A company...that for the moment shall go unnamed...is about to enter the Poser market and has ask me if I could get some general feedback from the community about one of their current projects. Its an articulated cr2 model of a 737 jet airliner with detailed interior. Here are the specifics: ------------------------- a Boeing 737-600, which can be ether a business jet or a commercial airline. As a business jet it has 850 sq. feet of cabin space which can be ultra luxurious. As a commercial jet it can hold 108 passengers (8 first class, 100 economy). The inside is a separate object which can be rendered alone Working Parts: Control Surfaces': Ailerons, Flaps, Rudder, Elevator, Landing Gear: Left, Right, Front Doors: Cabin Front, Cabin Rear, Cargo Front, Cargo Rear, 6 Gear At the time of this writing the cockpit, the bedroom, and the master bath and the commercial passenger interior were not yet completed. The company would like to know the following: What are your general impression of the model shown in the pictures? Do you think there is a market for this type of product? (vehicles and buildings with detail interiors and articulated parts) The finished model including the interior may get as large as 100,000 polygons. Is this too large for most Poser users? Also the maker would like to knowshould I make as many parts as possible moveable or should I keep it more simple? I plan on making the seats rotate as necessary but should I make the controls work in the cockpit or cabinet doors open and stuff like that Other project near completion are a Gulfstream V business jet and a Cessna business jet. Your feedback is most appreciated! More pictures to follow.

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one word awsome , let me know if you want beta testers :) Best regards CatMan

Really, nice work :-).

#1. Like CatMan said.....AWESOME! #2. Yes, I think their is a market for this kind of thing. #3. I am not computer "Saavy" so I don't know if it is too large for most Poser Users, as far as the polygons are concerned? #4. Yes, I think you should make as many parts movable as possible, but also maybe create one with less options of movement, and maybe at a lesser price? Personally, I work for an airline, so I can appreciate moving flaps, ailerons, etc. but maybe more people would be more in- interested in moving parts in the cabin, where their Poser people will be? Beautiful work, Smallspace, and I look forward to pur- chasing your model in the future. Do you think you can make a 747 too? (: Good luck and I hope you make a ton of money! (: genny

I know, put Vicki with Daz high res texture on in a scene with it. If it doesn't crash it's not too big ;-). Actually that's not really a fair test is it?

Man that's detailed ;-)

General impression: WOW!! Do I think there's a market? You betcha. I am always looking for models that have detailed interiors AND look good from the outside. Is 100,000 polys too large for most poser users? Possibly. But don't forget that there are those of us out there who don't use Poser as their primary rendering app. Some of us only use Poser to pose so the high poly model wouldn't really give us much concern (we can always convert it for use in other programs). As for the moving parts, yes, cabinet doors should open, etc, but don't make yourself crazy doing it. It is not necessary for every needle on every guage to move. grin Hope this answers your client's questions satisfactorily, SmallSpace. Kate (wiping the drool from her chin)

Yowzer! lol This is awesome :)

Cool! Change the texture... grab the HArrison Ford morph and do some AirForce One rendres... =)

My only concern is that it's so big and so very specific that I'm honestly not sure how useful it would be. This is a pro's toy, since, as someone else pointed out, the moment you introduce a Vickie or a Michael, or even a P4 with a reasonably detailed wardrobe, you're gonna max out the available memory. I'd recommend issuing it as a .3ds file instead of a Poser one. That way, it can still be imported if need be and it'll be that much easier to use in other modelling programs. It's amazing work, BTW. Very nicely done. The woodgrain texture in particular is spectacular.

That looks awesome and I definitely think that is a market for it. The interior sounds like a great idea, but I would keep them as separate figures that would either be smart props or conforming figures to the exterior so that if you're just posing with the exterior, the extra polygons won't weigh us down. Same thing goes for instance if I just want to render the cockpit, I don't need all the polygons from the rest of the plane. Even though it's a very detailed and wonderful plane, I personally wouldn't throw down more than $40-$50 for it. If you're looking for people who'll throw down hundreds or thousands of dollars for a model, then you might want to target a different community of 3D modelers. Look forward to seeing the final product.

I'd definitely purchase it if the cost is in line with products us poor Poser folks are used to (Daz, Renderosity Marketplace, etc.) and not up in the stratosphere like many "pro" 3d models are priced.

I'm NOT the maker of the model. I'm simply functioning as the connection to the community. The makers are a well established 3D model making company. They've just recently become "Poser Aware" (that's where I came in) They are well on the way to providing a whole library of Poser accessories, including planes, trains, automobiles, weapons, all sorts of miscellaneous props, and best of all...a line of human characters! What makes their Poser models different, besides the level of detail, is how flawlessly and effortlessly their morph dials work to move every part just the way it should go. For instance, If you open a door, the dial will only let you go as far as the door could open, and when you close it, the dial won't let you overshoot the mark. All the dials work that way. This ease of manipulation actually makes the cr2 far easier to handle than it would be if it were a 3DS file import. The maker is thinking about providing the interior and exterior of this model as separate models but in one package. This way the interior may be as little 30,000 polygons...less than a single Vickie! Of course, because you can hide all the parts that won't be seen, you can greatly reduce the size of the model for rendering and export. "...it's so big and so very specific that I'm honestly not sure how useful it would be..." Remember, this plane will also come in a standard airline package, with first class and economy. As such, it will be the only set of its type...anywhere! With the amount I fly every year, I can't think of a more generic setting than the inside of a 737! As for the price, well, I've tried my best to make it clear that ALL Poser users are 40 year old home-hobbyist and this is "mad money" not a professional tax write-off :) I think they will be in line with or close to what you see DAZ! -SMT

WOW! great! I just hope it's affordable...it looks like it's going to be expensive!

Very nice. Very detailed. I wonder about the poly count, when all is said and done.

making a "dummy" object would be nice. Low poly count for the choreography process and then replace it with the real thing for the render. Great looking set. What about the cost? Is this something your trying guage if people already have clients who would need such a thing? It would have to be reasonably priced to fly in the hobbyist market. Good Luck

Because it's large and has got a lot of stuff in it, I see three ways to distribute it: A CR2, a PZ3 or both. If received as that fashion, I would "cut it up" for whatever specific use by: * Export/import the exterior parts as a prop for use in exterior shots. * Export/Import any interior array to use as background * Use transparencies on various materials to cut hole or remove stuff from the camera's view * Save internal and external parts as props or smaler CR2's depending on what part to use. It would be difficult to use the whole thing with an array of characters with clothes for the average PC ... but by the methods above, such would not be necessary. I have done the above with other large PZ3's and it's a way to save what I need in the form I need it in...

I might be interested depending on price/need. A really good price, and I'd pick it up quickly, rationalizing that I'd find a need later. ;-) I'd be more interested in houses, buildings and a wider variety of cars as my Posers don't travel as much as they'd like to. (If I can't, they can't!)

Ditto on houses, buildings The airplane is seriously cool, however

I will buy it as soon as it's released. great job

Fantastic! Don't change a thing. Release it as is. It's great to see a really talented company making something contemporary, useful and NEW! Do we really need another suit of armor for the P4 Male or bathing suit for Vicky?

Well... here's what I (and only I) can think about it... Making some really good models high detailed is a very very good idea... most of us are in need of such that kind of things ! Higly Poseable with ease of use ? We would be fool to refuse that... saving time on that kind of things is gaining time for searching the good lights, and camera angles :-) 100 000 Polys ? Well as it was said, when you want only one part of the model you hide what is not interesting for you... You need an outside looking of the plane ? You delete all the seats, and elements of cockpit. You camera is in cockpit ? Delete the rest of the plane !!! It's only 100 000 polys if you manage your scene mindless... Beside all this, the question is "is there a market fot this ?". I think, most of users (or I can say it for me), vehicles (planes, car, etc...) are usually only parts of a whole scene. Or, it should be usefull for professional users with specifics needs. I've never seen (or I may be blind ?) an attempt to make a scene inside of a car, a bus, or a plane. Maybe for trains or boats models ?... But, only my point of view, it looks like there would be more demands on highly detailed buildings. Good looking victorians manor, New Orlean style house, Skyscraper, Gothic Cathedrals, Modern Art museum, Roman Castle, futuristic factory, french buildings, fantasy tower are more impressives and artistics models and are, perhaps, more interesting for poser's (and other's rendering software) users. Weapons ? There is already a lot of talented modelers specialized in making weapons... one more, for commercial point of view, is, in my opinion, a mistake... Characters ? Sure !!! We're all looking for new characters. A good new character is often the start of a good new scene... :-) Well... as I said before, it's my own opinion. Some will adgree while others could not... I keep in mind that it is for -commercial- purpose of a "well established 3D model company". Some of us will want some plane models, some will backstep for polycount, some will... That's all fols !!! :-) PS : I'm french, so you will excuse the eventuals faults in that message. I hope it is legible...

Theres a market for almost anything. But I would not make only airplanes. Widen YOUR market by offering houses with interiors, ships, buildings... etc. What I like is the amount of detail. Thats what takes time and will save customers time. For the poly count problem make differnt versions with it- no interior, interier only, etc. The more working parts the better. VERY NICE!!!!!!!!!!

Forgot to add: I would love to buy a yaught or a superyaught kind of a power boat if you like. with detailed interiour. BTW, I'm speaking about the yaught for Poser, not about the real one. I don't think I'll ever manage... (sigh, smile).

Well, as a modeler and a seller of poseable models and a user of Poser, Vue, & Bryce, I have to say it is wonderful work. But in my opionion it would be better if this company gave options. Meaning, take this plane, you may want to have them sell it as a whole and in sections. I know that can be hard, but it might make more sense because people can buy exatcly what they are going to use. Especially if the price is high, and the polygon count is high, that way you save the customer some money and still have it available for those who have it. Also, Poser does things to flat surfaces, which I am sure they know by now, hopefully Steve Cox's new UV Pro will help with the smoothing engine of Poser, if it doesn't those beautiful sections that are nice and flat will be all rounded and look like plastic no matter what texture you use on it. But other than that, it is beautiful. Sharen:)

Attached Link: http://www.n2comics.com

This would be great for the project I'm working on. I'm using Poser and Bryce to create a graphic novel for the internet (www.n2comics.com). And a set like this would come in very handy. I've had to create sets for subway cars in the past for the project (though the set was done in Bryce with Poser characters imported). One general question to the group, poser's ground/background "space" seems to be very limited, I know that Daz and this company have been working on making sets and stages for Poser. Has anyone played with these and know how practical they are inside of Poser as compared to creating your own sets in another 3d package and importing the poser files? Thanks JBSettle

The model looks great with one exception- the struts that hold the engines shouldn't have a flat front face. As to sales, going by the one non-figure related item I sell (a bicycle) sales would be in the dozens the first month, droping to single digits per month after that. That is assuming you have it in the "Normal" Poser price range, possably $40-60 for something like this, at say $100 (even though the model might be worth it) sales would be next to nill. I would think if you were doing a super detail thingee with interiors, something like a castle would do a lot better. Of couse if it does well (and it could very well sell really well) I'd have to do a stewardess outfit for Supermodel Vickie! And boy, would she look good in this plane!

Hi, I think that if you, (or your friends) are going to go into detail in the cockpit, they should sell that in a seperate model, I think most of us have no need of a working cockpit, though the doors and chairs things sounds good. Though I'd have to agree with Jim on the pricing, if you follow Daz3D's lead on this you'll charge about $50 for such a model and less for the "small" stuff. At that price I might buy it, but it's probably a bit too unusual a purchase at a greater price... Just my $0.02 However I'd be much more interested in a decent F16 model, etc. later jb

HOLY MACKERAL!! Beautiful model!! But I think Praxis22 has a good point about making the cockpit/interior as a separate model (much less taxing on processors and more useful for a broader scope of computer users) I would love to see the Poser Aviation groups go a little less commercial however. There are so many fine planes that can take Poser into the great wide open: Bi-planes, Tri-planes, Caravans, Otters, Bee-Bees (Possette & Eve can battle it out rounding the flags in an air race!) and where have all my beloved, beautiful, noisy, oil-spewing DC-3s gone??!! Nice model - Blue Skies!

Very nice model. Do Vicky and Michael can sit down in the plane? Do Vicky and Michael can stand up in the plane? DO they have enough place to do so?

nitreug, as of this writing, the plane was scaled around the dimensions of the standard P4 male and female. To fit Vickie and Micheal, you simply scale up its "body". (somewhere around 110-120%, I think) -SMT