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Poser - OFFICIAL F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2024 Nov 14 10:48 am)
Subject: Sanctum Arts, where are you?
Attached Link: http://www.sanctumart.com/index.php
They have their own website now."It is good to see ourselves as
others see us. Try as we may, we are never
able to know ourselves fully as we
are, especially the evil side of us.
This we can do only if we are not
angry with our critics but will take in good
heart whatever they might have to
say." - Ghandi
Quote - Yeah, Acadia hit it.
hehe I absolutely love this site's search feature now. It was so archaic before, and then after the initial change over was totally useless. But now I think they've perfected it! Using a combination of a keyword, search time frame, forum and sometimes poster name, I can find everything I try and search for!
"It is good to see ourselves as
others see us. Try as we may, we are never
able to know ourselves fully as we
are, especially the evil side of us.
This we can do only if we are not
angry with our critics but will take in good
heart whatever they might have to
say." - Ghandi
I suggest checking the rumblings in this thread at PoserPros.com before buying anything from SanctumArts:
http://poserpros.daz3d.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=54287
Not for the squeamish!
Interesting thread there. I added my 2 cents to it.
"It is good to see ourselves as
others see us. Try as we may, we are never
able to know ourselves fully as we
are, especially the evil side of us.
This we can do only if we are not
angry with our critics but will take in good
heart whatever they might have to
say." - Ghandi
Yeh, good call Marque. And to you Mizrael, I do appreciate the notice. It opened my eyes and has probably save me some future tension. I couldn't leave after reading all of that without posting. I think that SAkitty must have acted on her own when she posted to that thread, something I wouldn't have done even if the suspicions were correct. Having no proof makes her look like a bully and the guy who posted as SanctumArts seemed to be a lot more polite, almost as if he were doing a little damage control. I can see now why Daz and R'osity don't have SA as a merchant. If they are like this to their customers then could you imagine the trouble that they would bring here? I would love to see them try that stuff with ClintH around. He would boot them out the door (or has he?). I am going to be more careful now as to whom I do business with. Funny thing though. When I asked the people at Daz where I could find SA they told me that SA had their own site but, instead of giving me a link they told me to do a Google search, instead. I think maybe they helped me out by not doing so because, hey, that Google search didn't turn up the web site. Thank you Daz. And again, thank you Mizrael.
I saw SA when he first came into DAZ, i must say there is nothing in that thread that comes as any real supprise to me. his attitude (and his "PR" person's attitude) have not changed from day one.
It really wouldnt supprise me if DAZ asked him to leave.
SA has some really awesome stuff that i would love to have but I won't buy from them.
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I don't have anything against SA personally as I've never bought thier stuff. Mainly because it was out of my hobbiest price range, but I have made purchases in the past from merchants who treated their buyers poorly and resolved to never do it again if at all possible.
Great artistic talent doesn't always equate to great customer service. As the saying goes, "Buyer Beware". It's not my job to disparage SA, but I feel it's my duty to the community to let people know before they buy from merchants like this just what they're possibly getting themselves in for.
There are plenty of good merchants out there who treat their customers with respect and dignity to ever waste a dime on the ones who don't, unless you just can't live without that one item that only they produce. Even then, you don't always get what you paid for and sometimes you get what you didn't want.
SanctumArts only sells through there site and brokers some products from their site to content paradise.
Brokers and mechants that defend warez kiddies are horrible.
english as a second language isn't held against other merchants yet some are held to a higher plain on top of a huge spike.
One particular person has stated and bloged that it is their mission to troll, harrass and do harm. for shame, just shameful.
I personally would rather buy from a merchant that is looking out, protecting their interest and actually see's art I do and asks about it.
SA good for you! Go get um and don't let the masses of instanisty in Poser Prozak land get ya down!
-= Refuse the Refit =-
Yeah MachineClaw. Absolutely nobody's going to be surprised that you once again stand behind a merchant that's misbehaving. It's what you do best and BJ, Nobody said people were being nice in that thread. I clearly stated it wasn't for squeemish readers.
While I don't agree with any of the personal attacks made there, the overall dispute is cut and dried. Merchants do not have the authority to act as internet cops.
Ethics, honor, you betcha I'll defend.
149 posts in that thread over there 5000 views. 2 posts by SA/Kitty. Who's doing the badness? It was handled in private until the post was made.
When blatent lies against a merchant are spewed I will defend them. I do not believe that SA misbehaved in any way.
People who do not own SA products saying that their products are broken when they are not broken are lieing plane and simple. Linch mobing a merchant because people don't get what they want and to feel powerful just because it's all they can do to be a part of are horrible in my book.
SA produces high quality detailed products that work as advertised and are worth every penny spent on them.
SA Products are amongst the highest quality out there. extremely intricate (Spl?)! I've only had one small problem with them and that was with the naming of some jpeg files that were too long. They took note. I won't comment on the other stuff yin or yang, But their quality is top notch! ( although I wish they'd learn to smart prop a gun to a hand!)
Quote: "BJ, Nobody said people were being nice in that thread. I clearly stated it wasn't for squeemish readers. "
Meh, Squeemish Schmeemish.
Quote: "Merchants do not have the authority to act as internet cops."
How about Forum thugs? There seems to be a number of people in the poser forums in general who think they're the law...
Pity - the central topic was really interesting - Backhearted probably hit the nail on the head regarding the sad reality of a merchant's position (and it was a hidden truth I guess) - but any of the properly reasoned commentary was drowned out by the baying of rabid dogs...
Quote - I do not believe that SA misbehaved in any way.
One thing I found really amusing about SanctumArt accusing somebody of stealing his product is that his very first Poser product included mesh that was stolen. The mesh in question was a weapon made by Moebius87 which SA had got his hands on and decided to sell in his product. Moe had no knowledge of it at all until somebody asked him what his gun design was doing in SA's product. SA always says his products are "left overs from other projects", but whose other projects? He doesn't say.
Also, the designs don't seem to be original. Compare SA's Grim armour to Jin-Roh (http://www.jin-roh.net/) for example.
So when SA says somebody else stole something from him, I just roll around laughing.
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The Jin-Roh suit is certainly an inspiration for the Grim Suit - but I was never convinced of it being an outright steal...has anyone gotten down and dirty with a comparisson?
Cheers
Pic is something I threw together back when SA stormed out of Daz, someone had spotted his Grim suit over at one of the serious CG site WiP forums and there was much wailing and nashing of teeth that it would never be poserised. It's kind of like the sort of cardboard outfit you'd make for yourself as a kid when you didn't have access to an authentic Darth Vader or Stormtrooper outfit.
Quote - Ethics, honor, you betcha I'll defend.
149 posts in that thread over there 5000 views. 2 posts by SA/Kitty. Who's doing the badness? It was handled in private until the post was made.
When blatent lies against a merchant are spewed I will defend them. I do not believe that SA misbehaved in any way.
People who do not own SA products saying that their products are broken when they are not broken are lieing plane and simple. Linch mobing a merchant because people don't get what they want and to feel powerful just because it's all they can do to be a part of are horrible in my book.
SA produces high quality detailed products that work as advertised and are worth every penny spent on them.
That's funny! I don't recall a single post where anyone was slighting the quality of SA's products or claiming they didn't work. Would you care to point it out, oh mister all ethical and truthful? In fact, I'm pretty sure that most of the detractors of their business practice had good things to say about the high qualities of their meshwork. Sure, not everyone was pleased but I read the whole thread and there wasn't one claim of a product being broken.
You want to try laying claim to the high road of truth and ethics, maybe you shuold learn to use them yourself instead of misrepresenting what that thread was about! It wasn't about their products or the quality of their products, it was about their unethical business conduct. It's obvious to me that you either didn't read it or you're just pulling a typical fanboi spin control posting here.
quote: "I don't recall a single post where anyone was slighting the quality of SA's products or claiming they didn't work"
There were many underhanded comments about the quality of the products (I think even Psiwire said they were "average" quality or similar which had nothing to do with the issue at hand) - and a few legit ones about them being rather large files and hard-going on Poser.
It's arguable that a product which pushes it's target proggie to breaking point could be considered inferior to another product that has been optimised specifically for something like Poser (say Davo's Contruction Sets), though SA has always be upfront about the need for higher-end machines etc to run his stuff because of the polycount and huge textures. The comments in the thread weren't making that sort of point though.
I myself have posted about my feelings on SA product quality, specifically the fact that for the price of Alpha and Havoc all you get is a few poses, textures, and the mesh, which has a few facial expression dials, and probably (haven't checked) hand posing dial movements.
Personally, usability and alterability are things I look for in a good product. Uzilite's clothes are high-poly, but they also come with enough morphs to probably choke Poser, and still look good doing, and at a lower cost than SA's products.
Nybras, from DAZ, has a nice number of morphs built in, allowing a wide range of "different but similar" demons, and that's before adding in the one of the morph expansions, which you can get along with Nybras for the same cost of 1 of SA's products, and I know I'll use Nybras more, because of the morphability of his base mesh.
From what I've seen, with SA products, you get what you see, and the only thing you can change is texture, there are no muscular, obese, mangy, female, bloated, or whatever morphs, (and no, I don't feel like I should have to make my own for a product of that price) to give you a slightly different monster.
But then, that's my opinion, and SA wouldn't have gotten much more money off me even if this hadn't come to light (I can get far more than a single figure out of $35+ even at DAZ, so for me price is the biggest turn-off).
________________________________________________________________
If you're joking that's just cruel, but if you're being sarcastic, that's even worse.
Yeah, the prices are harsh - I can't blow $70 on a single product like the Grim Suit despite how nice it looks (though I think you get male/female and another sort of helmet and a jet pack dealie?).
With monsters I'd argue you can only expect to get what you see in the promos. Morphability isn't the point of a monster - it's monstrosity is...and to be fair his look pretty monsterous.
Animals and Humans are a different consideration though because identical figures in a scene don't work - but you can happily have 10 identical monsters in a scene going apecrap without worrying about the viewer having a problem with it.
Also there are many cool monsters at Rendo that don't have Daz-like morphability - so it's fairly common to get what you see, only the SA pricing policy is different.
Cheers
Quote - quote: "I don't recall a single post where anyone was slighting the quality of SA's products or claiming they didn't work"
There were many underhanded comments about the quality of the products (I think even Psiwire said they were "average" quality or similar which had nothing to do with the issue at hand) - and a few legit ones about them being rather large files and hard-going on Poser.
Yes there were comments on how well his products worked in Poser but nobody claimed they were broken as MC just stepped in here claiming. Saying they were memory hogs on Posers resources isn't the same thing as saying they were broken, regardless of the spin. For what it's worth, pointing out a products performance capabilities in the package it was made for is not the same as saying it was a crappy model.
to say a product is of average quality isn't an underhanded statement....i only wish the stuff i did was just average as far as the quality of merchants go. not that i'm a merchant...cos my stuff just ain't average lmao. now if they said theyw ere blow average...that would be another story. after reading the thread the two or three posts sanctum sent in did more damage to themselves that any or all of the other posts put together. in fact they made themselves look like really nasty merchants. i'll be honest if i were pswire or whoever i'd of shown the emails in their entirity.
as for ethics and honour...sanctum threw what they had of those two commodities out of the door when they posted as they did and when they asked for proof of purchase without reasonable doubt.....they also showed themselves to lie by stating they had gotten in touch with certain people. people who denied any such thing in an open forum. maybe you think what they did ethical and honourable claw......from what i saw the majority who posted disagrees with you. as such sanctum will be hit hard in the pocket and if they keep asking for proof of purchase more people who have read the thread will stop buying off them. personally i couldn't give a toss who asks me for proof of purchase 1, 6 or 12 months after i bought it. my stock answer would be ....sling your hook. my family by me a lot of stuff and what i won't do is interrogate them for the details...i always see the reciepts cos i see the emails verifying whats been bought but thats as far as it goes. after that i don't bother with the reciepts, i just write down the serials and keep em in a safe place should my machine go wonky bob.
billy
No one is defending warez kitties. If a merchant gets ripped off I'm one of the first to get ticked because in the end it costs all paying customers money. But I won't defend someone who treats their customers badly. I can only wonder when I'll be next. I'm unchecking the notify box, this is getting old.
Quote - I recall that the Moebius gun situation was resolved as it being too close to the actual design rather than being an actual theft of the mesh (saw it in a render somewhere and copied it perhaps?) - I guess you heard a bit more through Moe himself as part of Team Dystopia? Was it a mesh or design swipe?
It was the actual mesh. SA said he bought it from somebody else in good faith, believing they had the right to sell it to him. They didn't. In my book, a vendor who sells you something he didn't make himself and who hasn't properly checked that he has the rights to sell it to you is somebody you should be wary of buying from. See this thread at DAZ (http://forum.daz3d.com/viewtopic.php?t=5815 ) to see how when Moe released his own mesh, people who had previously seen the SA product jumped to the conclusion that Moe's product was a rip off of SA's , when it was really the other way around. In the thread, Moe posted some correspondence from SA that explained what happened.
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- I like Sanctum Arts quality. 2. The Texture work is outstanding. (sometimes to good.) 3. I don't like the models lack of morphs. What you see is what you get. 4. I don't like their demeanor. I stated one problem that incurred with one of their products. I was immediately told to spread'em and patted down. So I gave them my user name, date of purchase, and receipt number. (didn't know that they had problems with people not purchasing product and asking for support.) I was given a slight rude answer. I explain that I was notifying them of the long name jpeg problem, that I solved but wanted to pass on the info. Geez! 5. Yes! I'll buy from them again. Yes! I'll keep my communication with to a no other way. 6. Yes! I'd love a much bigger picture of Ms. Kitty :o BTW the Grim suit is very, very, very close to the Armor in Final Fantasy the Spirit within
Ajax:
Yeah that's the thread I remember. But I guess everyone just suspects SA of outright theft of the mesh himself rather than this 3rd party? (the acusations against psiwire put aside)
I got that dronetrooper weapon's pack recently during the brokers sale - v. nice. The big shoulder rocket launcher is a riot - I've got a very silly render in mind for it.
Final Fantasy Suit:
Had forgotten that one - will have to dig through my archives - I think I have some sweet renders of that somewhere - didn't spot a similarity myself, but it could've been the inspiration for the bodywork I guess, I'd have to check.
There's a really nice render of the Grim suit over at CP - linked image of the week from front page I think? I really can't see a clear rip-off of the Jin-Roh suit (though the mask is hidden a bit - Jin-Roh 2046 perhaps? heheh). However much an A-hole the guy is, the bastard can sure model...that's a niiiice image.
Cheers
Hi MachineClaw,
Thanks, I agreed and we are not going anyway. Thank you for your support!
SanctumArtKitty =^_^=
SanctumArtKitty =^_^=
Sales and Tech Support
www.sanctumart.com
Hi shaft73,
The weapons included with VAP Grim package such as the hand gun and rifle were designed as “figure” instead of as “smart prop” because of the complexity bone structure we wanted to incorporate in to them. Thanks to the “figure” setup, you can practically move all of the independent parts. For examples, the buttstock can be extended, sight adjustment of the rings, trigger, barrels, and ect. In opposite to the weapons, the other objects that do not have internal action features are made as “smart props.”
BTW: there are poses “gun to hand" for M3 and V3 are included with the package in the “Pose” library.
SanctumArtKitty =^_^=
SanctumArtKitty =^_^=
Sales and Tech Support
www.sanctumart.com
One Shot wrote:
“4. I don't like their demeanor. I stated one problem that incurred with one of their products. I was immediately told to spread'em and patted down. So I gave them my user name, date of purchase, and receipt number. (didn't know that they had problems with people not purchasing product and asking for support.) I was given a slight rude answer. I explain that I was notifying them of the long name jpeg problem, that I solved but wanted to pass on the info. Geez!”
Hi One Shot,
I am very sorry you got the impression but you wrote from a different email address that was not on file. I did have a feeling that it was you but I was not sure. That’s why I asked for verification. Try to understand with the unhealthy attitudes about illegal files sharing among some Poser users, (not to say that you are one of them) it was a necessary step to take.
How much bigger picture of me do you want? I am not all that!!
SanctumArtKitty =^_^=
SanctumArtKitty =^_^=
Sales and Tech Support
www.sanctumart.com
I would like to point out that Sanctum Art is NOT a merchant, broker, or PA as so many people keep on calling him but an independent store. Yes, we do sell products via Content Paradise but it is not on a “brokerage” based system as people are so familiar with. We have access to information who bought what. Although, we tried to keep it privately but psiwire decided to have a public lynching via Poser Pros forum knowingly he did not purchase it. How he could be our consumer when he DID NOT pay for the license to use it? I am very sorry that so many of you think it is invasion of your privacy or harassment, but we already have access to the information and it is within our rights to try confirm purchase. We are not being arrogant or bullies but simply trying to protect our products and PAYING consumers.
SanctumArtKitty =^_^=
Sales and Tech Support
www.sanctumart.com
Hi Ajax,
Actually, bigjobbie was right. It was not the MESH that was in question but the similarity of design to Moe’s models. Since it was resolved between Moe and SanctumArt, I do not know what is your beef with us?! SA wrote an email to Moe with an explanation and if Moe has any suggestion for him, SA would have gladly complied with it. Since Moe did not pursuit it any more; we considered it as being a closed case. Three years ago, we made a mistake of to collaborate on a project with a third party. Ever since then, all our stuff comes from us. Man, you really need to learn a new trick coz it is getting old now 
SanctumArtKitty =^_^=
Sales and Tech Support
www.sanctumart.com
SanctumArtsKitty,
Unless you have actual proof, we'd like it if you didn't accuse members of theft in our forums.
MorriganShadow
Poser Moderator
Sitemail | Freestuff | Craftythings | Youtube|
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it
into a fruit salad.
OK folks - this is being discussed at the Poserpros forum, I see no need of rehashing it all here, especially since none of the alleged incidents took place here. I'm going to lock this down now - please feel free to discuss in the existing thread over at PPros. Thanks.
Karen
"you are terrifying
and strange and beautiful
something not everyone knows how to love." - Warsan
Shire
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I run in to a roadblock when I make a Google search for Sanctum Arts. They used to sell great things here and at Daz. Now, I don't know where to find them. Does anyone know what has happened to these guys? If anybody can give me a link to their site (if it exists, that is) then I would appreciate it. Anyone who has purchased items from Sanctum Arts will understand why I want to find their Online Store.