On the displacement....

I actually saved the VSS prop after doing what you suggested Vestmann.
While it worked when I did this in the template, when I loaded my saved prop... it actually disconnects the displacement map every time I run it. (Even though in the template skin displacement has an empty image in it.)

It bugs the hell out of me and I'm trying to see what it's doing, and why it's doing it... no joy so far. :)

Go into the VSS Designer and click Autoname Images.  This will rename the displacement map so VSS will read it.

Yeah, I did.
Sometimes it sticks, sometimes it doesn't.

Getting rather glittery skin as well, and sometimes dirty speckles.

Argh. :)

I'm still playing with the nodes, but the more I play, the more annoyed I get and start over.

I'll keep trying. :)

Hehe, well have fun trying!  I learned most by making my own VSS prop.  It made me go through the Apply and Shader rules.  It's much easier then you'd think.

Yeah, I just fixed a prop up to work with the M4 Displacement maps, since they need to be adjusted.
It made me look at the SkinFace node, since that was way too high displacement wise, so I had to separate it out.
I set up a new Material template for the face, lip and nostril, taking care of the lower displacement on those.
Seems to be working atm. :)

Glad to hear it :)

I've sent you a PM with the result... lol
He's been submitted someplace, so I won't post a link here. :)

Sent you a PM back.  Thanks for the link by the way.

 BB, dose this system have potential for easier toon/cel shaded NPR?
Love esther

Quote -  BB, dose this system have potential for easier toon/cel shaded NPR?
Love esther

I have used it to apply toon shaders quickly to multiple material zones but I don't know if VSS offers any special features for toon shading.

bagginsbill...?

I was thinking to adapt it to the old DAZ dragon (I don't like the Millenium Dragon, his eyes are way too small). I was going to size the dragon down so he sits on the Mage's Desk that I'm working on, but I wondered if VSS couldn't spiff up the dragon some.

I have actually modified and used VSS with Nybras and a few of Davo's alien creatures.  It works very well.  Of course, you will need to tweak settings and change your SSS Diffuse_color accordingly, as well as create new rules to accommodate the different material zones.

Mucking about with the rules of the control prop is the part I don't quite understand. So I do it the hard way. I copy and paste the nodes from the skin to what I want to adapt, put in the maps and then save that as a material. Then apply the material and add in the maps for the various parts. I know it's the hard way, but when I'm done, I then save the whole thing as a material collection.

Making nodes and manipulating them is easy once you get the basic understanding of it.  You might try adjusting the Apply Rules first since that has the least amount of nodes.

I will try to give some steps for you to follow.  Let's say you wanted the VSS prop to apply ONLY to Victoria4:

Select your prop and go into the material room. Select the Apply Rules from the material list.
There should be a node and a *Ball node. Delete them.

From the Python Script menu, hit Designer and then hit Add a Rule Node. 
You will get a drop down menu. Select  * Other - type it in *.   
Type Victoria4 in the window and hit ok.  This should give you a new node called Victoria4.   That's it.  The current VSS prop will only apply it's rules to Victoria4 when you hit synchronize.

In the case of your dragon you would substitute the Body name of the dragon figure with Victoria4.  If the Body name is Dragon, you put in Dragon

Next thing to do would be to play with the Shader Rules.  Look at how they are set up.  You have a long list of rules on the left and some Copy nodes on the right.  Now look at the Designer in the Python scripts menu.  There you have a Add a Rule Node and Add a Copy Node.

Let's say your dragon has a material called Scales.  Hit Add a Rule Node and type in Scales.  You'll get a node called Rule Scales.    If you connect that node to Copy Template Skin, VSS will apply Template Skin to the Scales material on the Dragon.

I´m not used to writing instructions or tutorial so I hope I'm making sense ;)  The important thing is to experiment.  You'll be creating your own VSS props in no time.

 hmm sounds like it could work.
be interesting if there were some special shaders for tooning with new versions of poser as well.

Question: did the pro version ever get to a market?

 I don't think he's made the pro version yet.

IIRC he said there would be at least a year until the Pro version hits the shelves.  

 oh, that's disappointing.

Yeah but he is publishing a book on materials that I hope will be out before VSS Pro.

I decided to test VSS with toon shaders and found that it's quite simple to implement.  All you have to do is go into the materials of the VSS prop (like Template Skin) and click Set Up Toon Render in the Wacros dialogue.  It adds a Toon node and a Color Math node.  Make sure to change the color of value 2 to white in the Color Math node.  The advantage is that you retain all the VSS controls like Shine, GC and Bump.

The above image (click it for full size) took only 3 1/2 min. to render.  It has a single inf. light.  Apart from the shadow on the hair I think this looks quite promising.

 OKAY, now you have my attention.  I will have to look into this.  Thanks so much for testing. Now is the tooning also applied to the jeans?
Love esther

Yes but it didn't come out quite toony enough :)  I'm trying a full scene now with more lights.  I will post a render if it works out.

 I wonder if the pro version of VSS will have an auto-toon button?  That would be way cool.
Love esther

Don't know if BB has much interest in Toon Shaders or if he will concentrate mainly on Photorealistic Skin.  It would be a cool option though...

 actually he did once mention NPR for future versions of poser.  Got another render to show me?

Working on it...;)   BTW, what does NPR stand for?

 oh sorry - non photorealistic rendering
or I suppose nothing personal really
or nerdy poser render

lol.. ok. that makes sense :)   Almost ready with the render...

 I'm going to bed soon.  will check in the morning.
Love esther

Here's where I´m at so far.  I need to read up on the toon shaders a bit as well as experiment more with the VSS controls.  But I really like how this looks so far.  Only one light in the above render.  Render time 11 min.

As far as anyone knows, there may never be a pro version of VSS.  BB has been talking about this for over a year.  It just may not happen.  Keep in mind, the overall plan for VSS is to make it convenient to apply textures to all characters and props.  The present version was developed for skin textures.  There is a VSS for hair although BB is currently not to happy with it's results yet.  And I have custom built one, out of curiosity, to apply textures to a rigged structure.

The only "bug" I can think of with VSS is that doesn't work on parented props.  If that would be fixed I'd be well happy with the current version of VSS.  One of the upsides of this version is that it forced to go into the material room and manipulate nodes which is something I've been "afraid" of.

Quote - Here's where I´m at so far.  I need to read up on the toon shaders a bit as well as experiment more with the VSS controls.  But I really like how this looks so far.  Only one light in the above render.  Render time 11 min.

Forgot the render :)

3rd time's the charm...

Very nice render.  Must keep this in mind when I attempt tooning.

 Hi, that looks great.  Could you please make one in a lighter environment and tell me if it takes long to apply the tooning to the clothes and scene etc.
Love esther

 hborre  "The present version was developed for skin textures."  are you saying this system is only for applying shaders to naked "people"?
Love esther

The system was not developed for skin textures only.

The configuration of the free VSS control prop was set up for skin textures. You can set it up differently to do anything.

 thanks.  
so any ideas about easy tooning of whole scene, clothes person etc

Well, easy is relative. If you want to use the same shader on everything, it's quite easy. Apply rule = *, shader rule = * linked to a Copy XYZ where XYZ is whatever template you want to copy from. Create a Template Toon material on the control prop. Put a toon shader in it.  Copy Template Toon.

You can even build a new prop from scratch that just has a toon template in it. Load a Poser sphere. Add material zones "Apply Rules", and "Shader Rules". Add one more material for the template shader. Populate these as described above.

Of course, you probably do not want the same shader on every prop and figure. Which means you want more rules. Making lots of rules is kind of painful the way things are now. That's why I want to make a GUI for VSS - which is what VSS Pro will be all about - the GUI.

But I have no time right now.

 oh.  Well maybe once poser pro 2010 comes out you will have more time?
Love esther

 Vestmann's tooning looked quite good to me, but I'm not sure if the clothes and scene are tooned or not as it's a fairly dark render.

Perhaps after PPro 2010. My part is just about done, but other consulting opportunies are just around the corner, and I really want to publish my shader book, or perhaps make a multi-volume set and publish Volume 1.

If I were to generate some meaningful income from the book, then I might use that money to hire programmers to help me build more VSS stuff.  Then sales of VSS would generate more money to hire more programmers, and also content devleopers, and make nice addons including textures.

But here I am building a CG empire in my mind, and I haven't made $1 yet. LOL

uh can I preorder shader book?

 it's a virtual empire.  Fitting really.  Okay, I'll buy one (online version as I spend most of my day at the puter anyway), just to speed up your VSS Pro coming out. Personally I think you would make more money out of your VSS stuff than out of a book.  The book could be "the missing manual".
Love esther

Quote -  Vestmann's tooning looked quite good to me, but I'm not sure if the clothes and scene are tooned or not as it's a fairly dark render.

Everything in the scene has toon shaders.  The problem is that the scene prop has image maps applied and I don't know how to make them look more like a toon render.  I also don't know how to adjust lights properly for toon rendering.

I have some time now and I'm gonna try out a scene from scratch, applying toon shaders to a character, clothes and environment.  Any tips on lighting would be well appreciated.

The Plan:
I´ll use one VSS Prop for Victoria, another for all the clothes AND all the props.  I might also add a separate prop for the hair.

How?
Thanks to Stonemason's setup all the props begin with the letters 'si'.  I´ll add these letters to the bodyname of all the clothes and target the VSS prop to everything beginning with the letters 'si'  I´ll change the Shader Rules of this prop so that it applies the Toon Template to every material.

One thing about parented props.  This particular scenes loads with all the props parented to two master props.  VSS doesn't work on parented props.  I solved this by deleting these master props, then did 'Undo delete' from the edit menu and they come back with everything unparented so VSS should work.

The thing to remember is that there's no simple solution for every scene.  You have to plan your work for the scene you have each time.

I'll be back with the finished render...

I have uploaded VSS PR1 Revision A that fixes the problem with parented props and hair.

Get it from the VSS Home Page. I replaced the original zip file with the new one.

Nothing else has changed - there are no new shaders in it nor did I fix the lights.

The only file that has changed is vss.py.

Quote - I have uploaded VSS PR1 Revision A that fixes the problem with parented props and hair.

Get it from the VSS Home Page. I replaced the original zip file with the new one.

Nothing else has changed - there are no new shaders in it nor did I fix the lights.

The only file that has changed is vss.py.

Great news!  Thank you so much.  As I've said earlier this was the only thing bugging me with VSS.  Thanks.