How in the world is "Post here in you primarily use Dawn in Poser", an intellectually dishonest thread?

I wouldn't assume the Zbrush users all stay in their forum, or that the DS users all stay in the DS forum. The mixture you are looking for is already here around us, or at least those who want to mix know where to come. The poor Poser users users don't have the luxury of a nice quiet forum at Renderosity, where they can choose to stay and avoid the rest.

For better or worse the Poser forum is the hub of Renderosity, or at least that is the way it seems to me after 15 years or so. Maybe it would have been better way back then to have called this the general forum, and to have had a subforum that was Poser specific, but that's not what we got.  

Willow, and Jack, and all the others that have come and gone, some sadly passed on. There is a lot of history here. It's kind of sad to see it getting torn up so a few folks can watch a fight or two.

Things don't get torn-up so that others can watch, but others will watch whenever things get torn up

Apart from the physical aspect, fights over which figure or program is best are no different to fights in the street.  And just as in the street, a crowd gathers.  My recently locked thread generated a lot more view traffic per hour during the time it remained before deletion than it ever did while not displaying the locked symbol next to it - a lot more.

People thought 'oooh, locked thread, I wonder what that's all about?'

Nothing wrong with that because it's obvious people are going to be more interested in something exciting than something that might otherwise not interest them.  It's just the way it is which is why I think the mods here need more power to let things be, let issues repair themselves or whatever.

I remember on the DAZ forum, there was a few years where there was no mod at all as far as we could tell.  There were quite often fights, sometimes big ones, but the people involved in them always seemed to work it out, they're still forum buddies, and that might not have been the case if they weren't allowed to be adults.  If those arguments were controlled, those people might still be wanting to get their point across to this day, the tension would still be there.

I think the main problem about deleting stuff and locking stuff is that one way or another, an opinion is being silenced, and most adults don't like that.  If a lot of the arguments here were left to die out naturally, there would be a better community spirit because of it.  If you cut a thread when two people are arguing then it's never resolved.  I think thats why the arguments always 'reignite', because again, there exists a chance to get their point across, the one that was silenced previously.  If it keeps getting silenced, the want to get it across is always there.  This is why Clarkie's TITS system would never work, because once a person is trying to get a point across, doing so in private has no validity because they want to, understandably, rectify or challenge something in public that was said in public.

So basically that's my take on it.  No amount of goodwill on behalf of the mods or admin will change the way people are, despite their best intentions.  It's like I said directly to DAZ once: it is the adults that have the credit cards, not the children - so stop catering for children.  Adults will always have opinions, and adults will always argue.  No amount of contests, clever gimmicks, suspension of members, warnings, or whatever else will ever change that, despite their best intentions.

All that sort of thing ever does is keep it mounting up untill the next thread comes along where they can let rip again.

Ok this thread is beginning to veer off in the direction of an argument and that's not the purpose of the thread. 

We don't need to re-hash the DS vs Poser debate yet again, as it has nothing to do with this thread. This is the Poser forum and everything here is supposed to be about Poser and its content. 

We don't need to merge all the forums together. Renderosity has chosen to set up their forums to be categorized by topic for a reason. Discussing DS belongs in the DS forum. Discussing Poser belongs in the Poser forum. Of course the occasional criss-crossing of those topics are naturally going to work themselves in to different threads because of how closely related the two are. But there's no reason that every time one is mentioned in conjunction with the other it needs to break down into arguing. Too many people have formed their own opinions based on others opinions and prejudices which are not based on fact. Other mods have taken the approach to just 86'ing such threads as soon as they pop up, but I don't think that's the right way to handle it, because that has made some people feel like they aren't able to express themselves freely here. Everyone here is entitled to their opinions and welcome to share those opinions so long as they don't use them to try making them fact, or to cause deliberate drama just because they're bored.

Anyway, I'll save the long rant I just typed up for a later time. I'd rather push this back to what you all feel would help improve the sense of community here.

Maybe another approach would be for each of you to send me your thoughts in PM. Maybe that way I can get a better sense of things and you won't have to worry about your opinions causing conflict or being attacked. Some of you have already chosen this route and it's appreciated. 

To those who feel wronged by decisions admin have made, such as the removal of the old wiki (which I didn't even know existed before), I'm sorry for that. Hopefully we can all work on creating a replacement for it, and those who contributed before might be persuaded to try again. I'll even help to make back-ups of your content just so your work doesn't get lost. Maybe I can even get approval to create it on a separate site like Wikia and link to it from here. I just feel like this is an important feature and there should be one in existence that we can all refer to and refer others to when they have specific issues they're trying to sort through. I don't know, we'll see what happens. 

Thanks for everyone's input. I would like to hear more, just please keep it on topic and try not to derail into the usual debates.

 ETA:

Quote - I admit a single Mod would need constant health checks but can you imagine how lively that forum would be?

Haha, no. I don't let you guys' drama get to me and affect my blood pressure or my health the way it has for other mods. I just do what needs to be done, then move on to more important issues :m_wink: 

     I like finding threads wherein someone has asked "how do I get this effect?" and others gather in and figure out a way to achieve it.  BB in particular is rightly legendary for this.  These threads could be copied to a tut database area, perhaps edited to remove the inevitable off-topic wanderings.  Oh, and we should be given the chance to edit our own posts before the thread is archived, in order to correct errors and delete dead end approaches, etc.

     I'm favorable to the idea of render challenges, though I rarely do them myself.  My own postings will more likely just be "Look at my latest render project!"  The current "What are you working on?" thread gives that opportunity and gives a preview of coming attractions, so to speak, so folks interested in a given item will know to watch for its release.

     Forum nuts and bolts issues:

•   It would be nice to be able to attach more than one pic.
• When I insert a linked pic, I always set it to open in a new window, but the forum changes it to open in this window.  Irritating.
• Allow attaching MT5, MC6, ZIP, PP2, CR2, PZ3, etc.

Quote -      Forum nuts and bolts issues:

•   It would be nice to be able to attach more than one pic.
• When I insert a linked pic, I always set it to open in a new window, but the forum changes it to open in this window.  Irritating.
• Allow attaching MT5, MC6, ZIP, PP2, CR2, PZ3, etc.

You can attach multiple .jpgs with the HTML editor.Just don't ask me how.

and would be nice to know what page where on "exsample 1 2 3 4"

Seems like we allways fuss with what's wrong but seldome say good job
,you did do all this right.

I will say all the ones that makes Renderosity run Moderators
,Web Masters etc etc do a Killer Good Job.

Sincerely Appreciated
RorrKonn

• you can attach multiple imgs, provided they are already hosted on external site, e.g. postmyimage, or sited internally with advanced technique
• you can attach any filetype (pz3, mt5 et al.) provided it's less than 204800 bytes (which may require zip file) and has extension txt.  BB's posts are exemplary in this regard
• attached img can be opened in new window, provided it's already hosted on external site, or sited internally with advanced technique

Quote - and would be nice to know what page where on "exsample 1 2 3 4"

Look at the URL. At the end (or close to) you'll see page=#. The number is the page you're currently on.

i used to enjoy the sketchbook threads. :)

haven't seen any bounce back in a while 

the start to finish project ones were the most interesting.

Maybe the Poser forum could get sub-forums, that break down into how to forums.

I see a lot of advertisement on the web.

but I never see Renderosity advertising on the web.