Ok, here's a BW shot I took at the Arcade downtown. Like I said elsewhere, I'm new to BW photography. My question is, to paraphrase Shakespear, "to crop or not to crop, that is the question?".... Jack

and the cropped version...comments? thanks! Jack

This is a hard one I think you are right to crop out the top it's too light and draws your eye up out of the picture. I think the question is have you cropped enough? I would crop the left hand side to the edge of the tables, the window reflections and that black door frame distract the eye and draw you away from the point of interest, the figure, this would also move the figure over onto the thirds and give you a stronger composition. Hey but what do I know, if you like it, keep it like it.

Composition rules for B&W aren't really much different from with color, just have less to manipulate. Sometimes this helps when drawing attention, sometimes it hurts. Personally, I like the first (uncropped) one. I like the skylight, and its lines tend to play nicely with the other diagonals going off into the distance. Also seems to "frame" the image. I also like the lone guy's reflection in the window. The uncropped one gives me more a feeling of the large empty space, and the one person moving through it.

I agree about the skylight in the first one, it draws my eye up & out of the picture too. In the second the glass & reflections on the left seem much stronger & really draw my eye in. Other than that I think it depends what you want from the image, what kind of feel & focal point.

ok, thanks for everybody's input... let's try this version...comment? better, worse, indifferent? Jack

I prefer the second, this one seems a bit too busy with less focus, it really draws my eye to the litter bins marching down the aisle though ; D

The thing with black and white, is that the image can no longer rely on "pretty colours" to "make" a picture. Instead, the composition takes center stage. In a way, it makes black and white more difficult than colour photo, simply because it can be much more difficult to take we the artist himself feels to be "acceptable" photography. Many photographers start off with colour, and shift to black and white afterwards, and they often find it to be a great challenge. As for cropping, I dunno, but I like the final image most. The great challenge is to shoot pics that don't actually need to be cropped, which is a big f'in challenge that I know I haven't mastered yet. Also, even though I only shoot colour ever so rarely, I often take black and white pics simply because my eyes think the colours look great in a pic. Kinda sucks when u develop the film and think "Wtf was I thinking?" ry bobs his head to Static-X's "Black and White"

my 2

my 10

well, thx for the break from work. I know i've gone a bit overboard here, but there are just so many moods that can be conveyed with a crop. In the end tho, its up to the artist to render his/her intent. What are you trying to express with your pic? Is there a statement to be made, or like me, do you just want to present eye-candy? Am i helping? or am i just babbling? 8)

thanks to all of you for your input! I've dl'd all of your variations to look at easier. eartho, I really don't know if I'm making a statment with the picture or just making eye candy, I guess that is left to the viewer to interpret in their own way. I haven't ever tried to consider the philosophy of photography, although I guess like anything else, a picture can indeed make a statement (the Pulitzer prize picture of the little Vietnamese girl who had her clothes burned off by napalm comes to mind) whether the photographer intended it to. Me I guess till I really learn what I'm doing, I'm just making pretty pictures. I do appreciate everybody's input. That's why I joined this group, to learn all I can about photography. Thanks all! Jack