Bryce is the glue that binds these parts together... Nah, I'm not convinced either.

don't feel bad, I once used 15 packages to post a pic in Bryce..;)

Hey, I wasn't convinced when everyone here insisted that even if everything was modeled in Rhino, but rendered in Bryce, it was a "Bryce" image. "The render engine is what counts," "if Bryce let's you import stuff then the imports become part of the Bryce image," and "it's the final image that counts" ... that's what they told me. So no "yeah buts" ... either all those images with 99% of it modeled elsewhere are Bryce images AND your cobbled together piece is a Bryce image or they all aren't. I tried arguing that they weren't, and got shouted down royally (it was in the original "It's all Zhann's Fault" thread). And, while I'm not convinced either, I find that I no longer much care about being right or wrong on the point.

15 packages!!! I don't even own 15 packages. It's tricky to be sure. When does a Bryce render become a bryce render and when does it cease to be a bryce render? If I take a photo and paste it onto a 2d plane that's sqaure against the camera and I render it so it looks exactly like the original photo, is that still a Bryce render? Just playing devil advocate, since I agree that the renderer is the decider. I'm smiling to myself, because I know what's coming in the January challenge. "Mummy, what does no postwork mean?" MWAAAAHAHAHA!!!!

Oh, and like Ricky says, it doesn't really matter about being right or wrong. The art is the begining and the end.

And, as long as we're on the topic .... sometimes I frankly don't know WHERE to post some of my stuff. I mean, if I do a lot of post work on something, is it still a photograph?? Case in point ... my gallery image for today. I started with a photo, but there must be 15 post work steps on this thing. I originally posted it in photography, but then changed my mind and posted it as a "2D". But to be honest, I haven't a clue what to call it or how to pigeonhole it. Then, there's my "Experimental Texture" image that I created using the chaoscope program, and PSP, then put on a cube and rendered from inside the cube (with the camera pointed at a corner of the cube). I guess that's a Bryce image, but again, I really haven't a clue. I suppose that's why I like it when the artist gives me a hint as to what programs they used and how much post work they did or didn't do. Not because it changes what I think of the image as a whole, but so I have an idea of the technical difficulty involved. And, so I can see if that work sets a standard for the program (pushing Bryce to a new level), or means that I need to fork over more $$$ for yet another program if I want to do what he/she did.

I've been using a lot of Poser figures in my work recently but rendering in Bryce. Now I know that if I posted a Bryce rendered image in the Poser gallery they would be quick to tell me to put it into the Bryce gallery. So all in all, I think that it doesn't matter where you get your objects from it's where you do the render that counts. Anyway, Bryce was not made to do complex modelling and there are only a few artists I know of who can make models from Bryce primatives that look like they were made in a higher end proggy. So where does that leave the rest of us who are not so brill at modelling in Bryce, are we not supposed to import? Catlin

Heavens no .... you should import as much as you want. I just like to know whether or not the artist did the modeling in Bryce or elsewhere. If they are able to produce something really complex -- and it's all modeled in Bryce -- then I know that's someone I want to contact about learning things about modeling in Bryce. But even if it's 100% modeled elsewhere, if it's beautifully lit, then I'm going to ask that person questions about lighting .... or what modeling program they used. Part of my reason for participating in Renderosity is to learn. And, especially to learn how far I can push the programs I currently own (and understand to some extent). I just really appreciate knowing what the artist did so I don't waste my time trying to replicate some aspect of it that simply cannot be done in the programs I am using.

Well, for me, it's like with science fiction and fantasy: there are poles, but at the equator it's all blurred. So, it can all be Bryce, but what amethyss did up there is not Bryce. If you used Grass to create the grass, and Plant Studio for flowers and then rendered all in Bryce, it would be. Ricky, your cube is Bryce. I repeat, for me. BTW, "Lazing" was done with ... 8 or nine programs, including Photoshop for textures and a bit of more light afterwards.

There's a point where art becomes more PhotoShop or Paint Shop Pro than Bryce.

If I remember correctly, it was exactly that question that opened that thread about what constitutes a Bryce render. The person had used mixed mediums but rendered in Bryce and wanted to know where it should be posted then the whole topic ensued. Richy, I totally agree with you in that the artist should inform the viewer what was used to do the modeling. I often times feel that if the art dosen't make mention, then I assume everything is modeled in Bryce. Personally to me art is art no matter how it's created (it's the end product of your labor). But because Bryce is such a versatile little package, almost everything else falls under its domain. Just to muddy the waters a little, if you import a picture into Photoshop and define it as a brush and use it extensively to create your image, where should it be posted, under Photoshop or photography forum?

I guess it was a rant in such that some of the work is really good, and while learning Bryce I was fooled into believing that scenes were created using Bryce as the dominating tool.Then I learn that skies are only photos and foilage was painted using a lot of postwork.In a way it made me work harder to achieve results of realism using only Bryce and textures.If you work at it, a Bryce sky can be quite realistic.I know it feels like the Bryce Gallery is home to people.Rant over.Forget it.Carry on.Happy New Year.

Umm, make a picture...post it where your friends will see it. I like Bryce. Happy New Year!! ICM

Interesting topic that never seems to really go away. :^) I was just looking at a new piece by Rohi (If you haven't seen Rohi's gallery, go look now! An excellent artist!) that was posted in the Bryce gallery and found myself wondering how much of the image was a Bryce render. I esimated it at about 20-30%. Just curious, really, because I don't really care about "proper" categorizing. My viewpoint? If the artist thinks it should go in the Bryce gallery, that's good enough for me. If you don't think it belongs there, send the artist an IM (not a comment on the pic, everyone else doesn't need to read about it...and be polite) and tell them so, and why. Whether they agree with you or not, you have given your opinion, and what else do you need? Personally, I worry more about whether something I post is good enough to be seen by others, LOL. Everyone else has to make those decisions for themselves as well. John

I don't think it's that big a deal here, though I hear that in the Poser forum you'll get raked over the coals if you even use post-processing, much less rendering in another package..(sorry, Vue users..;)
Actually, aside from Bryce and Poser (4), I got most of them either free (anim8tor, Wings 3d), or cheap (Truespace, Strata)..which came from magazines like 3d World, Computer Art, Digit, etc. Hey, if the pic's good enough, I don't care how it was made..;)

I agree tjohn. Whenever I post a picture I want folks to like the final article and hope it is worthy of being posted. I do most of my renders in Bryce and that is where I post my images because Bryce users are the people I value the comments of the most. Sometimes I use postwork but not often and try mostly to get my desired results in Bryce itself, which is no easy task. But I think postwork has it's value in making an image more than just a Bryce render. Catlin

my only gripe is all the postwork that goes on in some of the posted stuff here.If more than 50 percent is post its no longer bryce,its a composited image in PS or some other program.Plus if you want to be a 3d artist then stop screwing all the images up with post work.If it doesnt look good without post work you need more practice,or a new program.

okay, here while back I asked why some were allowed to replace the images they submitted to one of the contests and why others were allowed to post after the deadline. I was told by several people that the rules were not written in stone and were for enjoyment and learning so I ask you this. If that is for that then what is Bryce for? If the program allows imports is it not part of the program and thus acceptable. I see many pics by prominent artist in here that use photos, touch ups, painting and other things with nothing said. Is that because they are good or because they are leaders in here? As long as you are told what is done what is the beef? Be consistent people.
mfd

I try to learn what Bryce can do by looking at the images posted here. I can understand though that a lot of users here will do post work to add reflections that would otherwise add days to their rendering time if done 100% in Bryce. I just skip past images that have obvious brush strokes or backgrounds added to them. Because it falls into the generic art bin. www.shonner.com

Shonner said; "I just skip past images that have obvious brush strokes or backgrounds added to them. Because it falls into the generic art bin". I just got to say on the images as backgrounds that it is another thing that Bryce is capable of so why not use an image for a background if you so wish. It is still 100% Bryce so what's the problem? The only thing that would bother me about such a thing is if it was very obvious, but that could just be bad art. 8) Catlin