Thank you, Stacey.  I'd determined the issue probably had to do with the time zones in one respect or another.  Unfortunately this week left me with little in the way of options but to shop late at night.

Thanks again.

Hi Tina,

It happened to me again tonight where I had items in my cart, all with the sale prices but when I went to check out, the products showed as having the regular price.  Advertising for the sale is still showing as in effect but sale prices have been ceased.  Not sure if this has to do with time zones, perhaps although the advertising seems to stay in place.

Thanks very much.

Thank you so much!

Thanks much, Deb! :)

jevans69, I'm not under the impression that you were objecting to someone making suggestions at all, nor was I suggesting anything akin to that.  I merely see a difference between a site which is designed specifically for the public and one which is private.  As I mentioned as well, I believe rules have to be put in place.  It's a given.  What makes it so difficult though is when first, there's no clear cut rules in place, and/or, because defining what is and isn't appropriate in some cases (obviously not over anything blatant), is purely subjective, what posting artists, viewing artists, or the community on the whole might view as 'fine', apparently, as has been proven, is not viewed the same by those who run the site.  I don't think it has anything to do with the ability or inability to decide on one's own whether something is okay or not.  In truth, the problem is in pretty much one-upping administrators and moderators by trying to guess at what their perception will be.  Unless a person is one heck of a pyschic, that's pretty much impossible to pull off.  I think when issues like this come up, it's better to have something as black and white as possible in terms of rules, as opposed to leaving much in the way of grey.

As for the comment 'I see no one gives a shit...', I can't comment on whether that was directed or not.  I'm not going to assume either the former or latter.  It may have just been sheer frustration on Bill's part.  I'd have to literally ask him to be certain of anything.

As for your art, although I haven't seen it, I'm certain it's beautiful since there is no 'good or bad art.'  All art, in my opinion, is valuable, however.  And it may be that there are images you know, or feel, you can't post here based on the TOS, and how you percieve it; at least based on those which are more clearly defined. 

I agree the people behind Renderosity have elected to shoulder the responsibilities which come with their job, and certainly that's not something to be undermined.  However, it is a job, and one they've chosen to do, just as I've chosen the responsibilities which go with my job, whether I like them all or not.  I also agree Renderosity has to keep the advertisers and such happy, but it becomes a delicate balancing act because the customers also have to be kept happy.  Without advertisers and the like, a business risks failing, but by the same token, without customers, a business risks failing.  As such, I think it's extremely important that each concern, and this is a concern, be examined based on its own merit.

Stacey has indeed provided a most apt response, responses, actually.  For that, I'm grateful.  I'm definitely most interested in what the outcome will be.

Just to set the record straight, jevans69, I have no opinion of you, simply because I don't know you.  I mean that in the most sincerest way.

Iggy, I've never known you to have a 'big mouth', girl, just the ability to shoot from the hip.

For what it's worth, I'm putting forth my opinion, though first, I'd like to address jevans69's post. 

I'm afraid I fail to see where the 'schoolyard mentality' is applicable to this site.  This is not a private site, and the reason the 'bills get paid' is due to customers purchasing from the Market Place.  It's the artists and paying customers who do pay the bills.  With that being the case, it would seem to me that if anyone has a right to make suggestions in how the site is run, at least to some degree, it's the ones keeping the site in business.  If you want to use the 'bat, ball and backyard' analogy, then by rights, those items are shared by those the site makes their money from, namely, the merchant's sales.  If the site was forking out all the money from their own pocket to keep this site running, that would be an entirely different story.

Having said that, I do understand the need for rules on any site, however, the one word which, in my opinion is definitive when it comes to passing judgement on artwork, and what is or isn't appropriate, is 'subjective.'  There are going to be images which can be considered blatant by the vast majority of the site and its members.  There are those images however, where it appears a select few make a ruling, regardless if a majority disagrees.  I've seen morphs created for Victoria 3 which, in my opinion, make her appear younger than 18.  Does that make my opinion right or wrong, or is it a general understanding that V3 'has' to be 18 or over?

With Aiko, just how old is this cartoon character?  I put forth that question in a very serious manner.  I don't think she fits in with the MilBaby, the MilChildren, or the MilTeens.  Further, I think The Girl fits in the same basic category as Aiko because she's a cartoon character.

I put forth the suggestion that the TOS include clearly defined statements regarding these two characters.  Either there's absolutely no nudity, or there can be.  Leave no room for error, and take the burden off the artists in trying to 'guess' at what might be okay to post.  This 'yes', 'no', 'maybe' issue is cumberson, at the very least, and as it's been proven, not only puts the burden of guesswork on the artists (only to have them sometimes shot down later), but also breeds animosity to the point of where we've already lost a number of artists with others in the process of making arrangements to leave.

In closing, I'd like to thank you, Stacey, since you plan to take steps to discuss this with other members of the team.  Thank you.  I may pull Aiko and The Girl off the dusty shelf yet.

Well JenyK, I have to admit that in all my years of being in the business sector, that is the most feeble attempt at explaining away an ambiguous clause as ever I've seen. I won't even mention the unprofesstional manner with which you've approached this whole situation. What that clause now dictates to me is that any posting can be deleted simply based on an administrators perception. I'd dearly love to know what 'reliable' sources have been sought for opinion before such an outlandish act, such as deleting images and comments, was both deemed necessary and actually carried out.

Thanks so much for the link geoegress! I've already registered. :) slinger, I'm now on my way to planit3d, so thank you so much as well! :) Contests/contest images cause disruption? How so? I don't get to post anymore than one picture per day either way, so...?

ROTFL @ SamTherapy...funny, I had the same idea running through my mind. Either that, or refer to the word 'contest' as the 'c' word. :-/

ROTFLMAO @ gillbrooks That might not necessarily be too far fetched hon, by the looks of things. I also like paintgirl's suggestion and will clear my mailbox for all the incoming e-bots in support of it. ;) We might indeed see a migration to Runtime DNA and Poser Pros too! LOL

Message edited on: 09/16/2004 17:52

I agree there should be absolutely no need for those who have held, or are holding contests, to apologize at all. My opinion is such that people who hold these contests create high morale in the community, offer challenges and fun for artists and through them, I've been moved to also purchase products seen in competing images. I further agree that the apologies needed here are from the Renderosity administration, along with compensation of some kind to the artists who have lost their work and the comments. It's my belief that won't happen since it's only taken a matter of moments to lose my faith in how this site is run.

I'm just leaving any of my images which have the word 'contest' in them. If it spins someone's dials to go around deleting artwork and comments, then so be it. I've saved the comments from my images and won't bother re-uploading the images themselves. Who knows what reason they'll use to delete images next time round. I'm wondering if it's worth the bother of posting anything at this point.

The fact images and comments are disappearing is a ludicrous act in itself, but the IM Blazerwiccan received, being chastised for hosting a contest when she wasn't even holding one, is a prime example of someone not bothering to do their job properly. If I were conspiracy-minded, I'd be inclined to believe this is exactly what's happening. I am developing an opinion that someone is indeed, drunk on power as has been suggested. Blazerwiccan, I surely hope you get a deep and humble apology for that atrocious IM.

I am appalled at the manner in which this has been dealt with with people losing images and comments. I wondered what in the world was going on as I clicked on links from my ebots only to find a wide range of images having been deleted. I agree with others in that an announcement would have been far more considerate to the artists as well as the viewers. The way this has been handled is something I'd expect from a dictatorship. Perhaps a little common sense could be exercised?

I know I don't even know you Rik, but honestly, my otherwise bad day just took a huge leap to one of the best. I'm just so darn happy and deeply relieved you're just fine. (((HUGS)))