Hi, once again i run in some trouble with PP11.2. I created a Prop and some Morphs for it. So far so good. After loading the first Morph in, i dailed it up to 1 and my mesh "exploded" so to speak. I pull the poser manual for advice and surprice, surprice, ther was an answer. It states and i quote:

If the morph works but it makes the figure “explode”, repeat the process. This time, check the Attempt Vertex Order Correction option in the Load Morph Target dialog. This might resolve the problem.

Sure, it kind of does...my entire scene went down the toilett. I repeated the process and every time i checked the Box "Attempt vertex Order Correction" PP11.2 crashes. Seems to me i found a new "feature". Anyone here got a similar experience? Should i send a notice to the help desk?

This sounds to me like a bad morph.

Just FYI, when creating morphs, you cannot delete or add polygons, you can only move the existing polygons around. If your morph is causing an "explosion" then you have polygons missing or polygons that were not in the original exported object file.

This has nothing to do with PP11.2 but is about your model itself and more specifically the user created morph.

@Glitterati3D Thank you for your input. I build the prop myself, it's a simple Bed with a mattress. So, i will be to blame for this. The morph was only a body shaped imprint, to let it look like someone is laying on the bed. Just some pushed down polys, nothing fancy. The poly count is in both objects the same. I solved the problem with the explosion by loading the bed as obj file and exporting it back to the original file, so it's getting overwritten. I repeated this with the morph and mark the box for morph target only. After this, everything works fine...until i choose to tick the Box "Attempt vertex Order Correction". It kills the program instandly.

Glitterati3D posted at 5:00PM Thu, 31 October 2019 - #4368765

This sounds to me like a bad morph.

Just FYI, when creating morphs, you cannot delete or add polygons, you can only move the existing polygons around. If your morph is causing an "explosion" then you have polygons missing or polygons that were not in the original exported object file.

This has nothing to do with PP11.2 but is about your model itself and more specifically the user created morph.

I disagree. A morph target doesn't care about polygons, but if you've inadvertently added or subtracted vertices, Poser will throw up an error when you try to apply it.

Poser should throw up an error if you try to apply any invalid morph target: crashing is never an acceptable response. To be fair, I doubt that the changes which were made to produce 11.2 would have affected this behaviour; it's more likely a long-standing bug in the vertex correction code. I never used that much so I can't offer an opinion.

Try importing your morph target OBJ instead of applying it, and see if it comes in all right.

@EnglishBob

"Try importing your morph target OBJ instead of applying it, and see if it comes in all right."

Could you explain the difference to me please, if you don't mind? How do you import a morph target to an specific objekt? And more important, who do i miss this option for that long periot of time. Okay, the last question is clearly not a question directed to someone else other than me.

Ok I was now wondering as I use the Obj morphs target allot ... have not for a while but it is sure useful So I made some tests like mentioned with and without "Attempt vertex Order Correction" then also ran a test with a wrong Obj to get the error message that the " Target geometry has wrong number of vertices " now either way I could not simulate or cause a crash I just would get an error message. using the "Attempt vertex Order Correction" worked without any issues

I am still running on Poser 11.1 and in my case impossible to make it crash .... just getting a error message if I mess up

blackbonner posted at 6:38PM Thu, 31 October 2019 - #4368785

@EnglishBob

"Try importing your morph target OBJ instead of applying it, and see if it comes in all right."

Could you explain the difference to me please, if you don't mind?

My bad - all I meant was to import the morph target by itself, using File > Import > Wavefront OBJ. This is to see if Poser has any problem with the file (although I suspect it's to do with the vertex order correction).

gate posted at 6:38PM Thu, 31 October 2019 - #4368789

using the "Attempt vertex Order Correction" worked without any issues

Did you use a morph target that needed vertex order correction? It may be that the crash only happens when Poser has to do something to the morph. My 11.1 has stopped working, so I can't test this myself.

I loaded a bunch of obj morph targets also corrupted ones but no crash at all wanted to make sure that mine still works LOL ... generated a few using magnet tools and Wave tool on Props and figures mixed with morphs also .... saved these as Obj's and imported as morph targets .. no issues at all all worked just great. also it sure is important that there are no issues as for the import of morphs made in 3rd Programs

I could assume ( Not a provocation ) as Poser is mostly based on open source using many 3rd party Pytons actually it runs that way based on Pyton scripts that after the update, with the known issue that many 3rd Pytons get errors due the change of the version number that it was never considered that it could also of damaged built in Pytons and that slowly the issues might come to daylight.

If the changed affected that many Private pyton scripts it might as well affect the Internals it is like a rat tail one pulls in the next ....

So someone else might have to test the features on P11.2 or you run another test by just generating some simple surface changes on your mesh then saving as Obj and import em back as morph target .... try it with some other meshes if you still get these crashes then there is something terribly wrong

try to set these options when exporting the Obj morph target

assign a group in your mesh or more then one but should do the trick if it is static to have the whole as one group if you have from import many groups ( due Material settings ) remove them and create just the ones you need

Question: Are you exporting the prop to another program to make the morph? If so, which program? Blender, for example, will ask you about vertex order when you export back into Poser. It's been awhile since I've done it, but I think it also asks on import.

Thanks to all of you. There is lots of stuff I have to check now. @eclark1894 Yes, I use Cinema 4D r12 for building my props and i re-imported the obj file to create the morphs. I noticed that the c4d obj file is smaller in terms of the amount of kilobits. After my work around [import the file, exporting it back without touching it at all] the file size is significantly higher. If I open the file next to the original once in c4d there is no difference in faces or poly count. The geometry is still the same. Hm...strange?! I sometimes have made very special experiences with my poser version because I use a german licence on a PC, set to the german keyboard and language. This has previously caused problems a native English user did not experience. For example, in my version OP 11.1 there was no way to use the 3d-path tool. It was simply not available, not even grayed out, it was literally not in the build. I had to change the keyboard and system language to get it to work. Nowadays the problem is solved, it works properly now in the german version. But again, thank you all for your thoughts and ideas.

That's why I was asking if you exported it to another program, then imported it back in. Some programs, like Blender will shift around the vertex order, not to be confused with count. Vertex order will tell you the position of a vertex. Vertex count will tell you the number of vertices. These are NOT the same thing and why your model looks the same on import than it does on export. I know that sounds confusing, but think of it like this: You have a square. You export it. The program you export it to may turn the model upside down, then you export it back, your model is still upside down, but it's a square, so you can't tell that and don't know. It looks the same. But Poser knows, because the vertices that used to be on the top are now on the bottom, so the order is not right.

@EClark1894 Okay, i get that. So, what do i have to do to avoid this? More specific ask, is there a program, that handles vertex and faces like poser does? Or did i do the right thing with my little work around i described earlier? I mean, it works for me, but the next step would be to create a free prop or a product to sell it here on Renderosity. I don't want to mess up other peoples work with a broken item of mine.

Well, if it works for you, then no problem. As for distribution, Rendo has Quality controls in place, so they'll test it before they let you sell it in there store. DAZ and Hivewire are the same. I don't know about CGBytes, but I would assume it's the same. Freebies are another matter. If you're worried about that see if you can line up a few testers first by asking people in the forums to test your product.

blackbonner posted at 10:50AM Sat, 02 November 2019 - #4368850

... I use Cinema 4D r12

Are you aware of the Riptide plug-in? It was made by a creator of Poser content, to work around problems he saw in the C4D native OBJ import/export. As a result it's specifically designed to produce Poser-friendly results. Sadly the Pro version is the only option if you're running r12, so you'll need to consider if the cost is worth it.

I noticed that the c4d obj file is smaller in terms of the amount of kilobits. After my work around [import the file, exporting it back without touching it at all] the file size is significantly higher.

This is nothing to worry about, by itself. Different programs format the OBJ file differently even though it's exactly the same model. It's just a text file so size differences are not necessarily a problem.

@EClark1894 The Beta-Testing by members of the Forum is a really good idea. I will keep that in mind if i have something worth sharing. Thanks again. @EnglishBob Ah, that rings a bell. The program version C4D r12 is about 9 years old and i tryed many plugins for it, but i don't remember all of them. I most likely heard of the Riptide Plugin and i will check it out. I do remember that i had years ago the problem that a obj file in C4D can have more then one Material, but after importing this obj file into poser, it has only one material left. In this context i might have come across Riptide. Thank you as well!