote - I recently posted this image, Peter Peter Pumpkin Eater , in my gallery. I have to warn you before looking, this is a dark version of the rhyme and is a bit bloody. I've been doing a series of Dark Tales and Twisted Rhymes in my gallery and they are a bit morbid.

Anyway, I was tickled by the wonderful coments I received on this series and especially on Peter. They've been very encouraging and I really appreciate the response. Then someone wrote this about the Peter image:

"That's really sick humor, sorry someone has to say this-but this is pretty sick."

I felt stunned when I read this. At first I thought it was meant to be a joke, but the more I read it, the more I understood it not to be. I felt as if this person was attacking me. It made me want to shrink into a corner as if I had posted some sleezy porn. I admit the image is morbid as is the humor in it. Call it dark, call it grotesque, call it black, call it grim or twisted, but sick?

I wouldn't let it bother you.

Art is subjective and we each like what we like. The whys and reasons behind our choices are vast, and can't easily be explained.  Some like certain art because of the subject, others because of the colours.  The reasons for not liking something are just as vast.  Plus our morals and religious beliefs play a big part in how we look at not only art, but other things in the world too.

When you post something for public consumption and invite people to comment, you have to be prepared for both the good and bad because there will be some who look at what you do and not like it and will tell you what they think, and will tell you so in their words, and not necessarily using words that you would have liked to hear.

Don't take things so personally.  The comment wasn't about you as a person. It was about the image itself and apparently the viewer didn't like it and told you so and why.

Things could have be worse :)  Your name could be Kevin Costner and you could be reading the reviews on "Waterworld", 

EDIT:  I don't comment  on many images because when I make a comment I want it to count for something and mean something.  Also, if I don't like a picture I just move onto another one abiding by what my parents taught me about "if you can't say something nice....."  I'd rather boost someone's ego with a pat on the back than shoot them down with negative comment.

tainted_heart

While I am squeamish about the content in that particular picture, I think you have done something to evoke a stronge emotion (a sense of revulsion) using both the mental concept and the visual impact of your piece.

In that sense, to me, you have achieved an artistic statement through that work.

I may not enjoy looking at that piece, but not all art is meant to make the viewer feel good.

If anything, that particular artpiece is a mirror into the darker side of the human soul, and I look twice inside myself to understand what it really is that I am reacting to.

The Venus de Milo is kind of sick too, displayed without her arms.  If we know that the sculptor had intentionally used a model with amputated arms, would it make a difference to the way people view that work ?

it could be worse. I got one about 3-4 years ago, got so upset about one of my comments, he went through half my (much smaller) gallery and left pithy comments on half a dozen pictures..

There's no way to please everyone. If   I see something I don't like, I don't look, or comment. I'll occasionally leave awful puns (my bad..;), but that's as bad as it gets. Things I know that can be fixed will be commented on, but in a postivie fashion.

If I remember correctly, 'nasty' comes from the 19th-Century political cartoonist Thomas Nast, who was unsparing in his criticism of the New York city political machine (he also popularized Santa Claus, starting all that Christmas mess..;) Another useless fact from yer Uncle Lar..;)

Don't worry too much about what people think or say. just paraphrase what Dr.Frankenfurter said to Janet Wiese when Janet commented negatively on Rocky Horror's muscles. Frankenfurter shoots back "I didn't make him for you!" that's my attitude, and I just used it slightly before going on the forums. Just for your edifiaction, I got a huge kick out of Pumpkin Eater and Little Miss Muffet. they kick buttocks.

No offense, but looking at the person's gallery who posted that comment , with all its
gentle images of beautiful women, I can see why that person might have made that comment
about your more violent image of a women hacked to death.  I can only guess that this
person felt you were degrading women.

Quote - No offense, but looking at the person's gallery who posted that comment , with all its
gentle images of beautiful women, I can see why that person might have made that comment
about your more violent image of a women hacked to death.  I can only guess that this
person felt you were degrading women.

Thanks Fazzel and everyone who helped to clarify the situation for me, I just found the image to be a little distasteful thats all, that is not in any way against the creative intent of the artist himself. Its just an opinion and it just evoked a sense of 'whoa! this is a bit much', I don't particularly like seeing women hacked into bits, I hope that's understandable.

Simple, You post images that are controversial and you may get a response you didn't bargain for!

I posted an image once of an anorexic female with a syringe sticking out of her arm, very gross image overall when I think about it.

I got a lot of comments, most of them condemming me for posting such a horrible image, the message didn't get across, I took it down eventually because of the nasty comments some were putting.

Truthfully, if you get upset by one so-so comment then don't post controversial images here, post them somewhere else!

On the other hand, you are entitled to post what you like within the terms of the site TOS and equally people can post comments on their opinion within the site TOS!

I've seen and had a lot worse, lighten up and get over it!!  

Nice image by the way!

Quote - I took a peek at the gallery of the person that posted the image. The person is talented. This person seems to like to do scantily clad women, often large breasted, pinup type images. Who the hell is he to pass judgement and insinuate that I am some kind of sick person for having a sense of humor that he doesn't appreciate. If he had something to say about my lighting or posing or a way to improve the image it would have been fine. Why not just say that my technique was good but the subject matter wasn't his cup of tea would have been ok. But to just post a snide remark because he didn't approve of the subject matter serves no purpose except to be insulting.

I'm not going to ask the mods to remove the comment. I'm not like that. All I ask is that everyone stop and think when they are commenting on an image. If what you have to say is not constructive, helpful, or encouraging and serves no purpose but to cast judgement or be insulting...better to not say anything at all.

Firstly, I am a girl...and I don't post large breasted women and pin-ups, that is an attack on my work. Again, like you said, you should stop and think before you want to make a remark on other people's gallery in general.  

Second, I failed to see what you're really after, other than making a propaganda out of all of this. I mean afterall, why would anyone (especially a person who creates such inconsiderate images and irresponsible comments) be so 'sensitive' to a trivial opinion such as 'this is sick?' Get over it dude!! There are other ways to attract more comments on your images okay?

Finally, I stick to my original comment on your image and further, I like to add that after seeing this in the public forum I really do feel sick, not about your image but about your immature way of approaching things. Grow up!

i´d say, art is (apart from sex) (well, and speeding of course) the only way to set the animal loose for a while in civilized world. that this animal is not necessarily a kitty lies within the human nature. ( did i say nature?)

thus fear and violence are a part of art as well as grace is, right?

btw, i saw that avatar in this forum, a little girl obviously eating a spider.....

this is   a b s o l u t e l y   S I C K !!!!!

this is   a b s o l u t e l y   G R E A T, and i give you all those "peach-sword-temple"-renders for this small image......

er, would someone pls link me to it´s original picture?

thx

A.

Quote - Firstly, I am a girl...and I don't post large breasted women and pin-ups, that is an attack on my work.

As if your comment wasn't an attack on my work. Secondly I did say you were talented which was an attempt to indicate my comment wasn't meant to be an attack on your work. It was an attempt at a "people who live in glass houses" kind of comment.

Quote - Second, I failed to see what you're really after, other than making a propaganda out of all of this. I mean afterall, why would anyone (especially a person who creates such inconsiderate images and irresponsible comments) be so 'sensitive' to a trivial opinion such as 'this is sick?'

"What I am after" was a discussion on what I felt was an unfair characterization of not just my image, but of my character as well. I don't create inconsiderate images. I do create a variety of work...some of it fetish, some fantasy, some dark and irreverant, but none of it inconsiderate. Who are you to pass judgement that my image is "sick" or inconsiderate and in saying so, you label me sick and inconsiderate as well by default, I'd say that was a bit irresponsible of you. You don't know me, and you certainly can't even hope to understand my nature from one image! Believe me, there are many people here who think that images of scantily clad, large breasted pinups are "sick" that would label you sick and inconsiderate just as quickly. There are many who feel those types of images are demeaning to women. I'm sure your intent with your images has nothing to do with demeaning women, just as my images have nothing to do with being inconsiderate.

As to my way of approaching the issue...perhaps I should not have made such a big deal out of it, but there is nothing immature about bringing attention to a comment made in a public gallery and having a public discussion about it. Bottom line is this...you are certainly entitled to your opinion and you are entitled to state it. Perhaps I over reacted to it, and I apologize for that, and for the approach I took when I started this thread, but I can offer no apology for discussing the comment or the nature of my work in public.

You are a fine artist and should be proud of your work. I am proud of mine and I am sorry if you found my image distasteful. I cannot say I won't create similar images, but I do so as an exploration of the darker side of human nature, to make people think and perhaps to poke fun at it, not to be crude or inconsiderate. Thinking it over, I am actually encouraged that I drew a strong reaction from someone. Good art should do that. I am only sorry that your reaction to my image made you feel I was being inconsiderate as well. That was not my intent. I hope you will accept my apology and set aside this difference between us. I have definately learned from this and can assure you, the next time I receive such a reaction from a viewer, I will approach it much differently I assure you. I invite you to continue to comment openly on my work, good or bad, and to do so without fear of my over reacting again. That is not to say I might not open a discussion of it, but I will be more careful to not cast a bad light on the person that made the comment. 

I accept your apology and may this be a lesson to anyone else out there trying to attract more controversy than necessary.

Regarding to my comment on your image, as I stated in my reply to your message to me - its a natural reaction after an image depicting a man hacking his wife and stuffing her into a pumpkin, with your comment 'Maybe I got a little carried away with the blood, but it isn't easy to stuff a pumpkin shell without making a mess'. I appreciate the dark humor but it really did go a bit far across the line for me, I believe I still have a right to comment.

**Besides, look how many comments you have attracted by creating all this shenanigan, fortunately for me, I have better things to do rather than to drag this on and on... **

Sometimes, people JUST NEED TO RELAX & BREATHE...

Have a nice day! :biggrin:

Quote - I appreciate the dark humor but it really did go a bit far across the line for me...

I don't want to "drag this on" either. My only reply is that I might not have taken it so personally had that been your original comment instead of saying sick, which I felt also implied I was "sick", as in mentally unbalanced. Sometimes, it's not so much what you say, but how you say it that's important. I'm not saying you have to walk on egg shells when you comment, just take the time to think about how your message might be perceived before you click the submit button.

I've got a pretty twisted sence of humor, so naturally I think your work is hot. At the same time, this is america baby... freedom of speach.  Great work non the less.

i dont think that comment was so bad... if that got you upset then you should start developing a thicker skin now, believe me there are far worse comments than that :)

with an image like that its either love or hate... you are pretty much inviting a wide range of comments whenever you release anything controversial or even simply different from the 'norm'.

love it or hate it ,it is for the audience to decide. remember, we can't please everybody. we might deem things to be tongue-in-cheek but to others it might be taken the other way. we all have different opinions on things. you exercised your right to post something that is a little dark and can be considered controversial, don't feel bad if others don't find the humor in it and exercise their rights to tell you so. personally, i don't see anything harsh about the comment just as you don't see anything that can be misconstrued as "sick" in your image. i am immune to dark humor, so such image doesn't bother me and i can see the humor in it but i am not everyone else.

Beats the hell outta me what GreyPixels gallery has to do with any of this.

"That's really sick humor, sorry someone has to say this-but this is pretty sick."

**"you label me sick and inconsiderate as well by default,"

So by that logic

The persons who said:

OMG!!!! LOMFAO...That`s just mean.

labeled "Mean" by default.

Oh my goodness... isnt THAT creative.. and very morbid,

labeled you "Morbid" by default.

 ".....What a perfectly insane and twisted expression."

labeled you "Insane and twisted" by default"

"so ghastly and gory"

labeled you "ghastly and gory" by default.

These are all adjectives that those commenting used to describe the "Image"

Why is it when GreyPixel uses an adjective to describe the image,she is suddenly describing you by default?

Give me a break guys...I already apologized to GreyPixel and I admitted I over-reacted. Seems like you didn't read the whole thread or you would have seen that. :P

well, anyway, taint - you see what I mean about disabling comments. artists are inherently sensitive, or they wouldn't be able to express their feelings in compelling images. that's why comments on images can be hurtful, or even a discussion about comments can lead to bad feelings.

You asked for comments, you got a comment, now you are whining about it.  Geez, grow up.

Your pic is a snuff pic of a whore and /or extreme domestic violence.. You modifyed a kids rhyme  for your pic. Thats not even remotely funny. (if the verse is an alternate version please post a referance to it.)

If you are going to do this sort of gore porn at least have the guts to stand behind your work.

This is my opinion.

I have no objection to this sort of thing, I just hate it when people try to wimp out on what they are creating. 

Quote - Your pic is a snuff pic of a whore and /or extreme domestic violence.. You modifyed a kids rhyme  for your pic. Thats not even remotely funny.

No, it's an irreverant look at the darker side of nursery rhymes. Half the so called "kids rhymes" from Mother Goose recount events from history such as murders, terrorist attacks, and worse. Do you really think Peter built a cute little pumpkin house for the wife he "couldn't keep". "Put her in a pumpkin shell and there he kept her very well"...someone would have to be really naive to think there is no hidden meaning in those words. I did modify the last line...but believe me, that's no kids rhyme.

Here's a little eye opener for you:

The Mary alluded to in the nursery rhyme Mary, Mary Quite Contrary is considered to be Mary Tudor also know as Bloody Mary, daughter of King Henry VIII. Queen Mary was a Catholic, the garden referred to alludes to graveyards which were growing larger with the bodies of murdered Protestant martyrs. The silver bells and cockle shells were slang for instruments of torture. 'Silver bells' were thumbscrews and 'cockleshells' were instruments of torture which were attached to the genitals! The 'maids' were a device to behead people called the Maiden, not to be confused with the iron maiden.

Maybe you should do some research so you know what you're talking about.

Quote - If you are going to do this sort of gore porn at least have the guts to stand behind your work.

What an idiotic statement. I've been defending my work in this thread, I'd say that's standing behind my work. I don't do porn...come down off your high horse. I described it as morbid, irreverant humor and quite a few people agree with me. Porn though is in the mind of the beholder. Perhaps you need re-examine your thinking and grow up yourself.

Quote - well, anyway, taint - you see what I mean about disabling comments.
artists are inherently sensitive, or they wouldn't be able to
express their feelings in compelling images.

Well Miss Nancy, I'm fast growing a thicker skin and learning that you just can't take some peoples opinions seriously, especially ones that start crying "whiner". By the way, your avatar freaks me out...lol! It always reminds me of one of my favorite movies Killer Klowns From Outer Space. 

yeah, I know, taint. I hate that klown - in fact, everybody hates it. if I weren't so lazy I'd replace it with something nice, but there hangs the tale. p.s at least ya didn't post an image based on "ring around the rosies, pocketful of posies". that would've freaked 'em out even worse, i daresay :lol:

I may just do that. Ring around the rosey refers to one symptom of the bubonic plague which was a ring shaped rosy red rash on the skin. Pocket full of posies refered to sweet smelling herbs (posies) carried in pockets or pouches because people believed the disease was carried by bad smells. "Ashes Ashes" refered to the cremation of the bodies! There is another version which replaces ashes with "A-tishoo, A-tishoo" representing the violent sneezing that was another symptom (A-tishoo, A-tishoo, we all fall down). Once again, another so-called children's rhyme actually refering to something other than sweetness and cute fun.

And we've all seen the darker side of Jack & Jill done to death! Nice to see some other nursery ryhmes getting their due in the dark genre's! I vote for "The Old Lady Who Lived In a Shoe" next!

Perhaps in future if there is a percieved problem with a gallery comment made it should be directed to a moderator? Just a thought!

Attached Link: http://www.rhymes.org.uk/

http://www.rhymes.org.uk/

BTW ..Sorry tainted_heart I did miss the apology.

8 )
 

Tom

Here's another link with a lot of interesting info on the dark side of nursery rhymes (and fairy tales). 
http://nemendur.khi.is/berghall/nurseryrhymes.htm

Love your work tainted_heart!  I'm looking forward to seeing what you do next!

On a semi-related note, is anyone here familiar with Roald Dahl's Revolting Rhymes?  I absolutely loved that book when I was a kid!  Here's a link:
http://www.roalddahlfans.com/books/revo.php

Quote - Perhaps in future if there is a percieved problem with a gallery comment made it should be directed to a moderator? Just a thought!

As I stated in my first post, I wouldn't do that. The mods have enough to deal with. I don't think negative comments should be deleted from the galleries, except in the case of obvious trolls. I am against giving members the capability of deleting comments from their gallery too. At any rate, I didn't feel a need to obliterate the comment from my gallery. It was really all a misunderstanding and I don't feel like rehashing it.

I've heard of  Roald Dahl's Revolting Rhymes, in fact I remember seeing it in bookstores. I think I may have even read it but I truly don't remember. I will definately look for it though. Thanks for the links hawkfyr and Neyjour!

Quote - I love you,
You love me,
We're best friends like friends should be,
With a great big hug,
And a kiss from me to you,
Won't you say you love me too?

• Courtesy of Barney