Quote - I have no connection to SM or anyone who is working on anything SM is developing. 

The idea that they have someone developing a figure is great, but at the same time it kind'a makes me wonder if I'm wasting my time. I don't have the resources that SM has, to put into a project of that scope in a way that would be deliverable in a timely or consistent manner. That's not to say I can't develop a professional figure that would be comparable or competitive, I'm just saying I can't do it as quickly and completely as they could. 

So I don't know. I'm developing Lucas, and a female counterpart for him. I have my own ideas of how to go about it. How similar they will be in comparison to anything SM releases, I have no idea about at this point, but if they're too similar then it will be kind'a pointless for me to continue with it. I guess that's just something we'll all have to wait and see, which project gets completed and released first. 

 

~Shane

I feel, as an occassional end user and full time content creator, that you shouldn't let that stop you from creating content.  We recognize that one of the biggest reasons for Poser's success is the support of the community in creating new content.  If you feel you have a character that will do well, release him/her/it.  If you're worried about having time to follow it up with another figure, simply make sure that before you release, you get a few people to agree to make clothing items for the character to be ready on release and at least one person to agree to make a character morph. The rest of the creators, if word of mouth is positive, will jump on board and you should be able to spend the time you need making the new character while the old one is carried on by others.  The most important thing you can do for a character you make though, is to support it. Wether that means come out with new morph packs 3 to 6 months later or get a bunch of people to make clothing for it or textures, that's up to you.   

Anyway, I look forward to what you release and I hope it does really well.

Edit: and YES! If you can get PhilC to support the character in Wardrobe Wizard, all the better, as that will extend the life of the character.

Well SM said that they were looking to work with an artist on this product, there was never any confirmation that they had actually found anyone or if there was any actual figure in production.  It was all sort of vague and nebulous--so I certainly wouldn't let that discorage you Shane, in fact if they see what you're doing and like it they may approach you about doing something for them. 

Once upon a time in the distant Poser past there was a male figure called Apollo Maximus who caused quite a stir.  I don't remember what company owned Poser then, but they had tried to adopt Apollo Maximus into their 3D human figure family and he would  have been a good addition too if the deal hadn't fallen through.  Now Apollo is a  has been.  I won't believe anything in until I see some threads where SM is actually previewing somthing tangible.  M5 just came out and this would have been a good time to unviel something exciting for Poser in the works--but the ship has sailed on that.

I really think there is a market for unique and good looking Poser figures outside of what Daz is producing--please don't let anything I've said discourage anyone.

Quote - M5 just came out and this would have been a good time to unviel something exciting for Poser in the works--but the ship has sailed on that.

See, I disagree with this compleely because it sets up a false dichotomy.  Just because Company A does something doesn't mean Company B has to respond.

That's exactly how you end up with inferior products.

The problem with new figures is not entirely the quality of the figure itself (though there have been a number of not so great quality figures released over the years), the problem is more with product support.

If a figure is not going to get mass support from the product makers, then no matter how good it is, it will never be able to achieve any impact on the market. Thats the simple fact of it.

As much as I am dissappointed that the new figure from DAZ does not work in poser, the simple fact that it is sold at daz and has somewhat dedicated support from PA's, that will ensure that it will still be around for the long haul (plus you can really do so much with it..it is kinda mind blowing).

Apollo did have some really serious support when it came out, and was very close to becoming a potential competion to DAZ figures of the time. But its creator kind of sabotaged things by alienating a number of his supporters with his volitile attitude.
But that is the closest we have come to seeing any potentially strong competition to the DAZ figures.

I personally think that m4 and v4 still stand up well in poser, and have proven themselves to have alot of support among product creators. So because of that support, I think they will still continue to a dominant figure in the poser community in a way that any new figure would not be able to live up to.

It's the support that makes or breaks a figures success in the market.

Yes I agree about the support, there have been some really good figures that had come out and there was practically nothing made for them--for instance I've been dissapointed with the stuff available for Antonia Polygon and I think that she is a nice figure and I'm not fond of Wardrobe Wizarding.

My point has been if people are not happy with the content made for Poser they will go to Daz Studio eventually and Poser will loose it's support.   I really think to maintain interest in Poser there needs to be needs to be alternative content created to keep people interested.  Perhaps people aren't tired of V4/M4 currently--but they will get tied of them even with new morphs and dresses and the rest of it.

So I must beg to differ, if Company A has the hot new human figures, and Company B has the same old, same old--customers will eventually loose interest in anything that Company B does.  That's the nature of competition and why people go out and buy new and exciting things because they get bored with the old things.  It not like Smith Micro didn't know that a new generation of Daz figures was coming out and that Poser wasn't going to support them.  It could have been a priority to have a new batch of humans ready with the release of Poser 8/Pro 2012.

I'm familiar with Apollo. I'm not familiar with how or why his creator abandoned the project or how he alienated his supporters. I wasn't around much just after Apollo released. I could see his potential though. 

I'll leave the details of Lucas to his own thread. May should bring a lot more info about him as the month progresses.  

~Shane

The creator of Apollo  had an axe to grind and felt that people were stealing his unique figure design and things just escalated from there.  There was another male figure called Clark that Anton said was a variation of Apollo's mesh--which the creator denied and said Clark was an all new mesh,  and I think it ended in  some sort of alienating legal battle.   Certain content creators supported Clark and became anti-Apollo.  In the end Clark ended up being killed and Apollo eventually became free with the 2nd generation release (Apollo 2007)--there was actually some new stuff that came out for Apollo at that time.  Then there was a 3rd Generation version of Apollo that was supposed to be released when another issue of some sort of digital plagerism came up.  It's all a very confusing sad tale.

Quote - So I must beg to differ, if Company A has the hot new human figures, and Company B has the same old, same old--customers will eventually loose interest in anything that Company B does.  That's the nature of competition and why people go out and buy new and exciting things because they get bored with the old things.  It not like Smith Micro didn't know that a new generation of Daz figures was coming out and that Poser wasn't going to support them.  It could have been a priority to have a new batch of humans ready with the release of Poser 8/Pro 2012.

I think these very forums prove this untrue.  Customer support is first to the software of choice and SECOND to the figures available.  If you have any doubt, see the current Poser|DS split.

If your premise were true, DAZ wouldn't have to give away DS hoping more Poser users will move away from their chosen software.

lol wow. Drama drama drama. (que brady bunch theme)

I remember the drama over Renda, but somehow I missed all that about Apollo, and I don't even think I've seen a Clark. And i was around in 07. Err, at least in the early part of it. 

~Shane

Quote - I think these very forums prove this untrue.  Customer support is first to the software of choice and SECOND to the figures available.  If you have any doubt, see the current Poser|DS split.

If your premise were true, DAZ wouldn't have to give away DS hoping more Poser users will move away from their chosen software.

Actually the forums dont "prove" anything. The amount of people who participate in forums does not come close to the number of actuall customers.

It could (very easily) be argued that the only reason poser continured to grow as a product has been because of the support of DAZ and DAZ's figures. If people were to rely on the figures that came with poser, then back around poser 4 things would have rapidly begon to die off. It is Michael and Vicky that kept things alive. They are where the innovations came and helped to push poser forward into becoming the viable piece of art software that it has become.

It will be interesting to see how far they can grow without adopting the new innovations that were introduced with genesis. I do hope that they do grow, because I really like poser and the poser / daz relationship have proven beneficial for both companies. However with all the different owners of poser, I am afraid it was not given enough focus to really help move things forward...So daz really had no other choice but to out-grow what poser offered.

I think it was very generous to help encourage poser users to be able to more easily adopt the new technology by giving it away free. It's not a sign of desperation, but a sign that shows how much they really do care about this community and want to make sure that people have as much of an opportunity as they can provide to be able to use the new fun toys.

I really do not like the split (and the fact that many people want to make the split seem worse than it is)..but it will be interesting to see how things will grow on either side. Hopefully they both will continue to grow. But I do question some of the decisions made on either side.

Rawn

Quote - > Quote - I think these very forums prove this untrue.  Customer support is first to the software of choice and SECOND to the figures available.  If you have any doubt, see the current Poser|DS split.

If your premise were true, DAZ wouldn't have to give away DS hoping more Poser users will move away from their chosen software.

 

Actually the forums dont "prove" anything. The amount of people who participate in forums does not come close to the number of actuall customers.

It could (very easily) be argued that the only reason poser continured to grow as a product has been because of the support of DAZ and DAZ's figures. If people were to rely on the figures that came with poser, then back around poser 4 things would have rapidly begon to die off. It is Michael and Vicky that kept things alive. They are where the innovations came and helped to push poser forward into becoming the viable piece of art software that it has become.

It will be interesting to see how far they can grow without adopting the new innovations that were introduced with genesis. I do hope that they do grow, because I really like poser and the poser / daz relationship have proven beneficial for both companies. However with all the different owners of poser, I am afraid it was not given enough focus to really help move things forward...So daz really had no other choice but to out-grow what poser offered.

I think it was very generous to help encourage poser users to be able to more easily adopt the new technology by giving it away free. It's not a sign of desperation, but a sign that shows how much they really do care about this community and want to make sure that people have as much of an opportunity as they can provide to be able to use the new fun toys.

I really do not like the split (and the fact that many people want to make the split seem worse than it is)..but it will be interesting to see how things will grow on either side. Hopefully they both will continue to grow. But I do question some of the decisions made on either side.

 

Rawn

ROFL, OK......so DAZ is giving away DS for alutristic purposes.  Ummm, if you say so.

At any rate, I'd say the results are already obvious.  One only has to look at the support forums at DAZ to discover that there is simply no increase in users asking for help with a software package with no written documentation.

What we're seeing is Poser users doing what Poser users did before DAZ - innovate.  (In fact, it was Poser users being innovative which CREATED DAZ, now wasn't it?) I wish every one of them well.

Quote - > Quote - I think these very forums prove this untrue.  Customer support is first to the software of choice and SECOND to the figures available.  If you have any doubt, see the current Poser|DS split.

If your premise were true, DAZ wouldn't have to give away DS hoping more Poser users will move away from their chosen software.

It could (very easily) be argued that the only reason poser continured to grow as a product has been because of the support of DAZ and DAZ's figures. If people were to rely on the figures that came with poser, then back around poser 4 things would have rapidly begon to die off. It is Michael and Vicky that kept things alive. They are where the innovations came and helped to push poser forward into becoming the viable piece of art software that it has become.

It will be interesting to see how far they can grow without adopting the new innovations that were introduced with genesis. I do hope that they do grow, because I really like poser and the poser / daz relationship have proven beneficial for both companies. However with all the different owners of poser, I am afraid it was not given enough focus to really help move things forward...So daz really had no other choice but to out-grow what poser offered.

I think it was very generous to help encourage poser users to be able to more easily adopt the new technology by giving it away free. It's not a sign of desperation, but a sign that shows how much they really do care about this community and want to make sure that people have as much of an opportunity as they can provide to be able to use the new fun toys.

I really do not like the split (and the fact that many people want to make the split seem worse than it is)..but it will be interesting to see how things will grow on either side. Hopefully they both will continue to grow. But I do question some of the decisions made on either side.

 

Rawn

As an artist, this kind of thought process irritates me. Its even actually kind of insulting.

I think I'm just going to leave this one alone.

~Shane

Quote - ROFL, OK......so DAZ is giving away DS for alutristic purposes.  Ummm, if you say so.

At any rate, I'd say the results are already obvious.  One only has to look at the support forums at DAZ to discover that there is simply no increase in users asking for help with a software package with no written documentation.

What we're seeing is Poser users doing what Poser users did before DAZ - innovate.  I wish every one of them well.

Laughing at my point does not add any validity to your argument. It's just kind of rude.

I know for a fact that the number of d/s users are growing steadily (my personal sales figures are proof of that). I am unsure if the same can be said for poser users.

I never said that giving away d/s was altruistic, they are a company afterall and have to make some money. But you cannot deny that giving away a program they have worked so long and hard on is a generous thing. You don't get rich giving things away. What you do with giving things away is to try to keep the market as content as possible. Unfortunatly there will always be those out there who will never be content with things no matter what any company does.

However the point still stands....without content, neither of these softwares will grow. It is that support that gives them the life they need. That is what I hope to see continue to grow no matter what direction either company takes.

Rawn

Quote - As an artist, this kind of thought process irritates me. Its even actually kind of insulting.

I think I'm just going to leave this one alone.

 

~Shane

Why would you find this insulting?

Rawn

i need new nicely bending men.  ... or an articulating hentai tentacle monster

I know for a fact that the number of d/s users are growing steadily (my personal sales figures are proof of that). I am unsure if the same can be said for poser users.

Now lets look at that point.

A company that is doing lots of Genesis products and less of Poser products, will see a difference in the sales of those items.

So, lets see, a company suddenly drops the amount of Poser items. They then see less sales from those Poser items.

They think to themsleves, no need to make Poser items as they are not selling.

So, the increase in Genesis items goes up, the amount of Poser items become less.

The PA's then have to go the way of Genesis at a certain store, otherwise they don't make money from that store.

In the meantime, other PA's move their stores because they do not want to go the Genesis way and go on to make money at other stores.

Whicheveer male figure you use and in whatever softwarre you use, YOU have the power. If you don't like what they are doing, you take your money elsewhere.

There are other stores out there, and they are all happy to take your money.

Support will always be there for whatever software you use as users will make things, wether for free or for sale.

Making things is not as hard as some of the PA's try to make out.

In the end it is down to learning to do things for yoruself if you want support for certain figures.

Take the step, learn to do what you want, then you make the money!

All the best.

LROG

It could also be said that Genesis is a step backwards. 

Personally I'm kind of glad DAZ has done what it's done. 

I think in the long run it will only serve to benefit Poser and finally move it more towards the direction that it should have been going all along. 

~Shane

Quote - It could also be said that Genesis is a step backwards. 

Personally I'm kind of glad DAZ has done what it's done. 

I think in the long run it will only serve to benefit Poser and finally move it more towards the direction that it should have been going all along. 

 

~Shane

Agreed. 

Quote - lol wow. Drama drama drama. (que brady bunch theme)

I remember the drama over Renda, but somehow I missed all that about Apollo, and I don't even think I've seen a Clark. And i was around in 07. Err, at least in the early part of it. 

 

~Shane

It was just ur typical, he said/she said foot shooting contest ;).

Laurie

Shit people, can we NOT make this a fucking Daz/Poser thing? Again??

Laurie

Quote - i need new nicely bending men.  ... or an articulating hentai tentacle monster

So do I, Misty... So do I...

~Shane

Quote - > Quote - lol wow. Drama drama drama. (que brady bunch theme)

I remember the drama over Renda, but somehow I missed all that about Apollo, and I don't even think I've seen a Clark. And i was around in 07. Err, at least in the early part of it. 

 

~Shane

It was just ur typical, he said/she said foot shooting contest ;).

Laurie

Actually it was more of a he said/he said and I never hit my foot when I shot.....

ED... I'm with you. I'm still waiting for a Genesis render that looks as good as a Poser V4 render. I think this is the poinbt that has gotten overlooked in the mad waves of Daz vs Poser rhetoric.

That is my opinion as an artist, not as the moderator. It is one of the reasons why I still use Poser as opposed to Daz Studio.

Now, can we please put all of this to bed and get back to figuring out how to make the Poser landscape better?

Quote - It could also be said that Genesis is a step backwards. 

Personally I'm kind of glad DAZ has done what it's done. 

I think in the long run it will only serve to benefit Poser and finally move it more towards the direction that it should have been going all along. 

~Shane

As I mentioned, I only got back into this CG stuff when Poser 9 came out...

At that point I compared Carrara and Poser... Carrara being the product that I got the impression that Daz might want to continue to invest in long term... I got the feeling that, who knows, they might want to eventually shift their user-base towards versions of that in due course and phase out the other software offerings perhaps, as the functionality of those... Daz Studio, Hexagon and Bryce... is all apparently duplicated within Carrara?

The dynamics, in terms of approximate equivalents to what Poser has, are all within Carrara, are they not??

This is just the impression I formed as an outsider, of course, so by no means is it necessarily even vaguely correct or accurate...

Carrara looks like a very good product too of course. It obviously does a lot more, in one package, than Poser, on the face of it.

But I went with Poser initially because Vue integrates natively with Poser's SDK, and I knew I wanted Vue... but also I perceived that it seemed to have slightly better, and growing support, via third-party plug-ins, for Blender... and gradually improving collada support etc... Poser seems to me to want to just focus on what it does and to let other software, by other providers do the rest.

I think that is a good thing.

I certainly wouldn't rule out looking at Carrara again... but, at the moment, probably, I'm more likely to spend that kind of money on ZBrush now... if I was going to go on another little spree.

I'm very happy with the investment I made in Poser and with the existing content too. But I'd also like to see more, new figures, that take advantage of the latest Poser capabilities.

So the impending release of a new Miki, your exciting project, ExistentialDisorder, and the promise of new figures from SM is all fantastic news to me ;-)

Quote - ED... I'm with you. I'm still waiting for a Genesis render that looks as good as a Poser V4 render. I think this is the poinbt that has gotten overlooked in the mad waves of Daz vs Poser rhetoric.

That is my opinion as an artist, not as the moderator. It is one of the reasons why I still use Poser as opposed to Daz Studio.

Now, can we please put all of this to bed and get back to figuring out how to make the Poser landscape better?

Yeah, that's why I try to stay out of those discussions as much as possible. Seems some people just won't let it rest tho. 

~Shane

Monkey - I would assume so, possibly, but I have never used Cararra and have no reason or intention to ever do so at this point, so I can't tell you the first thing about it. 

I was trained on Maya and ZBrush, and that's what I use, combined with CS4 and Blender. I don't really need anything else, so learning other software would be kind of redundant for me. 

~Shane

Quote - Monkey - I would assume so, possibly, but I have never used Cararra and have no reason or intention to ever do so at this point, so I can't tell you the first thing about it. 

I was trained on Maya and ZBrush, and that's what I use, combined with CS4 and Blender. I don't really need anything else, so learning other software would be kind of redundant for me. 

~Shane

As a pure hobbyist, I could never, at present justify the cost of Maya or 3DS Max unfortunately... my wife would probably never speak to me again.

Blender is likely my resort along those lines I suspect... and seems to do more than I could ever hope to use or get to grips with anyway and, with the open source community support it has, it seems to be growing into a better and better solution all the time.

At present I'm modelling in Hexagon... which, actually, I think is very good. Having downloaded it as a freebie, I would probably be prepared to pay a little money for a future release of it... if that ever happens ;-) 

ZBrush... is probably a negotiable purchase, in due course, if I agree to sell a drumkit... LOL ;-)

I have Carrara (6, 7 and 8) and hate, hate, hate it.  It's not a modeler, it's not a render engine and it's not a scene setup program.  It does it all very badly.

It will never successfully replace Poser or DazStudio.

Quote - At present I'm modelling in Hexagon... which, actually, I think is very good. Having downloaded it as a freebie, I would probably be prepared to pay a little money for a future release of it... if that ever happens ;-) 

I paid $1.60 for mine. Worth every penny. Don't hold your breath for a future update or version tho...I'm fairly sure Daz will kill it, let it rot or sell it ;). Heck, it took years just for them to release a bug fix.

Laurie

Quote - > Quote - At present I'm modelling in Hexagon... which, actually, I think is very good. Having downloaded it as a freebie, I would probably be prepared to pay a little money for a future release of it... if that ever happens ;-) 

I paid $1.60 for mine. Worth every penny. Don't hold your breath for a future update or version tho...I'm fairly sure Daz will kill it, let it rot or sell it ;). Heck, it took years just for them to release a bug fix.

Laurie

LOL... yeah, I was pretty disappointed to find that the free version of Bryce, that I got along with Hexagon, just crashes on launch under OS X Lion... and from what I've subsequently read, there's no fix in sight for this issue. Really, it serves me right probably for running an up to date OS.

I remember having a version of Bryce back about 1998... and it was pretty good for the time back then.

But since I have Vue already, I got over this problem pretty quickly...

;-)

OMG...if you have Vue, using Bryce is like going back to hammers and chisels...lmao. Bryce hasn't been up to snuff since Vue 3 came out giggle

Laurie

Although I agree that figure support is important - the quality of the figure is also very important.  Apollo could look like lots of different types of people but unfortunately he always looked a bit puffy and lacking in any subcutaneous definition.  Also his back was aweful and Anton said he checked the galleries and hardly anyone rendered from the back.  still you wouldn't want apollo as a main character in a comic if you couldn't sometimes render him from behind.  And I don't like puffy.

Love esther

Quote - OMG...if you have Vue, using Bryce is like going back to hammers and chisels...lmao. Bryce hasn't been up to snuff since Vue 3 came out giggle

Laurie

Well, funny you should say that Laurie... cos I originally learnt to sculpt with a hammer and a chisel.

I was terminally bad at it... it took me three weeks to make a dodgy looking stone horse's head... and it kills your wrists.

Oh wait... this is actually sounding not unlike my efforts to date in Hexagon. LOL ;-)

Quote - Although I agree that figure support is important - the quality of the figure is also very important.  Apollo could look like lots of different types of people but unfortunately he always looked a bit puffy and lacking in any subcutaneous definition.  Also his back was aweful and Anton said he checked the galleries and hardly anyone rendered from the back.  still you wouldn't want apollo as a main character in a comic if you couldn't sometimes render him from behind.  And I don't like puffy.

Love esther

Yep...I totally agree that figure quality is important too. That should go without saying. A crappy figure will be hard to support, and as such would not get much support and would die a natural death as well.

Unfortunatly having a quality well crafted figure may not always be enough either. Believe me...I look at pretty well every new figure released to see if it is something I would be interested in supporting.
I love playing with new innovations.

(and I also agree about apollo and the lack of back definition, and puffyness)

well when we see a really great figure I think it will get support.

But yes, hype and readymade stuff would be a plus.

Love esther

Quote - It could also be said that Genesis is a step backwards. 

Personally I'm kind of glad DAZ has done what it's done. 

I think in the long run it will only serve to benefit Poser and finally move it more towards the direction that it should have been going all along. 

 

~Shane

Too right.

If Daz hadn't come up with Genesis I might never have bought Poser instead! :D

The Apollo mesh does not attempt to define any of the back muscles. I'm not sure why. On the other hand, this mesh probably goes too far in that direction.

which is "this".  It looks pretty good to me so far.

Love esther

"On the other hand, this mesh probably goes too far in that direction."

Not at all. I'd really love to have a mesh that could give me a proper emacicated or even anorexic body shape with all the bones "properly" sticking out without the need of displacement maps.

Big boobs and musclular studs are no problem given most meshes, but try to show someone skinny and you're SOL.

Free advice and worth every penny. SM should set up a separate content creation arm -  give it a unique brand. Hire some of the talented people here full time, and give them freedom to create and compete -  free of any bureaucratic obstacles that may have contributed to hit or miss results in the past. You need some cooperation of the general direction and to make sure that the results suit the application, but IMO, you really need to adopt more of the DAZ model, rather than rely on scattered efforts. DAZ didn't succeed soley n(or some would say even mainly) based on the quality of their product. They had a business plan and they worked it, Art and passion are all well and good but if you're talking getting large numbers of people to part with their discretionary income, you need a solid business model, resources, and the singleminded determination to make it succeed over the long haul. A year from now will there be an ubiquitous set of Non DAZ Poser figures, or will folks be lamenting the fact that yet another marvelous new botique figure isn't getting any support or traction?

which is "this".  It looks pretty good to me so far.

*Thanks. It's my topology. We learn by doing.

The first generation Make Human mesh had a defined spine as well, but they dropped that in the second version.

I've thought the same thing Imckenzie.

Not really sure why SM doesn't have an official content creation team, but you'd think they would. I thought the G2 figures were from E-F/SM, but I'm guessing it was a 3rd party licensed thing. Maybe they do(have a content team) and we just don't hear about it?

I'm kind of under the impression that they prefer to leave the content creation up to the community though and just contract with various artists at different times.

~Shane

You know, to this day, I still have no idea who made the Poser 6 family of characters. Jessi, James, Ben & Kate must have creators out there somewhere. I know they weren't a lot of people's favorites, but I liked all four of them immensely even with their flaws.

I think they're the best looking in terms of anatomical accuracy. They are extremely poly heavy though, and in very odd areas, like teeth and gums. 

I seem to recall at least one of the kids had some missing polys in the mesh. I was trying to create a character for Ben at one point but stopped due to something with the mesh, I just can't remember exactly what it was now. 

It would have been nice to see that whole set revamped with fixes for a release in later versions of Poser, but who knows why it never happened. 

I never really got why the G2 characters all shared the same body just with different heads. Seems like that would have come in the form of morph sets instead of different geometry. 

Along those lines, I wonder if it makes more sense for kids to be a different mesh from adults, or share the same, at least from a gender-specific angle. 

~Shane

Did you ever check to see if Ben 2 from Poser 7 had the same missing polys? The reasoning behind the G2's sharing bodies that I know of was so they could share FBM's.

Quote - I've thought the same thing Imckenzie.

Not really sure why SM doesn't have an official content creation team, but you'd think they would. I thought the G2 figures were from E-F/SM, but I'm guessing it was a 3rd party licensed thing. Maybe they do(have a content team) and we just don't hear about it?

I'm kind of under the impression that they prefer to leave the content creation up to the community though and just contract with various artists at different times.

 

~Shane

SM is a software company, and poser is just one minor program in their catalog. So to build a dedicated content creation team would be a pretty major expense, for a relatively minor return. I say minor return because they are structured as a software company, not a content company, they would have to basically develop a seperate company just to produce the content, and in these times, I doubt companies have the financial resources to back something like that and "hope" the profits will roll in.

DAZ on the other hand was always structured as a content company, so the content making model worked well for them. Unfortunatly it could be argued that is why the software side always kind of fell short.It will be interesting to see how their current changes play out.

"Not really sure why SM doesn't have an official content creation team, but you'd think they would."

I would not think that..why would anyone think this??

You all seem to be forgetting that Smith Micro is NOT primarily a 3D Character&Content program company
their view of poser is not as narrow as the people in this "community"
Poser is just an asset they bought (probably very cheaply)

Go to:  http://www.smithmicro.com/
and tell me what you see:
Communications
Device management
content file management
Business solutions etc.
..oh and some "graphics program" (poser,anime studio)

Go to:  http://www.daz3d.com/
and what do you see:

Genesis Micheal 5 with a big green "buy now" button
DAZ studio pro with big blue "learn more' button
Links to their Forums where this content is discussed
links to their galleries where this content is showcased

Love them or hate them they have somewhat more of a focus on the things people here seem to care about,
"relatively attractive" looking  humanoid 3D figures and Content for those figures.

All this talk about Smith micro hiring some Dream team to Come up with some poser native super figure to challenge genesis is just wishfully thinking at best and pitiful self delusion at worst
...This will not happen.

Maybe its too early to call this one but IMHO posers weight mapping has been a bust.

A highly vocal Minority of techies bleeted for it for so long that it just became "fashionable" to wish list it when discussing what people wanted to see in the next version of poser.

Ask yourselves honestly what has WM really done for the average user experience.
 
I would love to be wrong on this but IMHO you will likely see a renovation of the "Ryan" mesh at best
and some new poser native "skin shader" options for him...thats about it.
 

Cheers

Quote -
Go to:  http://www.smithmicro.com/
and tell me what you see:
Communications
Device management
content file management

And this is where their money and budget is going. The company I work for just pushed into a new market using their video content solutions and they've been highly responsive in providing the extra functionality and resources to accomplish this (because their software wasn't originally designed for it) because they know it's a win for them as well. I simply don't see a bunch of money being thrown to get their content development up to speed with this has a MUCH broader reach.

"All this talk about Smith micro hiring some Dream team to Come up with some poser native super figure to challenge genesis is just wishfully thinking at best and pitiful self delusion at worst
...This will not happen.

Maybe its too early to call this one but IMHO posers weight mapping has been a bust.

A highly vocal Minority of techies bleeted for it for so long that it just became "fashionable" to wish list it when discussing what people wanted to see in the next version of poser.

Ask yourselves honestly what has WM really done for the average user experience.
** **
I would love to be wrong on this but IMHO you will likely see a renovation of the "Ryan" mesh at best
and some new poser native "skin shader" options for him...thats about it."

Couldn't have said it better.

I was against "weightmapping" from day one because while it indeed does allow you more "granularity" compared to falloff zones while rigging, it is nowhere close to the "magic bullet" it was constantly hyped as.

If you can't rig using falloff zones like 99% of Poser users, you still won't be able to rig using weightmaps.

If a mesh has anatomical and topological problems, weightmapping it doesn't make those problems go away.

And even if you can rig and you have an otherwise perfect mesh, you still need a tool to create proper JCMs because there is no way to properly rig the joints of a human mesh without JCMs.

(The ironic thing is, once you have a properly working tool to create JCMs, you actually don't need the extra granularity weighmapping allows you to have. The JCMs don't care if they have to fix a "50% perfect" or a "70% perfect" joint))

So, the time and effort to switch to weightmapping would have been much, much better spent on integrating ColorCurvaturs' JCM tool directly into Poser and to pay a professional figure artist to create a set of truly realistic human meshes with a proper set of official morphs that could rival the DAZ figures instead of just another bad rehash of badly made existing figures.

Or ideally to fully integrate Genesis.

As it is, weightmapping by itself, without an official set of figures of comparable quality to the DAZ products, is practically useless for the average user.

I only use it because I have 12 years experience in rigging Poser figures and because I already have all the other tools needed to rig.

Weightmapping has neither made JCMs nor good mesh topology obsolete. It's just another rigging tool that got ridiculously overhyped because PP 2012 has otherwise pretty little to show for.

LOL, 2 DAZ Genesis vendors in a thread about what direction Poser should take....

Hmmmm, what's wrong with this picture?