How important is it if it is based on making scenes.

For example, lets say you make a breath taking scene very real and everything, but not all of the stuff in it is modeled by you, then can you claim that you "Created this scene?"

or you can only say that if you modeled everything in the scene?

When is it necessary to model?
Can you claim to be a 3D artist if you don't model alot?
In 3D videos and demo reels, does everything have to be completely modeled by you?
Most of the galleries here, is everything model completely from scratch?
Is it ok to not be able to model everything and anything?

I hope you guys understand what im trying to ask.

This is a boomerang question it keeps comming back...

When you load things into a setting to make a scene you made the scene NOT the itmes..
So you can Claim the scene not the props etc etc...

Do you thing George Lucas makes the Starwars 3D things ... nope not even ONE
Still he claims the movie as HIS ....
Have fun and dont claim things you did not do and all be happy :}

Chris

Quote - This is a boomerang question it keeps comming back...

When you load things into a setting to make a scene you made the scene NOT the itmes..
So you can Claim the scene not the props etc etc...

Do you thing George Lucas makes the Starwars 3D things ... nope not even ONE
Still he claims the movie as HIS ....
Have fun and dont claim things you did not do and all be happy :}

Chris

haha sorry, I know the question probably has been asked before.
So basically if i made a 3D short movie, I can say I made the movie, but it would be really noble if they asked if i did all the modeling myself and i said no.

Right?

I am a honest person and I don't want to seem shady regarding making scenes and such.

Just check the credits on any cartoon/movie/thingy. All person involved should be given due credit

Well BETER and Fair is:
Give the makes "stonemason, Eleoroncedark,etc ,etc, " credits and used Freestuff should get credits.. in the end title etc etc .

EDIT X post with Manoloz

Quote - Well BETER and Fair is:
Give the makes "stonemason, Eleoroncedark,etc ,etc, " credits and used Freestuff should get credits.. in the end title etc etc .

EDIT X post with Manoloz

haha i have no idea what your talking about, but your sig is like so similar to what we are discussing, if you dont have it build it lol

What i am saying is this  ...
Lets say i made a House in 3D and you bought it or got it as a freebee..
Then I am the MAKER of the house ..so in the Credits it shoudl say something like :
Special thnx to : BAR-Code , etc etc,,, 

Or when you buy stuff from DAZ you can put Credits to the 3D content Creators From DAZ  or somthing like that ...

But why do you think the Credits of a movie take  over 10 minutes to pass after a movie is done

Chris

Quote - What i am saying is this  ...
Lets say i made a House in 3D and you bought it or got it as a freebee..
Then I am the MAKER of the house ..so in the Credits it shoudl say something like :
Special thnx to : BAR-Code , etc etc,,, 

Or when you buy stuff from DAZ you can put Credits to the 3D content Creators From DAZ  or somthing like that ...

But why do you think the Credits of a movie take  over 10 minutes to pass after a movie is done

Chris

Oh most definitly I agree, credit should be givin when its due.
So in short there is nothing wrong if you did not model everything yourself, just make sure to give the credit where it is due.

Thanks for clearing that up.

YW ... 
But be aware that in some forums "not here" you "can" get  "Ignored" on when you dont do it all yourself...
And now  im saying it mildly 

Chris

Quote - YW ... 
But be aware that in some forums "not here" you "can" get  "Ignored" on when you dont do it all yourself...
And now  im saying it mildly 

Chris

Like for example how some artist refuse to acknowledge Poser?
I think someone here warned me about that.. So i think i have a good idea what you are talking about.

There is nothing inherently wrong with using models that aren't your own models.
There are some times when it is not appropriate.
If you need redistribute meshes, textures, etc. then you need either the permission of the creator to do so or make them yourself. That is one big drawback of content. You don't own it, you license it.
Another time is if you are making a demo reel to show your work. It is just assumed that you made the models, unless you state otherwise (which is hard to do on a demo reel). If you are showing your texturing skills, or animation abilities or something, then it shouldn't be a big problem.

You run into 'trouble' with using content, and claiming it as your work, on sites that expect you to have made the models. Most of the 'high end' 3d sites are oriented towards 'content creation', and they expect that you made the models too.
I haven't seen much (I won't say none) problems when a picture poster is clear about what parts of the picture are their own models and what parts aren't. It isn't as if everyone at a high end site is slamming anyone that uses 'content'. There are some people that do that, I won't deny it;  but the majority of people are smart enough to know better. They know that they have used content also, and the reasons why they used content (time saving, budget, schedule, whatnot).
Obviously if you post in a modeling forum and use a lot of content, you are more likely to get slammed. Even so, you probably won't if you say: "A, B, & C are my models, the rest is pre made."; though you probably won't get the same acclaim as somebody that makes a similar scene but models everything themselves.

Dont you think it depents on what the demo reel is for ?
I know some one who used only 3d stuff he bought..
Because the demo reel was about his movie editing and story telling...
And even then he placed Credits at the end of the reel..
Nobody asked if he made the models even when the job was at a studio who makes a lot of 3dmovie stuff.

And he got the job anyway ..
So only when you are making one for 3D modeling work or texturing
100% own made things are needed i think..

Chris

Well yeah it does matter what you are applying for, and I did say that.

There are also the times though, that animators might do rigging, uv mapping, or other things too; so it would be a plus to include as much of your own work as possible.
You might not have to make the models, but if you did; it would make you more versatile, and more hireable. Any skill you could show that you have would be a plus.

Quote - Well yeah it does matter what you are applying for, and I did say that.

There are also the times though, that animators might do rigging, uv mapping, or other things too; so it would be a plus to include as much of your own work as possible.
You might not have to make the models, but if you did; it would make you more versatile, and more hireable. Any skill you could show that you have would be a plus.

Thats a 100% right  ..the more you made the more you show your skills ..
Chris

If you model content by using tutorials, does that count as you modeled it yourself? I would think so, but i wanted to check the validity of that. It's probably a stupid question but better safe then sorry.

tink of that like this :
Picasso bought paint ...now is he the real creator of the paintings or the factory that made the paint...

You made the thing ..your the creator.
ALL in live is a TUT ..

Chris

Quote - tink of that like this :
Picasso bought paint ...now is he the real creator of the paintings or the factory that made the paint...

You made the thing ..your the creator.
ALL in live is a TUT ..

Chris

lol thats a good way to put it

I personally think 3d models are digital sculpture; not paint, not brushes, or tools of any kind; but complete works in their own right. Even if they are just 'clay rendered', w/o textures. I view the softwares as the 'tools' of 3d art.
Meshes can be added onto, changed (morphed), painted, etc.; but the creative rights of the mesh remain with the modeler. They are covered by copyright laws too. For instance, you can make a texture for a DAZ figure and distribute the texture as you see fit (and it is copyrighted too); but you can't redistribute the mesh (or even any part of it). It is it's own work, and has just as much protection as the texture does.
Meshes can be stolen. Using a merchant's mesh that wasn't payed for is theft; the same as copying and using a commercial texture that you didn't pay for. Meshes are likened to property by copyright laws. Rightfully so, IMO.
I think it's silly to say that a texture painted onto a model is art; but the mesh itself is 'just a model'.
Other people might (and do) feel differently about it. I'm not about trying to change people's minds.

Kit bashing goes on in meatspace, too.  One could take it as creative art, or leave it.

Bar-code, I think your analogy is a little off. Using a tutorial isn't like buying your paint as opposed to mixing your own, its more akin to painting on a blank canvas vs painting by number. Grant it, that's a bit extreme and certainly not always the case, but if you want to make an analogy I think its closer than what you said.

Since the topic of demo reels cropped up, I've heard that tutorial work should be limited on a demo reel as much as possible. Grant it, there are different kinds of tutorials, some that teach a general principal, or approach and don't go into great detail while others are very in depth and are, "do this, then do this, then do this, now do this, now this, etc." I think you generally should avoid putting work created by the latter method on a reel becuase it really only shows that you can follow along or essentially copy what you're shown. They're both great learning/teaching tools, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with completing 102301874301874 tutorials, and even taking a certain degree of pride in that work, because you'll likely learn alot and have created some nice stuff, but at some point you have to show that you can absorb what you've done, and re-apply to something new.

As far as your question enigma, yes, stuff you make via a tutorial is your own, you ultimately did the work, and created something from nothing, and there's nothing wrong with using those things in your scenes or animations. And certainly, not all work created via a given tutorial ends up of equal calibre, I've seen some good work and then some pretty ugly things as well from the same tutorial. I think if you're displaying a specific model you made following a specific tutorial where the end result of the tutorial is the focal point of the image/animation, it should probably be clearly noted that the model/scene whatever was made by following the tutorial. If the object is just a background non-essential element to a scene then you can probably get away without needing to cite every tutorial used.

Like Barcode said, the more skills you can show the better usually. Also like Barcode said, if your focus isn't on modeling but rather-story telling or lighting or whatever, then you don't need to worry as much about what assets you did or didn't model from scratch yourself, just that the area[s] you're focusing on are the absolute best they can be. You do need to be certain to give credit tho for any assets you didn't create from scratch.

Also, just in general, if you're gonna mix content, i.e. using prefab items, always make certain you say what assets were and were not created by you and what affect you had on any elements in the image. I've seen a lot of cases of someone posting something "somewhere" that looks really good and gets great comments at first then someone comes along and recognizes one or two key elements as available for download from a site, or that one of the figures is a specific poser model or whatever, and then it all blows up. While it usually isn't the intent of the creator of said work to have decieved anyone, its already too late, and it usually gets ugly after that. If you say what's what form the beginning then people can take it for what is.