Attached Link: Can Egypt Copyright the Pyramids?

The rest of the article may be found at the URL I've entered. I regularly read archaeological news at the National Geographic site, and found this just tonight and thought to pass this information along.

Just make your pyramids 3-sided or 5-sided (not counting the base side).  Theirs are all 4-sided above ground.

Anything created before I think it's 1927 in the US is public domain. A flat date.

"The law holds that no exact-scale replica can be made: For instance, if an object is two inches (five centimeters) tall, a product of the same dimensions cannot be made without permission. But a three-inch (six-centimeter) replica would be acceptable, "

So, just make a fully scaled model of the pyramids and stick an inch on the bottom:)

I can't see how you can produce an "exact replica" of a pyramid anyway.  Perhaps the appearance otuside, but to me an exact replica would also mean what is inside the pyramids, and most of us have never been inside one, and even those who have are still discovering hidden rooms.

All they know thus far is that the pyramids were built using higher math skills and aligned with certain constallations. Heck, we can't even figure out how they went about building something that massive in size with the technology and tools that they had back then.

Quote - All they know thus far is that the pyramids were built using higher math skills and aligned with certain constallations. Heck, we can't even figure out how they went about building something that massive in size with the technology and tools that they had back then.

Yeah, actually we can.  The only debates (which may never be solved) are which of several methods may have been used, the main one being the style of ramp used at the Giza pyramids.  Everything else (cutting and dressing the stones, moving them, placing them) have all been replicated using tools and materials available at the time.

You'll see statements that "We couldn't do it today!"  What that means is that economically we couldn't do it today.  Given a few thousand workers manually hauling stone blocks working for only their meals and a place to sleep for two decades?  Sure, it could be done today.  Given an unlimited budget and modern equipment?  Done even faster.

Making a two inch replica of a 5cm original would not be an exact replica, as 2.54cm=1inch. So the exact replica would have to measure 1.968503937007874015748031496063inches.

Why not just brand the items with "Cairo Museum authenticated replica" and charge a premium for that? Everything else could potentially be a fake replica, hence the market value for authenticated items would increase, etc etc.

Sort of the "ISO 9000" label for everything from mega corporations to grocery stores nowadays.

It is not like Zahi Hawass has personal goons to send after 3d modelers, or even real modelers for that matter.  This is unenforcable.

And I'ld seriously doubt on an egyptian-looking figurine found in a pawnshop selling for US$30 being authentic anyway.

I agree that as it is, it is unenforceable. I suspect some politiians pretending to do something are the culprits, not real egyptologist experts.

We have truly become a world with nothing better else to do with out time.

I seriously doubt Dr. Hawass is personally behind it. I've met him a couple of times, and he has a genuine love for Egyptian antiquities and, although he's zealous as hell in persuing treasure-hunters and trying to recover Egypt's treasures that have wandered abroad, and may well want to limit the making of real-world models in competition with the  ones sold/licensed by the SCA, I doubt he's much interested in people making digital models of the antiquities

Society for Creative Anachronism? talk about living up to your name...;)

I haven't met hawass, but I've heard he's sincere about recovering looted artefacts.
altho they can't copyright nor trademark any of the euclidean solids IMVHO, I believe
they've also got laws against defaming islam that they can't enforce internationally.

Quote - ...they can't copyright nor trademark any of the euclidean solids IMVHO...

Well, Euclid did live in Alexandria, so...:biggrin:

If it works the same as copyrights, well they expire 100 year max after the artists death.

Besides, build a exact replica and remove three or two stones..and voila..its not a exact replica anymore.

Corect me if I'm wrong.

US law says that architectural objects built before 1990 are 
purely public domain.  (Reproducing a book of pyramid plans would
be different, because the book itself would fall under the much
broader publication laws.)

I suspect 5000 BC would count as "before 1990", though some
idiotic Federal judge will undoubtedly find otherwise.

I was stunned when I heard this a few weeks ago. I understand why they want it, but it sounds so silly to me, and how can they enforce it? Will they go after Summit, and the Luxor in Las Vegas, and the books printed about Egypt? And if they do, Will China, Japan, india, Native Americans, France etc all do the same and sue anyone who copies their national treasures? I was planning to build Egyptian themed Poser conent this year, but now.... I don't know.... It makes me sad. :( Hmmm.... A theme I have kicking around is "New Egypt" - sort of a What-if type of theme, What If Anicent Egytian culture never died out and was alive and well today? What would it look like, and what would it look like in the near future? Do you think this alternative take on an ancient culture could avoid copyright issues? Would the Stargate movie and TV series get sued, or would it be safe because it invented it's own style and mythology? Thoughts? bB

Quote- "Hmmm.... A theme I have kicking around is "New Egypt" - sort of a What-if type of theme, What If Anicent Egytian culture never died out and was alive and well today? What would it look like, and what would it look like in the near future?"

Uhh, maybe modern day Egypt?

You might try a lost Egytian civilization that broke off and evolved without todays Western influence, sort of like an Atlantis. I'm still puzzled how they moved those huge stones. The guy who built the Coral Castle said he had figured it out. Looking at his work that he claimed that he did by himself without hydrualics just simple tools I'd say he probably did. Took it to his grave though.

Quote - Quote- "Hmmm.... A theme I have kicking around is "New Egypt" - sort of a What-if type of theme, What If Anicent Egytian culture never died out and was alive and well today? What would it look like, and what would it look like in the near future?"

Uhh, maybe modern day Egypt?

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Modern Egypt has been heavily influenced by Islam since the late 7th century. But what if the Arabs had not invaded and Coptic Christianity had not replaced the ancient civilisation? What might Egypt be like today? (as an Egyptologist, I've wondered about this a lot)

What would the whole middle east be like if oil was obsolete?

What I gathered from reading the article, is that appears that within their country they could enforce these laws, but because of International Copyright agreements with Europe and the US/Canada, it is very unlikely they would be able to enforce the laws. The more I thought about it, it seems very unlikely that artists here would be affected by this, but I thought to post the link to make people aware of this. When I first found the article, I really thought it was almost on the crazy side. What next? Try to copyright Stonehenge? The Parthanon (yeah, right, like most building architecture in Europe and consequently over on this side of the Pond isn't all influenced by Greek and Roman buildings)? While I believe in being proud of ancient heritage and the enginuity of ancient cultures to build these wonders that have survived until modern times, I think it's crazy for modern cultures to try to 'copyright' something built or made thousands of years ago.

Maybe Nashville, Tenn. can copyright the Parthenon: :lol:
http://www.nashville.gov/parthenon/

*Modern Egypt has been heavily influenced by Islam since the late 7th century. But what if the Arabs had not invaded and Coptic Christianity had not replaced the ancient civilisation? What might Egypt be like today? (as an Egyptologist, I've wondered about this a lot)

*There wasn't a lot left of the pharaonic culture, by the time Christianity took root in Egypt.   In fact, it is thanks to the Copts' preservation of the last evolution of the indigenous Egyptian language (completely supplanted by Arabic for everyday use) that Ancient Egyptian scripts were able to be deciphered.   Even though the Ptolemies built spectacular temples in the old Egyptian style, their Egypt was very Hellenised, with Greeks/Macedonians and Jews enjoying higher status than indigenous Egyptians (the latter weren't even supposed to live within Alexandria, for example).  Although individual Romans, such as Germanicus and Hadrian, are recorded as having taken an interest in what were already considered "Egyptian antiquities" in their day, the culture that had created the pyramids and Karnak was already long gone.   During the persecution of Christians in the time of the Emperor Diocletian and his Caesar Galerius, the Southern Temple of Amun at what is now Luxor (which appears to have been functioning as a Christian church by then) was converted into a shrine to the Tetrarchs, i.e. Diocletian, Galerius and their two Western colleagues, rather than being restored as a temple of Amun, presumably because by then no-one could remember who Amun was.

As for the copyright question, I don't think that the Egyptian authorities ever planned to go hunting in architecture and the internet for hints of Egyptian influence and demanding royalties.  I think they explicitly stated that that place in Las Vegas would not be affected, precisely because it plainly was not an exact copy (the Fourth Dynasty car park was a different shape), which tends to suggest that their interest lies in unauthorised replicas of items in the Egyptian Museum.

When is a copy not a copy?   The temples of Abu Simbel and Philae were both moved, to rescue them from the waters of the Aswan High Dam.   They use the original masonry, but they are not in the original locations, so they are not exactly copies, but they are not wholly authentic, either. 

This is utterly silly, exact copy or not. Ancient Egypt’s intellectual property belongs to the human race.

Suppose that you run a major art gallery, which owns an iconic piece by Rembrandt.    There isn't a jurisdiction on the planet which allows you to claim copyright on the picture itself, but you can control the ability of others to create replicas of it.   If the only authorised, good-quality reproductions are the gallery's own, then the gallery is entitled to sue an unauthorised, good-quality reproduction, on suspicion of its being an ilegal copy of the gallery's reproduction.    The gallery has the responsibility for the upkeep, insurance and (perhaps) repair of the original artwork, so is entitled to protect the income which that artwork generates.

I suspect that that is all that the Egyptians are trying to do here.   I also suspect that that is nothing new.    There has been a high-profile exhibition of artefacts from the tomb of Tutankhamun in London lately.   This announcement may have been a shot across the bows of anyone seeking to copy the official merchandise.   To that extent, it seems entirely reasonable to me.

I think that's probably what they want.

I went to the exhibit when it was here, there were no reproductions, not when I was there anyway. The Summit stuff was there though. You can see the merchandise here: www.kingtut.org

Actually, I think Star Gate was a ancient Egyptian spin off deal only it was influenced by aliens and the pyramids were landing pads for their slave ships. lol

BastBlack, you need to change your name to something that does not include the name of the Egyptian cat goddess! Quick, before the Egyptions find out!

Next they'll sue the Aztecs and the Mayans for their derived works. pyramid + additional steps.

EEEKKK!!! oO! Maybe if I use a bizarro spelling I can get away with it? How's BestBleck? No, better yet, how about Bust Bunny. ahhahahahhahahahahhaha -^

"Bestbleck" sounds like the South African version...   The funny thing about most Mayan "pyramids" is that they aren't pyramids, even if you strip the steps away.