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Community Center F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2025 Jan 22 10:24 am)
Subject: The Daz/Poser Pros Merger - To PP or Not to PP
bitching about which thing? the fact that daz popped up and stated...at the same time the merger was announced that those of us who use vicki as a "mannequin" for clothing, can now be sued for copyright infringement under their new revised eula? that is the only bitch, i can think of, at this point... no, not happy...i would be happy if there was a new eula issued containing the clarification that danfarr made last weekend in forum. idiots? excuse me....i think those who complain, and, try to get some rational answers are the smart ones. the idiots simply call names. if one chooses to "grin and bear" it in this life...sobeit....however, wheels that don't squeak, don't get greased as often as the others. please, blanket statements are very offensive. do you really feel so very special as to be so very condescending to a large number of folks who were vocal on the past daz ugliness????
Hmat, I've talked with Mehndi herself and I can tell you that this didn't happen because of anyone bitching about anything. It was simply business matters, things that they couldn't agree on. Daz wanted certain things that Russ and Mehndi simply weren't prepared to give up. So it's no one's fault, just one of those "creative differences" type things.
Seriously, the merger not happening had nothing to do with the "bitching" from those who don't like Daz, or from those who don't like PoserPros, or ... It was a simple difference in visions. They had there's. We had ours. And though the money would have been nice, in the end we weren't prepared to let go of our vision, and replace it with their's. Simple as that.
No hard feelings between us as all. We hold the Daz guys in great respect. We know them all quite well at this point, and who knows, there may still be some sort of relationship worked out between the two of us still.
There's nobody to point a finger at, so stop trying folks. :)
Sorry Legume, it wasn't your fault. You are just going to have to find your inspiration somewhere else:) As Russel mentioned it was just that both companies had a difference of visions. Both parties realized that it was best to continue on independently. On the bright side, we had the opportunity to have Liz and Russell out to visit us in Salt Lake and get to know them better. Fortunately both campanies part this agreement as friends. Dan Farr President, DAZ Productions.
Daz and PP should not be suprised that there was bitching. 1) Chad Smith had done an awful job of relaying to the public his company's stance on derivitive works. It was poorly written, over written, and talked around the customer, not to the customer. People, including me, got really pissed. 2) Rumours flew that CL was going to claim copyright to all items created within Poser that used the proprietary Poser fiel extensions. (cr2, pp2, hr2...) People, including DAZ, got really pissed. 3) Mehndi, love her or hate her, has a reputation of being, well, less-than-nice, from time to time. We seem to be on a nuetral ground. (for now anyway A lot of people also remembered Mehndis dream to build the "elite" poser store and figured that the Poser Pros/Daz merger was going to be that dream. It was also coupled with paranoia that Daz derivitive merchandise could only be sold at DAz or PP. Everybody got pissed. It's over now. Something is bound to come along and take it's place. ((Please note that this is not a dig at DAZ, their front line customer service has always been first rate.))
"the idiots simply call names" Funny, I just did a search on your posts here, and you know what... some of your own words are mighty colorful too... and "creeps" and "idiots" seem to be in your vocabulary, Poppy. But I guess name calling never applies when you do it, huh.
L'ultima fòrza è nella morte.
- Chad Smith had done an awful job of relaying to the public his company's stance on derivitive works. It was poorly written, over written, and talked around the customer, not to the customer. lol....you noticed that too? the "clarifications" only confused me worse. Funny, I just did a search on your posts here, and you know what... some of your own words are mighty colorful too thank you for taking the time to view my past posts. my biggest regret is that you may no longer view the c&d forum. you would have been able to see me behaving like an "idiot" with the likes of mehndi, pje, rcook, and other larger than life characters.
I hope this won't be taken the wrong way, but I'm glad to hear that merger won't be going ahead. I admire both Mehndi and Russel for their integrity and while I don't spend a lot of time at PoserPros, I thought their vision for the site was a good one. DAZ on the other hand lost my trust in this latest fracas. I won't be doing business with them again and I'm delighted to learn I can still visit the PoserPros site.
I still applaud anyone who follows a dream. I was really eager to see just what brave new experiences the DAZ and PoserPros merger would bring. (Yes, I had those feelings in spite of any disagreements we may have or will have.) Maybe I'm a bit simplistic, but I can't see why an announcement of a merger would be made prematurely. One would think such issues as "visions" would be amongst the first things discussed so that people or companies could see if this would be a good match. What is done is done. I still see DAZ as a great shopping site. Of course, Renderosity is usually my first shopping stop. And I am curious to find out where the fine artists who left DAZ will be going. And in the end I'm saving whatever money I can find for Poser 5 anyway. I do wish PoserPros and DAZ all the best. Ron
That's too bad. I was looking forward to that.
Unfortunately, there seems to be a them vs us thing going here whenever another site is mentioned. I find that sad. I like belonging to PP, or Poserworld or 3-D Arena. I don't understand most of the childish behavior when it comes to other sites.
Why the uproar about Daz is still going on is confusing to me. Well, I take that back, I do see why it's still going on. It's posted in our faces every other day by the few who don't want to listen to the facts. Daz never was attempting to demand the rights to anything created in poser or even clothing created for their characters. They had the right to protect their morphs with the bodysuits. No more, no less. It was made into a huge mess by a select few.
And I admire Dan for posting here whenever it keeps coming up. A company who didn't care about their customers, or future customers, wouldn't take the time to do that.
...... Kendra
Daz never was attempting to demand the rights to anything created in poser or even clothing created for their characters. They had the right to protect their morphs with the bodysuits. No more, no less.<<< That was the intent. I do recognise that. But it's not what was said, and the language used in DAZ's further clarifications does nothing to change that. I totally support DAZ's right to protect their own copyright. As I see it, though, conceding that they have the right to stop people making clothing morphs - regardless of whether it's "just" for the bodysuits, and regardless of the method used to make the morphs - is setting a precedent that kills the free market that puts Poser where it is. (Clumsy sentence there. Sorry.) The idea of encoding files so someone has to own a DAZ model before they can use the clothing...that's anti-competition. What about using Victoria clothing on VinaD? DAZ's "acceptable use" precludes that. Or puts those who would like a clothed Vina into the same bag as warez kitties...and that's neither right nor fair. DAZ is a successful company because so many people develop add-ons for their products. Now they're saying people can only do so if they follow a certain set of rules. But you cannot do that, retroactively. Whatever the honourable intent, something is lost here. It's called respect.
We all know they would be cutting their own throats to attempt to enforce or even word such limitations. If we know it, they know it. I have no doubt their original wording was meant to protect themselves first and foremost. I also believe, based on their participation in the discussions here, that they are working on wording it correctly.
It never came up before so it stands to reason that the body suit morphs are truely their main concern.
...... Kendra
{that those of us who use vicki as a "mannequin" for clothing, can now be sued for copyright infringement under their new revised eula?} DAZ did not revise their EULA. It's the same as it's always been. They were trying to clarify their copyright "permissions" if you will. A copyright holder does have the right to grant permission to use their things without negating the entire copyright or granting blanket use to the world. DAZ has always been very generous in allowing people to use their copyrighted products to build on because it benefits everyone. They merely want to be sure that by granting those permissions they aren't harming themselves.
i'm not really sure whats going on. from what i'm reading. it seems to me if one whats to dream its there right. if one wants to merge then will will happen or not. and if not, then why hold a hold it agains another. i've been with Daz for 2 years. i suppose i'm one of the good artist the person above had mention. i don't plan to leave DAZ, they have always been fair and decent towards my business. i do find it a shame that some of the good broker artist at DAZ left, and took there products with them, its there right. and even though when some of the brokered artist took there stuff from DAZ, other brokered artist who made stuff for there products were removed as well. some may see this as unfair to other brokers who worked hard on the products that were selling well. but i see it as Pride gone a bit wirey. if Daz wants to merge with whom ever its there right, just as its your right to try to merge with other companies. i know that Daz. RDNA, and ROS, will do well in the future, theres alot of fine artist out there. it a shame some have to fuss over something we enjoy, beauty of art.
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I just read on Poser Pros that the arrangement between Daz and Poser Pros regarding the purchase of Poser Pros will not go through. The affected parties will seek other arrangements. I must go now. Tongue is bleeding.