I am trying to find a good, inexpensive modelling package for developing 3D models for an upcoming game programming language (Blitz Basic 3D). This language will support animated .x and .md2 file formats and non-animated .3ds format. Would Poser be a good program to (perhaps not directly as maybe a converted would be needed) create models for game use in these formats?

Not at all. Poly count is to high. Poser isnt really a "Modeling" package. 3D Studio MAX, Carrara, Ray Dream Studio, Rhino (Not sure about Rhino), True Space and a few others would be the packages to look at for modeling low poly count models for games. Clint

Clint is quite correct in stating that Poser is not a modeling package and the included Poser models are to complex. However I am using Poser in the creation process for models for the forthcoming Vain RPG. I build the models in Truespace then make them into a Poser figure to set up the animations. Then back into Truespace using the truePose plugin. Finally out to MDL using another plugin. You may like to view initial results at my site.

We're using Poser as the basis for up-coming high-res aircrew and ground crew figures in Microsoft Combat Flight Sim 2. The poly count isn't as big an issue, since the highest-res figure is only displayed at very close range; once the base figure is done it's exported into another tool for animation, decimation and conversion to the CFS2 format in multiple resolutions. Using multi-res techniques lets you get away with a lot in terms of close-up eye candy. Mark

If you do Diablo style characters that are sprite based and prerendered then its great. Poser can be used to render off all the sprite animations. Kind of a poor mans character studio. Plus there are tons of stuff out there so you can do super hero or Tolkien style games without making a lot of your own props. As was said above Poser models are way too high count for real time rendering. The poly count on most game characters are pretty low.

Thank you, all, for your replies so far! btw Phil, cool models! Here's my situation, I am a hobbiest. I have no delusions of creating a "Quake" or "Diablo" or whatever game. I have an idea for a 3d strategy game, but I'm thinking the "pieces" (models) would be fairly static (ie. chess) but shown on a 3d terrain and allow the camera to zoom around. Game would be turned based and no rely on moving characters towards attackers, etc... like Diablo for instance. My goal would be: 1) a good compromise between a simple but powerful tool. 2) good for characters/creatures. 3) libraries to start with. 4) good community support/plug-ins/model purchases. 5) perhaps some basic animation loops like walking(?) 6) need to get directly or indirectly to .x, .mds, or .3ds format. 7) want to have FUN!!! not bogged down in ugly interface. 8) not very expensive. Poser would be about my limit. Now regarding polycount, I have no idea what you do with a model within game code. I'm waiting for BB3D to arrive with some demos/tuts so I can see how it does it. I also don't know what happens with things like LOD depending on camera position, etc... So given this extra detail, maybe Poser with its higher polygon counts would still be ok since I'm not asking too much for the models? Assuming the poly's are too high, does Poser have a plug-in (or some other 3rd party tool) that you can run to reduce the counts and still produce a pretty good quality model?

I'm no authority by any stretch, but have tried Amapi, Ray Dream, TrueSpace and a couple other demos, and have had a hell of a time. I'm an artist, not a programmer, and have severe time limitations to do my work. So Poser has been the easiest program to build in, simply because the interface is idiot-friendly, allows me to maneuver primitives into place via morph dials, swing around and look for mismatches, and such (perhaps you can do that in TrueSpace, but I haven't found it). Even so, the process is very limited in Poser, and there are several modeling projects I doubt that I will ever be able to do, particularily with organic (living) figures, cloth and such things. If I can build it with a sphere and a cube, great, but if I need a tentacled beast, I have a problem. Additionally, as others have said, the resulting files are HUGE, because all of those polygons remain (i.e. every polygon of the sphere within the cube is still extant and still calculated -- no matter what the finished "size" will be, the number of polygons doesn't change). It would be some grouping challenge to go through and eliminate that. That said, if you're looking for about 8 different figures and a way to animate them, you may be able to create them with the figures that come with Poser and some free stuff from the forums (be careful there, because some are not okay for use in commercial projects), plus, you can also look into commissioning someone to model any additional ones you need. The Poser community is large, and there's a lot of product support to be had. If the number of figures you require is small, this might be more feasible, and Poser sure does give you movement and posing beyond the other programs. Plus, the interface is very versatile for those of us who can't maneuver in wireframe and don't have the time for the learning curve of bigger programs. Hope that helps.

For us the draw is, simply, Poser cost less than the time spent creating even a single human-type figure mesh using other methods. The animation requirements are extremely tractable, almost exclusively extremeties following small arcs of movement while controlling aircraft. The process of chopping the resultant mesh where needed and decimating the poly count is straightforward in other software once the base figure has been exported, and tagging the joint axes and defining the motion ranges are handled at a different level altogther. Given the nature of this business, the ability to bypass the laborious mesh creation step while obtaining very lifelike shapes is going to be a great asset. The stock figures are more than sufficient, just a bump or two and texturing take care of the finishing details. I confess I've collected a large number of additional Poser "stuff" since we've started using this method, but that's because I'm addicted to playing with the thing in my free time and the only uses to which the results are put are as renders adorning the walls of my kids' rooms. I can't believe I'm the only person who, after watching "Shrek," pulled out the Zygote dragon and took another long look at the "goofy grin" dial to compare, eh? ;-) Seriously, and to get back on track, Poser is an amazingly fast and easy tool for ginning up custom figure meshes, and the cost is so low (compared to 3Ds Max, for example) as to be irresistable. It might not work for FPS-type games, I have no clue and have never spent any time in that arena so can't speak to it, but in flight simming the poly count issues are trivially managed. Yep, Poser is great. :-) Cheers! Mark

You may find these links to these free or low priced 3D modeling programs helpful:-- Anim8or

• Blender
• MilkShape 3D

TrueSpace is simple, but powerful - it's also free (in older versions) on several magazine cover CDs (Check out www.computerarts.co.uk, digitmag.com and 3dworldmag.com). Amapi is a more powerful modeller, but one with a nasty learning curve (v. 4.15 also free on several cover CDs and sometimes on some (legal!) d/l sites). TS has a cornucopia of plug-ins (including Poser-like figure animation, particles, cloth simulations etc.) and a large user comm. Check out PhilC's post above. TS plug-in Puppeteer has pre-made skeletons and sample walk cycles. Ditto for upcoming TS plug-in Dreamotion. Amapi has no bones at all. Both apps export directly to 3DS and .X. Building figures is not so much a question of software as of talent - trust me, I know what I'm lacking ;-) From what I read in the 3D mags, more and more game developers use more and more "clip models" in their projects. You might want to consider that. As to the fun part, fun is in the mind of the modeller ;-) Personally, I started out using mostly TS and having lots of fun. Now I use Amapi, make better models faster, and I don't have very much fun, thank you! PhilC uses TS - might be having fun, can't tell if he's smiling behind that beard of his - but he sure makes great stuff!

I am now with TS 5