Thanks.   Just seems pretty complicated.  If I could get existing MESHes to match as close to the Characters I am creating then it’s just a matter of applying the head morphs and then all the talk designer and other stuff will work just fine.  

I have toyed with using SHRINK WRAP in BLENDER to get the POSER MESH to conform to the  3D character mesh - it is difficult for sure.  Now if I could just get AI to to conform my Poser HEAD Mesh to the character I want……

Yes I have been playing with that and I did not know about the LOAD FULL BODY MORPH so i went back to just dealing with the HEAD.  Created the morph in Blender then applied that to the Sydney Head. THEN, I added my custom up eyebrow morph and BINGO only the eyebrows move up because like you said you only do it on the original Sydney model.  In Poser pro 2012 all of the figures base geometries are OBZ which you can't read in Blender.  But I did find the way to do this and your notes are even more helpful!!

Now. I have another question.   Have you EVER modeled a figure and turned it into a poser figure that can BLINK, open mouth, and do some basic movements?  I saw a video on how to make it use the same names as TALK DESIGNER would be familiar with so you can make it "talk" but you would need to model Each and every PHONEME and use an XML editor etc.  Seems fairly complicated but the Poser folks had to do something like this when they created DON, JAMES, SIMON, RYAN, PAUL etc.   I am curious about that workflow . 

Thoughts?

I want to be able to morph dial them UP or DOWN and NOT effect anything else with other expressions or morphs.  When I do this - JUST for the head - what happens is if I  bring the morph in and I set it to 1.00 - remember the other custom head morph is already there so I have to back it down to 0.00.   The sum of the two can never be more then 1.00.

That is because I have loaded a full HEAD MORPH.  I just want eyebrows only - kind of like BLINK morph.  I can BLINK all day along and it doesn't affect anything else just the VERTS in the eyelid.  Make sense?

Your workflow actually WORKS! As long as I stay with the original DON HEAD. All I did was export the pucker of DON out of Blender with Nothing checked. It created a smaller file - the deltas? - and it works fine on the Don Base Head. Now, the rub is I have to go in an reload the Character Head Morph on a fresh DON along with the Pucker and it works. I will have to reBuild the character. The one I have for whatever reason will not take the morph properly and wants to affect the entire head.

So, I think I know how to do this but I have no idea why dealing with the BASE head seems to fix it. Thanks so much!!

TwiztidKidd posted at 3:44PM Mon, 18 January 2021 - #4410661

Import and export the mesh out of Blender without any options checked and it's essential that you export his head out of Poser as a morph target with everything zeroed out.

Import Don's geometry file into Poser (everything unchecked) ... use the Grouping Tool & Spawn Prop to select only his head... and export his head as a morph target, uncheck everything else... you want to keep his head the way it is... unscaled, unchanged or anything except the morph throughout the whole process.

Ok ths is a bit different. I did what you said but on my CUSTOM HEAD MORPH. You are saying to bring Don into a scene and export his head a s MORPH Target. No problem.

But in order for Blender to read it in - I have to select KEEP VERTEX GROUPS and check Polygroups during the import.

Now once in BLENDER I can certainly make the lips pucker. But at this point when I EXPORT IN BLENDER you are saying to UNCHECK EVERYTHING correct? Then bring that in as a PROP with nothing checked. SPAWN it and save as a morph target again. Then LOAD MORPH target back into the DON head. This is working entirely with the BASE Don figure and head right? Did I miss anything?

FVerbaas posted at 2:23PM Mon, 18 January 2021 - #4410641

Morphs are linear combinations, so if you give your 'modified face with puckered lips' morph a weight 1.0 and your 'modified face' morph a weight -1.0, the result will be a morph with just the puckered lip change.

The transfer may have triggered some other minute changes, resulting in residual deltas not large enough to give a visual effect but large enough to let Poser conclude there is a difference. Set of deltas may be larger than necessary.

Thanks. I can pretty much work around this by setting up a dependency that dials back the original Character Head morph as the Pucker is increased. It works BUT I don't want to set up all these dependencies should I create two or three additional custom face morphs. I just want it to work with the 'deltas'. But, again, I think Poser doesn't know this once the morph target leaves Poser World and then comes back in.

TwiztidKidd posted at 2:21PM Mon, 18 January 2021 - #4410647

I've got another idea... import your OBJ (the one that's fresh out of Blender) into Poser as a prop, uncheck everything when you do that... then go to the Grouping Tool and hit the “spawn prop” button... exit Grouping Tool... and select that newly spawned prop and export it as an OBJ... check "as morph target" uncheck everything else. That's your new morph target file... and this time should load properly onto the head as a morph.

Thanks for the idea. I did what you said and reimported back in - same issue. When you move the dial - it affects the ENTIRE head ontop of the Character morph already in effect. Lips pucker - distortion every where else. For whatever reason it seems to look at the entire import for the HEAD not just the lip deltas.

FVerbaas posted at 11:29AM Mon, 18 January 2021 - #4410638

You are developing a morph for Poser5 Don. Are you using Poser5?

no. I amusing Poser Pro 2012. I have no issues creating morph targets for DON. The weird thing is IF I use the Morphing Tool to make changes to the face INSIDE of POSER then I can save that as a morph. And when I dial it - ONLY THE AFFECTED VERTICES will change. Exactly what I want. But the tools inside of Poser are not good and I prefer to do the modeling in Blender. But when I bring that morph target in - it affects the entire HEAD. All I want it to do is pucker the lips.

POSER just thinks the Pucker morph is just another HEAD morph because it's being imported - I think. So it doesn't know to isolate just the 'changed' vertices. Thank you

Liquid_Ice posted at 9:01AM Mon, 18 January 2021 - #4410621

I can show you but I use zbrush. Basically it is the same only zbrush users have a direct link to poser.

That would be fine - I am interested - maybe the Zbrush connection applies the morph only to the vertices selected. I am available pretty much anytime. I feel like i am close but just skipping some important step.

I do work on it in BLENDER I make the change to the head. Then I LOAD MORPH TARGET back to the HEAD. But it puts it in the MORPH area of the dials - I don't have a choice to put it with LIPS or MOUTH etc.

So then I have TWO morphs.

CHARACTER HEAD set to 1.00 PUCKER Set to 0.000

The Problem is that when I dial it in it adds the pucker but it also ADVANCES the ENTIRE head morph where the head is now distorted. If I go all the way 1.00 -then the Character head is at now at 2.00 ! I ONLY want the delta change to the lips to be applied.

Yes, I can create an EDIT DEPENDENCY on this to correct but I don't want to do that for very additional tweak morph I want to develop for this character Hope that makes sense. Is there a way JUST to affect the lips?

In Blender for a HEAD morph I always 'keep vertex order' and polygroups checked. Thanks so much for getting back to me.

So How would I do that on the original figure? I can do it - is that something that has to be down in the face room? The minute I work on it in Blender and bring it back in it becomes a HEAD morph only. Thanks and advise.

So maybe another way of asking this is HOW are the facial expressions like BROWS UP BROWSN DOWN SMILE FROWN etc. morphs created for the Figure? Is is just no possible to add any to the figure that operate as the others do?

Well then that makes sense. How do I get those new details into the CR2 - with the same bones if possible?

the weird thing is then how does the CR2 know about the added detail after the subdivide? Granted - the basic shape has not chaned - except when I fooled around with the left shoulder in the pic above.

I am using an existing CR2 so that the Shirt will conform properly to the FIgure it is meant for. If I use a blank, CR2 then I am not sure that will happen. Granted I am trying to accomplish this with some short cuts. Maybe that is not possible. It's just funny to me that subdividing the mesh to create more faces and more detail works just fine.

I think so. When I import the orginal OBJ - I do so in a way that doesn't show the groups. If I subdivide and then export out - then the CR2 picks it up and the subdivide shows. But the part I add is not really part of a group - i get that.

So, if I import it into Blender in such a way that all groupings are shown - I add the mesh to the CHEST group - SELECT ALL and re-export it. When I do that - NOTHING shows when adding the CR2 to the scene.

Something is missing......for sure.