Hi everyone,
I had already attempted to post my questions about this just a few minutes ago, but something happened and it seems my post just went off into the ether somewhere. If it does somehow show back up, please forgive he duplication....
I have a couple of questions about setting up external runtimes, please. Poser has been giving me fits lately, and I'm pretty sure that my runtime size has something to do with it. My runtime is massive! Over 20GB's worth. So I'm hoping that setting up external runtimes will make things easier for both Poser and me. Here's a little background on what I've got going on:

1) I'm using Poser 5... I just bought Poser 6, but it's not installed yet

1. I'm following the steps in the tutorial at http://www.posermocap.com/news/?p=33  to help me out
2. I have a complete copy of my current runtime on an external hard drive
   4) I also have a bunch of external runtime folders set up on the external drive, as the tutorial outlines in steps 1-3
   5) The tutorial seems to proceed from the assumption that it's a fresh install of Poser, rather than an upgrade from version 5 to 6, and I think that's where part of my confusion arises from

So, here's my plan... please tell me if it's a sound one

A) I'm going to disconnect my external drive, in order to completely preserve the copy of my runtime
B) I'll delete Poser 5 and my runtime from my PC's internal hard drive
C) I'll install Poser 6 on my PC
D) I'll reconnect my external hard drive, and move the contents of my copied runtime to the external runtime folders
E) Finally, I'll navigate to my Poser 6 libraries with Windows Explorer, and transfer those contents to my external runtime folders well

All that being said, my questions, in a nutshell, are:

• Is my game plan a good one? If not, what should I do differently?
• My PC's hard drive is pretty full... is it possible to have Poser 6 on the internal drive, and my entire runtime folder on the external drive? I think so, but I'm not sure
• Is deleting Poser 5 and its runtime as in step B above, the right way to begin?

Sorry everyone, I know I've written a novel here. Thanks in advance for any answers to these questions -

Steve

Your plan sound feasible to me.  As you mentioned, your P5 runtime is completely backup; there should be no reason to not to delete it.  There are individuals that have an external runtime drive and are not experiencing any problems whatsoever.  Personally, I wouldn't do it.  I have a pet-peeve about data corruption across media connection, but again it's just me.  I see no reason not to have a separate drive.  As a suggestion, I would start thinning down your runtime considerably, especially of content you no longer need or are not currently using.  It is a waste of hard drive space.  Think about it.  You load up your runtime with content thinking you will need it someday and that day never come around. 
I create runtimes which I know I will use on a regular basis and delegate one time use content to a projects runtime which gets cleaned out routinely.  That way, I don't accumulate unnecessary content for the long term.  Either way, you may be going through content for awhile once you switch to P6.  Good luck.

It has been a while, but as I recall Poser 5, 6, 7, and even Poser Pro all pretty much work the same way on install, they will overright any duplicate files in the default runtime but other than that you should be able to install one over top another without difficulty.

If your runtimes are located somewhere other than the default directory you shouldn't need to shutdown your external hard drive at all, Poser won't find them until you fire it up and tell it where to look.

Again, it's been a long while since I worked with 5 or 6, but as I recall both install into c:program filesefrontier by default, whereas 7 and Pro both create a directory c:program filessmith micro and use it for the default runtime unless you tell it otherwise.

The result of the program changing developers so many times I suppose, but as a result you can install 6 and 7 side by side on the same machine and neither will know the difference.

One suggestion I can make, since you've already copied your default runtime for 5, if it were me I'd uninstall 5 completely and delete the old directory structure completely on your C drive before installing 6.  Once you have 6 installed, I'd connect your old 5 default runtime as an external lib rather than copying it back into the default library location of c:program filesefrontierposerruntime.

The reason for this is a bug in Poser that has been around since version 5, at least - the larger your default runtime grows, the more memory poser eats and the slower it runs at startup.  For whatever reason switching to an external lib seems to have no effect on this, only the default lib does, whatever process Poser users to index it's default library causes it to grab ahold of that memory and never release it back to the system.

I've had much better results with Poser running stable and fast by keeping my default runtime down to an absolute minimum - the only thing I install in the default runtime is what Poser sets up default and the very few items (like V4) that get snippy about having to be in the default runtime.    Other than that my default runtime is as small as I can make it, everything else is farmed out to external runtimes.  My poser runs much better and is a lot more stable this way, since sadly they have never addressed this bug since it's appearance in version 5, again my guess would be a side effect of the softwaring having changed developers so many times over such a short span of time.

Hope that helps.

It's good to know that this tutorial is being used.

A word of warning regarding the following:

Quote - D) I'll reconnect my external hard drive, and move the contents of my copied runtime to the external runtime folders

If possible, you should use the installers for populating the new, external runtimes rather than transferring assets from one large runtime over to another. Pose files have all kinds of dependencies written into the CR2 and PP2 files, and simply transferring these files across without also transferring the dependent files (such as OBJ and texture files) will result in problems with the assets.

From the review of 3D Content Installer on the Posermocap.com site:

Quote - Migrating Poser assets into multiple Runtimes can be a daunting and mind-numbing task of re-installing each and every asset by hand. Given Poser’s system of file dependencies among its assets, re-installation is the only way that migration works. Simply trying to move assets within the Runtime or even move the assets to an external Runtime stands an excellent chance of breaking the file dependencies and making the asset unusable. Trust us on this.

I thought I had included this warning in the tutorial, but I missed that. I'll add it in shortly.

Hope this helps.

EDIT - The paragraph warning against moving assets and breaking file dependencies has been added to the tutorial.

With the exception of the Geometry, Library, and Texture folders (and possibly the Python folder), it's not a good idea to copy the rest of the folders in the Poser 5 runtime into the Poser 6 one, as any important files (like the prefs folder) are set up for P5, and P6 has (IIRC) a few differences, enough so that it has a good chance of breaking your P6 install.

Or, you could leave the Poser 5 folder after uninstalling the program, as it should leave the Geometries, Libraries, Python, and Textures folders alone (it did for me with P5) and then simply install Poser 6 (it'll go into it's own folder, leaving the P5 install alone) and link the P5 runtime to P6.

Well my PC is a couple years old and so has only an 80GB hard drive (my C: drive). My external hard drive (E: drive) is also 80GB. Because I have so much other stuff on my C: drive, there's no way I could have Poser 5 and Poser 6 on there. One has to go, and obviously that'll be version 5. And I have no intention of re-copying my old runtime back onto my PC, unless it's absolutely necessary - and from what everyone's said here, I don't think that's the case.
Hborre, that's a novel idea that I never thought of....having  runtime just for stuff I might get around to one day. Good grief, I have so much stuff now that I rarely use... I'm like a Poser Pack Rat! 
I like the idea of keeping the runtime on the PC itself limited to the content that comes with a Poser 6 install, and having the copy of my original runtime confined to the folders on my external drive.To me that sounds like the ideal solution. I think that's the game plan I'll go with. The only thing I'm unsure of at this point is for example, if I want to use my Michael 2 character for a scene, how do I get Poser 6, once it's installed, to understand that this content isn't on my C: drive, but that it's on an external drive. But then again, I'm sure that's explained in the tutorial... I just haven't gotten that far yet. This all sounds like a project for tomorrow night. It's just after midnight here and I just got off work. I have be back in at 7:30am! Time for sleep now. But no work tomorrow evening - thank God for that!
Thanks for all the help. If there's anything else you think I need to know, please holler it out -  thanks again!

Quote - The only thing I'm unsure of at this point is for example, if I want to use my Michael 2 character for a scene, how do I get Poser 6, once it's installed, to understand that this content isn't on my C: drive, but that it's on an external drive.

From right near the bottom of the tutorial:

Quote - There is some content that really should be installed into the internal Runtime.  We installed the Daz Millennium figures such as Michael 3, Vicky 3, and Vicki 4.2 into the internal runtime.  Some of these files actually search for a Poser.exe file before loading, and so having them in the internal runtime allows them to load without difficulty. We also make sure that Python scripts are also installed into the internal Runtime.

Now, I'm not sure if this applies to Michael 2 or not, but I installed him into the internal runtime (i.e. the one that is right in the Poser program directory). Keeping the Daz figures in the internal runtime allows them to always be at your fingertips and keeps your internal runtime fairly small.

As far as external runtimes, once they've been added to your Runtimes list in Poser, Poser will be able to find the resources in these external runtimes quite easily, without having to factor in drive letters or pathnames or other messy stuff like that.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Quote - As far as external runtimes, once they've been added to your Runtimes list in Poser, Poser will be able to find the resources in these external runtimes quite easily, without having to factor in drive letters or pathnames or other messy stuff like that.

As far as I know any character other than V4/M4 will work just as well if installed into an external runtime as they would if there installed into the internal runtime.  All of my characters other than V4 are installed in external runtimes, never had any problem.  V4, however, requires itself to be installed in the internal runtime, and from the reading I've done on M4 it appears to have the same restriction.

As for my own runtimes, I have one entirely dedicated to V3, one dedicated to V4, etc.  So if I need a V4 based character I switch to that external runtime and load everything I need from it all at once.  Works fairly well for keeping things organized, keeping individual runtimes fairly small so I can find everything I need fairly quickly, etc.  Even though I have V4 loaded in the internal runtime, I setup a CR2 in the external runtime for V4 as well, by simply loading the figure default and then switching to the external runtime and adding it back to that library.  That way I can load V4 and anything associated with it all from the one external runtime.

But of course everyone has there own system, that's just what works well for me personally.

Quote - Hborre, that's a novel idea that I never thought of....having  runtime just for stuff I might get around to one day. Good grief, I have so much stuff now that I rarely use... I'm like a Poser Pack Rat! 

Just an FYI if you start running low on drivespace  you can also put stuff you use only very rarely in a runtime and burn that runtime to CD or DVD, then put the DVD in the drive and add that runtime to Poser when you need it.  The real trick here is to keep a good record of which DVD that stuff is on, because if you save a scene using something from a "offline" runtime like that you'll need to be able to find the DVD it's stored on to get the scene to come up properly again after that. 

Quote -   how do I get Poser 6, once it's installed, to understand that this content isn't on my C: drive, but that it's on an external drive. But then again, I'm sure that's explained in the tutorial... I just haven't gotten that far yet. This all sounds like a project for tomorrow night. It's just after midnight here and I just got off work. I have be back in at 7:30am! Time for sleep now. But no work tomorrow evening - thank God for that!
Thanks for all the help. If there's anything else you think I need to know, please holler it out -  thanks again!

Easy enough, when you open poser click on "figures"* from the library tab and it should open a list of figures in your internal directory.  At the top of that list will be a file folder with an arrow on it, click on this and it will take you up to the next directory listing, in this case that will be a listing of all your runtimes. 

**(you can actually do this from pretty much any tab, poses, props, etc, I just got into the habit of using the figures tab for this because it's at the top)

You should see one for poser and I think one for downloads in Poser 6.  At the bottom of the library box you'll see a check mark icon and a + sign icon, if you hit the plus sign icon it will ask you to add another runtime, it will pop up a box that will allow you to browse to the directory for your external runtime.

Just repeat the process above to add additional external runtimes, I have a runtime for each figure type I normally use (one for V3,, one for V4, one for M3, etc..) and additional runtimes for things like transportation (cars, bikes, helicopters, planes), interiors (furniture, walls, balconeys), exteriors, animals, etc.

This allows me to very quickly navigate to exactly the sort of thing I'm looking for to complete my scene.  Again, works well for my workflow that way but really you can set it up anyway you like.

Quote - As far as I know any character other than V4/M4 will work just as well if installed into an external runtime as they would if there installed into the internal runtime.  All of my characters other than V4 are installed in external runtimes, never had any problem.  V4, however, requires itself to be installed in the internal runtime, and from the reading I've done on M4 it appears to have the same restriction.

DAZ recommends that the Mill 3 figures be loaded in the internal runtimes, but that's supposed to be (IIRC) because the morph INJ poses want to look there first, and having them elsewhere slows down their loading. I've never had a problem with that though.

As for V4/M4, you can load them into external runtimes, you just need a Poser.exe file in the folder the runtime is in before the installer will accept it as a valid location. I did that with both, and my M4 installation has nothing in my P7 main runtime and still loads quickly, with morphs loading fine.

Quote - DAZ recommends that the Mill 3 figures be loaded in the internal runtimes, but that's supposed to be (IIRC) because the morph INJ poses want to look there first, and having them elsewhere slows down their loading. I've never had a problem with that though.

As for V4/M4, you can load them into external runtimes, you just need a Poser.exe file in the folder the runtime is in before the installer will accept it as a valid location. I did that with both, and my M4 installation has nothing in my P7 main runtime and still loads quickly, with morphs loading fine.

Never had a problem with the injectors myself for the other figures being in external runtimes for V3/M3, no appreciable difference in speed from what I can tell.  Never tried that with V4, since it got so grouchy about installing only where it could find poser.exe I thought better safe than sorry.

That's good info though, appreciate you taking the time to share it :)

Ok, so I'm FINALLY working on this.... migrating my stuff to my external runtimes, and I've thought of another question:
Can I name an external runtime folder "Sports" and dump all my sports related stuff in it? I mean if I have a football uniform that's considered a character, and yet also have helmets and footballs that are considered props, can they all go into the same folder? Or must I name the main folder "Sports" and inside it have two sub-folders, one for props and one for characters that are related to sports?
And further, I have one main runtime folder named "Clothes". I know that in order for Poser to recognize it, I must have a sub-folder inside "Clothes" that is simply labeled "Runtime" (step 3 of the tutorial)
However, inside my "Clothes" folder I have it broken down further into separate clothes folders for M2, M3, V2, V3, etc, etc. Must each of these subfolders also have a folder labeled "Runtime" in them?

I hope I've explained this adequately. Please let me know if what I said here makes sense.
Thanks -

Yes you can name an external runtime Sports and use that for all your sports-related stuff. When Poser adds a runtime to its internal list, it should create the necessary subfolders for characters, props, etc.

No, you don't need "runtime" subfolders in your M3, V3, etc subfolders for your individual characters in your "Clothes" runtime. I would, however, recommend separate runtimes for character clothing. In my setup, I just had a Clothing_Everyday runtime, and I'm looking at setting up new runtimes for Clothing_Everyday_V3, Clothing_Everyday_V4, etc. I think that keeping clothing separated into individual runtimes based upon characters is a good way to work, especially if you have a lot of clothing of one type. Since most of us collect a lot of clothing, it's best to keep these Runtimes as small, and as organized as possible.

At the very least, I'd recommend separating the clothing by types into their own runtimes rather than creating a massive "Clothing" directory. So you would have Clothing_Military, Clothing_Fantasy, Clothing_SF, Clothing_Everyday_Male, Clothing_Everyday_V3, and so forth.

Hi - I'm still in the process of transferring all my content to my series of external runtimes.... it's taking so long because I work 2 jobs and I'm trying to squeeze it into whatever spare time I have. I find myself with another question.... I peeked ahead in the tutorial that I'm following but didn't see anything about it, and I'm hoping someone can enlighten me on it.
I've installed Poser 6 on my computer, and deleted my old runtime. I've be taking a copy of my old runtime, dissecting it and transferring the contents to the series of external runtimes that I've created. Here's the question I have:
What about my "geometries" and "textures" files from my old runtime? I'm thinking that I'll have to transfer them back onto my C: drive into the new runtime folder set up by my Poser 6 installation. Is that right? I think it must be, otherwise how would Poser 6 know where to find them? I didn't see anything in the tutorial about this.
To nutshell it - the only thing in my external runtimes (on my e: drive) should be the actual props, characters, lights, etc. All the texture files and geometries will have to be in my internal runtime (my c: drive).... right?
Getting ready to head off to work again, and I'll have a look here when I get home tonight. Thanks again, everyone for all the advice and help.

Steve   

You should put the geometries and textures folders into the external runtimes, Poser will still find the contents.

Python scripts are the only things that I believe must be placed in the internal runtime, everything else for a content can go in an external runtime.

Basically (unless I'm wrong here), when you select an external runtime as your current working runtime, Poser looks there for all necessary files (geometries, textures, morph data) there first and only looks elsewhere if it can't find them.

modus0 is correct about the location of geometries and textures.  They should accompany the parent content.  Although python scripts should be located on the internal runtime, I have not found this the case.  I have both Poser 7 and PoserPro installed on my computer; the Poser 7 with most of my 'internal' content feeds PoserPro.  I can still run my scripts from Poser 7 in PoserPro with any problems so far.

Ok... wow. That's gonna be a tall order. I don't know which geometries go with which of my character files sometimes. Same for the texture files. For example, if I have a character file of say... a dog. Well that's fine, but the geometry for it might have come in a geometries folder called "Loops_a19" when I downloaded it. I just plunked that folder right into the "geometries" folder of my runtime. When I load the dog character into a scene, Poser knows what geometries folder to look in, but I don't know how I'm supposed to remember all that. I'll have to go thru the geometries one-by-one. I'd better drink some Red Bull.... Looks like I'm gonna be up for a while tonight.
Thanks for the help,

Steve

I'd suggest, if you have the zips/installers to simply categorize them and start over installing things where you want them.

It may sound intimidating to do that, but it's probably easier than trying to match up geometries and textures to stuff.

I'd just try putting the geometries and textures for one item in the Poser 6 runtime. IIRC Poser 6 will search there, too. 

Working directly from the installers is what I'd recommend as well. Matching geometries and textures to the CR2 files is a nightmare with way too much risk of failure.

The easiest way that I have found of migrating content--and as I counsel in the tutorial--is to work from the installers and, if you have it, to use 3D Content Installer to do the actual installation of the content from the installers.

Yeah, I guess I didn't get that fully until now - the part about working from the installers, that is. Unfortunately, I don't have about 95% of the original zip files that I've downloaded, so in that respect, I'm kinda stuck.
But I've re-thought my whole idea on this. The main reason I wanted to setup external runtimes, was because of the whole runtime-bloat thing you described in your tutorial. It was hard to find a lot of things and it was causing Poser to run sooooooo slow and shaky. I still have a lot of content that I haven't even installed yet. A bunch of zip files just waiting to be opened. I think I'll set those up in external runtimes.
But in the meantime, I'll continue tearing apart the copy of my old runtime,re-organizing it, deleting stuff I just don't need. Then I'll drop my old geometries and texture files back into my c: drive runtime (so I know where they're at). Then, I'll take all the character files, props, lights, etc, etc, that I still want to keep but don't need right at the moment, and either put them on a nice roomy thumb-drive, or burn them to a series of CD's. Then when I need them, I can still have them, but they won't be using umpteen GB's of space on my c: drive.

You know that geometries and textures need most of the room on your drive?

And to say it once again: Poser 6 will find geometries inside its main runtime even if files are loaded from external runtimes so just keep the geometries and textures from the library files you moved to other runtimes there.

If you can wait a month or two, then I may even have a solution for you to copy the textures and geometries to the correct runtimes...

Recovering the zip files and installers can be pretty easy, just time consuming. Both Daz and Renderosity keep track of purchases made through their stores, so you can always re-download installers and zip archives from them.

As far as free stuff, the Renderosity Free Stuff area is nice in that it's searchable, but since the actual archives are stored on external sites, you may be out of luck if the hosting sites have gone down.