Hi.. im a beginner of adobe photoshop user... and i never tried it before. I just wonder what softwares that people usually used to create realistic picture from poser graphic, i mean it looks real. Did poser renderer alone can do it?And can i alter my animation graphic using photoshop? i Got to know this before i buy the software.. thanks

Try the other forum for photoshop.

Rowlando

I really want to see some foul language in this thread.  I opened it and was greatly disappointed at the lack of profanity. 

&^&%^&%YT(&HGIUYGT^%^U PHOTOSHOP!!!!

#$^%I^^(&+()(&&%%$%^&^%*& POST WORK!!!

&(^%@#$%#&(&^(&( REALISTIC RENDERS!!!!

(always glad to be of service...)

Attached Link: http://poserbagginsbill.googlepages.com/vsshomepage

I have developed some tools and shaders to help with that, called VSS (Versatile Shader System).

If you'd like to see what it can do, have a look at the images I've linked below. Most of these have no postwork at all, other than logos and frames and such. Some have slight postwork for levels adjustment (contrast, brightness).

There's a thread going right now about the appropriateness of postwork in the Poser gallery. I think it's fine to use whatever tool you need to use to get the kind of results you're after. However, personally I prefer the renderer to produce the right output from the start, because it's just more convenient for me. Of course, I'm not an artist, I'm a technician.

---- warning - some of these are nude ----

- HARLEY GIRLS : SEASONS GREETINGS - by MungoPark (no postwork)

Momentary Lapse Of Control by PsychoNaut

Picture this.... by yorkshire_pud

Lace 'n Leather by DigitalDreamer

Time to Relax by jartz

Dark Rose Xaggerate by Daventaki

Coy by fivecat

Real Vanessa by gamedever

Priestess by Holler

Jordan by santel (postworked hair)

Cabaret Girl by me (heheh - gotta include myself in this showcase, right?)

These are just some of my favorites showing VSS. There are dozens more by many talented people, and I hope none of them get mad at me for leaving them out. (It would take me a couple hours to list them all.)

These artists are all active in this forum, and I'm sure that any of them would be happy to discuss how they made these images, if only someone would ask them. Ask in the forum, not privately, because I want to know what they did, too. :)

would VSS work on Poser 4 render settings?

does it take a long while to render such?

Quote - There are a bunch of us Poser users who get a kick out of doing no postwork. Realistic renders are possible directly out of Poser. The key is doing your lights and shaders correctly. Particularly, the skin shader has to be a bit more than most Poser users deal with.

Count me in as one of them.

Quote - would VSS work on Poser 4 render settings?

does it take a long while to render such?

Nope - doesn't support P4 because it's all about nodes and P4 has no nodes.

And it doesn't support P5 either, because P5 doesn't have a Python API for accessing the nodes. VSS dynamically rewrites the materials on the fly and the only way to support that in P5 would be to manipulate files and load them. VSS could be made to write files instead of in-memory node changes, but I'd have to read them as well, and I don't have a material file reader. I'd have to write one.

i think it depends on your perspective and your intended audience.

in general and overall, i completely agree with bagginsbill's statements when it comes to materials and light.  i highly recommend exploring the capabilities of Poser as an application.

i've seen images here that made everyone "oooh" and "ahhh" and made my boyfriend exclaim at how horrible they looked when he saw them over my shoulder (one office).  why?  because the Poser community is extremely tolerant of anatomical and posing problems with figures and clothes to the point of blindness.  myself included.  and still, i can see that each of those images, except "Jordan," shows a pretty good example of V4's anatomical flaws.  and they're not very dynamic poses, so they don't show some of the more extreme anatomical problems or hair and clothing problems.  if you notice, "Jordan" avoids a lot of the typical Poser figure problems by not showing anything more than face, being a custom morph, and having postworked hair.  and not showing enough of the sweater to show any of the typical "floating" problems conforming clothes (the most common type) have. 

if your audience is CG people outside of Poser (who are sticklers for anatomy)  or even your average citizen who isn't almost instinctively blind to various errors (primarily those of the reigning Vicky), then there's only two solutions i know of for realism.  lots of custom morphs specific to your figure's pose or postwork in Photoshop.  major problem areas are eyes (especially the eyelids), shoulders, elbows, knees, ankles, feet and hands.  hands and feet are so much of a problem that i can usually use them to spot the DAZ figures within completely repainted works on CG Society. 

if you want to do really dynamic works, Photoshop, another image editor, or  a really good custom morph tool will be absolutely necessary for realism.    even more importantly, spend some time drawing or painting from life or photos so you know how something should look.  and what proportions a figure should have.  sure, there's a debatable range, but when your figure's elbow is half a head length above her head when she raises it, you just need to do something about it. 

oh!  and expressions might be an issue.  also, textures stretch and distort in certain places when figures are in certain poses.

and remember that what people think is there is usually not what is there.  a lot of learning to draw realistically is learning to draw only what you actually see rather than what you expect.  the same rule applies to 3d if you are concerned with figure realism.

if you're looking for really, really high end realistic lighting effects, like caustics (example: light patterns beneath a crystal goblet), colored shadows (examples:  light through stained glass, the glasses shadows wine or juice cast), or even just true global illumination  (example: a nude whose arm redder on the inside due to reflected light from the body), then you need a high end renderer more than you need Photoshop.   well, you can kind of do the last one in post, but the rest are more difficult.  so if you wanted to focus on very specific types of materials with a CG professional level of accuracy, you should probably look at rendering with something besides Poser.  there are free renderers  out there, and ways to accomplish this.  but i'd say, mostly, people don't notice when those are absent, and for the types of renders 99.9% of the people do around here, most of those effects are unnecessary. 

if stained glass were a requirement of that temple vicky's always strolling around naked with her sword, it would be another story.  and if you want to do mainly still lives and/or explore effects like those, you might want another tool.

effects like depth or motion blur are mostly more effectively and quickly done with an image editor and a depth map render. 

i have personally run into walls with shadows in certain lighting situations.  the most significant recently involved a light at a certain angle and a plane with cloth dynamics and medium heavy displacement.  i tried and tried to get raytraced shadows to work for that image.  raytraced shadows and blur with distance as real shadows do (though i'm not sure they do it at a rate that's technically accurate). they just didn't work.  i had to switch to depth mapped shadows.  but i've had depth mapped shadows just disappear in certain spots with fine objects (jewelry, for instance).  so i've had to postwork shadows in certain situations.

a lot of the postwork in my gallery is obvious, because i like to paint hair and i like to play in Photoshop.  but in any one of those there's a lot of corrections i made that aren't so easy to detect and just get rid of problems. 

oh! and a technique for maximum realism and effect is to render each aspect separately then combine them in an image editor.  one render for just diffuse colors, one render for shadows, one for specular, etc. 

Following with interest...

A public head-scratch about rendering each aspect separately, if I may.

I know Charlie (callad) does this from D|S as a matter of course, and I admire his work. I've never really understood the reasoning behind why it should achieve better realism, unless it's simply that it allows you to adjust each of those aspects independently. But that in itself could just as easily lead to a loss of realism, unless you really know how to go about re-combining the aspects. Are there any tuts on this type of post-work, or is it just a case of trial and error?

to tell you the truth, i have no idea.  i do know that it's a standard production process in the CG industry.   for me, it's sort of like matte painting and purely painted photoreal textures.  i know people do it, i know they get photoreal results, but i don't even begin to know how they do it.

Personally I use Paint Shop Pro. It is cheaper than Photoshop, and with some external plugins (PSP is adobe compatible meaning that most Photoshop plugins/filters will work in PSP) and can do about 90% of what Photoshop can do.  Plus the learning curve is way, way less.

I started with Paint Shop Pro and I have Photoshop CS, but I just can't wrap my head around it. The interface is so different and it seems to take a gazillion steps to accomplish what I can do in PSP in 2 or 3 steps.

Anyway, a graphic program is only as good as the person using it.  To do basic post work like fixing poke through or resizing the image or adjusting hue, you can do any of that in a free program like GIMP.  If you want to do digital painting, you can do that in any program. If you do digital painting you will want to get a graphic tablet because it isn't so easy or acturate with a mouse.  A tablet works just as well with PSP as it does with Photoshop or PhotoImpact etc.

just to clarify, everytime i said "Photoshop," i meant any image editor. 

(Foul language + humor) + Photoshop training = You suck at Photoshop.

Quote - I really want to see some foul language in this thread.  I opened it and was greatly disappointed at the lack of profanity. 

wow, i really  poor in  graphic design.. hey great freebies!! i'll download them for my next animation... thx for posting! Visit my channel "ka06059" at youtube and please comment if i lack of sumthing..   (-:E

Quote - P4 has no nodes.

How does it smell?

Quote - > Quote - P4 has no nodes.

How does it smell?

Bloody awful (NOW there's a language advisory :biggrin: )

Before you buy PS, there is good free alternatives to it, like paint.net, gimp,and some others.

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - P4 has no nodes.

How does it smell?

Bloody awful (NOW there's a language advisory :biggrin: )

Boom-boom!

I sure hope that you did not purchase Photoshop.  Photoshop is the industrial standard used by the graphics  industry.  IF you are going into the graphics industry, the answer would be ABSOLUTELY, because that is what your company will be using.  For folks that are doing art as a hobby,  Acadia is correct except with the percentage, I'll go with 95 percent.  Acadia I'm kidding. 

I recommend that you go to PurPlus.com and check out the price difference between the two $600 Photoshop vs $50 PaintShop Pro.

The PSP folks simply are not doing justice to their product, its not just red eye, and crop adjustments for photos, its much, much more.  A  professional artist can from scratch paint a village scene, a seascape, landscape, animals, even a Vicky type figure that could very well be confused with a photograph of same.  Jan

Yeah, I love PaintShopPro :)
Have Photoshop CS2 as well for some things, but Photoshop is so damned clunky :/

Realism, well, a better renderer than Poser would be a big help! ;)
Muhahha!
hids under a trash can to avoid the Poser crowd

Well ti is true, although beautiful art is done in Poser, it's renderer is not that great.
I export Poser folk/stuff and render in Vue, it's miles better :)

Postwork can do amazing things, though  (wish I could do what some folk can do with another wise so-so "NVIATWAS", and turn it into a radically and better looking image! That is impressive.)

The tools usually used in post work of Poser renders are:

1. smudge to hide crumpled mesh at joints
2. liquify to get rid of shoulder bulges
   3 shadow/highlight or levels adjustment to adjust the perceived value range
3. noise or a third-party filter to simulate photographic grain in some cases
4. I also find I use Photoshop to de-saturate renders as it is easier than doing it with lighting or nodes.

Can't tell you about editing animation frames... are animation renders outputted as flash files or can the frames be saved out individually? My only advise for animating and Poser is start with low-res figures such as the Poser 4 figures so you have a reasonable render time when you are learning. I used to just output the un-rendered preview displays to paint over in Photoshop back in the Poser 4 days.

PSP actually has better "movie" making tools than Photoshop I think.