This is by no means a dig at Renderosity - I cut my teeth here and learnt loads over ten years, and Renderosity has always been that; a great community for 3D beginners & developing amateurs. However, it used to be a place where seriously good (ie regularly photorealistic) stuff was posted but this seems to be getting more rare.

So my question is, does anyone have any idea where the best artists have moved onto? I mean, what's the natural progression from here?

If I'm wrong, give me some recent examples of photorealism please! Hope this thread doesn't get moderated into oblivion; I think it's a fair question and to claim that R'osity is where it's at for the top-end Poser work online would simply be incorrect. If this is a controversial point which has been done to death recently, or you'd like to offer a suggestion for where the best people have gone, please feel free to PM me!

Thanks, PN.

PS. some examples of the best galleries going dead:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1949312&user_id=142974&member&np

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=832490&user_id=629786&favorite&np [NUDITY]

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/browse.php?user_id=11343

......etc.

People come and go work on improving your own work

and get on with life.

Cheers

Well, to be honest, the art work posted in the the Rendo gallery is among the best that I have seen anywhere.  I've seen very few thrown together scenes with base Vicky's and bad lighting.  Most of the renderings show a lot of thought in scene development.  Jan

Blackhearted still regularly reads and posts here (don't be surprised if he posts in this thread).  What is so special about the other two linked galleries?

Wait.... so in order to be considered great on here, I have to do a pin up? That's the only thing I see about all the galleries you posted. Sexual innuendos and partial nudity. I think it takes more than that to make a good picture/render. And I think there are plenty of really good galleries still on here. Look around. Or better yet, as wolf suggested, post your own.

Quote - Wait.... so in order to be considered great on here, I have to do a pin up?

Yep. :)

Quote - > Quote - Wait.... so in order to be considered great on here, I have to do a pin up?

Yep. :)

Yeah, that's sad...

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - Wait.... so in order to be considered great on here, I have to do a pin up?

Yep. :)

Nope!!!

those 3 linx were pretty good IMVHO.  mobius is an old-timer who did some of the first posette and vickie freebie characters and textures.  I recall arguing with willow (poserforum) about where to get one of those, it was like a version of one of the porno queens from 96 or 97, the "perfect woman" as mobius called it.  but there was a some rule in effect about requesting those, unbeknownst to me.  :lol:

"mobius is an old-timer who did some of the first posette and vickie freebie characters"

BTW, Vethril is back with a new freebie, talking about old times :-)

Quote - This is by no means a dig at Renderosity - I cut my teeth here and learnt loads over ten years, and Renderosity has always been that; a great community for 3D beginners & developing amateurs. However, it used to be a place where seriously good (ie regularly photorealistic) stuff was posted but this seems to be getting more rare.

So my question is, does anyone have any idea where the best artists have moved onto? I mean, what's the natural progression from here?

 

If I'm wrong, give me some recent examples of photorealism please! Hope this thread doesn't get moderated into oblivion; I think it's a fair question and to claim that R'osity is where it's at for the top-end Poser work online would simply be incorrect. If this is a controversial point which has been done to death recently, or you'd like to offer a suggestion for where the best people have gone, please feel free to PM me!

Thanks, PN.

I'm not sure what photorealism has to do with art either.  There are plenty of artists who are not photo-realists including the masters who realized that there is more than simply copying what the eye can see for art.   Photo realism can be very artistic, I'm not saying it isn't, BUT, there are other styles just as artistic.

Inspiration, composition, sense of color, flair, that certain something that it's hard to put a finger upon, but is just 'there' when you look at someone's work.  That is what art is, and it comes in many forms - realism included, but also fantasy, gothic, surrealism, etc... etc... etc..  

Delaney 

The good ones move up into the CG industry.  They don't come back.  They actually vanish from all forums.  Their bio and job title will appear on a major corporate site.  They might show off their work at a SIGGRAPH conference.

Or, they became world famous artist like Andy Simmons..

Quote - > Quote - Wait.... so in order to be considered great on here, I have to do a pin up?

Yep. :)

Wheee! I'm considered a great one!!  You may all bow down to me now!!! ;)

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1303669&user_id=127942&np&np

Seriously...

There is lots of great art and artists posting images at Renderosity.  You have to remember that only a small fraction of users post on the forums. Forums aren't for everyone.

Excellent artists, and thanks for bringing their galleries and stores to our attention. I'm sure they're out there doing their own thing, and we'll see them back this way eventually. Until then, keep on checking the 'whats new' files for new talent.

hopefully they are making stuff to render for folks like me who can't draw

Attached Link: Wintercoat

"

Yep. :)"

In that case,

I make my grab for greatness!

I'd have to agree there isn't alot of photrealism found here . Not the end-all to look professional,but I love a nice photoreal render  -considering how impressive a nice photoreal render looks , surprising it isn't used more.

I looked page after page with not a single photoreal render- I know they arethere somewhere.. Nice if there were more, in addition to other image qualities.

There is little love for poser at most higher end websites/forums. Once you enter that group, you will likely take some heat of you use Poser, & likely work on teams with modellers, etc. . Poser users tend to be hobbyist.

I don't agree with such discrimination. I see few models as good or better than Poser/Daz models IMO- of course professionals do awesome work- but they get the most quality from their creations & could do equally awesome work with Poser models. The Poser/Daz libraries of poses, props, clothing in Poser/Daz is mind boggling. Seems saving all that trouble modelling would free users to greater things.

Render times for photorealism is torture- & there are so many other time consuming aspects of 3D.  I see Vray 2.0 is using gpu power now. Hope to use this soon.

Pack

Apart from ShawnDriscoll & patzoriley I think you have all missed the point!

• I'm not saying art here is not art. (That would be silly)

• I'm not saying pin-ups are the only thing worth doing. (That would be silly)

• I'm not saying the quest for photo-realism is the only thing Rendo should be here for. (That would be silly)

I AM saying I thought there were more frequent cases of photorealistic art previously (photorealism being the hardest to achieve in my view; anyone can knock out a crap cartoon or collage and call it art; and if you think the poser gallery has precious few examples of basic V3 with no decent lighting, think again!). So if photorealism is dwindling then the artists must BE somewhere. And I was really looking for example places where they might BE. I'd have thought at least one person would've suggested Deviantart! There must be other communities I can google...

Anyway, I looked through 15 pages of the most recent Poser gallery, and only two items were really worth the mention for CG excellence in terms of realism (which in this case is what I'm after): Bagginsbill's Dreaming in 3d and Lorraine's Tachi. Both are excellent, but Lorraine's the only one of those two who posts regularly, and Tachi is her best work yet.

...which means there's precious little realism bounding about. Whereas a year or two ago there was surely more..?

Or perhaps I'm mistaken. Perhaps realism does come round in small doses, and those who achieve it tend to sublime off to Corporate jobs, as ShawnDriscoll suggests. Would be a shame.

Hmm, PN, I notice that in your favorites you've got some pictures from Gizmee, Zorglube, Chimera, and RajdArge... all fantastic artists in my book, and all still posting. While there are a few of our favorites who may have moved on, I tend to think theres still plenty of folks posting work thats worth checking out (and that I'm trying to learn from too ^_^). 

Don't you agree?

You do realize that the image in your first link wasn't rendered in Poser at all? It's a 3dMax render with the Girl.  Anyway, you might check over at Deviant Art. I've been posting over there for two reasons. The first is the option to have a watermark added to image on upload (a feature that I wish Rendo's gallery had), and that you can sell prints of your work, though I haven't sold one yet, so it's not a very strong second reason.

There is another reason for kissing goodbye to Renderosity galleries: here galleries are application-centric (understandable, this is an e-commerce site and everything is devised to foster content sales) while on DeviantArt galleries are artist-centric so your works are held together, regardless of the application/s used to create them.

Quote - I AM saying I thought there were more frequent cases of photorealistic art previously (photorealism being the hardest to achieve in my view; anyone can knock out a crap cartoon or collage and call it art; and if you think the poser gallery has precious few examples of basic V3 with no decent lighting, think again!).

Years ago there were books that had CG Poser type art in them (like gallery books of a sort).  The art was very good.  I don't know if those artists were ever Rendo members though.  They were using 3DS Max to render in with Mray or Vray thrown in.  I do have a couple Poser gallery books and the art looks like it was rendered in Poser with default lights almost.  But $9 for the books.

Art books and artists I prefer to look for are Poser figures that have been painted over in Painter or Photoshop.  The Poser figures were used as a guide.

Ugh. Remember the old song "Video Killed the Radio Star"? Photorealism, IMHO, has killed a lot of developing artists. You get bogged down in the science and math, just to find out it isn't Vahalla, or give up attempting perfection. What are we going for,  'Wow, great render settings'?

As for those who achieve photo-realism going on to better jobs... think about what you see on tv and in movie theaters. Car commercials are about the only place true photo-realism is standard. Sci-Fi movies mix it with live action. Pixar blends it with a more traditional animation style. Blade Runner, to me anyway, is still the standard for balancing realism and artistic vision.

I'm not anti-realism, I just think it's overrated. It can be downright boring.

"Photorealism" might be boring if you're just dragging content into a scene and clicking render.  The pros are creating their content from scratch.  So photorealism is probably a more interesting goal for them.

For instance, which cars are real and which are only photoreal in this scene? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDqfmEd4fQ8

Check Alex Roman site and his Vimeo channel; in particular, have a look at the short and at the making of.

This is photorealism, the kind of stuff which makes people gasp on CGForums.

Quote - "Photorealism" might be boring if you're just dragging content into a scene and clicking render.  The pros are creating their content from scratch.  So photorealism is probably a more interesting goal for them.

For instance, which cars are real and which are only photoreal in this scene? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDqfmEd4fQ8

I'm the one who's ranted for years about hitting the render button too soon? Hello? The one who will spend months on one simple image? The person who feels guilty for not making every last object in a scene, and lists everything not my own? Who can't even use a shader preset without rebuilding it?  (And hates my latest image because there are too many imported objects.)

The boredom is in the final product. As in: would have been a heck of a lot faster and better with a camera.

This, of course, is just my opinion. Photo-real can be impressive. I just find renders that concentrate on content leave a more lasting impression.

2005-2007 was an exciting time. The Poser programmers were right here listening and trying to solve issues. A lot of that was trying to produce realistic results with Poser and just make it a better prog. It was cheap and full of promise after P6 came out. A lot of smart people poured thousands of hours into free development. It was challenging. They put up some amazing renders for the time. I knew a few of them. They moved on. No single reason... it was just a nice hotspot in Rendo history.

Quote - The boredom is in the final product. As in: would have been a heck of a lot faster and better with a camera. This, of course, is just my opinion. Photo-real can be impressive. I just find renders that concentrate on content leave a more lasting impression.

If I had a camera with me at the right place at the right time, then sure I wouldn't need to have set up the scene on a computer to render it.  But part of photorealness is that one does not have all those real objects handy and the location to photograph them in.  Fantasy scenes can be photoreal.  It's rarely done though.  Which is why we all go WOW! when we do see one posted on the world wide web.

To me, playing with early Poser and getting that Poser look for ages and ages, I found growing past that was such a relief. I wasn't looking for real people... I just wanted to get away from these horrid looking plastic things. And then, came skin. Wow. And lights. Wow-wow. And shadows. Triple-wow.

With each discovery came another dimension of possibilities. Of course, we can get real picky and say it's not a photograph, but jeez, really, isn't that more the arena of trompe-l'oeil. We aren't trying to fool people into thinking we've re-created reality. We just want the art to not scream "Oh, btw, I made this in POSER!!!!" I don't mind the whisper, the huint, just not the scream. That in itself makes the effort worth it.

"If I had a camera with me at the right place at the right time, then sure I wouldn't need to have set up the scene on a computer to render it.  But part of photorealness is that one does not have all those real objects handy and the location to photograph them in.  Fantasy scenes can be photoreal.  It's rarely done though.  Which is why we all go WOW! when we do see one posted on the world wide web."

I agree
I dont really understand the whole
"Why not just photograph it "
Mantra.
If it is Arch Vis or product visualization
the "Live" or Physical version of the items in the scene typically Dont exist yet and cannot be photographed with a camera
and in the area of "fantasy" many of the subjects
Will Never Exist (in this world at least)
So We often would like to see a "photorealistic"
representation of what we can Imagine

http://www.coroflot.com/anabran/3d-illustration/5

http://www.coroflot.com/anabran/3d-illustration/32

http://www.coroflot.com/anabran/3d-illustration/12

Cheers

I didn't mean actually go out and photograph it, I meant that's what I think after the image renders. It's probably due to the fact that I personally need to take another step in the progression, and figure out how to render what's not physically there. You know, mood, overall feeling... ambience... whatever that intangible thing is. Very, very good arch-viz guys can do it. Fantasy artists depend on it. I can see it, but not create it.

Quote - I didn't mean actually go out and photograph it, I meant that's what I think after the image renders. It's probably due to the fact that I personally need to take another step in the progression, and figure out how to render what's not physically there. You know, mood, overall feeling... ambience... whatever that intangible thing is. Very, very good arch-viz guys can do it. Fantasy artists depend on it. I can see it, but not create it.

Yes, Photoshop does wonders to a photoreal render.  Just like it does wonders to an ordinary photograph.

And then some of us just don't want to do photo realism as our chosen artform. :)  While I admire a good piece of photo realism, as a collector it's just not my taste in art :) and I won't be putting it on my walls.  But that's just me :)

So while I might agree that there isn't as much as there once was, I can't agree that it means that all of the higher end Poser artists have gone somewhere else, nor do I believe that it means that the "best artists" have moved onto somewhere else.  That's a pretty big insult to a whole lotta talented artists that are still here.

Just sayin'.

Not talking about higher-end users.  Talking about the pros.

I was actually addressing the OP :) on those points :)

Ok.  Anyway, everyday there seems to be someone here that manages to push their art gallery quality to epic-ness.  Hopefully, they will stay here awhile longer.  Poser is what feeds Renderosity, afterall.

Quote - http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/browse.php?user_id=11343

......etc.

dont write me off yet, im still here :P

Quote - > Quote - http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/browse.php?user_id=11343

......etc.

 

dont write me off yet, im still here :P

Glad to hear it! :biggrin:

Quote - Wait.... so in order to be considered great on here, I have to do a pin up?

No. That's just a happy coincidence you'll find in my faves! I get just as much inspiration from the likes of Teyon, Eferrier etc. Who, by the way, don't seem to be around anymore... case in point.

Quote - ...Or better yet, as wolf suggested, post your own.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2156740

What can I say... I'm still learning; hence wanting to know where the best renderers have gone!!!

Not a dig at Galleries.. but I know that I stopped posting and removed all I could, after I found my art used on sites with no credit (worse was selling the image printed on a T-shirt) Not sure they got any sales, but it was sort of eye opening.. . stopped me cold from posting Gallery images. I have one for clients to view, mail them the link depending on the project. No sense in showing them Pin Ups or Fantasy Art if they want Sci Fi or Animals.

Quote - ...selling the image printed on a T-shirt.

OUCH!

Yeah I googled my username and found Xhime had reproduced my stuff with their logo on it! Cheeky monkeys. But then, I've got loads of stuff through filesharing* etc, so I can't really complain.

*legally, of course...