I won't be returning it. I will wait till it gets fixed. My issue is people have all these opportunities to make a difference and they mess it up due to silly reasons which could have been avoided. It just frustrates me.

Sure. But why are we picking on one vendor? Should we make a list of the 4000 others whose products -- even recent products -- aren't GC compliant? I don't see anyone else being fingered today? Why not, if it's such a big deal?When releasing a new figure, it's always under the spotlight. Supporting content nobody really makes a fuss about. It's just the way it is. This is a figure centric market so whenever there is a new one, it is going to get analyzed and get more attention.

I made a stripped out figure so I could re rig it, but that wont happen.

You can't mirror the rigging, it goes fubar due to asymmetry in the mesh....

... Well, sometimes, you can get Poser to do it anyway, but the results are not always predictable. Rigging it entirely by hand, without benefit of mirroring is possible, but I would certainly opt to adjust the current rigging instead of going with scratch, in that case. Because... fingers. /shiver :)

It may be that you could mirror rigging with something else besides Poser's native toolset. One of the clothes rigging scripts/apps might have enough flexibility to be used to do that. The only one I normally use is Quick Conform, standalone, and it doesn't offer that, but Wardrobe Wizard might or there could be a python script out there that would do it without fussing about symmetry problems.

I am surprised that it's not symmetrical, though.

Who cares why they default, it is wrong in the cr2. You build for the program, and don't make excuses after the fact.

Sure. But why are we picking on one vendor? Should we make a list of the 4000 others whose products -- even recent products -- aren't GC compliant? I don't see anyone else being fingered today? Why not, if it's such a big deal?

Your here, but you are not. The gamma thing would have been easily fixed by any user. Making a symmetrical wire frame is not as easy. Neither is the rigging, jcms, etc. It is just one of many issues that I would not have expected from a vendor. Guess I was wrong an should expect more of the same.

The character should be pulled from the store until it is actually functional on a level that even the free ones are.

I made a stripped out figure so I could re rig it, but that wont happen.

You can't mirror the rigging, it goes fubar due to asymmetry in the mesh....

... Well, sometimes, you can get Poser to do it anyway, but the results are not always predictable. Rigging it entirely by hand, without benefit of mirroring is possible, but I would certainly opt to adjust the current rigging instead of going with scratch, in that case. Because... fingers. /shiver :)

It may be that you could mirror rigging with something else besides Poser's native toolset. One of the clothes rigging scripts/apps might have enough flexibility to be used to do that. The only one I normally use is Quick Conform, standalone, and it doesn't offer that, but Wardrobe Wizard might or there could be a python script out there that would do it without fussing about symmetry problems.

I am surprised that it's not symmetrical, though.

I have scripts that will mirror the rigging, but if mirror joints is used it will ruin any non symmetrical mesh. I weight mapped Sydney, and you can tie her into a knot. But if someone uses the mirror command on her it is all over. You have to load the character again. That is why it was never released it, because it just doesn't work with all the tools in Poser. A character that doesn't work with those tools is not going to last. Rigging clothes for it was a nightmare as well. Rigging a non symmetrical mesh is possible, just keep in mind that I dropped the whole idea because I did not want to release a freebie that was that fragile.

Selling one with similar issues is something I would never do.

Who cares why they default, it is wrong in the cr2. You build for the program, and don't make excuses after the fact.

Sure. But why are we picking on one vendor? Should we make a list of the 4000 others whose products -- even recent products -- aren't GC compliant? I don't see anyone else being fingered today? Why not, if it's such a big deal?

Your here, but you are not. The gamma thing would have been easily fixed by any user. Making a symmetrical wire frame is not as easy. Neither is the rigging, jcms, etc. It is just one of many issues that I would not have expected from a vendor. Guess I was wrong an should expect more of the same.

The character should be pulled from the store until it is actually functional on a level that even the free ones are.

I agree. The GC issue is minor, which is why I posted about it. I buy a lot of content and scenefixer gets used on ALL of it. The only reason I noticed the artifacts at all is that, like you, I assumed the creator would have updated shaders. So I didn't run it through scenefixer before my first render. But I wasn't at all surprised that he didn't, since very few actually do. Perhaps I have lower expectations precisely BECAUSE I buy a lot of content. :) About the wireframe -- indeed. In fact, it sounds as though it's actually rather challenging to make it symmetrical. Obviously for some that's a deal breaker in itself. And I don't think that's unreasonable, even if the newest Poser figures themselves also aren't symmetrical; though I do find it a little unfair to hold an independent vendor to a higher standard in this regard than the software manufacturer itself. People criticized Roxie's rigging as well, but I don't remember this level of anger. No one demanded that she be removed from Poser's content library. And while we did not pay for her separately from the software itself, we certainly did pay for her.

I am going to stop. There is no comparison between Roxie and Scarlet.

If it is ok for an independent developer to release a piece of shit and rip people off, so be it.....

I won't say its really a piece of shit lol, and it does offer some nice new features. Unfortunately it is broken, and that is an issue. Also, the overall quality does not justify the long development on this. I expected more. I have her side by side with default V4 and V4 still does things better. The glute distortions on Scarlet are bad. That to me is not acceptable for a new figure released in 2015.

Have a look. I won't even focus on the Genitals because they are even worse.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/u883hb1qbncpitk/Capture.JPG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ptbd0bdv0yby0cs/Capture22.JPG?dl=0

There are some things I really like about this figure.  The scaling stuff looks cool.  The hair looks interesting.  And the shoulder looks better with the arm raised than most Poser figures.

But there are some weird flaws that are visible even in the promo images.  Clothes don't seem to fit quite right.  The shoulder looks bad with the arm down/forward.  There's mesh crumpling in odd places. 

He promises a male counterpart, Jonathan.  Maybe there's still time to fix that one before release.

Oh and clothing does NOT fit right. Even the ones that come with the figure. And heaven forbid you bend the legs with underwear on. But then again we are just being mean and should just show our support and throw them our money:)

I take a very close look on the promos. This was enough for me to know that I will never buy her. On one promo, where she bend , her mesh on the feet and shin is broken. With just a simple pose.

No one outfit fit her properly.

I agree with Vilters. you don't need to buy her to see that she is not well made.

Asymmetry is a problem with Poser. I doubt the model was built asymmetrical, however I know from personal experience and other top vendors I've spoken to in the past, that Poser will randomly knock a model out of symmetry depending on how the model is saved into the library. It happens in very small increments and in various ways, and not all the time. It's been an on-going issue for many versions that makes content creation all the more frustrating, that S-M has yet to fix or even acknowledge.

I've seen this firsthand. Seen things that I KNOW where symmetrical were not once they were run thru Poser. AFAIK, its been a problem since at least Poser9/PP12.

Jesus H. Christ the quote font is ****' annoying. Back to hardly lurk mode.

Laurie

Example: If you load Roxie directly from the library - into another modeler or even into Poser, her mesh is 100% symmetrical. If you load her via her .CR2, she is no longer symmetrical. The asymmetry is being saved into the .CR2 - and thus, into the new .OBL that gets saved out along with each new copy of the .CR2. I have to wonder if part of the problem isn't due to Poser's mirror rigging features. I don't know, I haven't investigated it very thoroughly because I don't know how I'd go about fixing it even if I did figure out what the exact problem is. I just know it's very annoying.  

So one way to work around it, I think, is to always keep a master copy of the figure in your geometries folder (and NOT in the figure library, where Poser always likes to store it for some illogical reason), and go in and manually change the .CR2 to point to the model in the geometries folder. That way it's loading an unaltered version of the model each time. Roxie is not the only figure this applies to. Pretty much all of them as far as I can tell. However some of them are in fact asymmetrical.

(Note on quote fonts: If you press the arrow key down  a couple times to get passed the quote block before you start typing following a quote, then your response text won't be ginormous. That's using a normal pc. If you're using a tablet or phone i can't help ya)

A new, successful, well accepted and supported base figure would be welcome. It would also be a considerable investment on the part of the Poser user, given that much more than a base figure is needed to get full use of a figure. I am rather a collector of Poser figures, so I was ripe for this one. Because I make a lot of my own content, a new figure represents not only an investment in money, but an investment in time as well. Given the tools that we have in Poser, I want things to work with the minimum of fuss. Clothes rigged in the fitting room, with all the morphs transferred, should fit. I little pokethrough is ok. A few strokes with the morph brush after conforming and posing is something I can accept. I have made clothes for Michelle, Dawn, Kez, Angela (both versions), BVH's Cynthia, Bella, Lusitana, Polly Gon, Antonia, plus many Daz and Smith Micro figures and I haven't been as frustrated as this. 

Will I be a customer for the add-on content for Scarlet that is in the pipeline? A lot depends on how the creators handle the issues that emerged at launch. 

Hornet3d: There are a lot of theories on what will make a good figure but over the last few years they have remained just that, theories. After reading a lot of this thread I question if there is anyone around with the skills to make such a figure that is stupid enough to try and risk having a good few years of their life trashed in public.Moriador: I get what you're saying. On the other hand, I'm not sure how threads of this sort will affect creators like Teyon. If he reads this, he'll won't be able to have a bowel movement for a month. In many ways, there's a self-defeating effect for us in our enthusiasm for perfection and quality and the way it plays out in the forums. It's almost gotten to the point that if you want to release a human figure for Poser, you have to be so thick skinned as to not care at all. And that's not an improvement. How many people have started to make a figure and given up because undergoing this kind of scrutiny just isn't worth it? I personally know of more than a couple. Would a friendly environment not be more encouraging to those who actually have the skill to make such a thing? Or might we actually be driving these people away to use their talents elsewhere?

Mayhaps these are good reasons to have a figure developed in front of the community, so that everyone sees the development as it's happening, and can voice their input accordingly. Doesn't mean every request can be met, but combined with a group of sincere testers at various stages, it might produce more favorable results, less room for obvious errors, and less of an environment for public stoning once the final product is released.

Oh Hell no lol. Too many cooks in the kitchen is never a good thing:)

@AmbientShade That doesn't always work. Case in point: Hivewire. Chris is always posting WIPs and taking user input, yet on release, there are plenty of people willing to throw the Hivewire figures into the recycle bin. They want to bash the figures, yet they're usually people I have yet to see in the forums. The only figure that didn't have a thread for end-user input was the initial release of Dawn as the site didn't go live until she did (iirc though there was a thread here that was going on), but she now has an SR2 (completely backwards compatible with the products from the first version). Dawn, Dusk, the Horse, and now the upcoming baby all have work-in-progress threads for various upcoming products that anyone can look at and voice their input, and Chris is very involved with those.

No offense here, but the majority of those giving him advice are people who are fanboys and even the sub-par things made are met with "OH That Looks Great!!!". Not just at him, but any other content WIP from other people. There is no honest feedback there at Hivewire. If there was, we would see a better level of content once those products are released. But people are too scared to say anything negative because it might disturb the harmony and peace of the community. It's like your mom telling you that you sing like an angel and when you finally audition for IDOLS, you get the honest feedback that you can't actually sing. Hey, I am just being honest here. EG, people there praised him for the dusk body morphs, meanwhile if you take an honest look at them, well......

While you may have a point, what I was getting at was that it's not a closed off process. Anybody is free to come voice their opinions and ideas. If somebody sees something that needs addressing, whether released or unreleased and still a public WIP.. well come open your mouth. lol

As long as it's worded in a manner that conveys a genuine want to help, and not just bash things like a troll.

It's like elections. You can't bitch when the candidate you wanted didn't win if you didn't vote.

Zev0 is right, honest feedback is often not appreciated.

I have hope that Sixus1 has the commitment to support Scarlet, but I am worried that there has been no response here.  While all the discussion was going on, I checked a number of times and saw that Sixus1 was online at the time.

@ Vaskania - That won't work lol. If I go there my feedback will be masked with "DAZ Fanatic, GET OUT, how dare you enter this sacred ground!!!! There are plenty of times I tried giving genuine advice but because of where I sell and who I develop for, all my comments are ignored and people just focus on the fact that I am from the evil empire and want to throw insults. So, I do not really help anymore:)

Well I'm sure Sixus is reading the thread, even if they aren't commenting (aren't they a husband/wife team? Not just a lone ranger).

Scarlet is in the top row of What's Hot, so obviously a lot of folks are buying her. If they aren't voicing their concerns directly to the artist via e-mails, etc, then it's possible most of this will just be ignored or glanced over. <- not to slight Sixus, but if they're consistently getting rave reviews directly, or no negative feedback at all, then a few complaints in a forum from less than a handful of users isn't going to mean very much in the scope of things. 

I was half tempted to buy her just to see, but nah, this thread is enough. I have enough females in my runtime as it is.

@Zev0 - Have you ever actually been to the HW forums? You know how many DS users we have over there? lol We have quite a few DS only users, Poser only users, and users using/learning both. The only DS vs Poser you'll get over there is how one process from one app can be done in the other, how to convert items over, etc. Flamewars don't last because there's a zero tolerance for bullshit.

You could be creating ASCII art on a commodore, whatever floats your boat. lol

@Shade - Yea they're a husband/wife duo. I thought Sixus was a female for the longest time, until I read sixus was actually a married couple. lol

I read the Hivewire forums everyday. You don't need to be a member at Hivewire to view the threads:) I have been reading the threads from day one. I like to be kept in the loop of what is happening around me:) Does this mean I have to participate? No thanks. That community is not for me.

OT question Zev0: is this a fulltime job for you? Just curious.

Yes I do this fulltime. 2 to 3 hours a day reading forums keeping me updated on events, then the rest of the day I do production work.

I read the Hivewire forums everyday. You don't need to be a member at Hivewire to view the threads:) I have been reading the threads from day one. I like to be kept in the loop of what is happening around me:) Does this mean I have to participate? No thanks. That community is not for me.

Gotchya.

Nice. I need that kind of discipline.

I have a catalog of half-finished content that stretches 10 miles. Just not enough hours in a day.

Oh it's still tough. Takes a lot to get you motivated at times, specially if you work from home. But you learn to manage your time eventually:) I get to work in PJ's so it's all good:) I can use a bit more discipline though lol. Having game consoles in the same room as your workstation can cause issues:)

So I guess having my PS4 hooked up to my 2nd monitor isn't helping. LOL

LOL no:) That does not help:)

This tread has been a harsh one.

The only point proven is :

Who ever you are, and whatever you make; You need motivated and independent beta testers from day 1. => And listen to them!

It is just impossible to check your own work.

Yes. In fact you need an experienced one (technical) and a normal user as a tester so you get feedback from both ends. Sometimes when thinking too technical you overlook the processes of how a normal user would find using a product. Same thing can be said for script and python to be honest. There are some that are very powerful, but way too technical for the average user. This can be applied to interface tools as well. Sometimes good design is just as important as functionality. The two go hand in hand.

I don't even own a tv. and i deleted all my games months ago. 

@Vilters
I think we should merge and call ourselves Vilterco or Pumers :-D

Sorry Pumeco.

As a tester, I have to stay independent, and can not team-up with anybody.
Time permitting, I offer help and beta testing for free to all who asks for it.
But I will stay independent.

Both words are equally important :

• Independent
• Motivated

When one joins a "team" one looses the "independent" part.

That's what I meant:

• The one with skill in design does the design.
• The one that can advise and test does the advising and testing.

The problem with a lot of stuff nowadays is that computers have taken away the requirement for skill.  But anyway, I doubt I'd ever produce a figure unless it was something I did in spare time at a relaxed pace.  But if it ever happend, I'd be sure to send it over to Vilters Testing Laboratories for some bulletproof testing before I decided to release it.

Computers have not replaced common sense yet,,,, Nor will they create anything for you for the most part.

It would be great if you could make a character in a day. Wait, they have programs for that already.....

I get what you're saying. On the other hand, I'm not sure how threads of this sort will affect creators like Teyon. If he reads this, he'll won't be able to have a bowel movement for a month. In many ways, there's a self-defeating effect for us in our enthusiasm for perfection and quality and the way it plays out in the forums. It's almost gotten to the point that if you want to release a human figure for Poser, you have to be so thick skinned as to not care at all. And that's not an improvement. How many people have started to make a figure and given up because undergoing this kind of scrutiny just isn't worth it? I personally know of more than a couple. Would a friendly environment not be more encouraging to those who actually have the skill to make such a thing? Or might we actually be driving these people away to use their talents elsewhere?

I think the problem is often the tone of the criticism; having X problem doesn't make a figure a piece of crap or somesuch, and there is no need to to say the latter; it has a technical issue which can be fixed.  Likewise someone else shouldn't be arguing that the issue doesn’t matter. One shouldn’t get too emotional about it. Funny you mention Teyon, because he posted over at RDNA just the other day asking why Poser users argue so much.  The post was soon followed by an argument... :(

I am shocked by this thread.

I'm all for constructive feedback that's the only way to improve, because when you sit on a project so long you are going to loose your fresh look and miss things.

I'm very lucky to have my very critical and experienced beta tester and am very grateful for his input even though he tends to give me a lot of extra work. But it makes the project much better.

But I do feel in this thread that the way how feedback is presented is heartbreaking.

Creators have feelings too! Try to add solutions or tips to your critique, try to help the creator out.

Hopefully figure creators aren't demotivated and given up to try after this thread.

Cause we need poser characters who can inspire artists to make beautiful renders.

Unfortunately from my views of the promos, Scarlet isn't the one who inspires me personally,

so no not gonna jump the V4 ship just yet.

But I'm ready to be inspired...

I am shocked by this thread.

I'm all for constructive feedback that's the only way to improve, because when you sit on a project so long you are going to loose your fresh look and miss things.

I'm very lucky to have my very critical and experienced beta tester and am very grateful for his input even though he tends to give me a lot of extra work. But it makes the project much better.

But I do feel in this thread that the way how feedback is presented is heartbreaking.

Creators have feelings too! Try to add solutions or tips to your critique, try to help the creator out.

Hopefully figure creators aren't demotivated and given up to try after this thread.

Cause we need poser characters who can inspire artists to make beautiful renders.

Unfortunately from my views of the promos, Scarlet isn't the one who inspires me personally,

so no not gonna jump the V4 ship just yet.

But I'm ready to be inspired...

I should render Scarlet in some of your absolutely gorgeous dynamic clothing -- though I agree with others that she doesn't look ready to be supported by third parties at this point. However, I also don't think the tone of this thread is going to encourage Scarlet's creator to fix those issues. And we wonder why so many figures are created and then quickly abandoned, despite all the good intentions of their creators. Well, if anyone wants to know, this is why. "Heartbreaking" is the right word. And if I were Sixus1, I wouldn't even know how to respond to this thread. For the sake of my mental health, I'd have to avoid reading the forums altogether. To say that the mesh has problems and demonstrate what you mean -- reasonable and helpful. To point out rigging issues -- perfectly legitimate. To say, "This figure is a piece of crap" -- that is bashing, plain and simple. And there's no excuse for it. In this community, it takes less than a day to go from reasonable to vile. If anything, anything were to persuade me to wave goodbye to Poser forever it would be this. Not the software features, not the figures, not the content, not the phone home activation in Game Dev, not the price, not the vendors -- but the community. I just don't want to be a part of it anymore.

And I expect I am far from alone in this feeling.

I don't read the forums or forums in general as they generally tend to go the same way... this one in particular. I did buy Scarlet I don't think it is the most perfecty figure of all time, nor do I think it will replace my V4, yet. I see potential in it and as in the early days of Dawn I took a leap that the developer in question who I do have respect for... will improve or correct problems people bring up. 

I test software for a living and I understand the challenges on a professional level that goes into QC. To be frank most folks that beta test or QC in general and haven't for years... or do it as volunteers and not professionally... are not QC experts. Takes a certain mindset and one that isn't actually entirely that common. :) So I am not surprised stuff got through a QC process.

That all being said, there is a difference between constructive criticism and destructive criticism. Using bold text, large worlds, combative language, etc... is the dark side of the force ;) Are folks entitled to opinions? Hell yes! As a person that gets in trouble for being honest... well I hear ya. But folks have a tendency to believe they are also entitled to be downright mean and call it opinion or valid criticism. No way, no how.  It is easier to tear someone down than it is to support as well as advise them of issues in a professional manner. 

Every figure I've seen thus far has had issues or has issues. The question that remains for me is what the developer will do, Scarlet has been out all of a couple of days, I recall when Dawn came out I heard all kinds of stuff around the same... heard it on about every figure in recent memory. Folks have mentioned the pricing well I still see many figures gen, gen2, etc that came out at similar pricings and others as well. I'm not concerned on the pricing bit all that much yet. 

I see potential with Scarlet as she sits as v1.0, she needs work, but I'm willing to be patient and see how things unfold before I have a final verdict. I await to see if sixus will fix the issues or not, the content that comes out, and where things evolve... cause I think long term not short term. I do believe we need a replacement that is V4 or better equivalent that is natively workable in Poser... is this it? Don't know to early to tell... 

My two cents, nuttin wrong with opinions, it is how you present them that is the problem I see here and forums, most people (note I say most not all ;) ) I don't think would act this way if the person was sitting in front of them and say things in this manner. The net gives you a anonymous face that you don't connect to the text, your guard is down, you are a different person than you would be in a family, friend, public, work... setting.... so it is easy to get into this sort of bad habits of destructive criticism.

Just my -2.5 cents... Use Scarlet, don't use Scarlet, love her, don't love her... but at least be a bit more constructive and less destructive in feedback, think of the children! ;)

David Wrote:
"Computers have not replaced common sense yet ..."

Much too often there is no common sense to replace!

Doesn't matter what a Vendor make, add ons, characters, figures, clothes, Merchants Resources. 

It seems that the work gone into something so many times goes unappreciated, instead of patience on something that's only been available a few days this thread has turned into a beat down of the skills of a person who has feelings. 

I'm not going to say Scarlett is perfect but has any figure been when first released, there's usually service releases after or updates.  

This community shouldn't be bashing him but trying to encourage improvements or updates to the figure, honestly if i read this as the vendor in question i'd say stuff ya and walk away.  Look into your own hearts on how you'd feel to be on receiving end of a lot of whats been said because honestly I wouldn't like it personally. 

There's errors, ok fine fair enough, but point them out nicely, be polite in criticism because you don't know what goes on in that person's offline life any more than they do yours. 

Just my penny's worth of thoughts on this. I'm nobody to you guys but i'm somebody to others, so is Sixus1 

Doesn't matter what a Vendor make, add ons, characters, figures, clothes, Merchants Resources. 

It seems that the work gone into something so many times goes unappreciated, instead of patience on something that's only been available a few days this thread has turned into a beat down of the skills of a person who has feelings. 

I'm not going to say Scarlett is perfect but has any figure been when first released, there's usually service releases after or updates.  

This community shouldn't be bashing him but trying to encourage improvements or updates to the figure, honestly if i read this as the vendor in question i'd say stuff ya and walk away.  Look into your own hearts on how you'd feel to be on receiving end of a lot of whats been said because honestly I wouldn't like it personally. 

There's errors, ok fine fair enough, but point them out nicely, be polite in criticism because you don't know what goes on in that person's offline life any more than they do yours. 

Just my penny's worth of thoughts on this. I'm nobody to you guys but i'm somebody to others, so is Sixus1 

I think the problem is that a flawed product is presented, and before people can point out the flaws and suggest ways to fix, other people start raving about how "OMG it's the best ever!" and "It's perfect, better than anything out there". The percieved anger about the flaws is most likely originally aimed at the people who are thus praising a flawed or broken product, not the creator, but tone and intent are impossible to read on the internet. And when the flaws ARE pointed out, others will often claim they aren't flaws, or "you don't see them when rendered", which is patently (and provably) untrue.

Doesn't matter what a Vendor make, add ons, characters, figures, clothes, Merchants Resources. 

It seems that the work gone into something so many times goes unappreciated, instead of patience on something that's only been available a few days this thread has turned into a beat down of the skills of a person who has feelings. 

I'm not going to say Scarlett is perfect but has any figure been when first released, there's usually service releases after or updates.  

This community shouldn't be bashing him but trying to encourage improvements or updates to the figure, honestly if i read this as the vendor in question i'd say stuff ya and walk away.  Look into your own hearts on how you'd feel to be on receiving end of a lot of whats been said because honestly I wouldn't like it personally. 

There's errors, ok fine fair enough, but point them out nicely, be polite in criticism because you don't know what goes on in that person's offline life any more than they do yours. 

Just my penny's worth of thoughts on this. I'm nobody to you guys but i'm somebody to others, so is Sixus1 

I think the problem is that a flawed product is presented, and before people can point out the flaws and suggest ways to fix, other people start raving about how "OMG it's the best ever!" and "It's perfect, better than anything out there". The percieved anger about the flaws is most likely originally aimed at the people who are thus praising a flawed or broken product, not the creator, but tone and intent are impossible to read on the internet. And when the flaws ARE pointed out, others will often claim they aren't flaws, or "you don't see them when rendered", which is patently (and provably) untrue.

I have heard that argument before that hey all these couple of people said it was awesome and therefore I was irate. I don't know about most people as I am only my lonesome but really I make my own opinions. If folks love it that is fine, people get excited, ... I don't think t hat means folks should then get all irate and blame it on the good stuff folks say as an excuse to be destructive. I been on the net a long time many forums, ran them, tone and intent IMHO is very easy to read in posts. Maybe that is just me but I think written word tone comes out rather nicely... I read a lot of fiction so maybe that's it :)  Folks are going to say what they will. Nature of the beastie, doesn't mean it has to get impolite and destructive. I appreciate honesty and I boil down a lot of this anyways reading through this post anyways, but... I still believe that there are better ways to communicate dis-satisfaction and the like than some have done in this forum thread. 

Doesn't matter what a Vendor make, add ons, characters, figures, clothes, Merchants Resources. 

It seems that the work gone into something so many times goes unappreciated, instead of patience on something that's only been available a few days this thread has turned into a beat down of the skills of a person who has feelings. 

I'm not going to say Scarlett is perfect but has any figure been when first released, there's usually service releases after or updates.  

This community shouldn't be bashing him but trying to encourage improvements or updates to the figure, honestly if i read this as the vendor in question i'd say stuff ya and walk away.  Look into your own hearts on how you'd feel to be on receiving end of a lot of whats been said because honestly I wouldn't like it personally. 

There's errors, ok fine fair enough, but point them out nicely, be polite in criticism because you don't know what goes on in that person's offline life any more than they do yours. 

Just my penny's worth of thoughts on this. I'm nobody to you guys but i'm somebody to others, so is Sixus1 

I think the problem is that a flawed product is presented, and before people can point out the flaws and suggest ways to fix, other people start raving about how "OMG it's the best ever!" and "It's perfect, better than anything out there". The percieved anger about the flaws is most likely originally aimed at the people who are thus praising a flawed or broken product, not the creator, but tone and intent are impossible to read on the internet. And when the flaws ARE pointed out, others will often claim they aren't flaws, or "you don't see them when rendered", which is patently (and provably) untrue.

I have heard that argument before that hey all these couple of people said it was awesome and therefore I was irate. I don't know about most people as I am only my lonesome but really I make my own opinions. If folks love it that is fine, people get excited, ... I don't think t hat means folks should then get all irate and blame it on the good stuff folks say as an excuse to be destructive. I been on the net a long time many forums, ran them, tone and intent IMHO is very easy to read in posts. Maybe that is just me but I think written word tone comes out rather nicely... I read a lot of fiction so maybe that's it :)  Folks are going to say what they will. Nature of the beastie, doesn't mean it has to get impolite and destructive. I appreciate honesty and I boil down a lot of this anyways reading through this post anyways, but... I still believe that there are better ways to communicate dis-satisfaction and the like than some have done in this forum thread. 

And in this very thread I saw the flaws pointed out, and naysayers immediately try to shout them down with blatantly and provably untrue statements. C'est la vie.

I don't think this thread has been particularly hostile. People have a right to critique a figure or product they paid good money for, and if those critiques are angry then there's a reason for that.

The hostility in the community overall is something that's been frustrating to me for quite a while now, but I can't do anything about it because the PTB won't let me. So as long as people aren't killing each other, this is pretty much the way it is. It's also a big reason why most content artists/vendors avoid the forums these days.

Constructive criticism is always better than outright bashing for the sake of bashing. I don't think I've spotted any direct attacks on Sixus1's character as a person. Negative reviews are part of the game and require a thick skin. Having people tell you it's good when it's really not, just to spare your feelings doesn't help you or anybody else. If you (and I mean you in general here - not anyone in particular), can't handle your work being called crap when it's crap then you need to find a different job, and any studio will tell you that. And I'm not saying Scarlet is crap - I haven't touched her. I don't think she is, she just has some issues. There are other figures out there that really are crap. Some of them exist in everyone's Poser runtime.

Doesn't matter what a Vendor make, add ons, characters, figures, clothes, Merchants Resources. 

It seems that the work gone into something so many times goes unappreciated, instead of patience on something that's only been available a few days this thread has turned into a beat down of the skills of a person who has feelings. 

I'm not going to say Scarlett is perfect but has any figure been when first released, there's usually service releases after or updates.  

This community shouldn't be bashing him but trying to encourage improvements or updates to the figure, honestly if i read this as the vendor in question i'd say stuff ya and walk away.  Look into your own hearts on how you'd feel to be on receiving end of a lot of whats been said because honestly I wouldn't like it personally. 

There's errors, ok fine fair enough, but point them out nicely, be polite in criticism because you don't know what goes on in that person's offline life any more than they do yours. 

Just my penny's worth of thoughts on this. I'm nobody to you guys but i'm somebody to others, so is Sixus1 

I think the problem is that a flawed product is presented, and before people can point out the flaws and suggest ways to fix, other people start raving about how "OMG it's the best ever!" and "It's perfect, better than anything out there". The percieved anger about the flaws is most likely originally aimed at the people who are thus praising a flawed or broken product, not the creator, but tone and intent are impossible to read on the internet. And when the flaws ARE pointed out, others will often claim they aren't flaws, or "you don't see them when rendered", which is patently (and provably) untrue.

I have heard that argument before that hey all these couple of people said it was awesome and therefore I was irate. I don't know about most people as I am only my lonesome but really I make my own opinions. If folks love it that is fine, people get excited, ... I don't think t hat means folks should then get all irate and blame it on the good stuff folks say as an excuse to be destructive. I been on the net a long time many forums, ran them, tone and intent IMHO is very easy to read in posts. Maybe that is just me but I think written word tone comes out rather nicely... I read a lot of fiction so maybe that's it :)  Folks are going to say what they will. Nature of the beastie, doesn't mean it has to get impolite and destructive. I appreciate honesty and I boil down a lot of this anyways reading through this post anyways, but... I still believe that there are better ways to communicate dis-satisfaction and the like than some have done in this forum thread. 

And in this very thread I saw the flaws pointed out, and naysayers immediately try to shout them down with blatantly and provably untrue statements. C'est la vie.

Yep two sides of the equation both sides need to keep it professionally like :) ... but one thing about destructive like criticism it's like a plague highly contagious ... infectious, spreads and the like... leaps all over the place ... Good talk by the way. :)

I am going to stop. There is no comparison between Roxie and Scarlet.

I totally agree, Even after spending hours trying to morph Roxie in the faceroom, she still looks like a psychopathic killer with flat eyes and a very limited range of expressions. (This may well be my lack of skill, but a figure that is easier to use is better for me, in my mind,) A certain person has made a reputation working with those characteristics (aka: girl with blade). And good for him. But it's not really my thing. However, given her superior mesh and rigging in the places where it really counts, I'll definitely keep her in mind should I develop an odd penchant for rendering extreme closeups of girls' buttcracks. My purposes, which include character and portrait renders, Scarlet is much better suited. She's exceptionally good where it matters -- to me. And there's really no competition between the two.

If you feel ripped off, ask for a refund, and push your case politely until you get one. Me, I am very happy with my purchase.