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Poser - OFFICIAL F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2024 Dec 04 4:13 pm)
Subject: Male clothing Doesn't sell ...
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The girls tend to be more popular ... And all the new stuff nowadays is mostly Genesis based. I just use Poser and I have a fair amount of stuff from Daz for M3 and M4, and use Wardrobe Wizard to convert it for James and the other (older) male figures. There's still some Poser male clothes on my wishlist; pennies are tight at the moment, though.
I sold Biblical era clothing for many years at Rendo for both male and female. The male Biblical clothing outsold the female clothing. Years later, Biblical clothing lost its appeal and modern female skimpy clothing has taken over by societal preference. The buying customers decide what is popular. Pappy
A_Sunbeam posted at 11:15AM Mon, 23 October 2017 - #4316561
The girls tend to be more popular ... And all the new stuff nowadays is mostly Genesis based. I just use Poser and I have a fair amount of stuff from Daz for M3 and M4, and use Wardrobe Wizard to convert it for James and the other (older) male figures. There's still some Poser male clothes on my wishlist; pennies are tight at the moment, though. I didn't really make any distinctions between the male figures and female figures when doing the clothing category, but would you be interested in seeing a section set up like that in the directory?
Looking at my own wardrobe, I conclude we men are simple creatures (if I am a typical example) who generally don't need much variety in our outfits. Even back when I was younger and a rather stylish fellow, there wasn't too much in the way of lurex, latex or ostrich feathers.
Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.
Personally, I would welcome more male clothing. In my finished works I found I have more males in my images than females. I'm also NOT a fan of skimpy clothes. I've even created mat-file body coverings to go UNDER some of the skimpy stuff. They just embarrass me! I have grandchildren looking at my art!!
Boni
"Be Hero to Yourself" -- Peter Tork
Boni posted at 7:45PM Mon, 23 October 2017 - #4316593
Personally, I would welcome more male clothing. In my finished works I found I have more males in my images than females. I'm also NOT a fan of skimpy clothes. I've even created mat-file body coverings to go UNDER some of the skimpy stuff. They just embarrass me! I have grandchildren looking at my art!!
You know kids, Boni. They'll just think granny's getting her groove on. 
My kids aren't in the least bit bothered about nekkid Poser figures. They're more interested in Daddy's Dalek models than a set of Poser norks.
Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.
In real life that seems to be the case. Just look at how my wife commandeered all the closets in the house, including mine. I'm just saying.
Software: Daz Studio 4.15, Photoshop CC, Zbrush 2022, Blender 3.3, Silo 2.3, Filter Forge 4. Marvelous Designer 7
Hardware: self built Intel Core i7 8086K, 64GB RAM, RTX 3090 .
"If you spend too much time arguing about software, you're spending too little time creating art!" ~ SomeSmartAss
"A critic is a legless man who teaches running." ~ Channing Pollock
I also think female renders are just more popular. When I go looking for male clothing it's usually pretty specific, either scifi or something useful like a suit, tuxedo, uniform or what I'm searching for now which is an old-time nightshirt and cap for a Scrooge Christmas image. And yeah, the closet analogy fits runtime directories too. :)
...... Kendra
I was around for the great Why is there no male clothing piefights from the M3 era._ It boils down to this:
I don't want to make male clothing. Why won't the customers stop asking for it.
I made a niche product for a niche figure - it didn't sell well, so I'll never make a male clothing product again. It is all the customer's fault."
I don't want to make male clothing. Why won't the customers stop asking for it.
I tried to sell male outfits They were poorly made, and I wanted 25% more than what I ask for a comparable female outfit. Pay no attention to the fact that the plaids go in 3 different directions. Pay no attention to the fact that it has no movement morphs (like my female outfits). It is all the customer's fault."
I don't want to make male clothing. Why won't the customers stop asking for it.
I made a male suit to sell. All of the textures were in colors and patterns that no man would be caught dead in. It didn't sell. It is all the customer's fault."
The vendors are more concerned about their art than they are the customer's art. And they are only interested in being a Frazetta or Elvgren wannabe.
The good news is that if you have Poser Pro (for the fitting room), Wardrobe Wizard, and/or Xdresser, (with appropriate plug-ins) it doesn't matter. Someone new to Poser won't be able to move outside of Fantasy/Pinup, because there simply isn't content available.
The good news is that if you have Poser Pro (for the fitting room), Wardrobe Wizard, and/or Xdresser, (with appropriate plug-ins) it doesn't matter. Someone new to Poser won't be able to move outside of Fantasy/Pinup, because there simply isn't content available.
There is another option . Learn to model and make your own
This is what I did.
Also it future proofs the figure of your choice
(Daz G2 for me) , from being abandoned by the merchants as they
inevitably do in favor of the new & shiny. 
EClark1894 posted at 9:39AM Fri, 27 October 2017 - #4316794
willyb53 posted at 11:21PM Thu, 26 October 2017 - #4316785
I have made a couple of items for Dusk. I will say that sales have not been outstanding. https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/?uid=546285 Bill
Honestly, Bill, I would say that the Hivewire animals are far more popular than Dawn or Dusk.
I should add, that while I do think that the animals are more popular, than Dusk or Dawn, I perceive that to be a reality of how well and thoroughly the Genesis figures have permeated this market, and not as a slight to Dusk or Dawn.
Yeah, about that. If your goal is single image with single figures, that is an option.
I am an animator I render hundreds of frames for multiple characters for multiple shots. https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2TYEp536iB8aVBBdHJWRE9jODg/view?usp=sharing
(i.e. need a complete wardrobe for multiple figures, for multiple days, for your graphic novels) that isn't really an option.
Well I use Daz studio So multiple Characters( Human & nonhuman) Can easily wear Anything I make via Auto fit.
Also if you a Create proper base Development mesh you can create a complete outfit in ONE afternoon if you know how to use your modeling tools efficiently.
wolf359 posted at 2:44PM Sun, 29 October 2017 - #4316911
Maxon Cinema4d Studio Studio with BodyPaint 3D
Looks good :)
============================================================
The
Artist that will fight for decades to conquer their media.
Even if you never know their name ,your know their Art.
Dark Sphere Mage Vengeance
In regards to male-clothing sales appeal, IMO: The reason that some male clothing items don't sell well might be due to limited variability in what men actually wear. If you have a pair of pants and a shirt, you're considered just about "fully dressed" if you'r a guy. :)
So, for a complete, basic, wardrobe for a standard male figure, what do you need? Long pants, short pants, long-sleeve dress shirt, a knit shirt, some underwear if necessary, a pair of sock and, perhaps, two different sets of shoes.
There, done. With a paint program, you can make those look different, even appear to be of different types of materials, with very, very, little effort. One can even make decent shorts from a pair of long pants only using a transmap.
Women's clothing, as any man who's had a girlfriend or wife knows, is as varied as the flowers in a field... So, modelers can really get creative and can use many, many, different real-world examples as inspiration. All the while, a man's "knit shirt" remains... a knit shirt.
Taking this assumption to heart, providing it is true, then what does a creator need to do in order to sell male clothing? If it's "standard wardrobe fare" it needs to be of excellent quality, with great textures, lots of movement morphs, and must demonstrate good conforming/deforming in the promo renders. For a dynamic shirt like that, it really has to shine in its demonstration of quality and ease of use.
In other words, if you're producing male clothing, your quality of standard male clothing items must be prominently displayed in everything you provide for its marketing.
But, one could focus on unusual or unique clothing and gain some successes, there. Period dress, armor, job-related clothing (spacesuit, uniforms, lineman gear, etc) could sell fairly well, simply because they are dramatically unique and interesting.
Lastly - Quality sells. A pair of generic pants with crappy textures, evidence of bad conforming, few options listed and no extras isn't going to sell at all. There are fifty-eleven other "pants" out there and users would likely rather retexture ten of those than take a gamble on a product that already looks bad on its face. Quality sells and vendors who are known for selling quality items will always get the lion's share of purchases of "generic" clothing items. (IMO) For instance, if I buy a Hongyu generic button-up shirt, I know that even though it's a generic button-up shirt, it's going to be of outstanding quality and I won't ever "need" another generic button-up shirt... ever. And, because of the quality, even if they're "generic", I've bought every single piece of generic clothing from Hongyu that I can use and have modified them for other figures. There are very few other creators I would ever consider buying a piece of "generic" clothing of any sort from. (Not shilling for Hongyu, just demonstrating how far "quality" would be considered when a consumer examines something that is relatively "generic." "Unique" clothing items have their own appeal factor. Quality, however, is always most important for customer sentiment.)
I know some just don't know or have the experience n there trying and eventually there get there. but the ones that quality isn't there top priority just will never get anywhere.
Aery Soul was a top vender cause they had quality. It's a shame they didn't make matching male out fits.
male cloths are more or less a niche. niches need stiches cause there's no faster way to put a hole in your pockets.
============================================================
The
Artist that will fight for decades to conquer their media.
Even if you never know their name ,your know their Art.
Dark Sphere Mage Vengeance
Curious fact: Men's clothing has been outselling women's clothing in the "real" world for a good few years now, by about 10-20%. It's a $110 billion industry and growing at an estimated 8% or so faster than women's, which is why - if you take the time to look around - you see a lot of men's clothing stores and websites popping up lately. The idea that men don't need or want much variety in their clothing is an outdated myth, especially by today's standards. And there are just as many styles for men as there are for women. I have several men's clothing websites bookmarked for reference with countless designs ranging from urban wear, club wear, to business and formal. There's a lot more variety than just color and fabric patterns. And that's just contemporary clothing. When you factor in historic, fantasy, sci-fi, etc, and then mix in a bit of imagination and creativity, essentially an artist could crank out a new outfit a week for the next 10 years and would barely put a dent in what is possible just for men's clothing.
The truth of it is that this is a female centric market, and most of the people making clothing don't put the effort into it that is required for conforming clothing to look right, especially on male clothing. Some do but most don't. It takes a lot of time to create all those movement and adjustment morphs and it's a lot easier and faster to make some skin-tight skankwear. And because that stuff sells like hotcakes, that's what most people make.
AmbientShade posted at 10:04PM Tue, 31 October 2017 - #4317104
The truth of it is that this is a female centric market, and most of the people making clothing don't put the effort into it that is required for conforming clothing to look right, especially on male clothing. Some do but most don't. It takes a lot of time to create all those movement and adjustment morphs and it's a lot easier and faster to make some skin-tight skankwear. And because that stuff sells like hotcakes, that's what most people make.
And that's the crux of the matter, isn't it? People going for the easy sell. I swear, if I hear one more person tell me how they should be making ten times the amount of money for the clothing and props they make for Poser and DAZ, I'm going to ask them why they're doing this, then? If I knew I could command ten times what I'm making here, I'd be gone.
EClark1894 posted at 10:37PM Tue, 31 October 2017 - #4317108
And that's the crux of the matter, isn't it? People going for the easy sell. I swear, if I hear one more person tell me how they should be making ten times the amount of money for the clothing and props they make for Poser and DAZ, I'm going to ask them why they're doing this, then? If I knew I could command ten times what I'm making here, I'd be gone.
There was a time when that was true, but the 3D content market has become so saturated and everybody with a free copy of wings3d or blender and a few hours on a weekend to spare is selling their half-baked models on a thousand different websites for $5 or less - if its something they made themselves to begin with. A lot of it is stolen from other artists/sites. I've found people trying to sell Genesis on several of the big sites on multiple occasions. So combined with the out of control piracy, the days of selling models for much more than that are pretty much gone. Those that make good money are the ones that make it a full time job and put every effort into every detail, and they've been in the game for years so they have an established following. You can still make a living at it, but it takes a lot more effort and time. Or find other ways to turn it into an income stream, like producing comics or animations and grow an audience that way.
AmbientShade posted at 3:42AM Wed, 01 November 2017 - #4317109
EClark1894 posted at 10:37PM Tue, 31 October 2017 - #4317108
And that's the crux of the matter, isn't it? People going for the easy sell. I swear, if I hear one more person tell me how they should be making ten times the amount of money for the clothing and props they make for Poser and DAZ, I'm going to ask them why they're doing this, then? If I knew I could command ten times what I'm making here, I'd be gone.
There was a time when that was true, but the 3D content market has become so saturated and everybody with a free copy of wings3d or blender and a few hours on a weekend to spare is selling their half-baked models on a thousand different websites for $5 or less - if its something they made themselves to begin with. A lot of it is stolen from other artists/sites. I've found people trying to sell Genesis on several of the big sites on multiple occasions. So combined with the out of control piracy, the days of selling models for much more than that are pretty much gone. Those that make good money are the ones that make it a full time job and put every effort into every detail, and they've been in the game for years so they have an established following. You can still make a living at it, but it takes a lot more effort and time. Or find other ways to turn it into an income stream, like producing comics or animations and grow an audience that way.
I thought about that. Here's some problems .
1.Are you sure what your buying is not someone's else's copyrighted stuff ? If you didn't know any better you could buy superman ,etc etc I don't know all the comics n anime characters in all the countryes and make a comic ,never knowing it belongs to DC or Bollywood.
2.conforing cloths is not made for animation ,so...
3.if you want to make a sluty comic you got plenty of conforming stuff to buy. but what if it's pirates or something else.
4...
============================================================
The
Artist that will fight for decades to conquer their media.
Even if you never know their name ,your know their Art.
Dark Sphere Mage Vengeance
RorrKonn posted at 10:18PM Wed, 01 November 2017 - #4317118
I thought about that. Here's some problems .
1.Are you sure what your buying is not someone's else's copyrighted stuff ? If you didn't know any better you could buy superman ,etc etc I don't know all the comics n anime characters in all the countryes and make a comic ,never knowing it belongs to DC or Bollywood.
I was talking about content you make yourself mostly. But that's why we buy and sell content anyway. And if you're creating your own characters then you probably aren't looking to buy a superman model, if you're intention is to market your comic, since you don't have the rights to superman.
2.conforing cloths is not made for animation ,so...
Where did you hear that?
3.if you want to make a sluty comic you got plenty of conforming stuff to buy. but what if it's pirates or something else.
Well those seem to sell pretty well, so...
4...
Yep...
AmbientShade posted at 10:00PM Thu, 02 November 2017 - #4317217
No, I wasn't saying that at all.
Sorry, I was talking to RorKonn.
EClark1894 posted at 3:17PM Fri, 03 November 2017 - #4317204
I'm not sure what the argument is here... Are you saying we shouldn't make stuff for men, because... pirates might steal it? I suppose that is a concern, but hardly a reason not to create for men.
Oh no I was saying we need more "not talking about pirated stuff " pirate looken stuff ,steam punk etc etc content. cause we have enough slut content
============================================================
The
Artist that will fight for decades to conquer their media.
Even if you never know their name ,your know their Art.
Dark Sphere Mage Vengeance
AmbientShade ,I've animate conforming cloths. results may very. depending what app or cloths you use.
I have nothing against slut where or comics. but I want more of a variety .sluty pirateteses ,sluty steam punks etc etc ;)
============================================================
The
Artist that will fight for decades to conquer their media.
Even if you never know their name ,your know their Art.
Dark Sphere Mage Vengeance
AmbientShade posted at 11:50AM Sat, 04 November 2017 - #4317104 ...
The truth of it is that this is a female centric market, and most of the people making clothing don't put the effort into it that is required for conforming clothing to look right, especially on male clothing. Some do but most don't. It takes a lot of time to create all those movement and adjustment morphs and it's a lot easier and faster to make some skin-tight skankwear. And because that stuff sells like hotcakes, that's what most people make.
Agreed. This is generally a "render your dolly's boobs" market. Though, I have to say that most of the quality products and renders aren't entirely focused on that. I will also say that product quality is a true issue, here. I make most of my own stuff, so don't go to the marketplace looking for content. But, I like getting something new, every once-in-awhile, so I keep my eyes open for deals. (Mostly hair, since I suck at making it, and specialty items that look really cool.) Whenever I step outside of my comfort zone of a select few vendors I know that make quality stuff, I get disappointed. And, I don't have to buy it in order to know it's not worthy of being bought - I can tell if it's crap from a suitably revealing product page, no need to buy it and see... I do not understand why someone who obviously spent a good deal of time creating a product doesn't invest a suitable amount of time on rigging it properly or creating some simple correction morphs or JCMs, choosing instead to release their lovingly textured product, with fifty different cut&paste-Photoshop-resource-Google-search-seemless-pattern-download as well as an example of "I discovered HSV", "as is" and then expect to be able to stand in the ranks of dedicated 3D artists who actually care about the quality of their work...
/rant off
In short - Yes, it's a boob market. Yes, there's a lot of junk in it. BUT, there is always room for a quality product, even if it's male clothing. I think that if someone truly produces a good, versatile, product of any sort, they will be able to sell it.
And, if they don't think they can make enough money on such a product, given how much quality time went into it, then... price it higher. They're not going for garage-day sales with such a product, so stop trying to sell to those customers! A full, high-quality, clothing set for a male figure with everything needed, including accessories and alternate geometry or extra clothing items, if marketed correctly and presented well, can command "top price" from those who are actively seeking out such products. $40-$50 list for a complete high-quality wardrobe with excellent UVs, suitable for easy retexturing, great rigging, good selection of basic and movement morphs, and including shoes, socks, pants, shorts, underwear (top&bottom) two shirts, a light coat and a baseball cap? That's a steal. Make that $60, instead. Don't accept discounts higher than 10% introductory, no coupons, buyers later get a "freebie" that is a sample of the next product pack and a link to a questionnaire about their satisfaction with the product, just to show them the artist cares about their opinion..
It ain't that hard. IF one thinks a market doesn't exist, one goes out and creates it. If it's a small market, then make it "not small" by being the best one in it.
I would pay a premium price for high quality clothes. It seems too many developers just adopt the "male stuff does not sell" and go on their merry way making more skimpy outfits for females. Strange but there are developers at renderotica that produce only male material and several tell me their stuff sells very well......
drafter69 posted at 4:11PM Tue, 07 November 2017 - #4317537
I would pay a premium price for high quality clothes. It seems too many developers just adopt the "male stuff does not sell" and go on their merry way making more skimpy outfits for females. Strange but there are developers at renderotica that produce only male material and several tell me their stuff sells very well......
I believe the adult oriented market is a completely different animal than the non-adult Poser market.
EClark1894 posted at 9:40AM Wed, 08 November 2017 - #4317548
drafter69 posted at 4:11PM Tue, 07 November 2017 - #4317537
I would pay a premium price for high quality clothes. It seems too many developers just adopt the "male stuff does not sell" and go on their merry way making more skimpy outfits for females. Strange but there are developers at renderotica that produce only male material and several tell me their stuff sells very well......
I believe the adult oriented market is a completely different animal than the non-adult Poser market.
Clothes for Males are clothes no matter where they are sold. The fact that they are sold on a site that allows adult material is of no relevance....
I would think people go to where they know what then need is there. we don't go to the Harley store looken for Hummers.
============================================================
The
Artist that will fight for decades to conquer their media.
Even if you never know their name ,your know their Art.
Dark Sphere Mage Vengeance
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I keep hearing that. And it really doesn't matter what figure you're talking about. So my question today is Why? Are vendors not making stuff for the male figures solely because they BELIEVE that male stuff doesn't sell or are they satisfied by sales data that it's true? Is there something they could do or make to change that dynamic or is it solely up to the customers to turn that around?