I'm not sure how windows does it, bit Apple locks down old versions of flash whenever they discover potential vulnerabilities. There are three typical vectors of infection for Macs today: Flash, Java and users who grant random scripts super user permission (i.e. going to some bad site and then willingly typing in your password to let it install malware with administrator rights). 

Poser forces me and other Mac people to install Adobe's bug riddled crapware...about once a month. On other words, poser requires me to install one of the two primary vectors of malware. Am I the only one who finds this really irritating? Doesn't Poser already have a GUI? Can't they just ditch the flash library system and write one in Python or maybe even...whatever the rest of the GUI was written in? Do we REALLY need a webserver embedded into an already bloated application just to make life easier for the developer(s)?

Am I the only one who really wants them to switch? Is there someplace we can go to let SM know that we aren't happy with this? 

Never been a problem for me. 

Questions:

1. Do you have an anti-virus software running on your computer?

2. Do you have a firewall running on your computer?

I only ask this because for some reason there are a bunch of Mac users who think that their computers don't get viruses. That assumption means that they don't buy antivirus software or firewall software to provide security for their computers.

Like basicwiz I haven't experienced the flash issue that you are having. It's been more than 5 years (maybe more) since I've even had malware problems of any type and the reason is because I have the extra security running on my computer and I increased my knowledge on how malware typically gets on a computer.

To be perfectly honest with you, I have never updated either Flash or Air in all the versions and years Poser has been using them.  Back in the P8 days, SMS tech support told me to disable the auto updates.  They told me that the version of Flash or Air is adequate for the Poser's needs.  Since I have no real need for Flash or Air outside of the Poser library, I have all versions of Poser from P5 to Game Dev on my system.  This includes all the Pro versions.  Never updated Flash or Air.  Never had a problem. 

So, if the only thing Mac users need Flash or Air for is Poser, why not install the version that is part of Poser and let it go at that?

I hope they ditch it for the next release otherwise I won't be upgrading, it's an outrage it's a requirement even now.  The content browser of Poser should be coded as part of the main program like it was before, not based on some crappy dead technology that requires corporate spyware to be installed on your computer in order to use it.

Personally, once I've reformatted, there's no way the Adobe corporate spyware (AKA Flash) is getting back on my computer, so I can only hope that the next release isn't too long after that, and that they remove the need for Flash.

["NO MORE FLASH!!!!!!"

](http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro?thread_id=2886996)

To be perfectly honest with you, I have never updated either Flash or Air in all the versions and years Poser has been using them.  Back in the P8 days, SMS tech support told me to disable the auto updates.  They told me that the version of Flash or Air is adequate for the Poser's needs.  Since I have no real need for Flash or Air outside of the Poser library, I have all versions of Poser from P5 to Game Dev on my system.  This includes all the Pro versions.  Never updated Flash or Air.  Never had a problem. 

So, if the only thing Mac users need Flash or Air for is Poser, why not install the version that is part of Poser and let it go at that?

I'm not entirely sure where you would get the SM flash version. When I installed poser on this new mac a couple of weeks ago, I was forced to go directly to adobe in order to use it. And now, once again just 2 or 3 weeks later. So, maybe it was installed but it was being blocked by apple. I have the same problem with Java. I have an IDE that I use that requires Java, and that version was blocked, so I had to go to oracle and download the latest version of the JVM.  Oh well. Maybe I'm the only one who finds this really annoying. 

As for anti-virus, I have been using the mac for nearly 10 years, and I have never installed anti-virus nor have I had any problems. Part of it is that there isn't as much to gain by exploiting macs (fewer numbers), but I think the general security model for unix was very mature when script kiddies started exploiting windows back in the late 90s, making anti-virus necessary. All you needed to know back then was basic, and you could write yourself a melissa virus that took down whole companies for days. 

the adobe stuff came on my poser dvd, pp12 retail box version.  my pc isn't internet connected, no updates forced on me.

i do miss the poser 7 library.  actual size thumbnails, subfolders were sorted to the bottom of the folder. admittedly was slower 

I've never had any problems either. But then I use Windows ;).

On a side note...if you have the pro version of Poser you can use Air rather than Flash. Of course, I have no idea if Air runs on a Mac, but I'm fairly sure it does :).

Laurie

I'm not sure how windows does it, bit Apple locks down old versions of flash whenever they discover potential vulnerabilities. There are three typical vectors of infection for Macs today: Flash, Java and users who grant random scripts super user permission (i.e. going to some bad site and then willingly typing in your password to let it install malware with administrator rights). 

Poser forces me and other Mac people to install Adobe's bug riddled crapware...about once a month. On other words, poser requires me to install one of the two primary vectors of malware. Am I the only one who finds this really irritating? Doesn't Poser already have a GUI? Can't they just ditch the flash library system and write one in Python or maybe even...whatever the rest of the GUI was written in? Do we REALLY need a webserver embedded into an already bloated application just to make life easier for the developer(s)?

Am I the only one who really wants them to switch? Is there someplace we can go to let SM know that we aren't happy with this? 

Yes, you are the only one who wants them to switch.  Yes, you can go to SM's site & let them know that YOU are unhappy with it.  Don't presume to speak for the rest of us.
The chances of SM changing it are effectively zero, but if it makes you happy, knock yourself out.

I hope you're wrong, cause the chances of me buying another copy of Poser are also zero unless it becomes independent from Adobe components.
Poser wasn't dependent on that junk before, and shouldn't need to be now.

I am not - SM rewrote the entire code base.  "That Junk" is why we have the add-on framework and access to everything that has been added to it. 

The reason they went to the webkit Library interface is that they can use the same code across multiple products and platforms.  Bagginsbill did the coding...

"I hope you're wrong, cause the chances of me buying another copy of Poser are also zero unless it becomes independent from Adobe components."

Promise? (ROFL)

 I have been using Poser for over 10 years now, don't know at which point they started with Flash and Air mainly because I have never had a problem.  I have updated them in the past but it has never been an issue for me.  Once again I am on Windows so perhaps that explains it.

I know Baggins did the coding, I stumbled upon that the other day, but it's not the coding I have an issue with, it's the use of "Flash" I have an issue with because I don't see why I should have to install corporate spyware from Adobe on my computer, in order to use Poser.  I would never have purchased Poser 10 in the first place if I'd known Flash was required to actually use the program, it's normally only requred for Flash exports, not to form one of the main features of the program!

And mean for crying out loud, Flash of all things!
Flash is dead, and even when it was in it's prime (if you can call it that), it was always a festering, resource hogging pile of crap, and still is!

No "Flash" and no "Air" is getting installed on my system again, so it looks like goodbye Poser.

Well, I guess there will be nothing to complain about then :)

Laurie

If you're so bothered about having to use it now, why wait until the next version of Poser to stop?  Threats to quit using a program rarely change anything if they aren't made directly to the company.

Good lord....

Chill.

Laurie

You should try that yourself instead of trolling.
When you post unwarranted wisecracks like that, you can expect a response for it, same for Wiz.

There's a person you're aiming the wisecracks at, and they're not posted by accident.

Be interesting to see if the EX Mod gets a suspension for trolling - which he clearly is doing with a comment like that!

Please let's keep this thread civil and polite.

Will do, fictionalbookshelf, but my god, it's pretty damn hard around here sometimes!

I know Baggins did the coding, I stumbled upon that the other day, but it's not the coding I have an issue with, it's the use of "Flash" I have an issue with because I don't see why I should have to install corporate spyware from Adobe on my computer, in order to use Poser.  I would never have purchased Poser 10 in the first place if I'd known Flash was required to actually use the program, it's normally only requred for Flash exports, not to form one of the main features of the program!

And mean for crying out loud, Flash of all things!
Flash is dead, and even when it was in it's prime (if you can call it that), it was always a festering, resource hogging pile of crap, and still is!

No "Flash" and no "Air" is getting installed on my system again, so it looks like goodbye Poser.

If you do not install Flash on a new system, some things won't work. Air probably wont be that big of a deal. HTML 5 is slated to be the replacement for both, from the powers that be. And is in use with a lot of things now.. 

HTML 5 uses the websocket protocol for things like the library, which has it's own book of issues. Another issue, is what is trusted here may not be trusted anywhere else.

Commands listed as trusted in one browser may not be in another. Making code, and it wont work everywhere,... Including operating systems.

So even if an HTML 5 library is written, it will have holes in it because it is written in HTML 5..... It may also need multiple code paths just so it will work on different platforms.

Don't let this stop anyone from writing a replacement thou. As there already are more than a few of them out there.

Food for thought....

HTML 5 is fine with me, it's an open cross-platform format, has nothing to do with Adobe, and doesn't require the installation of spyware in order to use it.
I even use a HTML 5 player for YouTube, so, no problem with HTML5  here - no complaints.

Flash though, that's a different thing altogether - in more ways than one.

As for anti-virus, I have been using the mac for nearly 10 years, and I have never installed anti-virus nor have I had any problems. Part of it is that there isn't as much to gain by exploiting macs (fewer numbers), but I think the general security model for unix was very mature when script kiddies started exploiting windows back in the late 90s, making anti-virus necessary. All you needed to know back then was basic, and you could write yourself a melissa virus that took down whole companies for days. 

10 years without an anti-virus program.   I never really understood how people without antivirus claim that their computer doesn't have a virus or could never get one.  Even worse you state that there isn't as much to gain by exploiting Macs.  Mac users have credit cards and bank accounts just like everyone else.  A target is a target regardless of what OS they are running,  The fact that many Mac users don't use antivirus software or firewall software makes you an easier target. Here's an article from 2012 Malware Infects One In Five Mac Devices: REPORT   The top malware problems that affect Macs comes from flash, but only Macs have that issue. According to the report, PC computers don't have this same issue.  In addition the report states that Mac leads the OS world for having security vulnerabilities.  I can only assume that Mac users who think their computers don't need antivirus or firewall software would have the most security vulnerabilities.

I clean malware off of computers and the majority of the malware and viruses that I find don't cause problems and the only way that anyone would know that they are there is to run a software that can detect it.  Just something to think about.

Problem is, not enough people are aware that the Flash Player is corporate spyware, so not enough people are bothered about it, and you have to wonder how long it will take for people to realise that if Poser didn't depend on Flash, none of them would be having a "Flash-based" issue in the first place :-D

The Content Browser really should be integrated like it used to be, coded in whatever language the bulk of the program is coded in.

Never been a problem for me as far as poser, I use D3D's XL and Shaderwork's Library Manager. The only thing I use the poser library for is to set up runtimes and sometimes to swap figures in the scene.

I do use a flash blocker in Firefox though, to keep flash ads from loading and playing automatically.

 I admit to gritting my teeth every time I install a Flash update. The first thing I do after is to fire up Poser and check it all works. Me- Poser Addict????

 I'm not clever enough to replace Posers reliance on Flash or IE so I'm stuck with them. I just make sure they're up to date along with my AV and firewall. If you don't like the vulnerabilities then find software that doesn't use them- DAZ Studio or Lightwave spring to mind. The only system that will be secure is one with an air gap to the World Wide Web.

 I did have a choice to Adobe Acrobat and installed Foxit reader instead- even that has its own foibles.

 It's your choice and only you can make it

Problem is, not enough people are aware that the Flash Player is corporate spyware, so not enough people are bothered about it, and you have to wonder how long it will take for people to realise that if Poser didn't depend on Flash, none of them would be having a "Flash-based" issue in the first place :-D

The Content Browser really should be integrated like it used to be, coded in whatever language the bulk of the program is coded in.

1. Every software that you get has the potential to be "corporate spyware" That's just the way things are. They make the software so they can gather any information that they want so long as they aren't stealing passwords or your personal files. Monitoring browsing habits is nothing new. Having applications communicating with the company's server is nothing new.  That's been going on for the longest.  The "corporate spyware" that you are complaining about, is the same thing that Microsoft does with all of its applications. My firewall application notifies me when any of my applications are "talking" to the server.
2. Do you ever read the Terms & Conditions for software?  The "corporate spyware" that you are complaining about as being "corporate spyware" is stated in their terms.  Section 7.7 Please note that the Adobe Privacy Policy allows tracking of website visits and it addresses in detail the topic of tracking and use of cookies, web beacons, and similar devices. This is small in comparison of what other applications doe, For example, phone applications go way beyond this sort of tracking and information gathering.  It's not spyware if they are telling you what they are doing.  The point of spyware is to get information without you knowing. If you don't want adobe talking to the server then block it with a firewall.

But most apple users don't use security software like firewalls so blocking it may is not possible and Mac users seem to be the only ones with this issue.

Yes, I always read the label, but I shouldn't have to install Adobe spyware to use Poser.  The point is, we're having to accept spyware terms from Adobe in order to use a 3D Figure tool that has nothing to do with them.

Other than the obvious, that we're having to do so, can you give me one good reason why anyone should have to do that?

The only reason the Flash spyware had to be on installed on my system before, was to play YouTube videos, but since HTML 5, it was no longer necessary to tolorate having Adobe's spyware on my system.  Today, the only reason it needs to be there is so that I can use Poser 10, something that would never have been purchased if I'd been made aware of the need to install Adobe's spyware in order to use it.

Basically, SM need to ditch Flash, and the original poster of this thread (and myself) are perfect examples of why that is.
No Flash, no Flash problem!

Pumeco

Sometimes the only reason you need is the obvious one.  If you want to use Poser then you have to accept any of their third party scripts that are used to operate Poser.  It's no different than any other software out on the market. The same thing that you are complaining about is done with Mac OS.  Your Mac OS tracks your behavior as well and collect more data than adobe flash. 

Washington Post Article: Apples Mac Computers Can Automatically Collect Your Location Information I

"Once Yosemite is installed, users searching for files – even on their own hard drives -- have their locations, unique identifying codes and search terms automatically sent to the company, keystroke by keystroke. The same is true for devices using Apple’s latest mobile operating system, iOS 8"

See even Apple does what adobe does and more

Exactly, FightingWolf, but I refuse, point blank, to own anything that Apple produces - so Apple's disgusting data-mining isn't of interest to me :-)
The only obvious spyware on my system, is Adobe's Flash Player, and I'll be permanently rid of that on my next installation.

I've no interest in having poorly performing, dead technology that incorporates spyware, installed on my computer - never have, and never will.
Obviously, I have no problem with Poser accessing other code libraries, but not ones that require the installation of spyware in order to use them.

MODIFIED MY POST

I thought I found how to turn on the HTML library. I didn't manage it.

Hang on - I'll be back.

Cheers Baggins!

I don't have Pro, well, only the previous version, but if Flash manages to survive even next release, it's great to hear it can be disabled.
Thanks again!

"But most apple users don't use security software like firewalls so blocking it may is not possible and Mac users seem to be the only ones with this issue"

I have both a Mac and a new PC

On My Mac I run "Littlesnitch"

which allows selective blocking of incoming&outgoing

internet communications for any application I choose to block.

"Zone Alarm" on my windows Machine has the same function.

As far as the"Flash issue" it was supplanted by HTML5 because it was not really 

useful for the explosive growth of mobile TOUCH screen devices

that could not use the"Mouse roll over" function so central to FLASH for web content

So you will likely never see a tablet version of poser as long as it uses FLASH for its 

content library.

LOL!!  I stopped buying poser after version 6 

so I am not really affected by its current library setup.

"See even Apple does what adobe does and more"

ALL Corporations do it.

Frankly and if one is that concerned about "corporate spyware"

disconnect &run your system in a "Faraday Cage" to assure it never connects to the web

and it will never get to "call home" and report what info it has collected by you.

We are in the age of "Big Data" and that Data has to be collected somehow

that is the reality in which we live.

"Frankly and if one is that concerned about "corporate spyware"

disconnect &run your system in a "Faraday Cage" to assure it never connects to the web

and it will never get to "call home" and report what info it has collected by you."

Nah, Wolf, I have no concern about my computer being connected to the web.  Don't need a Faraday cage either cause I use a safe, non-commercial OS called Debian and have complete control over absolutely everything that comes into and goes out of it.

I only use my Windows machine for programs I've still to replace and use on Debian.  Poser is one of them, and it's the only reason I tolerated Flash on the Windows installation.  I'm pleased Baggins might have found a way, because it really would have been the end of Poser for me otherwise.  There's only a few more things I need to try on Debian, and then I'll never have to use Windows again!

Wheeeeeeeee :-D

OK I think I found the setting - it was introduced in Poser 10 and then rescinded - probably because it doesn't work right somehow.

Exit Poser if it's running.

Find your poser.ini - the path may differ for you - mine is in

c:/Users//AppData/Roaming/Poser Pro/10

In your poser.ini look for 

LIBRARY_EMBEDDED_TYPE 0

and change the 0 to a 1.

In Poser 10, this is (I think) all you would do. For Pro 2014, you'd need to choose the embedded library as well with this line:

LIBRARY_IS_AIR 0

This HTML library is very primitive in ability and appearance - I hate it and won't use it, but to each his own.

Exactly, FightingWolf, but I refuse, point blank, to own anything that Apple produces - so Apple's disgusting data-mining isn't of interest to me :-)

ha ha ha.. Ok.  you don't have apple, then Microsoft OS does the same thing. lol. Microsoft does it with their office products as well.

@FightingWolf - There are versions of Linux that are supposedly spyware free. 

However, there is talk of spyware being built directly into various components such as mother boards these days, which will make whatever OS you use irrelevant no matter how open source it may be. Data mining is big business, and that business isn't going to let something like an OS get in their way. They will come up with other ways to collect info. 

Anyway, stop arguing and keep the thread on track. 

I don't see how Flash is so dead, since so many software titles still require it and much of what exists to supposedly relpace it still hasn't lived up to the claim, even HTML 5. 

@Baggins
It might not be colour coded but it looks fine to me, and I only have the browser open to bring in content anyway.
Will try it out later, thanks!

@FightingWolf
lol - I think you missed my previous post to that other Wolf of the forum ;-)

@Shane
Just a heads-up, the Raspberry Pi is believed to have safe hardware and BIOS, so hopefully they cannot manipulate it with a safe installation on board.
You can run Debian on it, so hopefully a safe, self-contained web machine :-)

@FightingWolf - There are versions of Linux that are supposedly spyware free. 

However, there is talk of spyware being built directly into various components such as mother boards these days, which will make whatever OS you use irrelevant no matter how open source it may be. Data mining is big business, and that business isn't going to let something like an OS get in their way. They will come up with other ways to collect info. 

Anyway, stop arguing and keep the thread on track. 

I don't see how Flash is so dead, since so many software titles still require it and much of what exists to supposedly relpace it still hasn't lived up to the claim, even HTML 5. 

The original selling point of HTML 5 was that the enduser would not have the ability to block ads made with it. - Which makes it a fine replacement for Flash as far as Steve Jobs was concerned - (iAds was supposed to be the next big thing.  How did that turn out, anyway?)

We are in the age of "Big Data" and that Data has to be collected somehow that is the reality in which we live.

This is very true. People use the cards from grocery stores for additional savings and what the customers don't realize is that the store is tracking purchasing habits and what products you buy.  It's not just a software or web browsing thing.  Business understand the value of collecting this information and they get a lot of it, which is  why the government (won't say names lol) goes to these companies to get information about people.

@FightingWolf - There are versions of Linux that are supposedly spyware free. 

..Anyway, stop arguing and keep the thread on track. 

I don't see how Flash is so dead, since so many software titles still require it and much of what exists to supposedly relpace it still hasn't lived up to the claim, even HTML 5. 

No argument here. I just think the OP was focused on the Flash being spyware instead of just asking if there was another way view the library without using adobe to do it.  Bagginsbill has already provided the solution that should address the OP desire not to use flash.  The rest of the conversation was just to point out that "data collecting" goes on every where and no system is immune to it. Companies come straight out and say that they are collecting the data, so at that point it's no longer "spyware" if they are telling you that they are collecting that type of data.

I agree with you Flash isn't dead, but the way we know it is dying.  Flash will have to undergo some changes in order to remain competitive to HTML5 (assuming that HTML5 will always seek improvements). Some things are just easier to do in flash especially when it come to the advertising industry.  Advertising and Gaming industries are big users of flash.

From what I can tell most people who think of flash only thinks of its use in website development and compare that with HTML5.  In terms of website development, flash has been dead for many years now, but that's not the only market that it was operating in. Some of those other markets depend on flash simply because HTML5 can't do the job.

"OK I think I found the setting - it was introduced in Poser 10 and then rescinded - probably because it doesn't work right somehow.

Exit Poser if it's running.

Find your poser.ini - the path may differ for you - mine is in

c:/Users//AppData/Roaming/Poser Pro/10

In your poser.ini look for 

LIBRARY_EMBEDDED_TYPE 0

and change the 0 to a 1.

In Poser 10, this is (I think) all you would do. For Pro 2014, you'd need to choose the embedded library as well with this line:

LIBRARY_IS_AIR 0"

Just a courteous confirmation; this worked perfect on Poser 10.
Thanks again, much appreciated.

I've used ShaderWork's Advanced Library Manager since it came out years and years ago to replace Poser's own library system. I'm using Poser on linux and haven't bothered to install those pesky Adobe add-ons since they are only needed by the library browser.

There's no need to use Flash/Air components if one chooses not to do so. Third party library alternatives have been around for quite some time. So I don't really see what's the issue in the first place.

**Thank you so much. Problem solved as per your help below. My system is Win10, pc, Poser 10. **

bagginsbill posted at 12:41PM Wed, 13 January 2021 - #4184370

OK I think I found the setting - it was introduced in Poser 10 and then rescinded - probably because it doesn't work right somehow.

Exit Poser if it's running.

Find your poser.ini - the path may differ for you - mine is in

c:/Users//AppData/Roaming/Poser Pro/10

In your poser.ini look for 

LIBRARY_EMBEDDED_TYPE 0

and change the 0 to a 1.

In Poser 10, this is (I think) all you would do. For Pro 2014, you'd need to choose the embedded library as well with this line:

LIBRARY_IS_AIR 0

We have a current discussion on this topic HERE

Please visit that thread for info.

I am going to lock this one down, but you can still read it. Thank you :)