I have a two-piece setting and diamond earring. They are in two pieces because my experience (perhaps erroneous) has been that if I combine metal object (that needs rounding by Poser) and diamond  object (that I definitely don't want rounded) I will get rounded surfaces on my diamond which looks like poo.

I want it to look like this:

I have been able to save the two props together into my Props Library but never as smart prop. The dialogue just never comes up when you select more than one object at a time.

Any bright minds have any clues how to make a multi-obj prop into a smart prop?

Or is there another solution I'm not considering?

If you rig it as a figure, the diamond and the ring will be two separate body parts,
and you can set the diamond for No Polygon Smoothing and the
ring for Yes Polygon Smoothing. 

i.e., the paragraph for the diamond would end with something like

    displacementBounds 0
    shadingRate 0.2
    smoothPolys 0
    }

and the paragraph for the ring would end with

    displacementBounds 0
    shadingRate 0.2
    smoothPolys 1
    }

Or a simpler solution: Use UVmapper or your modelling app to split (or bevel)
all the vertices of the diamond.  Poser will then leave it sharp and flat.

Quote - Or a simpler solution: Use UVmapper or your modelling app to split (or bevel)
all the vertices of the diamond.  Poser will then leave it sharp and flat.

Thanks for your quick reply, Ockham.

In Blender, I've already separated all the faces of the diamond from each other, so no two faces share an edge. When I import that object into Poser, all tick boxes are unticked... I want the prop to end up at exactly the size and location I had designated on my exported zeroed V4 obj which I use in Blender as my dress-maker dummy for positioning and scaling stuff.

But saving as figure... hadn't thought of that. And so, when I load this multi-obj figure from my figure library, I just do a "Conform To..." and it sorts itself?

There might be a non-figure way, as well. I managed to do this a while back and managed it, but forget how I did it. Lesbentley knows this stuff top to bottom. Get him.

Quote - But saving as figure... hadn't thought of that. And so, when I load this multi-obj figure from my figure library, I just do a "Conform To..." and it sorts itself?

Nope. You'd have to rig with a skeleton to get that to happen. Ugh.

Quote - > Quote - But saving as figure... hadn't thought of that. And so, when I load this multi-obj figure from my figure library, I just do a "Conform To..." and it sorts itself?

Nope. You'd have to rig with a skeleton to get that to happen. Ugh.

I was afraid of that.

I guess the other option is to just give instructions to users how to parent the multi-obj prop once they've loaded it.

BTW, Bill, that shader on the diamond is more or less yours - want to give you credit for it. One caveat: people who use this one which I am including as an option instead of the ones that work with "conventional lights and settings" (read: crap lights sans setting - nothing for the gem to reflect against) will need some sort of sky-dome (yours, preferentially) and lights that make sense and the problem with that is that people are going to load this freebie - yes, it's going to be a freebie for the May Rendo Newsletter - they are going to expect to use it with their favourite lights, which are all crap (sorry, light-makers, but this shader renders like poo in everything I've tried, and I've tried some of the most popular lights, because against sage advice I actually went out and BOUGHT lights) because there isn't anything to reflect against and usually lights are depth-mapped and no AO and ... and ... and.
So, freebie-downloader, beware. "Opportunity-to-learn-something" detected...

If you're targeting those kinds of users, connect a Sphere_Map node to the Reflection Background input, which should be set to white. To the Sphere_Map, connect an Image_Map. Provide something like an EnvSphere image, but much smaller in that Image_Map. It doesn't have to be big or good. Just has to have some vague impression of the lighting patterns found in an EnvSphere image, such as sky and ground, or a wide-angle indoor shot with floor, ceiling, windows, etc. Doesn't even have to be equirectangular. Any photo with a clear division at the midline, and with some sort of hot spots here and there will work as a source of environmental reflections.

For those using it with a true 360 env, this will have no impact at all.
 

Quote - I have a two-piece setting and diamond earring. They are in two pieces because my experience (perhaps erroneous) has been that if I combine metal object (that needs rounding by Poser) and diamond  object (that I definitely don't want rounded) I will get rounded surfaces on my diamond which looks like poo.

...

Or is there another solution I'm not considering?

You can assign different Smoothing ID's to the metal and diamond polygons using Poser's grouping tool.
Selecting the polys shouldn't be much of a problem as you can select by material zone.

This should work for Poser 6 and up...

I've done this only once some time ago, but it's covered in the Poser Reference Manual.

Martin

Quote - > Quote - I have a two-piece setting and diamond earring. They are in two pieces because my experience (perhaps erroneous) has been that if I combine metal object (that needs rounding by Poser) and diamond  object (that I definitely don't want rounded) I will get rounded surfaces on my diamond which looks like poo.

...

Or is there another solution I'm not considering?

You can assign different Smoothing ID's to the metal and diamond polygons using Poser's grouping tool.
Selecting the polys shouldn't be much of a problem as you can select by material zone.

This should work for Poser 6 and up...

I've done this only once some time ago, but it's covered in the Poser Reference Manual.

Martin

Oh, I think that's probably your best bet Robyn :o).

Laurie

Brilliant! Ooooo gotta love this... merci milles fois, Bill!!! Hope you have a spectacular weekend.

Here's the thing, though... you come up with these brilliant solutions and I've been following you around like a lapdog and I Still run into this wall when it comes to doing this sort of thing. I have a gold shader that looks great in a real environment (one that supports reflections) but like poo in the above-mentioned lights. So, the solution you suggested should work with that as well, I'm going to assume?

BTW, I do envy you your mind.

Quote - You can assign different Smoothing ID's to the metal and diamond polygons using Poser's grouping tool.

Grouping tool. Half the time it doesn't work properly. It's one of those aspects of Poser that needs a complete re-design. But, I suppose I'll have to struggle with it.

Quote - Selecting the polys shouldn't be much of a problem as you can select by material zone.

Selecting is the whole problem. It doesn't recognise my materials and clicking/try to select anything does nothing. Which is why I try to avoid it. I must be doing something seriously wrong...

Thanks again, though, Martin... I'll have another go.

Poser doesn't save multi-props as smart props, a bug since Poser4.
Poser only save as smart prop a single prop.

To make a multi-part prop smart prop you must do:
1- Select all the props and sve them in the prop library. It doesn't matter if the root prop has a parent or not, Poser always will save it as without parent.
2- Once saved, with a text editor find in the pp2 file the root prop and change the line

parent UNIVERSE  by smartparent your body part

ex: smartparent Head
    smartparent rRing2

In this way you can make every prop parented to a different body part, for example, loading a single armor prop you have each armor part parented to its respective body part

Quote - Poser doesn't save multi-props as smart props, a bug since Poser4.
Poser only save as smart prop a single prop.
To make a multi-part prop smart prop you must do:
1- Select all the props and sve them in the prop library. It doesn't matter if the root prop has a parent or not, Poser always will save it as without parent.
2- Once saved, with a text editor find in the pp2 file the root prop and change the line
parent UNIVERSE  by smartparent your body part
ex: smartparent Head
    smartparent rRing2
In this way you can make every prop parented to a different body part, for example, loading a single armor prop you have each armor part parented to its respective body part

Stroke of genius, kawecki!! Thank you - that worked a treat.

My gemstone was already smartparent -ed to the setting, so I only had to do this:
replace
parent UNIVERSE
with
smartparent Head

I think the body part is case sensitive.

Thanks again: my partner and I were tearing out hair out! (not a good look in either Oz or Denmark... lol)

If you wish to just keep the ring as a single prop with the stone nice and sharp it is simple if you have UVMapper.
Bring the ring into UVMapper
Select the ring group
Map it, assign to a material
Select the stone
Under the Tools use the Verices, Split vertices by group option
Map it, assign to a material.
Save wit no options selected, I suggest adding uvs to the name.
Import that into Poser and check.

If this works for you would you please let me know.

Wouldn't that still leave the facets welded? All you need to do is completely unweld the facets and then smoothing becomes a non-issue.

Quote - > Quote - You can assign different Smoothing ID's to the metal and diamond polygons using Poser's grouping tool.

Grouping tool. Half the time it doesn't work properly. It's one of those aspects of Poser that needs a complete re-design. But, I suppose I'll have to struggle with it.

Quote - Selecting the polys shouldn't be much of a problem as you can select by material zone.

Selecting is the whole problem. It doesn't recognise my materials and clicking/try to select anything does nothing. Which is why I try to avoid it. I must be doing something seriously wrong...

Thanks again, though, Martin... I'll have another go.

you need to create a new group and then you can select by materials. so you create two groups. then you select.

but after that i dont know how you change the smoothing options.

From my experimenting, mostly Hex to Poser issues of how to maintain a sharp edge I found splitting the vertices in UVMapper apparently creates a new mesh by altering the edges by the given crease angle. that's why I map after I split.
to prove this to myself I made a very simple wall. Went through the splitting process.
Made a sizing morph and when I tried applying it to the wall in Poser I got a wrong vertice error.
Split the morph obj then it worked. It matched the vertice count of the wall.
  I haven't seen an Un-Weld function in UVMapper so I can't comment on how that might work.

This technique can be further refined, depending on if the modelling app can assign textures and export them. Then the areas that need to remain sharp can be split by material.

Is this the proper way to fix a bad obj? Who knows but so far between splitting vertices and checking for concave facets I've been able to fix most anything I've needed so far for use in either P4pp or P7.

if you model you can somehow control how hard the edges are. i will post some exemples. they are called control loops.

Splitting vertices is unwelding. Combining vertices that are in the same position is welding.

Smoothing of normals across polygon boundaries happens when they share vertices, i.e. when they are welded. Smoothing cannot happen if two adjacent polygons do not share welded vertices, but instead have each their own copy of the vertex points.

Welding and unwelding indeed does change the vertex count unless the tool is capable of leaving unconnected vertices after a weld. Most do not.

yup called Microbeveling - been a used technique since poser 4...

but why 180? that distorts any mesh. even a microbeveled one - look at the faces inside the bevels.. just as distorted as the mesh you did'nt bevel.

the best Crease values are 0-90. (I prefer 22.5 or 45 myself gives you flat surfaces but smooths curves...)

i used 180 to show what i meant. i never use 180

why?
.... that makes no sense. if 180 is never used, why use it to demonstrate a point ...

all you've proved is setting 180 as the crease angle will distort anything....

because when i used 90 on both objects they looked the same. and some here wouldnt understand what i was talking about.

"Splitting vertices is unwelding. Combining vertices that are in the same position is welding."

Cool. I learned something today :) Thank you.

And yes, I am quite familiar with control loops, filleting and chamfering to adjust the roundness of an edge. The technique I was pointing out is how to keep the edges Sharp so Poser doesn't round them. Especially useful for the individuals still using older versions of Poser.

Quote - because when i used 90 on both objects they looked the same. and some here wouldnt understand what i was talking about.

in what way looked the same?