Before I start can I ask that no Merchant names are posted. if you do so then you are just being a troll and you plan is to get this posted blocked.

I have been thinking of posting something like this for some time. but after seeing the store today I could not let it go on any longer with saying something.

Merchants you have got to up your game. some of you are pissing in the wind if you think that the folks here are going to pay what your asking for your products.

some of you still think we are all using poser 5 (that or you are)

some is so over priced that I really cannot see anyone paying what your asking. get a grip and look around you.

I have seen models from film and TV shows for sale that are no better than free models you can get from well known site.

V4 characters that are no more than dial spinners and skins just a joke.

I am sick to deaf of seeing yet another slut wear outfit.

there are some very good model makers here, that sell very good value for money works. but some of the rest, its getting embarrassing to look at the market place.

The simple answer, and the only one that I see ever working is the one I use: Vote with your dollars. I buy things that I think I might use and that appear welldone. If I make a purchase and the item is not well done, I have no hesitation to write the vendor and ask for a refund, and I make sure I am a nuisance until they give me one. 

What's wrong with my plan? At least, it works well for me. I reward the merchant who makes things that are of benefit and I withold my dollars from those who do not. Simple.

the broker should weed out obviously bad stuff in testing. They are not though determinerws of style, taste or morality. In short the product sells or it goes away and that is as it should be.

Theres a big market for 'slutwear' although a lot of it starts to look the same.

Overpriced ? maybe although that is up to the purchaser.

overall I think it is good that new vendors get a chance to try their product out in the store and see how well its accepted.

Who will determine what is acceptable and what is not?

I rather leave the choice to the buyer. If it does not sell, it disappears.

And your remark about not wanting to see "slut wear" is your personal private opinion and has nothing to do what should and should not appear in the store. If the outfit is within the TOS and it sells better as a pair of sweaters - why would it not be allowed to sell it?

I don't like weapons and toons - but that does not mean I want the store to remove them.

Pricing is a complete different matter. If a simple item which costs 20 dollars and saves you 3 or 4 hours or more of time creating it, it is well worth the money. If a perfectly made magnificent piece of clothing costs 5 dollars and you never use it, it IS a waste of YOUR money. The price and cost should reflect a reasonable wage and profit, but I think in most cases it is way less than that.

Let the customer decide whether it is worth the cost or not - not some individual who has his or her own ideas of what it should be

Gotta agree with you about some prices. My take is make it really nice, include loads of stuff, make it good value and sell it as cheaply as the store rules will allow. Saw one model recently elsewhere at nearly 50 bucks and the quality was worse than a beginners freebie. So yea, definitely voting with the wallet there. Though do disagree a little about versions. My preference is maximum compatibility across apps. Which means bitmaps not shaders, but mapping carefully so an artist can easily replace things if they want to. As for slutwear, personally not my bag. Done the obligatory NITVWAS like most folks. Must admit I can't see the attraction of fantasizing over a few polys. But if that rocks someones boat, fair play to them. Each to their own.

For the most part, the Poser marketplace remains one of the most deflated on earth. It's too bad we don't have a "Helicopter Ben" to drop free money to prop it up. Occasionally a newb merchant with dreams of grandeur will set a Turbosquid price, but I'm sure reality soon teaches what is practical and what is not.

I hear you soultaker.  We still have folks making .rsr files - in 2012!  Getting vendors to leave Poser 5 and earlier behind is going to be very difficult.

Quote - Merchants you have got to up your game. 

Quite a sweeping statement there, chief. Have you ever put anything in the store? Have you even put something up as a freebie? Do you have any idea at all how much work is required to make a product, and how absurdly low the prices are for most poser stuff?

Take a look at stores like Evermotion and Dosch Design if you want to see what 3D stuff is worth in the real world. And much of that stuff is just textured models, it doesn't automatically plop itself into fancy runtimes with thumbnails or options or any of the frills Poser users have come to expect from a product.

Quote - some of you are pissing in the wind if you think that the folks here are going to pay what your asking for your products. ...

some is so over priced that I really cannot see anyone paying what your asking. get a grip and look around you.

Look around at what, exactly? A morphing sword and armored bikini set for V4 might sell hundreds and hundreds of times, so the artist might be satisfied asking a low price, and if there are lots of other sword and armored bikini sets to compete against, customers will only pay a low price. 

But some items just aren't going to sell a lot of copies, not because it's a bad product, but because the market for it is smaller (like anything for male figures, historically accurate stuff, etc). A merchant may put a higher price on an item that will only sell a handful of copies in its lifetime, I think that's fair.

Merchants are free to put whatever price they want on their products. If the price is too high for what it is, customers won't buy. If the product doesn't sell (because the price was too high, the quality too low, or the market for it just too limited), it gets removed from the marketplace. Why should it bother you?

Quote - some of you still think we are all using poser 5 (that or you are)

But some customers are still using poser 5, what's wrong with making a product that they can still use? It doesn't stop PP2012 users from using it. A product that's optimised for the latest version is nice, but then the P5-6-7-8 crowd can't use it.

Or do you want ALL the options covered (for your $5)?

Quote - V4 characters that are no more than dial spinners and skins just a joke.

If it's a nice-looking character and a customer wants it, who cares it's custom morphs or dials?

Every pose set out there is just 'dial spinners' but pose sets are useful and they still sell, don't they?

Quote - I am sick to deaf of seeing yet another slut wear outfit.

I don't like it any more than you do, but it's always in the "what's hot" bestsellers list, so clearly a lot of people like it and buy it. I doubt that merchants are going to stop making it anytime soon. And don't expect Rendo to stop pushing slutwear anytime soon, they take half the proceeds, so they love it as much as the customers apparently do.  Get used to it. 

If it weren't for slutwear and giant chesticles, there wouldn't be a poser market, cause the brokers couldn't afford to keep the place open long.

Just sayin.

~Shane

Let the buyers decide with their wallets.

Quote -Before I start can I ask that no Merchant names are posted. if you do so then you are just being a troll and you plan is to get this posted blocked.

I have been thinking of posting something like this for some time. but after seeing the store today I could not let it go on any longer with saying something.

Merchants you have got to up your game. some of you are pissing in the wind if you think that the folks here are going to pay what your asking for your products.

some of you still think we are all using poser 5 (that or you are)

some is so over priced that I really cannot see anyone paying what your asking. get a grip and look around you.

I have seen models from film and TV shows for sale that are no better than free models you can get from well known site.

V4 characters that are no more than dial spinners and skins just a joke.

I am sick to deaf of seeing yet another slut wear outfit.

there are some very good model makers here, that sell very good value for money works. but some of the rest, its getting embarrassing to look at the market place.

Have you seen the low end content that sells at turbo for 10 times more then Poser content
,that's 10 times easier to make then Poser content ?
We are very very lucky that CGI Artist are willing to make High End Poser content.
For a 10th of what's it worth.

When requests for lower prices come up, merchants often point to content made for high end apps and the prices professionals are willing to pay to use that content. There is one big difference. Most poser users are professionals. They are hobbyists. Most people can't afford to spend the pro prices on a hobby. I understand that merchants are wanting to make money (that should be a given otherwise they'd be freebies) and want to have some compensation for their time. I think few of us would truely argue it should be otherwise. I think the biggest problem is that some vendors price things like they want that compensation paid in full by each customer.

And to purchasers who are wanting increasingly lower prices, keep in mind (at least here) that Renderosity has a minimum list price set and they also take a share of that price so we can't expect to see a bunch of 50 cent items just because we'd like to. Vendors are trying to make money can buyers can expect them to to have the adittude of "We lose money on evey order but make up for it in volume." (if that statement made sense read it again)

PS please note I said things most, usually, few not all, always and never. There are exceptions to everything

Quote - ...giant chesticles...

:lol:

All merchatnts loose money in their sales.

How much would you have to pay for those items if they were based on a price per hour spent on the item?

Those merchants that take their time, beta test to extreme etc., spend quite a lot of that time making their products.

You may buy them for say $5.00.

They only get $2.50

Now if they have spent 5 hours on a product and charged just $2.00 an hour, that would be $10.00.

Now, NO one in their right mind is going to work for $2.00 an hour on high end products.

Yes, prices are high on certain things, but we know the difference in how much work has gone into it, just by looking at it.

If somethig looks badly done, then you are not going to spend money on it, at least I don't.

In the end you are not only buying the product, but the talant or lack of the artist.

An example would be:-

Your friend takes photos at weddings as a hobby, but they don't have the experience or expertise of a proper professional photographer.

Would you pay a small amount for pics with heads cut off etc. for your wedding pics. or would you pay a professional and get the results you want?

Merchants, make what you want and put it in the store, you will find your level in the marketplace.

Those buying, check out the item, do you really need it? Will it only be used once?  Is it value for money? etc.

All the best.

LROG

If V4 has chesticles, does M4 roast his chestnuts by an open fire????? LOL.

All the best.

LROG

Quote - When requests for lower prices come up, merchants often point to content made for high end apps and the prices professionals are willing to pay to use that content. There is one big difference. Most poser users are professionals. They are hobbyists. Most people can't afford to spend the pro prices on a hobby. 

I think you meant to say "Most poser users aren't professionals."

But that's what is so crazy about poser content pricing. In the real world the hobbiest buys the cheaper, more limited hobby version of the product (whether it's a power drill or software or whatever) and the professional user buys the pro version which costs more because it is usually far superior in every respect.

But in the world of poser, hobby users expect their content with pro features at less-than-hobby price. A pro user buying, say, a hospital room model for $150 expects to have to do some work on it to get exactly what they need. It's just a textured model, so they might have to replace some textures on some parts or adjust textures in photoshop, even re-UVmap some parts, select some parts and move them around, scale them, add some detail to the model here and there, make morphs and so on.

But most poser users can't do any of that stuff for themselves, they want it already done for them with presets and options and neat little dials and pose files to do it automatically. We had someone complaining the other day that doors in some ready-made room scenes don't open. The guys who pay $150 for a room don't complain about that, but the guys who pay $15 for a room do. 

My point is that if we followed real-world patterns here in poser land you'd pay $150 for the pro version of the content if you wanted all the features, the thumbnails, the tidy installation into your runtime, all the nice textures, all the morphs, preset pose files to turn things on and off, rigged so everything opens and closes, etc, etc. 

And then there would be the hobby price of $15 where you get the mesh, (just an obj file, UVmapped and with material zones if you're lucky) with no textures or morphs or any frills at all. Hey, if you're a penniless hobby user you have time on your hands to do all that other stuff yourself, right? 

Quote - All merchatnts loose money in their sales. How much would you have to pay for those items if they were based on a price per hour spent on the item?

Those merchants that take their time, beta test to extreme etc., spend quite a lot of that time making their products.

You may buy them for say $5.00.

They only get $2.50

Now if they have spent 5 hours on a product and charged just $2.00 an hour, that would be $10.00....

But if they sell a hundred of them at $2.50 profit per, they made $50 an hour...

No, that would be $240 profit.

You cannot really put an hourly rate on something that is spread out over say 6 months.

To myself, an hourly rate is continuous.

When I used to do DTP, if it was a short job that would take say an hour, I would chrage a set price. At the end of the project the customer would be told that this was a finished deal and that there would be no other works done.

But...

If the job was going to be a long one, then it would be an hourly rate. If the customer keeps wanting things added, you charge foir that, you don't do it for a set price. That way you could be working on somthing for about 30 hours for just $10.

In the end, you pay for a persons time and expertise.

All my items at the moment are free. The reason for this is that I can do what I want when I want. I'm not bothered is something is popular or the next great thing.

All the best.

LROG

The idea that poser content is so cheap because most poser users are hobbyists and shouldn't be expected to pay pro-grade prices is a complete falacy. 

First, it's not the merchant's concern whether their customers are hobbyists or not and doesn't make creating content any less difficult or time-consuming. 

If the hobbyist can't afford the prices then they need to find a different hobby. 

Second, hobbyists will spend money on what they want to spend it on if they want something badly enough. Just look at the world of ball-jointed dolls for perfect examples of that. BJD collectors will spend more money on clothes and accessories for their dolls than they do on clothes and accessories for themselves or their kids, and often times, clothes for those dolls cost more than clothes for real people. Not to mention the prices of those dolls, which average about $700 to $1,000 EACH just for a naked doll with no paint. If you want painted faces, that's another $50 to $100, and unless you know how to paint faces yourself - which is an art form all its own - you'll be paying artists to do them fairly regularly as the paint wears off/fades/chips etc over time. And most BJD collectors - and there are many, many of them worldwide - have multiple dolls, each with their own wardrobe. I'm not talking one or two or even five outfits - I'm talking an entire full-sized dresser full of clothing, dedicated to just one doll. Thousands of dollars spent on just one doll and its accessories, multiply that by about 5 to 10. They treat them like members of their family. 

I used to breed sugar gliders. I never did it for a living, but I did sell most of the joeys I bred, and a single standard gray sells for an average of about $150 now. At one point I had 14 breeding pairs, most of which usually had twins. Sugar gliders are a hobbyist pet - they're extremely high maintenence but they're still considered a hobbyist pet, and when you start getting into the exotic colors, such as leusistics and platinums, they will easily sell for $1,200 and up for just one. I've seen gliders sell for as much as $6,000

And the same rules apply to just about any hobby out there. It doesn't matter how much something costs, if people like it and want it they will buy it, even if it means skipping bills. And you can't point to the economy either, because even in this crap-tastic economy there are still plenty of people running around with the latest iPhones and plenty of others making small fortunes buying and selling and/or making accessories for BJDs. It's not a merchant's job or problem to determine what someone does with their product, or feel sorry for those who don't want to or "can't" pay fair price for his time and talent. A merchant has to feed himself too. If the hobbyist wants what a merchant is making, they'll find a way to pay for it one way or another, or they can do without. 

DAZ is the reason there's crap in the MPs for $5 a pop cause they made it common-place to give away their models. Because they could afford to, and they knew it would crush the competition. Now even DAZ is raising their prices, and people are complaining. I hope they continue to raise them, as it will gradually eliminate the crap from people who have no business trying to sell, and make room for those who actually do have talent and can get payments that are a bit more reasonable.

edit I'd love to get into the hobby of collecting sports cars. I'm not talking matchbox, I'm talkin real horse power. But I'm not "pro" driver, I'm just a hobbyist, so should I be able to buy a 2012 camero for $200 bucks just because I'm not a pro and shouldn't have to pay pro prices? It's the same logic.

~Shane

Quote - If V4 has chesticles, does M4 roast his chestnuts by an open fire????? LOL.

All the best.

LROG

No, V4 does that for him when she catches him playin hide the salami with Steph... or maybe David. LOL

Actually with M4, it's more like hide the vienna.

~Shane

Quote - Actually with M4, it's more like hide the vienna.

ROFL!

That was always one of my major complaints about M4 (and most of the Daz pantheon, actually)... it took third party add-ons to make the genitals look realistic. However, now that scaling is fixed in Poser, I'm more than satisfied with the results that can be gotten very easily. 

I could make three different jokes here, but being an employee of Rendo, I'd best behave myself. 

Voting with your dollars is the best way to make your preferences known.  And I know the marketplace doesn't accept just anything submitted but the range of preferences to appeal to is vast and they can only do so much.  

I've noticed that some of the skin textures, especially in the Prime Club content, are not very realistic or suitable for close-ups.

Quote - If the hobbyist can't afford the prices then they need to find a different hobby. 

This is why the model trains hobby is dying.

If it was so simple to make things everyone would be doing it, either buy the stuff or don't, you think the vendors are going to take notice of people moaning in the forums? No, they will only listen with loss of $$$$

you know. I was a vendor. I made a few hundred.. spread over a couple of years... but I could have made much more flipping burgers.

so now I have a job cleaning water tanks and cooling towers, making sure folks like yourselves don't get nasty bugs like Legionaires.. and I'm earning hundreds a month and poser is now a hobby only where I make my own content for my own uses.

would I like to be a merchant again? yes. will I be? no. not while the market is still this thing where the merchant is expected to make a loss constantly. and yes. they do make a loss. they still have to pay food, electric etc... there's a name for this in the real world. it's called Bankrupcy.

and sorry. saying we shouldn't be paid a proper amount because it's a hobby for us is plain insulting. do you say the same things to the clothes store ? or the supermarket?

no. you don't.

so why do you say it to the merchants for poser?

and sure. vote with your wallets. please. watch the good vendors walk because it's just not worth it to them to carry on making the efforts for a pittence return.

then don't complain when there's no good items to buy and it's just rehashes and flood fill textures and fast models with no detail.

*it's what you paid for.

I purchase both cheap and what I regard to be expensive items, well expensive for the Poser world anyway.  My only real question is "what time will it save me?" and if a cheap item will save me enough time with me putting in a little bit more work then I will still buy it.

Considering the work involved with building models I think all the items are cheap so everything is relative.

Personally I worry more about the people that will pay hundreds of dollars to have a device that has a display with more pixels than you can see....now I really do call that taking advantage.

Quote - > Quote - If the hobbyist can't afford the prices then they need to find a different hobby. 

This is why the model trains hobby is dying.

A big issue with model trains is that they now cannot be marketed to children because of safety regulations.  This has taken away much of the low end, which used to help subsidize the equipment for 'serious' modelers by spreading out the fixed costs...

Attached Link: DAZ store pricing back in 2002

Vicky 2 used to sell for $59 and her textures were another $34.95.

But it became clear quite quickly that Poser users are simply not a high end "collectors" demographic.

We're talking stay at home moms and people on a fixed income mainly. People who use Poser and Studio as a tool to escape their everyday life, not because they look for a job as a professional CGI-artist.

Poser is a very egalitarian tool, almost communist in allowing the masses to express themselves in ways that otherwise would have been way out of reach for them.

And the cheap content is a big part of it.

I think most problems could be solved with a better search engine: You don't want to see slutwear, floodfills or cheap content ?

Just exclude it from your search.

Yes, I wish there would be more high end content: Clothes with properly sculpted folds and wrinkles, cars and planes that weren't eyeballed but look like the real thing, humans that are photorealistic and don't look like a Photoshop hack job.

But those wanting these things are just a small minority. I create that "high end" Poser stuff strictly for myself and would never bother selling it because I know it simply wouldn't sell unless I literally gave it away.

But this is the Poserverse. It is what it is. A lot of people tried to change it in the last dozend of years, but it turned out to be quite resilient.

:-)

Quote - Just a reminder:

Vicky 2 used to sell for $59 and her textures were another $34.95.

But it became clear quite quickly that Poser users are simply not a high end "collectors" demographic.

And 10 years later their prices are moving back towards those 2002 prices. Technically they're even higher now.

V5 is about $40 just for the base figure - not counting their current holiday sales. Add to that another $24 to make her half-way functional in Poser.

If you want M5 with his boy bits you're gonna pay over $60 - on sale - plus another $24 just to make him functional in poser. 

It has nothing to do with them trying to cater to the poor depressed housewife on food stamps and everything to do with marketing and crushing competition. 

You're still paying virtually the same prices from 10 years ago, likely even more, they're just divided up differently so it doesn't feel like it. 

Sort of like MMO's. More and more of them are going "free to play" because people don't want to pay $15 a month for a subscription, when in actuality the free to play model earns the developers more monthly revenue per player than a subscription fee because they nickel and dime their "free" players to death with all the added features you have to buy seperately if you don't have a subscription, and want to actually be competitive in the game and "experience" everything it has to offer. 

It's all about marketing and killing competition. 

~Shane

There is something to be said for volume sales though, and for an independant merchant trying to make a living selling poser content, volume sales are mostly where it's at, combined with a higher quality.

There ARE merchants who make a decent living on creating content as a full time job, it just doesn't happen over night. You can't look at it from a dollar per hour perspective tho, because you're not making much of anything that way. But over time, if your content is of high enough quality, you will make good money. You just have to be persistant and dedicated. Once you've made an item and listed it for sale, your labor on that item is done, so everything from that point on is profit. Minus any updates or bug fixes you might have to do to some items - but that is relatively miniscule in comparison. There is no more overhead cause it doesn't cost any more in materials to sell one copy than it does to sell 1,000 copies. Over time, if your products continue to sell - and they will if they're good enough - your profits per item increase. There are merchants still selling character sets and custom morphs they made 5 and 10 years ago, because they're that good, and enough people want them.

~Shane

Quote - ....

Vicky 2 used to sell for $59 and her textures were another $34.95.

...

Yeah, I remember those DAZ Vicki/Mike CDs were like $80 each and many of the character/texture sets here at rendy were around $20 average.

I actually think we buyers are spoiled nowadays really.

Heck, in the past three months there's been almost constant sales at every poser store.

Quote - But those wanting these things are just a small minority. I create that "high end" Poser stuff strictly for myself and would never bother selling it because I know it simply wouldn't sell unless I literally gave it away.

You might be surprised; there seem to be a lot of niche figures coming out, of varing quality.  Your stuff that I've seen is really nice, and it's already made; what do you have to lose except the time to package it up?

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - If the hobbyist can't afford the prices then they need to find a different hobby. 

This is why the model trains hobby is dying.

A big issue with model trains is that they now cannot be marketed to children because of safety regulations.  This has taken away much of the low end, which used to help subsidize the equipment for 'serious' modelers by spreading out the fixed costs...

I think I can safely take issue with both of those statements.  Put the blame solidly on those that deserve it, the manufacturers, or in todays model, the importers.  Most have abandoned the less detailed models that the kids would have the money to buy, and at the same time, taken away a major part of the hobby, customizing a model to match what they see every day.  Roundhouse, a smaller manufacturer, mostly kits, bought out by a larger retailer and wholesaler.  No kits now.  You take what they jam at you, no choice to customize, or kitbash.

As far as safety issues, I have indoor flying helicopters here that are "recommended for ages four and up".  Look up on youtube what happens when a lithium polymer battery is overcharged, or accidentally shorted.  Only if you like smoke and flames.  Safety regulations that prevent marketing to children, I'm unaware of.  I haven't seen any hobby shops with age limits.

Not just with trains, but also airplanes.  Computer simulators for models, you sit in front of the screen with the box in your hand and guide the 3d model around, hopefully landing it without crashing.  Real world, that simulator did almost nothing and the first time you try a real flying model, you're gonna crash.  Period.  Then blame the real model because it doesn't fly like the sim.  Sorry, the sim doesn't work like any real model.  The real models break.  It's a pretty complicated situation, but at every turn, every time a big company gobbles a smaller one, choices disappear and quality always, invariably, falls.

D.

Has this merchant overpriced their product? It's very nice, but I'm not sure it's worth what they're asking.

Basically a rectangual prism

Quote - I think most problems could be solved with a better search engine: You don't want to see slutwear, floodfills or cheap content ?

Just exclude it from your search.

I think the problem there is that classifying stuff along those lines is so subjective, if the arbiters were grumpy old men like me there wouldn't be much in your search results after you excluded those terms, but I doubt any vendors actually see their own stuff as slutwear (or their texture as floodfill).

I mean there's a clothing category called 'casual/everyday'.  Now maybe I'm just old and out of touch, but I imagine that to mean the sort of thing V4 could wear to a PTA meeting, right? Wrong. In the world of poser, I think it only means that it doesn't contain elf-ears or fairywings. While the category really does have a lot of very nice everyday outfits, it also contains some you'd only ever see on a pole-dancer, at least one tomb-raider outfit complete with holstered guns, at least three armoured outfits (the usual leather bikini and armored sleeve things), but it's casual everyday sexy armor I guess, so it's okay for the PTA meeting.

And bugger me if there isn't a real VIATWAS, not quite naked because it is, after all, a casual/everyday clothing set, but she really is in a temple with a sword (just an everyday/casual sword, obviously).

I'm sure that once the dust has settled on the new categories this will smooth out a bit, but the point is that in the world of poser, "sexy" is never far away. How many pose sets have you seen where the title says stuff like "everyday" and "daily life" but all the poses are your typical 'hot model posing for men's magazine', standing on tiptoes, both arms behind head to show off those assets, head thrown back like she's having her neck kissed, or trying to hump whatever prop she's holding.

Poser has a reputation for being useful for making sexy pictures of hot women, and maybe that's because a lot of users (the majority perhaps?) use it for exactly that. If it's true, it's only natural that the marketplace will reflect that pattern and poser clothing will mostly be 'designed to reveal as much as possible.

I think my next project should be a hazmat suit for V4. It'll be a cap, dustmask, skimpy shorts and platform sandals. And nipple caps in the shape of the radioactive symbol. Ok, I'm exaggerating, it'll be boots, not sandals. And it can go in the 'workclothes' department, or 'uniforms' ot whatever it is, where all the other themed' outfits for pole-dancers go. 

;-)

Quote - Has this merchant overpriced their product? It's very nice, but I'm not sure it's worth what they're asking.

Basically a rectangual prism

I can only assume that someone uploaded that as a joke, and it makes a mockery of Turbosquid. They don't appear to have any sort of quality control, there are some good models there but a lot is overpriced rubbish or ripped off from other sites. The site takes a fat cut of anything that sells, so maybe they don't care, even if it's stuff posted as a joke hoping someone will bite.

If I went to my local yarn store, and told them that it was unfair that the price for Noro Silk Garden is over $12, because, after all, I'm just a hobbyest, and I should get to use high-quality yarn, too, they would look at me like I'd suddenly sprouted a 3rd eye. 

If you REALLY want something, and it's outside of your "buy it now" budget, put some money aside and save until you have what you need for it. If the product you want is worth it, it's worth a couple extra weeks of saving.

Have to agree. If I cannot afford something at this point, I wait a bit, until I can.

Sometimes I fall lucky and a sale comes up.

The thing is, I don't have a problem with something that is worth it. I have bought a few tutorials for ZBrush etc. recently that are considerably more expensive than an outfit.

I spotted one as soon as it came out, thought it would be worth having, but couldn't commit to it at that time. Did I start posting that it was too expensive and that it should be a really silly low price? No, I did what everyone else would do, I waited till I had enough for it, and yes, I did buy it at the full price and it was well worth it for what I have learned.

Just because people cannot afford things, does not mean that the merchant should bring down the cost.

When I bought my I7 machine, I didn't go into the store and say "I can only afford £50, you should sell it me for that". No, I scrimped and saved for a while to get it and appreciate it a lot more for doing so.

Sorry to say this, but if you cannot afford a product of any kind, it's no one elses fault except yours.

To merchants, if you think something is worth a set price, go with it. You will soon find out if your customers agree. If they don't buy, then you know you have not done your research.

The world moves on and prices now are not the same as 5 years ago.

All the best.

LROG

Quote - > Quote - Has this merchant overpriced their product? It's very nice, but I'm not sure it's worth what they're asking.

Basically a rectangual prism

I can only assume that someone uploaded that as a joke, and it makes a mockery of Turbosquid. They don't appear to have any sort of quality control, there are some good models there but a lot is overpriced rubbish or ripped off from other sites. The site takes a fat cut of anything that sells, so maybe they don't care, even if it's stuff posted as a joke hoping someone will bite.

Where is the joke? It's digital art. 

People have paid millions for art in galleries that was nothing more than a dot in the center of a giant canvas, or two colored circles on a white piece of wood. 

If the artist feels it's worth $6,500, or even $6,500,000 for his/her digital art to be used in someone else's project, then the only other person it should matter to is the one who pays that price for it. 

If you consider all the ways a 3D model can be used in the modern world, it's not unreasonable to expect to see more of this sort of art popping up in the future. Ever hear of 2nd Life? people make RL money in that VR game by buying and selling digital commodities, among other things.

Bit coin? Real money traded for cyber money, which is then used to buy both real and digital merchandise. 

If I owned some fancy night club in Miami or NYC and wanted to do holographic projections of digital art and sculpture, I wouldn't be browsing for a $5 vase of flowers, I'd look for something more unique, and the high price tag means there wouldn't be many other places to see such a display. Granted this piece is pretty boring to most of us here, but I don't think many 'rosity members are high society night club owners either. 

~Shane

All I can say is the same thing I say to anyone who complains about vendors,..what they make, what figure they make it for, how much they charge blah blah blah...

Make it yourself.. sell it yourself.... see if you think its a good return on your time investment.

If you think vendors are a bunch of sobs then get in there and show them how it can be done better... or more likely learn how much easier it was to just sit on the sidelines and complain.

Just to clarify.. I'm not a vendor, but I have dabbled in some content creation and even 'technically' completed some products.  what I found is that the work that goes into putting out even half assed content is substantial.  My time is limited and I cant bring myself to put out poorly polished product.  

Like everyone else has said.. if you dont like it dont buy it, but I do find moaning about it on the forum without being able to offer better yourself fairly distasteful

Quote - All I can say is the same thing I say to anyone who complains about vendors,..what they make, what figure they make it for, how much they charge blah blah blah...

I have to agree with that sentiment and I don't complain, well not about vendors and products anyway. While I do think some vendors might be asking too much for a given item that is based upon the prices for similar products not on the work that has gone into the product.  I would love to able to model even at the most basic level but until I can find the time I will pay for what I need and modify it if I need to.

Even if a product is a little more than what I'd like to spend on it, I try to imagine just how much use I can actually get out of it before spending the $. If it's an outfit that I can see being mixed with plenty of other outfits/textured plenty of ways, or a plant/prop pack that can be used in plenty of scenes then it's worth the price to me. If it doesn't look like I can get that much use out of it, but I feel I'll die without it then I get it anways when I can afford it or wait until it's on sale lol.

I know I'm not one of vendors this pertains too, but I'd still love to lower my prices here at Rendo. There's one thing stopping me..... store policy. I cannot lower my prices, since they will get below the 'recommended' store pricing. I can imagine others having the same problem, since it's not a voluntary recommendation.

Okay, maybe I have missed where someone else pointed out one important detail. Renderosity has a minimum price that a vendor has to ask for a product based upon stipulations such as how many parts there are to the model. How many texture options ect...

I have noticed that most vendors price thier products according to those established rules. There are some who ask more, but most appear to be within those mandatory guidelines.

I for one, really appreciate the Prime Marketplace and the many sales that vendors have throughout the year that allow for a lower price than the minimum one they have to ask. Besides, vendors do a lot of work for each model and they do not always make much money on any given one. Sometimes they might work for months on a model and sell only a few.

I would, however, like to encourage vendors to do more products for the male models and more medieval and fantasy stuff all around. I love armor and beautiful dresses for example The Luna Gown. Fantasy stuff for Anastasia would be great. I love the Black Moon outfit. That is where I will spend my money.

Just because Hobbist are 99% forum posters.
Don't mean Pro's aren't 99% sells.

Quote - I would, however, like to encourage vendors to do more products for the male models and more medieval and fantasy stuff all around. I love armor and beautiful dresses for example The Luna Gown. Fantasy stuff for Anastasia would be great. I love the Black Moon outfit. That is where I will spend my money.

I would second that request even though most of my renders are of a Sci-Fi nature I do some medieval and it is surprising how many such outfits can be adapted for Sci-Fi with few tweeks and a change of textures.

Mind you have retired in the last week so my spending will probably drop in the New Year but I still intend to buy a few items.  In fact I intended to cut down before the New Year and then Rendo launched a daily 50% sale - best laid plans and all that.

Congrats on the retirement Hornet ;-)

I haven't yet done any medieval renders... although I've been tempted by Xurge3d's medieval stuff... and to therefore put together some scenes on that theme / of that period.

Quote - Congrats on the retirement Hornet ;-)

I haven't yet done any medieval renders... although I've been tempted by Xurge3d's medieval stuff... and to therefore put together some scenes on that theme / of that period.

Thanks I had planned to retire in July 2013 but despite my vast spending on Poser content I discovered I could go slightly earlier and the thought of a long relaxing Christmas (I work.........sorry worked in retail) was too big a temptation. I have also just built myself another PC, again with retirement in mind, now I can put that through it's paces a lot earlier.  Not to mention finding time to do all those tutorials I have purchased.

Quote -> Quote -Congrats on the retirement Hornet ;-)

I haven't yet done any medieval renders... although I've been tempted by Xurge3d's medieval stuff... and to therefore put together some scenes on that theme / of that period.

 

Thanks I had planned to retire in July 2013 but despite my vast spending on Poser content I discovered I could go slightly earlier and the thought of a long relaxing Christmas (I work.........sorry worked in retail) was too big a temptation. I have also just built myself another PC, again with retirement in mind, now I can put that through it's paces a lot earlier.  Not to mention finding time to do all those tutorials I have purchased.

We just finished a 2 1/2 years long project.
Longest project I've ever been involved in.
Seemed like it would never never never end.
I'm not retired but I know how good it feels to know you don't half to go back.

Congrats on your retirement hornet3d.

After a break ,thought I might attempt some Poser stuff.

None of us are naive here, we know how the market works and what is happening. Its like complaining about paying for tap water because the rain is free, we all know someone has to build the reserviour, lay the pipes and pump the water. Renderosity and Daz are providing a service, if we don't like it then we can dig our own well. If we want to influence what's on sale or the quality then we need to set standards and to offset some of the risk the service provider and vendor takes when providing the product. Clearly that's the purpose of the prime market but it doesn't have enough control for me, I don't see the need to become a punter when 99% of the products are of no interest. To misquote a saying you get what the last person paid for.