Right, anyone who takes this thread seriously, asks sensible questions or actually comes up with reasonable points will be taken seriously and will be answered. By Poser forum Moderators and Coordinators. If we aren't answering at the exact second you post, it's probably because we are not online or are doing something else just then. NOT because we are avoiding an issue. We'll be back and we'll answer real questions with real answers. We will not discuss individual cases however, so it's no good saying "Mod X did Y to Member Z" We have a confidentiality clause here and we do not discuss individual members business in public. Anyone who just complains, with no other point than to complain and with no constructive suggestions on how to do things better will be ignored. So, fire away, what is it that you guys want? Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why? Why do you think that is a good idea? Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead? What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it? What do you like about the forum/community page/Poser galleries/Poser Freestuff here? What don't you like? What would you prefer we did differently? How could we make the Poser forum a place where you would feel happier to be? Would you like to see things like a featured freestuff provider of the month? Would you like to have a featured artist of the Month that you all vote for? Not site wide, just Poser based. Or to have interviews with Poser challenge winners so you can get to know people a little better? Just some examples, I'm sure you have your own points, questions or suggestions. We want your input, this is supposed to be your forum. Here's a chance to have your say. If you can make a good case for a change of some sort in the Renderosity Poser community (ie galleries, forum etc..), we will do our best to make it happen, as long as it doesn't break the Terms of Service here. Shoshanna. Poser Forum Moderator. ps. Please do not post nudity in this thread or it will be deleted. That way, people who do not (for whatever reason) want to see it will still be able to input if they wish.

better search engine,better layout,
more user friendly thread browsing..

well. in one word i coul say : "phpbb :)
or anything at least a bit as userfriendly as it, because it is very hard to ever dig down in older threads, find them back for reference, search a specific topic, or posts from one given user and such.

was my 2 cents...
it was for forum

for galleries one suggestion: crosse picture gender reference (at least 1 major and one minor category to define them so they can be answered by search engine by both inquiry), ex: fantasy AND anime :)
Better search engine for the gallery may be ?

for the IM section, it would be useful if we could hae checkbox on all IM so we can batch delete/archive those of our choice instead of clicking on each one and wait tfor the page to reload each time...

... now it makes 6 cents :) and for freestuff too, some refining categories for a better search engine would be a blessing. Often i search for a precise word and i get out items that are totally irrelevant (barely see where my search word was), more than one word research with operators. Have you ever tried to search for, let say, v2 productr ? you put v2 but people whou put vicky 2 or victoria 2 in their text will not show, you search for victoria and you are swarmed by v3 for example :) the new market place is definitly more useful than the previous one, yet some minor changes/ilmprovements needed but it is a huge leap.

Message edited on: 06/15/2004 05:16

I generally have no problem with forum per se, the community here is helpful and welcoming, I find, for the most part.

I will offer some constructive criticism on the forum layout and design.

This system seems hopelessly outdated. There are more sophisticated forum engines available, which are far more condusive to community communication.

Just an opinion, but I like the Invasion board v1.2. I see it used at auspaytv.com for their forums and lots of other places. I have no idea what its like for an admin/mod, but as a user I think its clean and easy to navigate.

Not that I have really explored the in-depth options of this forum, I havent made that many posts.

Message edited on: 06/15/2004 05:34

Absolutely a more up-to-date forum software to make communication with each other more intuitive and easy. The ability to quote a post in your reply without having to do it via cut n paste, the ability for to bump threads with a reply so that you don't have to go searching for them later on. Someone mentioned PhpBB. Yep, that's basically the kind of forum layout I'd like here as well.

Tools : 3dsmax 2015, Daz Studio 4.6, PoserPro 2012, Blender v2.74

System: Pentium QuadCore i7, under Win 8, GeForce GTX 780 / 2GB GPU.

Another mark for improved forum software and better search ability.

I would like to see a featured freebie provider. I don't feel freebie providers get much recognition in general.
(Similarly, although off forum, I would like to see the current freebie "all time best contributors" replaced or supplimented by a "hot contributors". Right now, because only the top 200 freebies are considered, there's no way for a new contributor to ever be recognized unless they're doing something erotic. You need almost 6800 downloads before you even get considered, and you're competing against stuff that has been here since 1998.)

I have always thought that the members who donate their work to the free stuff area should get more recognition. Maybe a "Free stuff contributor of the month" for the person who uploads the most popular free stuff item. Could be measured by the number of downloads or by a voting system. Just a thought.

The Poser forum is the most active in Renderosity so anything new (like artist of the Month and freestuff provider of the month) would be supported by people. Better and more complex search engine for sure! Anonymous entries on all the contests... Custom "how's on line" maybee... pitklad

Allow people to post OT topics if it is something that the rest of us might what to hear, for example, so and so is ill or had a baby or got a new job kind of thing. Also not be so nick picky about the nudity flag and such in the galleries. Let's face alot of the work there is going to have the Naked Vickie in etc kind of thing.... I personality find that gallery images based some sort of religous theme more objectable. They should have the same kind of flag as the nudity or violence.... Now, I'll creep back into my dark corner.....

I think it is more important to focus on content and not so much on representation. The forum software is fine as it is. (I hate those phpbb boards.) > Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why? Yes and why not. There are too many stupid rules anyway. Sometimes I just want to communicate with other Poser users about non-Poser themes. > Why do you think that is a good idea? It is not a bad idea, thats enough. > Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead? An extra off topic forum is bad, because it could vanish at any time. > What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it? How about some consistency in enforcing the TOS? A respectful members conduct is only viable if the admins/mods are worthy of respect. > What do you like about the forum/community page/Poser galleries/Poser Freestuff here? What don't you like? I think you do a good job of it. But the forum header ist to big for my taste. The first messages are only visible after I page down.

I agree with the complaints about the pitiful search engine and the forum software, but I could live with the forum format indefinitely if the search engine would just be improved... Technical issues aside... Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why? Why do you think that is a good idea? Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead? Sure, why not? In a community, people talk about MANY topics, not just one... The "OT Forum" concept didn't really work very well here, you know? The OT Forum became a place where people went to argue about stuff, and while I have no problem with people arguing about whatever they wish, it wasn't really a place where the general community went to look for or participate in conversations like, "Guess what, I got a new puppy!" or "My wife gave birth to our child last night, here's a picture!" or whatever. What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it? The biggest problem I see is that the TOS is unevenly enforced, or it sometimes definitely appears to be. As for why people feel the need to scream and rant that someone wants them to tick the Nudity flag if the image they're posting contains nudity, I have no idea. I put it down to a misplaced sense of entitlement. ;-) What do you like about the forum/community page/Poser galleries/Poser Freestuff here? What don't you like? There are a lot of knowledgable folks around, and some really good artists whose work I admire. What I don't like is that some people just can't seem to play nicely with others and feel the need to gratuitiously engage in "dead horse" arguments. What would you prefer we did differently? Everything! Just kidding. :-) More even and regular TOS enforcement would be good. When discrepancies are noted (such as a mod who maintained that warez talk was not "zero tolerence" but "at their discretion" to discipline), a simple correction AND APOLOGY would go a long way. Mind you, I haven't seen too many TOS-related muck ups here in this forum for a while. The current style of moderation is actually pretty good. Flexible. :-) How could we make the Poser forum a place where you would feel happier to be? I don't feel especially unhappy here. shrug But I do think making the environment "community friendly" is a good thing. Would you like to see things like a featured freestuff provider of the month? Maybe. Would you like to have a featured artist of the Month that you all vote for? Not site wide, just Poser based. Maybe, but how would something like that be arranged? How would people be nominated? Wouldn't it just devolve into a big popularity contest that is essentially meaningless? Or to have interviews with Poser challenge winners so you can get to know people a little better? That might be very nice, actually. Okay. There you go. My thoughts at the moment. :-) bonni

"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis

I would like to post WIP's again in this forum to get feedback from the largest poser community on the net, instead of having them shunted off to the showcase forum because they MAY become a product for sale somewhere. It is great to see peoples WIP's and share ideas in an open forum. People go to showcase to see new products coming out...and that is a different mindset that doesnt give as much opportunity for comment as it would in the open forum. This crack down on WIP postings is what drove me from being as active a participant on this site as I used to be. (and also influenced me to sell my products on other sites which were more open to giving feedback...hell....if they give the comments, it only makes sense to have the product in their stores) Rawn

Here goes.... By simply asking these questions, you have already moved in the right direction! I like the Poser Forum here at R'osity. However, I have to say that the sense of community has dropped in recent times. I think this is largely from the inability to post OT here. As Elizabyte said, if I have great news that may be off topic, I want to share it with my 'friends' who I have made here in the Poser Forum. I want to post it here. Easier search as stated would be great. Many a time I know I have seen a thread on teh problem I am having, but I cannot sift through all the past posts to find it. I deplore asking the same questions over as much as I'm sure our gurus are tired of answering. Not that they aren't nice and still give great answers! I think that recognition of good freebie contributors is a terrific idea. THese folks give away vast amounts of hard work. Obviously money isn't their motivation, their stuff is FREE! If I see something great, I try to comment or drop them a post saying thanks. Making that more public would be nice. As for TOS violations. I have to agree that TOS must be enforced, and while the Mods' stnace is that the TOS is even;y enforced, equality is not the perception. It is often more important to appear fair than to be fair. In a venue like this, image is everything. Thanks for asking!

I dont mind off topic stuff in the forums as long as it is marked as off topic. I don't have unlimited time to read every little post on the forums. Posters, be more vigilant with the nudity tag. its not about you being offended, its about me getting reprimanded or fired for trying to learn something during my breaks. If you feel confident in your persuasion abilities, I welcome you to come down here to the "Bible belt" and explain to these conservatives how we shouldn't hided nudity. I doubt youll change any minds. Market place: We need a category for M2. Currently we have a Michael category that has everything and a M3 category. Which seems backwards to me because M3 has the ability to use some of the M2 stuff, but M2 cannot use M3 stuff. This probably helps perpetuate the M2 vs M3 discussions because you can either look at M3 stuff or you can sort thru all the M3 stuff till you find some M2 stuff. Same goes for V2.

My Homepage - Free stuff and Galleries

A better search engine for the forum would be great. I try to find the answers to my questions that way but I find that I get a million useless links for the one good one I get. I like this forum. The people are friendly (I asked a question in 3ds yesterday and it's not even been acknowledged that I asked). I love the posts. There are a lot of good ones but the good joking humor of everyone here is wonderful. Kristta (I will be posting my first poser work sometime this week if I can get the poor dogs eyeballs to show up!)

Yeah WIP's here would be nice. Not blatant promotion WIP's like "which of these 4 colours of nailpolish is best on my brand new V3 character that will be for sale next week", but genuine ones. As it is now, you're sometimes afraid to ask questions about something with a new model that is acting up, IF that model is intended for sale. Also Off Topic subjects. They're here to some degree anyway, and I think that the ones that are too polemic will be shut down, not because they're off topic, but because they'll become off limits. People naturally go where here are the biggest chance of being read. And at Renderosity, that's here, in the Poser forum. OT threads should be flagged though, so that people who wouldn't like anything but Poser related posts could skip them. Just as people usualy post a [OT] in their subject even now :o) Butch mentioned a "religious" flag. I'd like that. I do NOT want to see religious pictures (and I'm NOT kidding). I LIKE this forum-software. I LIKE that Rosity is not just another PHP-clone. But yes, PLEASE do something to the search engine. Make boolean seaches possible. A Free Stuff provider of the month could be a cool idea, possibly with an interview of said person, it's always fun to read about some of the people you feel you know. I'm not sure how a "FSPOM" should be elected though. The things that are downloaded most seems to be Vickie textures, yet there are many other interesting things around. If it was only by the number of downloads, texturemakers and clothes makers would be all we ever read about. How about that silly goose that uploaded a doggie poop? ;o) Anonymous entries (and possibly votes) in contests too, please. Would make it way more fair for everyone. The current batch of moderators/coordinators does a great job. Well done guys and gals!

This place is filled with good people with lots of knowledge they are willing to share. That has made my projects possible. And I am very greatful for this forum.

I would like to see a better search engine.

I also think the header is far to big.

Maybe freebee department could be divided into something like: Humans, Animals, Props
or: Models, Textures, Morphs

OT posts are ok for me. It is kind of nice when someone share special happenings or thoughts.

I also think the header is far to big. L Have you ever been to the Max forum? Then you can talk about a HUGE header...

Absolutely no OT Forum. Some OT sutff in the poser forum (to post announcements of family happenings like a new baby, or a lost job or a death in the family etc.) is ok with me, but no religion and politics etc. like the last OT Forum. I hated the flaming there by people who totally didn't know about what they were talking and just came there for the trolling. Please let it stay an art community. I like the Poser artist of the month idea. I like the freestuff provider of the month idea. I have no problem at all with the nudity in the galleries or in the forum, but I do dislike the violence thumbs in the store (witch on the stake, gaschambers, torture machinery etc.), but that is personal, so I just don't look. I would like the option to delete comments on images, instead of writing the mods to delete it for me. I would like a header like the Bryce forum with a link to the Poser challenge, Poser top 20, Poser tutorials and freestuff, instead of the links to the Productforum, Poser patches, Dazstudio and copyrights forum. What I really like in the Bryce Forum are the posts with mini tutorials. Like this week somebody found water brushes and showed in a post how he made an image using the brushes in postwork and gave the link where to download them. I never thought of that! But overall I am very satisfied with the forum as it is!

My gallery @ Renderosity

I, too, would like to see a better search engine. Trying to find stuff in the forums is hopeless using the current search engine.

Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why?
Why do you think that is a good idea?
Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead?

Either way would work for me. Either allow OT posts here, properly flagged, or have an OT forum. Not allowing OT posts at all will never work, IMO. We're human beings, not robots. We have interests and lives apart from Poser, and we need to share them.

What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it?

IMO, the complaints are due to the TOS being inconsistently enforced, leading to the perception of favoritism. Some people get warned or banned for minor offenses, while others get away with murder. It's the perceived unfairness that's infuriating, not the TOS.

What do you like about the forum/community page/Poser galleries/Poser Freestuff here?
What don't you like?

What I like is the cleanness of the Rosity site. That's been a bit eroded lately, with Flash ads and the cluttered look of the MP, but it's still much better than most sites. (The people at 3DCommune are wonderful, but their store really sucks. Java windows for every product. Arggghhh. It's like they're trying to keep you from spending money there.)

What would you prefer we did differently?

Go back to having all your past purchases on one page. It's a real PITA to have to search a dozen pages to see if you've bought an item, instead of just one.

I'd also like to see more than one upload to the gallery allowed per day. I understand there must be limits, but I'd prefer, say, 12 a month to one a day.

How could we make the Poser forum a place where you would feel happier to be?

Loosen up on the reins a little. As others have pointed out, when you try to stifle expression, it always comes out in some other way. Perhaps an OT forum would be the best way to go - one in which only a few holds are barred. Key, I think, would be a very good, very experienced moderator, and an upfront warning that anyone who is easily offended should stay out.

I'm sure that someone has already said this somewhere, but I'd really, really like to see some enforcement of the nudity warnings in the gallery. I'm all for artistic license but there have been a few lately that,well, let me put it this way: If I'm browsing the thumbnails and I see one that is nothing more than a set of male genetalia, I quit looking at the gallery and go do something else. I don't think it would be too much to ask that the artists ensure that they do the simple task of clicking the warning boxes when they upload their art. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I have spoken to several others who view Renderosity's galleries as the best that digital art has to offer and they feel the same way. Just my input, nothing more.

Some OT (birth announcements, etc.) here is fine, but give politics/religion it's own forum. I like the Poser AOM idea, but I'd like (no offense to any of the incredibly talented atrists who've made the Hot 20, as I can only dream of having your talent) to see a focus on artists who DON'T make it to the Hot 20 on a regular basis. It'd give people a chance to view the work of people who have more potential than experience. The FreeStuff provider idea is great - they're way under-appreciated. Anonymous contest entries would be a good idea, too.

Well, I like the software. It's not the same old stuff everywhere else, and it's easy to read. I don't like the censorship, but since this is a "family friendly" site, that isn't going to change. And freedom of speech isn't why I come here anyway. The mods seem to be learning, and aren't quite so quick on the draw. Assume an honest mistake, rather than some the worst case. It would be nice if freestuff contributers were honored in some way in the forums. The big freestuff contributers keep giving, and get very d*mn little in return from the 'sity. Their freestuff links should be more appreciated. After all, freestuff is why a lot of people come to the 'sity. I agree that sometimes an item in progress needs some input. The item may or may not be a for sale item. Sometimes the vendor doesn't know when they're doing it. If we post it in the Poser Forum, it gets moved to Product Showcase where it doesn't get as much play. Set the default on the boxes to the most stringent: IE nudity and violence. Let people change them to make them non-nude and non-violent. That way someone doesn't get in trouble because they forgot to set a box. It seems an easier way to deal with the pervs and pruds. ...I like that... "pervs and prudes"... (grin). I think I just offended 90% of the members (bigger grin). OT should come back, and be limited to chatty news items. Sometimes you want to hear news about your online friends. Controversial issues should be allowed in a more open, less controlled forum with a good level-headed mod. Sometimes people want to discuss the issues of the day. Sometimes feelings will be hurt. It's a fact of life. If there isn't a place for this, people will bastardize another forum and use it there. The new forum would be limited to adults. You know, what we're all supposed to be.

I haven't been here long enough to get involved in the politics, so I can't comment on "uneven TOS enforcement," "who did what to whom," or any of that stuff. What I have seen is a knowledgable group of people helping each other out, sharing work and ideas. And -- guess what! -- that's what I look for in a Forum!! Yeah, a good search engine would be nice, but often when I'm looking for an answer to Question A, I find an answer to Question C (which I had a week ago, but forgot) and I get ideas for Projects 1,3, and 7. Interface? You wanna talk interface? Join a Web Design forum! This works, why fiddle with it? Enough. Thanks to the moderators and coordinators who make this possible. I know how much money you guys make off this gig: it's exactly what I get paid as a volunteer fireman.

A couple more thoughts: How about an OT flag, operates just like a Nudity flag. If you implemented that, then folks could update their profile to ignore OT, much like they can have their browser not display Nudity. (Same could go for Religious). Also, rather than an OT forum which invariably turns into a catfight ring, leave OT here (as mentioned above), but also put in a forum like at 3D Arena or Poser Pros where controversial posts, comments or questions are expected to be put in order to spark debate. You don't like debate, don't go there. You've been warned. Thanks, Oh, and I agree that the current moderation of the forum has been good of late.

one single thing that I would like to see: a FAQ database, like a directory (like the "yellow pages" in a phone book) for the forum.. ..with categories and links to tutorial threads already in this forum. It will be tough work to sort through all the posts in this forum. It could be even better than an improved search function, and new people can easily look for answers there. And highlight it at the top of the forum for those who cant see "FAQ" links that well, heheh ;) Nothing else I'd want changed. I love it here, but that's just my humble lil opinion :) Thanks, Dru

I don't mind the n*dity tag, because, like some others out there, we stop by on breaks and our lunch hour to see what's up. Now the subjects per se don't bother me, but I'm traveling here on someone else's nickel, so if they have a policy against it, I have to honor it.
I miss the OT forum..the more intelligent responses, and the information you might not ordinarily see. The descent into name-calling I could do without..;)
My concerns on the freestuff is more general; use the Requirments field to let folks know it's only for a specific model, or needs some other doodad to work..;) One thing that would help me is a readme that actually tells you where specific file go in the download (some folks do this, and thank you for it..;) If the search engine could handle wild cards, that would be a plus..
another thing that I'd ask folks is to be nice to yourself..;) there are no 'stupid, idiot, dumb, foolish' questions, (unless you're asking for warez..and then you're on your own..;) because most folks here have been there before (naysay and I are still there..;)

I wish I'd said that.. The Staircase Wit

anahl nathrak uth vas betude doth yel dyenvey..;)

How about we leave this place alone and change the bad attitudes. Try to cater to the masses and you'll please none.

In a community, people talk about MANY topics, not just one... The "OT Forum" concept didn't really work very well here, you know? The OT Forum became a place where people went to argue about stuff, and while I have no problem with people arguing about whatever they wish, it wasn't really a place where the general community went to look for or participate in conversations like, "Guess what, I got a new puppy!" or "My wife gave birth to our child last night, here's a picture!" or whatever. Actually, there was quite a bit of "Guess what, I got a new puppy!" or "My wife gave birth to our child last night, here's a picture!" there. Also jokes were traded, silly news links, all kinds of stuff. OT and VT were also good places for different types of artists to get together. Some were Poser, some were 2D, etc. IMO, the complaints are due to the TOS being inconsistently enforced, leading to the perception of favoritism. Some people get warned or banned for minor offenses, while others get away with murder. It's the perceived unfairness that's infuriating, not the TOS. Bingo! And, like it or not, in a real life environment people are going to disagree and argue about some things. The more that interaction is censored, the further from reality you're going to get.

the forum is ok as it is... just pleeeeease dont make it beige... shudder hehe ;)

My Gallery

Oh but Simderz...They need to know exactely HOW your view in the forum will be. Heaven forbid you prefer a black background. Black is bad for business, remember ;o) Actually, I am getting accustomed to how the MP looks. I still won't exactely say I LIKE it, but with the other things improved, I can live with the colour. But I agre, PLEASE don't touch the custom colours in the forum.

Better search engine facility (that goes for the whole site, not just the forums.) 2. OT in a separate forum of some description ("Community News and Views"??) Sorry, but I don't have much time to browse and I like things categorised so I can scan thro' relevant sections easily. Let's face it, some people enjoy being controversial/obnoxious and are going to do that wherever the OT stuff is put. 3. I agree with MadYuri: "The forum software is fine as it is. (I hate those phpbb boards.)"

My Renderosity Store

Boolean search terms. Everywhere -- to search for a member, for a post, for a store item. Wild card control -- as in the Google model, where 'ca' will pick up 'california,' 'cat,' and 'incandescent'; but '"ca"' (with the quotation marks) will pick up only 'ca.' I can not remember the number of times I have tried to search for, say, 'PT' clothing and got 'pteranadon' and 'inept' and 'pup tent' instead. Also, I spend about half my time in forums where threads "bump" with the most recent activity, moving to the top. I prefer this, personally. It saves having to page through several pages then guess whether something new was added. Others may disagree.

Thank you Sho for recognizing the fact that things are getting a little cold around here lately. I appreciate the attempt to find a solution to this situation. I hope all will respect each other and recognize that R'sity is trying to reach out to us in this thread. 1)Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why? No, return the OT Forum so people can visit it if they want on their own. 2) Why do you think that is a good idea? It's good to have someplace to share non-poser related communications with ither members. 3) Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead? Yes, as stated above! 4) What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it? Nothing or else chaos would ensue, "Dogs and cats living together in sin...." The impression, real or not, is that some believe the TOS is not enforced equally. I have myself felt that way several times, PM'd a moderator, and the problem was generally resolved. Some people just think they are always right. We all need to realize that whether we like it or not sometimes we are wrong and should just accept it. We are all human beings, with feelings and emotions and should respect each other. 5) What do you like about the forum/community page/Poser galleries/Poser Freestuff here? Pretty happy with most of it. Still trying to get used to the new Marketplace. 6) What don't you like? Thumbnails for merchant's products. Not all of us are compression genious' and really think that 25KB would be a better thumbnail size for buyers to view products. First impressions are important and a compressed thumbnail of poor quality can kill a merchant's sales for impulse buyers. 7) What would you prefer we did differently? Accept that we make mistakes as well, most of them are honest and without malice. A polite correction PM like what I received when I inadvertantly violated the TOS, really meant a lot to me. Some people claim they have been warned with expulsion on their first screw up, I don't know if that has ever happened, personally I have never felt threatened by any moderator or co-ordinator here. You and JeffH have been extremely patient and fair with me. 8)How could we make the Poser forum a place where you would feel happier to be? Be a little more flexible and understanding maybe, "Anyone who just complains, with no other point than to complain and with no constructive suggestions on how to do things better will be ignored.", is what we call a Heat-Seeking-Missle in Management. There are better ways to make this statement, "Please make your comments constructive, respectful, and based upon facts you have personal experience with so that we may address them accordingly.", would have been a less antagonistic way to state that and would not alert most people's defense mechanisms. If you start off a conversation with a negative, then the conversation becomes an argument immediately. Start things with a positive statement then address the problems, accept input, and wrap up the discussion with a projected plan of action. 9) Would you like to see things like a featured freestuff provider of the month? Yeah, that's OK but not a big deal to me. I spend about $5.00 a day for bandwidth of my Free Stuff downloads and I can't afford to post as much Free Stuff as I'd like to. 10) Would you like to have a featured artist of the Month that you all vote for? Not site wide, just Poser based. That would be a neat idea. Recognition always is always good for the ego, and sales! Maybe, a featured New Artist to recognize new talent that may not be selling a lot of products but shows the talent and drive to possibly become a popular merchant? 11) Or to have interviews with Poser challenge winners so you can get to know people a little better? That's not a bad idea either. Stroke the ego, stroke the ego. Recognition of people as human beings, not just names on a board is always good and reminds us that we are all just people going broke trying to support our latest Poser Addiction...err Hobby.

Definitely rip out this creaky old steam powered forum software and put in something newer, faster and more in keeping with current software standards. I would like to see OT rules relaxed (note, I didn't say "scrapped") around here. I think it's a good idea because we are a community of sorts, and forums which stick entirely to topic tend to be dull as ditchwater. Conversations don't generally stick to one topic, and often what we have here can be thought of as conversation - or discussion and debate. I wouldn't visit the OT forum for the simple reason that I can't be arsed to open yet another window and flick back and forth. I often have the Merchant's and the Copyright forums open, as well as the Marketplace, Galleries, my email, maybe DAZ, 3D.sk, or Poser Pros and squished in there somewhere is Poser. I could use another open window like a hole in the head. Besides which, I'm a Poser person, and I like my OT to be Poser flavoured. TOS wise, I have no problem so long as it's evenly and fairly applied. Sometimes it isn't (I honestly can't think of a specific example right now), which gets my dander up, but generally, I have been a defender of the TOS. Not because I think it's particularly great or wonderful, or that it makes me feel good, just simply on the basis of "This is our house and if you stay here, you abide by these rules". I'll leave the debates about censorship et al to others. Interviews with other artists is a great idea. I'm all for that.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

My Store

My Gallery

You should let members post off-topic personal stuff (health, babies, dogs, cats, jobs) about themselves. That's what members really want - a personal touch, a way to connect with each other. Members want to feel like they belong to a community, connected by sharing personal experiences. However, there's a difference between sharing personal experiences, and airing prejudice, hysteria and intolerance. So you should not allow politics, religion, war or other contentious topics here, because some have proved, time and again, that they can't discuss those in an inoffensive manner. Rather than force admins to read through yet more rants (whether they be anti-this, anti-that, anti-whatever) to constantly check for TOS violations, just prohibit that. There are already plenty of newsgroups and yahoo groups for that kind of irresponsible behavior; no purpose for it here.

I would like to have small icons by the post to indicate what it is. An icon indicating question, tutorial, sample work, poser philosphy, ot, and etc.... and perhaps this could be filterd.

So, fire away, what is it that you guys want? How about a few handy FAQs like a myth buster faq that explains and dispells myths about poser. Perhaps a top 10 most frequently asked Poser question faq. I liked the idea of icons next to a post that can be searched or filtered on that can be marked as a tutorial, discussion, etc.. 2) Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why? NO! This is a technical forum about poser. Have another forum for OT. There are bizillions of forums about every possible subject. No need to air dirty laundry here. 3) Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead? If you need one then yes. 4) What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it? Well a TOS may not be 100% descriptive. Also, even though a TOS is outlined, people may interpret it differently or think some of the guidelines are a bit silly. But this is your private property so you can do with it as you like. 5)What do you like about the forum/community page/Poser galleries/Poser Freestuff here? The fact that its here. Its very useful. Great resource. 6) How could we make the Poser forum a place where you would feel happier to be? Why? Is this an issue? I thought this was a forum about Poser issues not a place to make people ahppy. If people need to come here to make themselves happy then that's a problem you certainly aren't going to solve. 7) Would you like to see things like a featured freestuff provider of the month? That would be kind of cool. 8) Would you like to have a featured artist of the Month that you all vote for? If you want. I don't look at the galleries myself since my artowrk far surpasses everyone's here. :)

Message edited on: 06/15/2004 15:04

Well I would like more updated FAQ'S too! I have been searching forever on how to get P5 to change background colors, and I couldn't find it in the FAQ's :( And I know I have seen it posted here!

Poser 9 SR3 and 8 sr3
=================
Processor Type: AMD Phenom II 830 Quad-Core
2.80GHz, 4000MHz System Bus, 2MB L2 Cache + 6MB Shared L3 Cache
Hard Drive Size: 1TB
Processor - Clock Speed: 2.8 GHz
Operating System: Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
Graphics Type: ATI Radeon HD 4200
•ATI Radeon HD 4200 integrated graphics
System Ram: 8GB

I agree with shogakusha on 2 points he made. 1. - You're making a move in the right direction by asking the question. 2. - An OT flag would solve a lot of the problems Let's face it. This forum has become a pretty grim place to be lately. It's like a birthday party where someone died and they left the body in a corner. Ever since the last 'crackdown', people seem to be scared to broach any subject that doesn't directly concern poser. Well, that sucks, IMO. I like to come here and I'll help whoever I can, but in the last 2 months, I've been coming less and less. It just ain't much fun any more. 'Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why?' Yes. This is a community and people who are part of a community may share a common interest, but they also talk about other things. If there's a new virus out there, I want to know about it, and this is (was) a good place to find out. Similarly, if someone is ill/happy/fired from work, I may or may not want to know. But at least give me the option of looking. As far as religion, politics, and general lunacy go.... forget it. Keep 'em for the late-night drink and argument sessions. Just add an OT flag and state clearly that NO controversial subjects or outright attacks will be tolerated Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead? No. It just becomes a stamping ground for nutters and idiots. And no one goes anyway, except the real diehard flamers and looneys. I like the Freestuff poster-of-the-month idea. A bit of long-overdue recognition for these people wouldn't go amiss. mac

First let me say I like things as they are for the most part. 1) Offtopic posts - not here please, make a separate forum. I know I may be in a minority but I'm comming to this forum to find out about Poser, not that someone won the lottery or whatever. I also come to this forum to get away from all the other stuff that goes on in life, I don't really need to see existential debates, etc. here - unless they relate to whether the dork has an immortal soul or not, and even that's questionable. 2) Better search capabilities - and that's site wide. It's hell trying to find stuff in the free stuff category due to the lack of categorization information. 3) Sticky links at the top of the page to important poser related areas/sites/tutorials. How many times do we have to repost links to Dr. Geep's tutorials in our posts? It would be better for all if we kept some basic stuff at the top level that we could refer people to. Relatedly a link to a community updatable, categorized, well commented table of all the known Poser related sites (with links) would be fantastic and a real site draw I'd imagine. I'm 50/50 on whether the message post flow should be different. Changing it to place the most recently created/responded to threads at the top would be nice, but I'm afraid that this would also tend to demphasize some of the smaller one or two post topics that people need to sort out specific problems they have which is one of the real benefits of this forum. Smaller posts would drop off the front page real quick at the hands of this weeks hullabaloo about whatever's going on at DAZ or how someone didn't use a warning tag correctly. Unzipped

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=1676872

@ pokeydots: see the link for P5 background colour solution ;-) ======== Big questions. Lots of answers. And a very small chance of everyone agreeing ;-) What I enjoy about this forum is that I generally get a qick response if I need help, that people are usually open, helpful and honest - on the rare ocassions I've posted a WiP here, the comments have been much more helpful and forthcoming than in the gallery. I would like a relaxation of the OT rules. I have noticed that recently this seems to have kind of "naturally" relaxed, and threads haven't been disappeared as they were being. Actually, the moderation recently has been good, with very little to vex me. What does frustrate me is the crappy search facility. I'd definitely second a move to phpBB or similar. A featured freestuff provider (or item) would definitely get my vote. Recognition encourages more sharing :) And interviews would be good too. An excellent chance to get to know the people behind the screen name. Thanks for asking these questions. I understand that you can't always implement all the things we want (forum software upgrade, for example, would involve a site-wide change) but it's always nice to be asked :)

"you are terrifying
and strange and beautiful
something not everyone knows how to love." - Warsan Shire

Thanks Karen!

OT - Fine with me. I do think it should be flaged, for those that don't want to read them. WIP - Again, fine with me, as long as it's not just an advert for a market product. I don't have a clue as to how to mod that though. A better search engine is a must. AOM - YOU already have that. It's called the Poser Hot20. The big question would be, how do you choose the artist? I have seen some better stuff by unknowns, who don't get votes or comments or hit's, NOT to take anything away from the main Hot20 artists. I just don't see a need for another popularity contest. Which brings up my last comment. "Anonymous entries on all the contests," including the Poser Challenge. It's to bad that we can figure out who is going to win before it's anounced, most of the time. Rosity has not had a contest that a lot of us can enter, due to the members voting system. Maybe a random member pick to judge said contest might be an idea to make it fair.

A BETTR SEARCH FACILITY!
Search by author. Search by title. Search by contents. Search with logical operators "and", "or".

Message edited on: 06/15/2004 15:55

galery search engine: limit a search within one software or one category for example search the word (words preferably) only in POSER or only in FANTASY or only in POSER and sub categorye Fantasy for example

OT doesn't bother me at all. It doesn't take that long to dip in, skim the first couple of posts and decide you're not interested.

I would certainly like to see the use of forum software that keeps live threads at the top. Sometimes you can go back 5 pages and find a thread still very much alive and kicking, that most people probably haven't read for days.

IMO Free Stuff is the area that really needs a makeover though. OK it doesn't generate revenue directly, but I'll bet it's what brings most people here in the first place, who then go on to buy stuff in the MP. People should be able to rank and leave comments on free stuff, as they do gallery images, and the ability to order search results by those rankings should be added. Try thinking that most newbies come here in search of freebies, as I did, referred from the CL or e-on sites and have a look at the FS area as most people's first experience of this site... get the idea?

John

Oh, yeah, and better search facilties.

John

I have no issues with the search engine we have right now; it seems to handle my needs pretty well. But clearly it's something other folks want addressed, so maybe it's time for it to get a little spruce-up. OT posts? No. Emphatically. This is a Poser forum that receives scores of new posts every day. If one really wants to share news about one's new job or one's new baby, there should be (and probably is already) a community forum for such things. This is about Poser, remember? I realize income drives this site, but can we do something about the constant barrage of banner ads? (The supposedly-WIP "oh look at my new character up for sale next week" posts vaguely skirt the issue, but we could definitely use a tighter hand on those, guys.) I've watched as this place has gone from a community to roughly the equivalent of WalMart, and it's not pretty, okay? I know where the store is -- you make that clear on the home page -- and if I want to buy something, I'll go there. But when I'm here, it's to find information. If that makes the forum seem cold, well, so be it. There's probably a "general community" forum around here somewhere -- and if not, perhaps it's time to start one.

docandraider.com -- the collected cartoons of Doc and Raider

I would like an off-topic forum back. For the short time I was able to visit the old OT forum, the ability to get to know the people behind the name tags was a welcome change to the one-dimensional quality of a regular Poser forum. It was wonderful to discover other people who enjoyed Poser also felt the same way I felt about topics. It was even more wonderful to find a thread I didn't agree with, yet made me think - really think - about the topic being discussed. And it was also wonderful to laugh out loud at some of the things written. Sometimes because the messages were funny, sometimes because the messages were absurd. But whatever the reason, the OT forum was the area on this site that brought me closer to the people who enjoyed the same hobby I enjoyed... and that's what made this place a community.

It seems to me like people automatically think OT = politics and flamewars. I am not afraid that the Poser forum woud de-evolve into a mudpit just because we allowed something like "Beware of this new virus" or "have you all seen my cute new kitty". Politics are so utterly boring and most of the people who come to the Poser forum comes because they basically want to discuss POSER, not POLITICS. If a stray "see my new dog" is posted it is easy to skip it if you detest dogs. We're supposed to be adults here. If we keep that in mind, ALSO when someone posts something we do not agree with, this place will be even more alive, and we'll get the community feeling back, as we learn to know each other :o) Just PLEASE do not change this to PHPBB!!!!!

The problem with banning "controversial" posts is how you decide what's controversial and what's not. Remember when Bungle1 posted an image of his George Bush M3 character? That thread turned political pretty fast. Ditto the thread about that crucifixion pic in the gallery, which was originally posted only because someone liked it and wanted other people to see it.

How about allowing short personal OT posts here, but asking people to take long or controversial threads to an OT forum? I loved the OT forum, to tell you the truth. Spent more time there than here. Discussion was sometimes heated, but there generally weren't actual flamewars. I could see how some would think there were, if they didn't know the principles; some of the regs had a habit of posting satirical rants that might be taken for serious. Really, I hung out there for quite a while, it things went smoothly with no moderation that I ever noticed. It was only a short period where things got a bit rocky. (Due mainly to the appearance of a particularly...um...controversial poster. Let's just say he later managed to get himself banned from PoserPros' Chicken Coop in about a week.)

Anyway, eliminating the OT forum struck me as a permanent solution to a temporary problem. After all, we "real diehard flamers and looneys" have to hang out somewhere. ;-)

So, fire away, what is it that you guys want? - A better search engine. I'd like to be able to link words so that I can, for example, look for a topic on "MAT pose" and only get messages that specifically talk about MAT pose and not get every message where "MAT" or "pose" is mentioned. I've occasionally had to give up searching for a post that I knew was answered sometime in the past because I simply couldn't figure out how to find the answer after sorting through over a hundred messages. I hate asking the same question that's already been answered, but it's often hard to find stuff. Once, I knew that Anton had answered a question, that it was in reference to fixing an M1A1 tank download and I still couldn't find that post after searching through a couple months of his posts and for the tank. Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why? - Probably prefer posts to stay on topic. There's enough volume of posts every day that something needs to be done to rein in the volume. Maybe there needs to be another community forum to be more freewheeling where Poser friends can post about any subject. What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it? - No problem here. What do you like about the forum/community page/Poser galleries/Poser Freestuff here? What don't you like? - I love the Freestuff pages. I would never have ever started buying anything if it weren't for finally accumulating a large enough library of material that I finally started using Poser more seriously. It would have been hard to dive into Poser without all the community support. The galleries are also an excellent source of inspiration and a means to display what I've done. What would you prefer we did differently? - Can't think of much. How could we make the Poser forum a place where you would feel happier to be? - I'm happy. I wouldn't be here otherwise. Would you like to see things like a featured freestuff provider of the month? - Doesn't matter, I go through What's New on an almost daily basis. Would you like to have a featured artist of the Month that you all vote for? Not site wide, just Poser based. - That might be nice. Or to have interviews with Poser challenge winners so you can get to know people a little better? - I don't know. I guess not every artist participates regularly in the forum, so it might be interesting.

My visual indexes of Poser content are at http://www.sharecg.com/pf/rgagnon

I'd like 'Email me when someone replies' to be turned OFF by default. John

Having looked over a bunch of responses, I've got a few more thoughts that are kind of similar in nature: WIP and Off-Topic are things I'd rather see left out. Like everything, it's a matter of degree. If there's a couple a day, it doesn't bother me. If it starts drowning out the Poser information I'm here for, it does become a problem. Back in the old days before community newsgroups were choked to death by spammers, I found myself losing interest in some because they had become too chatty. That's a good thing and a bad thing. It's nice to have a community atmosphere where people from around the world are brought together over the joy of using a piece of software. Without an enforced focus, it's very possible that the tone of the forum can shift from being a useful place to learn about Poser to something where a person, who wants to ask a question about Poser, is almost out of place because everybody's talking about their kids and their vacations and other stuff. This forum currently serves a purpose and I'd rather not see that focus be diluted too greatly. Much as I understand the dilemma of creators wanting to gain feedback on projects in development, it's a tough area to have here. It seemed a year ago that every third or fourth post was a blatant advertisement disguised as a WIP. Maybe the solution is having a signature line that links to the products page in an otherwise on topic post. I can't see any easy way to say some WIPs are okay and others are more ads than useful posts. It's easier to say "no" to all of them.

My visual indexes of Poser content are at http://www.sharecg.com/pf/rgagnon

A pomposity flag could be a useful addition too. John

The search functions downright suck, to be honest. It's the number one reason I don't even bother shopping here...in the MP NOR freestuff. I'm on dial-up and don't have the time or patience to sift through dozens of unrelated items that sometimes don't even have a thumbnail to help. It's a major turnoff and a sizeable incentive to shop elsewhere. Heck, it may even be part of the reason I lost interest in learning more about Poser. It's very overwhelming to newbies. And let's face it, without a continuous stream of newbies, it will get harder to make a profit. As for the off topic stuff, my opinion never mattered before, I doubt it will now. :)

What we need is... a GENERAL Forum!

That seems to be what most of the people are really saying, and what constitutes the main problem with the Poser Forum. Some of us want it to be JUST about Poser and others want it to be about EVERYTHING, so why can't we have BOTH?

In a general forum you could allow all sorts of OT's and Birthday greetings etc. without diluting the purpose of a real Poser Forum. Then the Poser forum could concentrate on real Poser issues without all sorts of distractions. Of course, most people would really WHINE about this, so the only way to really do it would be to shut the Poser forum down completely for at least 30 days while people grew accostomed to the General Forum. (Actually, just rename THIS forum the General forum and you're done - then in about 30 days create a new Poser forum). I think that alone would do more to stop the bickering and make TOS enforcement easier than anything else because it reduces the contradictions of purpose, and provides the proper venues for a real community. That AND a better search engine which at least did a boolean AND for multi-word searches would be a big help.

Okay, just so you know I got back online 5 minutes ago so it's going to take me a while to read through all this and answer everyone. Wasn't expecting so many replies ;-) Shanna :-)

Quickie list. Better searching Better Resourse section (For those frequently asked "Where is ...?" or "How do I ...?" WIP allowed like Rawnrr said

First off, thanks for taking the time to answer :-) I've gone through every single post and I think the suggestions all come into the following sections. I'm answering them one by one so please bear with me :-) 1. Changes to site software. There are some excellent suggestions, all of which I will put together and pass on to the Admin, but the Poser Team itself has no control over decisions on software changes. Sorry about that. The place to put ideas about these kinds of things is the community centre.

An OT forum As I was not involved in the old OT forum (except to read some of bonestructures devastatingly funny posts) I can't really say anything about that. However, I will get the Admin to read through this thread and if the topic continues to be discussed in a reasonable manner, they MAY reconsider having an OT forum. I can't make any promises, but I can do my best. It's up to you guys who want an OT forum to show that you can moderate yourself enough to have discussions without them turning into flame wars and hate fests. Frankly, this whole thread shows that you can. In the Poser Forum: It seems to me that the majority of people who have answered in this thread so far would like some OT to be allowed in the forum. I have no problem with that, but it is a question of balance. This is primarily intended to be a learning forum for Poser, so the OT posts should not overwhelm the Poser posts or the whole reason for the forum will get lost. I agree that sharing some bits of personal news is part of being in a community, but this is not a general forum. How about this for a suggestion? For the next month, as long as a post begins with the words OT, posts about personal news will be permitted in the forum. Other forums here permit a little of this and I don't see a problem unless it overwhelms the Poser posts. If you want to include the default Poser guy waving from the corner of your photo of your new pet, that's fine with me too ;-) I feel that these are community related and relevant to the Poser forum: news about Poser members which other members may want to hear. However: if the subject line doesn't begin with OT, on an OT post it will get deleted. That way, people who don't want to read OT posts can skip over them. The following topics will NOT be permitted and will be immediately removed: Politics, Religon, War, posts related to Nationalism/Racism No 'this country sucks' or 'that race is awful'. No argument/discussion/posts on those kinds of subjects. I know we have Poser members who are part of the military and who may feel this some of these subjects relate to personal news for them, but I would ask you to respect this request and not post about these subjects. This forum is for discussing Poser, not general debates. Please exercise some restraint so that members who don't want to read them will still be able to read the forums without wading through pages entitled OT. If there are too many OT posts on a particular day, then either add yours onto an existing one or wait until tomorrow. On July 15th, the OT status in the Poser forum will be reviewed. If it stuck within these guidelines then we'll vote in a thread to see if members want it to stay or go. If it has been a source of non stop contention and arguments, it will be banned from the forum completely. It's up to you now to make a success of OT postings in the Poser forum. How you handle it will decide if they get to stay. Fair enough?

nice idea changing the software.. but... not gonna happen.. you see, the software used here is Bondware... and since Bondware is owned and operated by Tim.. the guy that owns and operates Renderosity.. yup.. this place is a showcase of what bondware can't.. er, can do...

I know. But they could improve it, surely? They've made changes before. I don't mind the way the forums are set up. I kind of like it, actually. But it's really painful, not having a proper search function.

have a look in the contact forum, where changes to the search engine have been begged for.. (so far we've been told that it's coming and the system does work... if anyone believes that I have a bridge in brooklyn for sale...) who knows when the search will be fixed.. cos it seems it is not important to the ppl that code this software at all...

We have an option for nudity and violence when we post, could it be possible to add an OT button too? That way, members could decide whether or not they want to see OT posts or not in the same way that we can choose not to see nudity/violence.

Hmmm....the search engine definitely needs improvement.

OT stuff: I agree with every thing that mateo sancarlos said in post 35. If I want to talk/argue politics, I can do that anytime with the people in my very conservative town! :)

I have no problem with any images and do not get too hung up on nudity, religion or anything else for that matter, including someone going "berserk" and launching a tirade. There was a great one at DAZ not long ago and I thought everyone over there handled that very well.

I do understand the need for nudity flags and the like for those who are bothered by nekkid folks...or have kids and really believe their kid has never seen a nekkid person before :)

Finally, forum software that does not go "bonkers" and "dump" the comments you're trying to post :)

Message edited on: 06/15/2004 22:51

When someone starts a thread they must be able to delete the post, but once someone has replied then it must not be possible to remove the first post. I hate seeing a thread with thirty responses but the first post has been deleted, so you don't know what the discussion is about. 2) Allow OT posts but should be marked OT, or flagged with an option to ignore OT posts in your preferences. 3) Free stuff provider of the month is a great idea, but should not be based on downloads. Should be based on some other system. At the moment the most downloaded products are clothes and textures, but some other downloads are more innovative, and deserve recognition. Maybe two different categories, one for most downloaded, and one for most innovative or original. Some products such as python scripts and utilities may not get many downloads, but they do push the abilities of Poser beyond the norm. 4) Some better way of showcasing animations. t the moment the only way of showcasing an animation is by putting it in free stuff, which is frankly quite rediculous. Possibly a size limit on the animation, sent to the moderators, who then post one animation a month for download. Not the best system, but at the moment to the casual observer it would seem as though Poser is only for static renders. 5) The header on the Poser forum is way too big. Lay it out better and it will take half the space. 6) The 'Email me when someone replies' should be turned OFF by default. 7) Poser has three forums, the Poser Forum, the Poser Technical Forum and the Python Forum. Posts that were OT were moved to the OT forum, posts that were copyright were moved to the copyright forum, but I have never seen a Python post moved to the Python Forum, or a technical post moved to the Poser Technical FOrum. I find that odd, but maybe that's just me. Is there really a need for those forums?

No matter what we do, there are always going to be people who perceive that the tos is not evenly enforced. We do our best to do so, but we don't always get it right. Because we do not discuss members personal circumstances in public, even if they post something completely untrue about a situation, we are not free to discuss or refute it. We have rules which we must follow, just as you have. Angry people are likely to post complaints about how they feel they have been treated. Once they have calmed down, they are very unlikely to post that they are now happy so you will always see more complaints than compliments. YES, of course we do make mistakes sometimes. Particularly when someone is new to being a coordinator (or moderator), they are going to be over eager to do the right thing and perhaps enforce things more strictly than is necessary. Just like some members misunderstand things, we do to. However if you contact the mod/coord who you feel has dealt with you unfairly by im or email and you put your point across reasonably you will get a response. It may be that we will find we made a mistake, or it may be that you then understand why we did what we did. If you take it to the forums, you will undermine your point and probably put our backs up. We do apologise when we realise we have made a mistake and we do our best to put things right. We are also not walking encyclopedias containing every bit of knowledge about every member of the entire Poser community across every single site. You may be annoyed that Member x is apparently getting away with posting about a merchant product from another site while you follow the rules, but we may not know that member is a merchant, or that merchants best friend or whatever. If you let us know, it gives us a chance to do something about it. Sometimes we need your help to make things fair for everyone. Handing out warnings is a pain in the backside, we'd much rather not do it. If you have received a warning, it will have been accompanied by a request to re-read the tos here. If you haven't already done so, that is a good time to make sure you do understand what it says. If you don't understand something about the tos or something doesn't make sense to you, contact us and ask. We are happy to explain. So, the more members communicate with us, the more misunderstandings we can clear up and the more even handed things will be. In case you weren't aware of it, there was a discussion in the community centre some time ago and it was agreed that if someone incurs a warning but then has not done so again for a long time (I think it was a year, but I'll have to go find the thread to be sure) they can request that their warning be reviewed and removed. Ultimately, this is a privately owned site and we have Terms of Service which members agree to abide by when they join. If you do not wish to abide by the tos and keep posting things we will not permit you will keep falling foul of it and you will end up banned. The tos is not going to be changed to a free for all. It is each individual members responsibility to govern themselves and not break the rules of the site. We will do our best to help you understand it, but after that, it's up to you. If you want to stay a member, follow the rules. If you don't want to do that, there are other excellent Poser sites with like minded people and different rules who will welcome you. The vast majority of members never receive warnings of any kind, but lets face it who wants to read a post called "Hey, I didn't receive a warning today"? It's always going to be the bad news you hear about, it makes more interesting reading. It has taken me so long to get this far, that I will have to leave the rest of this until later. I have to go to work now. I'll be back to answer the rest of this when I get home. Shanna :-)

Free puppies for every member!

We are also not walking encyclopedias containing every bit of knowledge about every member of the entire Poser community across every single site. Well, you should fix that, too. ;-P bonni

"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis

I don't know if anyone else mention it (I haven't read all the posts scholastic) but something else that would be good It would be a place with the most common questions and links to the threads that answer those questions. A usefull database! A notice also at the top of the forum for everyone that before asking something would better make a search in the archive first... Oh!And maybee A Random member of the week/month with a quick interview so that all the others know it better! I also vote for the religion and OT tag and the free WIP posts here... pitklad

You know, it seems like a lot of the things people complain about could be fixed if the forum software had basic filtering software. I mean functions that Usenet readers have had for a decade. Like a killfile - the ability make certain posters or posts containing certain keywords disappear, at least for you. Those who didn't want to see OT or WIP or Controversial posts wouldn't have to see them. I think that would reduce the amount of work the mods had to do, too.

Ok, gonna weigh in myself, finally. First, sorry to Shoshanna and SndCastie -- got too busy to ever follow through. Better choices were made, though :) Insofar as the forum's basic elements: I didn't really see you ask about that. Read it twice more after seeing the huge number of software changes I saw being asked for, and I'm still trying to figure out how they got in there in the first place. So I'm not going to suggest anything regarding software because that's pretty obviously not the point. I am incredibly concerned about the "Poser community" as a whole. My reasons for it are personal and run fairly deep emotially, but there is a great amount of intellectual interest in it as well. I "came back" to 'rosity for the same reason I left it -- the spirit of the forums had turned ugly and dark and was filled with whiny, spiteful, antagonistic posts and responses. I left because it disgusted me (ok, yeah, there have Always been some, but for a while there it was incredibly bad). Although some elements can be laid on the moderating team that was in place, the bulk of it was due, pretty much entirely, to a group of folks who seemed to think that Renderosity "owed" them something akin to miniature fiefdoms and special privileges. I came back because it bugged me that every time I did peek in, things weren't any better, and then, one day, I figured that if no one else was going to do anything, then I might as well. So I started posting. I chided the bad folks and commended the good ones. It was brought to bear in my head fully when Geep nearly quit. Since that time, things have changed. Dramatically. Even the names across the top there have changed. The forum is suddenly a better place to be again. People are exchanging ideas without getting bitter, and yes, folks are sorta treading on eggshells and ya know what: they damn well oughta. Now, I do not make always popular suggestions. Nor do I recieve them. I live in a hot place, though, so heat doesn't bother me. 1 - Create a general forum. Mentioned twice before. I liked the names it was given earliest. Let that forum linked to VERY prominently -- I suggest one of three banners at the top of the page -- sorta like an extra backroom. 2 - The proposal I would give on OT topics is exactly what you stated, Sho. 3 - A second one of the banners should be to the existing backroom, which, as this thread already shows, is both outdated and pretty much forgotten or unknown. Shake out the cobwebs and dress that puppy up. (I'll even offer up the few scant tenths of a second I have each day to assist) 4 - The third of those banners should be to a sort of weekly feature. Between you, Carolly, SndCastie, nemirc, and now Ferguson, ya'll shouldn't have much trouble finding something cool to point out. lol Don't limit it, though -- do all of the above. Make it another backroom, where you (or perhaps members) can spotlight all of the suggestions above: Freebie makers, general members, the contests, new challenges, etc. Renderosity was, long go and when I first joined, not called Renderosity. The heart and soul of it was and is still Poser. Recognize that and use it. My last suggestion is a simple no brainer, but it's the one that gets ya'll the most flak: Keep it up. Enforce the TOS as consistently as you can (which you do now, though some don't always see the greater picture) and strive harder to remind more frequently about using the flags. (ok, gonna take a step into programming and say check freebies for nudity flags, please) and when folks say things like be less agressive, ignore them. I would tend to be more agressive than less, but I am a self confessed Prude who is married to a bigger one and has to deal with the scowl potential everytime I get online. ;) I'm also crazy :) Huggs to ya.

thou and I, my friend, can, in the most flunkey world, make, each of us, one non-flunkey, one hero, if we like: that will be two heroes to begin with. (Carlyle)

Definitely give creators of freestuff more spotlight and appreciation Have less stringent posting rules, but maybe have flag requirements (ie - Nudity, Violence, Theology, OT, cutesy, Rant, etc.). If there's a Poser forum and a Poser technical forum, it seems to me the former is more of a social venue - more like a 'Poser Community' forum where us Poser addicts bond - ha ha

Just wanted to express my appreciation to you for taking the bull by the horns. Keep up the great job. :O)

An improvement I'd like to see? This is still the slowest website I visit on a regular basis. THE slowest! Doing something to avoid the 20-30 second waited during the US daytime would make me happier. Because of the slow response, I look at the bare minimum and leave.

I don't know where these suggestions fit but I hope that these along with the others are compiled and sent along. Set flags such as nudity on and have the poster uncheck as appropriate. That way people who want/need to be protected are at the outset. Have collapsible threads. Number messages within a thread (on the thread page) so that when a thread is accessed it is easier to find a particular message with a thread. Provide rewards, such as advertisement latitude, to those people who post in freestuff Provide rewards (advertiesment or otherwise) to "gold" members. That is those who are consistently helpful to the community (e.g. geep, PhilC) Decrease size of top banner Allow readers to highlight (in preferences) certain people's names so that their posts are easier to find Prevent post deletion once there is a response to the original post

I wanted to respond to a couple of ideas above about the monthy challenge. Some thought we should make it more anonymous (anonymous names) and others thought less WIP's in forum would be good. While this is certainly worth discussing, I'll share my view which is just the opposite. I want to move the challenge more towards a community effort than a competitive one against all deal. As for the anonymous names, etc, we have two problems with that. The first is a technical deal in that when I delete and repost an image because an artist has wanted to change their entry, the number changes. So voting by number can lead to real problems. The second is that there have been concerns about what is done in secret. With voting and names out in the open, everyone gets to see what is going on. If a trend or pattern does emerge (and so far we've not had any) then it will be way easier to spot with the openness. As for WIP's, I personally am trying to encourage more. Perhaps we might want a WIP forum, but for now, the WIP's for the challenge should be in this forum. I suppose it would be good to start the thread with "WIP: Your topic phrase next" and let the folks who want to skip that do so. The reason for the WIP's IMHO, is so that we can grow as artists. Its amazing what others see that we miss when we're all engrossed in the image. A little change here or there can change a basic image into something really brilliant. That's what learning and progress is about, so we should take advantage of the comments of others. (And if you don't like the comments, relax, the thread will be buried in a day under the volume of posts here.) I patterned the Poser challenge much like the Bryce challenge. Its a challenge, not a contest, and I want to move away from the contest way of thinking. If a person posts an image to the challenge, that's great. If they post in the forum as a WIP, and make changes, and post a better image to the challenge, that's a better thing because it means they learned something. I want the challenge to be about learning moreso than placing high on the ladder. That's also why I do 3 challengers and honorables. Nevertheless, I have always said this is YOUR challenge, not mine. You pick the themes and your input is always considered. Heck, June relaxed the violence/nudity rules at the suggestion of a member because it simply made sense to do so for this one challenge. EricofSD RIM Senior Technical Editor

If you haven't taken part in one before, you may not know that EricofSD takes the time to run our Monthly challenges in the Poser forum. I haven't forgotten this thread, I'm just looking into a couple of things before getting on to some more answers. I'm still rereading posts, so if you have any more input I'd be glad to hear it. I will be looking at making the Header smaller if possible, but I won't have time to do that until next week at the earliest. Shanna. ps. I take your point dlarsen that there are a few things I could have phrased better. If I came across as condescending or argumentative I apologise as it wasn't my intention. So thank you to everyone who looked past the way I wrote what I did and answered what I was asking. I appreciate everyones input.

I wish I had something devastatingly funny to say about all this, but I don't. My life isn't terribly funny or fun lately and the removal of the OT forum took my home away from me. Remember that saying about nazi germany that was like, when they burned the books I didn't do anything, and then they came for me? Something like that? Well, keep going like this and they will be coming for you. Freedom of speech no longer exists.

Talent is God's gift to you. Using it is your gift to God.

Definitely we need a "trickle up" system so that active topics don't get buried under three pages of other stuff in a day or two. It's impossible to continue a discussion longer than a couple of days no matter how interesting or important the subject. That's just not right. It leads to people having to restart threads to keep them near the front. Yes, I know about the option not to show read posts, but it isn't the default and I don't think many people use it.

Please don't take that personally! You above all have been extremely fair with me and always responded quickly and propmtly to direct inquiries I made. It was more to make the point that "we all" need to be more tolerent of each other. I didn't want such an important thread as this to degenerate into a bitch session. You opened an important dialogue and reached out to us, giving us the opportunity to openly discuss with you. That was a big risk and a great step to break down the walls that seemed to be building here. The majority of the posts to this thread have been constructive and relatively on-topic and I commend you, the other mods, staff, and the forum users for taking time come together here. Ynsaen is correct in his assessment and I was incorrect in not recognizing that things are getting better in this forum "overall". It has been a much more pleasant and a better learning experience here since "some are walking on eggshells", and that is good as he Ynsaen stated. Once again, thank you so much for reaching out to us and thank you again for taking a position here that not many people would take, but everyone thinks they would do a better at. Dale

How do you get off this thread, please? It's facinating but...

Untick the email me when someone replies box and you shouldn't get any more ebots about it :-)

I might have taken too much time to write my reply but I posted it 5 minutes ago and it still doesn't show up. I took the precaution of copying it into a textfile just in case so I am reposting it here. If it appears twice, I guess I'll be able to delete it? __________________________________________________ First of all, I have to say that I am fairly new to this forum (this community) and when I first started to visit, there was a kind of "war" going on. BUT it has calmed down in the first week I was here. Second, I hesitated before replying to this topic because I am new and inexperienced both in 3d world and in the kind of setup here at Renderosity. Then I figured that since I intend being here for a long time, I might as well put my two and a half CDN cents in this topic. ;o) So here are my answers to your questions: 1) Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why? Definitely YES. 2) Why do you think that is a good idea? Because I am not a Poser figure. I have feelings and I like people. Those OT should be clearly indicated in the subject line though. Must start with OT. Then members who don't want to read OT messages could just skip them. Better yet, as many others have stated, there should be an option to not show OT messages in our preferences. 3) Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead? NO. This group of members (who participate in this forum) is fast becoming an extended family to me. When I want to discuss a specific topic with members of my family or with friends, I don't have to go to a special room to do so: a room to discuss computer related topics, a room to talk about my children, a third room to talk about pets, etc. But in my house, when I talk about something and there is one member of the family who is not interested in that topic, he/she is free to do something else and is not forced to listen to what I have to say. So I don't see why it should be different here. That is, IF we want this to be a real "community". 4) What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it? I honestly don't know. If I ever don't follow the TOS, it will be because I don't understand that specific part of it since it is in English. Better not try to translate with an online translator either!!! lolll 5) What do you like about the forum? The kindness and the helpfulness of members and their tolerance towards newbies who ask questions they must have answered hundreds of times. 6) What do you like about Community page? Sorry to say I don't know what this is. ;o( 7) What do you like about Poser galleries? I like to visit the galleries because it is relaxing and inspiring. 8) What do you like about Poser Freestuff here? That's what brought me here for the first time and I still visit the "What's new" every day. 9) What don't you like? (about the items 5-8) The forum: I don't like it when someone ask a question and some members reply to their message with OT messages or just to comment on the habits of the person who asked the question. In other words, if you don't have a constructive answer to a specific question, nobody forces you to reply! Community page: as I said, I don't know what it is so I can't comment on it. Poser Galleries: the fact that we can't upload more than one image a day. It would be better, as someone else suggested, to allow a maximum per month. Sometimes, we are inspired and can create many scenes in one day and then we can be doing nothing worthwhile for a month! ;o) Poser Freestuff: There are too many broken links. Most of the items don't say precisely what it is for and what you need to use them. The "no picture because of nudity"... why is that? I thought we could use the option not to see nudity on Renderosity so if I don't use that option, it's probably because I don't mind seeing it. 10) What would you prefer we did differently? I think by asking our suggestions like you just did is a very good way of doing things. 11) How could we make the Poser forum a place where you would feel happier to be? I am happy already here. If I wasn't, I wouldn't come back. Again, by asking our comments and suggestions, you are already making it a happier place to be. ;o) 12) Would you like to see things like a featured freestuff provider of the month? Yes but I think it should be a random choice among all the freestuff provider, ie., not based on the number of downloads or the quality of the items offered or the "most wanted". This should not become a competition. If we, the newbies, don't upload any freebies because the stuff offered by more experienced or more talented members is way better than what we have to offer, in a few years, there wouldn't be any freestuff here. 13) Would you like to have a featured artist of the Month that you all vote for? Not site wide, just Poser based. Yes and no. My answer is the same as for number 12. 14)Or to have interviews with Poser challenge winners so you can get to know people a little better? That would be nice. You could also present interviews with the Featured Artist of the Month and the Featured Freestuff Provider of the Month. ______________________________ I apologize for the length of my reply but I have to use many words to convey my meaning in English. France

France, Proud Owner of

KCTC Freebies

P.S. What about these special topics (like this one). How does it work? Do we receive notification when there is a reply like for the regular topics? And why isn't it in the regular forum anyway? I know how the regular forum works by now and I am comfortable with that but these special notices confuse me. I'm probably not the only one either. Thanks. France

France, Proud Owner of

KCTC Freebies

This is not really a special notice... at least there's nothing special about the way it works :o) It's a normal (very long) thread :o) So you WILL get an ebot from my reply.

I haven't had an e-bot notification since post #59 and would like to know why not?!? Not that I wanted them, I just forgot to uncheck 'Email me when someone replies', can't help wondering if this lack of notification doesn't imply that I'm being discriminated against in some way, and hence am missing an great chance to complain about something. I am English.

John Edited to include the OT flag.

Message edited on: 06/18/2004 19:40

John, I'm not sure about this, but I think that if you received a notification for post 59 and didn't come to read the new messages here since you received it, you won't receive more notifications. At least, that's the way it works in the rest of the forum. France

France, Proud Owner of

KCTC Freebies

So there's a good reason for it? Doh! John

For new members, Renderosity is obviously an invaluable resource for learning Poser and its potential. However, for many of the longtime members, that is really no longer the reason this place stayed on our Favorites list. We would share our individual knowledge and experiences, often answering the same questions over and over again, for the benefit of new members because it encouraged their participation and reciprocal contribution, and helped to build the community as a whole.

The key factor in the above is the essential concept of Community.

With the departure of the OT Forum, my personal interest, and thus my participation, has simply waned. I still breeze through the Poser forum, but fairly quickly these days, largely seeing the sameolsameol, but now, when I reach the end, there is nowhere left (here) to go hang and just shoot the breeze with the folks whom I have come to regard as old friends.

What was formerly like an exciting novel with new chapters everyday, has become merely a textbook, and one that I have largely already read.

In her post above, TygerCub really nailed it for me:

TygerCub:
the ability to get to know the people behind the name tags was a welcome change to the one-dimensional quality of a regular Poser forum, the OT forum was the area on this site that brought me closer to the people who enjoyed the same hobby I enjoyed... and that's what made this place a community.

I havent been here in a few days and just now saw the announcement about an new OT, so off to go see what youve done.

Thanks for asking Shanna.

(and howdy there Bone, long time no see)

I agree with the above on increasing thumbnail size in the store to 25k. 15k KILLS a thumbnail with any amount of color. I'd like the OT forum back also. I think it would do well to have an "Argue" tag on posts there, so people who do not wish to argue can avoid the thread. Any thread with an argue tag should be "enter at your own risk" and people could then get as flamey as they like. Some people like to argue, some don't. I don't think it's right to judge argumentative types as "wrong" or "unprofessional". Some people even enjoy trading insults. There's nothing wrong with it as long as everyone is having a good time. An "Argue" tag would sort out the types and keep everyone happy. -WTB

Do you want to post off topic in here and if so why? Yes Why do you think that is a good idea? I enjoy learning about the other artists here and what's going on their lives. It's a great way to get to know each other. It could also help build a better community. Would you prefer there to be an off topic type forum instead? Not necessariyl a bad idea. At least that way you know what you are reading is not related to anything technical. It would be a much easier way to filter out posts that are off topic. What is so terrible about following the tos when posting that leads some people to complain about it? I don't have a problem with that. What do you like about the forum? Giving a nd receiving helpful information, tips and tricks. community page? The fact that there is a site like Renderosity on the internet is enough said, I think. Poser galleries? The ability to share artworks with others and receive feedback. Being able to view some of the best artwork worldwide that otherwise might not have been seen. Poser Freestuff here? I love the freebies here...Most of the stuff is of excellent quality. When I first started out, I used alot of freebies to help myself improve. I also think that freebies are a great way to show the community the quality of products for the people looking to sell at the Marketplace. I personally have purchased a vendor's product after downloading one of their freebies. What don't you like? What would you prefer we did differently? I like that there are great contests here. Someone else mentioned anonymous entries. I think that's a great idea. I feel that this would allow the art to be judged for itself. If the art is good quality it will speak for itself. It sucks seeing a great piece of artwork passed by because that person isn't as well known in the community. How could we make the Poser forum a place where you would feel happier to be? N/C Would you like to see things like a featured freestuff provider of the month? That would be wonderful for them. I think they deserve recognition for the things that they do. Would you like to have a featured artist of the Month that you all vote for? I like the idea of a Poser Artist of the month. I enjoy reading about how other Poser members got started. You could randomly pick from the community or have nominations. I think we are all capable of nominating different artists each month. Or to have interviews with Poser challenge winners so you can get to know people a little better? A swell idea as well.

Some OT should be allowed here. I understand the need to try to keep the forum mostly on topic, but when people start to self censor themselves, due to fear that a post will be deleted due to it not being on topic enough, that's a bad thing for community!

WIPs should be allowed here. Most definitely. Better products are better for the entire Poser community. There are so many Poser products available from so many different vendors, I find it silly that any particular site would be concerned about WIP posts for items sold elsewhere.

It probably is counterproductive from a business stand point to ban WIPs as well, even if the item ends up being sold elsewhere. How so? There are a lot of popular products sold here that are texture sets or add-ons for products sold elsewhere. Being involved in the WIP process here for an item will encourage developers here to make add-ons for those products and sell them here. This is not only good because of the revenue from those items, but it helps establish in the minds of customers that Renderosity is a good place to go for add-ons for all products, even those bought elsewhere.

Of course, as others have pointed out, banning WIPs also drives away vendors who may have otherwise sold items here. That alone should be reason enough for a quick reversal and it would probably be productive to make a very public announcement on that change of policy.

Encouraging WIPs = Good business sense.
Banning WIPS = Bad business sense.

May seem counter-intuitive in the "Us vs. Them" mentality, but encouraging an open WIP process here will actually draw more products and revenue here.

Forum: Poser - OFFICIAL

Subject: What is it you want exactly from the Poser Forum here at Renderosity?