Which programs do you use to model clothing for Daz or Apollo figures?

I'm trying to get a good toolbox of programs going where eventually I will be able to do pretty much anything I want - (not that I will be able to do it well, I just want to be capable).

I have Carrara, Vue, Poser, Photoshop cs2, and a freebie modeler CB model pro.  

What do you guys suggest specifically for the use of modeling clothing and/or detailed props.  I'm not infinately wealthy so programs like Maya are probably out of the question until such time that I've put all my children through school and can afford to go myself (ie never =D).

I have a pretty good grasp on whats out there, but I just don't know what is the best for what, and I know different goals warrant different software more often than not.

Thanks in advance.

Attached Link: Silo 2 Public Beta 10a (windows only) June 2 2007

You might want to look into Silo.  It's fairly intuitive and had a great support forum as well as constantly being updated and improved upon without changing work flow so much.  Version 2.0 is about ready to be released within the next few weeks I'd imagine at this point.  I have Hex 2, Carrara and a few others but I always come back to Silo.

If you are Windows user you can download the trial which is now a public beta. 

Follow the link.  I think you will have to sign up for the forums in order to get it but I'm not a 100% sure about having to become a member to obtain the beta.

Silo is great, I tend to use hexagon a lot myself.  Thanks RAMWolfF for the link :)

I don't have Vue (yet), but do have Cararra.
There are some older versions of programs that can be purchased at low cost. The biggest part of the battle is to get a good handle on various modelling techniques (mainly of the subdivision kind). Once you do that, most programs will start looking the close to the same, and it ends up being a matter of personal preferences.

I'm sorry, my brain is jumbled up from trying to learn too much stuff at once so I'm not remembering a lot of detail, but, also there are several pieces of software where a demo version is made so that you can do everything except for saving, or have a limited number of 'saves', rather then being limited to a number of days etc...  Rhino being one of them.
I find those kinds of demo versions particularly useful for learning the program (on the budget)

Cloth modelling for example... I'm in the middle of comparing the simulations (in max) vs. hand sculpting them.  I'm not the best at setting up simulations yet, so atthe moment I'm on a cusp, it takes as much time to hand model something (by pushing vertices) as it does to set up and run a simulation, and get a pleasing result.

Also, the tools are only as good as one's knowledge of art techniques is. For example, I have years of experimenting with various clay modleing, from play dough to polymer clays to regular modelling clays, so modelling something in a program is just the matter of knowing which pencil to use for what. But, I'm not the best at figure drawing or sculpting... so, you can guess, figure modelling for me is a pain! Clothes, accessories, objects etc... no problem.

hmm..I just tried Metasequoia last night, and it seems to be able to do a couple of good things; selective smoothing (intensity), and 4-sided polygons. If you go to the Daz Freepository and check the stickies at the top, there's a whole raft of programs. Also, I think I have another site..but I'll have to find it.

first thanks for the info so far!  Downloaded Silo and I'm about to open it up and look around.

As far as lists of free programs, I have seen a plethora of links to this and that, but my problem is that details are rarely specific.  Now Im sitting with Vue and Carrara and the programs essentially do the same things in the way of things I want.  I don't want to do anymore of that.

I want to in the end just have a good arsenol of things to work with - and personal recommendations or descriptions of what a program does in response to a specific request for information is going to save me $$ I hope = D

Welll, folks like Wings too.  I don't care for that program but that's just my personal preference!!

I gave that one a try once, it wasn't very friendly to me.  Of course, mind you, what you guys call vertexs and polys I refer to as dots and lines (and I probably have them mixed up)- so Im not really far enough to make any real judgements ; )

The big seller points for me right now are probably very silly to others, for instance - if I can figure out how to make a ball appear in less than 30 minutes - the software earns a point.

Quote - I gave that one a try once, it wasn't very friendly to me.  Of course, mind you, what you guys call vertexs and polys I refer to as dots and lines (and I probably have them mixed up)- so Im not really far enough to make any real judgements ; )

The big seller points for me right now are probably very silly to others, for instance - if I can figure out how to make a ball appear in less than 30 minutes - the software earns a point.

 

IMVHO, in that case Hexagon might be very good option for you to start with.  I found it to be extremely friendly to use. More then Cararra, or Silo or Wings etc...
Also, it tends to use less high end technical terminology.
Then later on if you end up using cararra more, you'll find hexagon and cararra interfaces and commands very similar, which i find to be a bonus.

Then again it all may be due to the way my silly brain is wired. Who knows ;)

Although I'd personally recommend Silo, the best thing I can tell you is find one modeller and simply stick with it. No program out there is going to take a couple of days to master. Modelling is one of those things that you never seem to master, but rather just get better at it. And unless you are a complete wiz, you won't be making anything you'll want others to see in just a few days.

So find one (the suggestions so far are good choices) and just go with it. Use it all the time, even if what you make is stupid. Find every tutorial for that program and do them, even if it's for things you'd never normally make. See if there are any tutorial DVD's or anything like that you can buy and use those as well. If you don't dedicate a good portion of your time to learning your program you'll only ever be a so-so modeller.

There's not a day goes by that I don't open up Silo and make something in it. 90% of the things I make never even see the light of day, but it all goes towards helping me understand the program better and stretch my skills as a modeller :)

I did get a few tutorials from the marketplace here just a bit ago.  I got Silo earlier and decided I would try the tuts with silo and carrara - to see which I found was easiest to follow along with.  Then that would be the program I chose.

Well Im stuck on both in different places LOL.  In Carrara I could not find the "slice" command - in Silo I can't figure out how to mirror so it shows side by side.  Nor can I find the answer to those questions for either program - so maybe onto Wings???

The tut was written using 3ds max but he specifically said on the product page that I should be able to follow along with other programs as well.  So I know I can just a matter of figuring it out I suppose.

Look up CUT TOOL in Cararra. Reference Manual pdf, Page 523

well, polys are faces (or facets, if you prefer). Vertexes (I think) are edges. To be honest, I call them faces and lines (dots are points..;)

I found Wings a bit mysterious at first, but look for a spaceship tutorial by Draculaz, which will set you on the right path.  IF they've put all the tuts back..;) I've been using it for about 5 years, and I still have things to learn, but it's free, and useful.

There's also no reason you can't use more than 1. I also have Blender and Metasequoia, Topmod, CB Modeler pro, and others, to do specific things that wings might not do. Everyone develops their own style, with their own tools. It won't happen overnight, but you'll get the hang of it. And stop by any of the forums if you have questions.

I didnt read through all the posts but dont think I saw it mentioned, but I always liked Milkshape3d, especially for modelling props. 

http://chumbalum.swissquake.ch/

"And stop by any of the forums if you have questions."

I have tried that, even with these questions.  I keep coming back to the Poser forum for questions because I enjoy the friendly people.  Of course I haven't given it many chances (I'm a first impression kind of person) but this is the only forum regarding 3d that nobody is ever uppity  on.  (to me at least)

Alot of people assume that if you ask a question it must mean you aren't willing to research or look for the answer yourself.  I suppose in alot of cases that is true. For me it's not.  When I do ask a question I usually do because I feel the information I recieve that way will be more valuable than another method.

Rant off - lol

back to this particular thread - searching for cut tool yielded much better results Connie - thank you.

Quote -  searching for cut tool yielded much better results Connie - thank you.

 

Cool :)
I hope my answer wasn't too curt :) I was trying to be efficient.
I've been there, cut in one program is slice  in another is detach in a third, I swear, sometimes a person needs a 3D theasurus.
I was just noticing in Hexagon, in some sports it's called a point, in another spot it's called a vertex... (.)   
Them darn dots and stick figures!

"I hope my answer wasn't too curt :) I was trying to be efficient."
Not at all, I'm a mother of 3 - efficient is my best friend =D

Hex until my computer died. Now I still use Shade8.5 for curves and toon renders, Silo because it works on this old computer and simular to Hex. Wings3D because that is what I learned on and can do some of the finish work faster.

BTW, I thought we were being nice in theother foum/Carrara. LOL

I use Hexagon but i'm at the just beginning of my learning. Sometimes a try a tool and say "Wow, that's so cooooo!", 2 days later, i just can't remember which tool it was... So i learn, forget, learn again... not very efficient though... LOL

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=887298

Modelers really need to "fit" with the way you think, or you end up working very hard to do fairly simple tasks. I've never given Silo a fair try, but many people love it. It looks like Silo 2 will be a great product!  My first real success for modeling was with C4D. C4D was very easy for me to learn, it really fit with the way I think. I just couldn't afford the upgrades, and it's getting more expensive now :-(

I like Hex, it was easy to learn, and plays well with Poser. Hex is missing some of the things I liked in C4D,  but when I run into something I can't do in Hex, I'll use my aging C4D. There are some great tuts in the Hex forum at DAZ, they may work for Silo too.

Modeling clothing for Poser in Carrara is quite difficult, though it can be used very efectively for props. The modeler keeps improving too, but if your primary focus is poser clothing, I'd look somewhere else. The only way to do symmetrical modeling in Carrara is with Project Gemini from Digital Carvers Guild.

Typically though, unless you can afford something it the $800 plus range, you will need to have at least a couple of tools in your tool box. Learn one tool very well, then when you know it's weaknesses, look for a second companion tool that will make your life easier. Silo 2 could be the killer modeling app for those of us on a budget. I'd definitely recommend giving it a real chance. If it doesn't seem to work for you, then give Hex a try. It may work better for you.

If you can find a free copy of C4D 6SE (came free on one of the 3D magazines), give it a try too. The first link is to an image I did quite a while ago that used content made in C4D, CS3/CS4Pro (there is a reworked/improved version of the image in the Carrara 5 Handbook). The Bikini top in the link below was my first project with Hex. The image above was my first real model with C4D 6XL, something I could have never done in the time alloted with anything else (because it clicked with the way I think).

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1017046

Good luck, and don't give up!  It takes some time, but once things start to click, you'll really enjoy being able to make your own models!

If you are looking for a free program and want it only for modeling, wings3d is the answer.