vilters there is a lot more to poser 8. but they are not ready to promote it.

i think they just allowed bagginsbill to post some renders with GI. thanks again.

Ok, thanks ice-boy, i'l put my patience in the fridge ;-)

I am just hoping, someone will blow the unmanagable V's out of the sky. But. . . . .

Been working on the V4 low res for a week lately just to convert her balloons into something. . .

I don't even start on the zillion version.
I am just an amateur, and Poser is a hobby, nothing more, but every model needs to be "tweeked" in that area.
So I guess even another week of spare to time to do that, before I can get to model the clothing I like.
One could say, it keeps us of the streets; Too dangeroes anyway lately.
If only,
If ony, I could just let the helium out. ;-) Anyone found the valve yet?
Have a nice day.

Quote - > Quote - Well I can assure you that it is an annoyance to the many of us who have hacked it out of our current copies of Poser.

You didn't answer my question. I'll ask it again.

It doesn't do anything unless you click it, right?

Second question: how is it an annoyance exactly? My point was there are lots of buttons you don't use. Why does this one, and this one alone, annoy you? Just curious. I don't really mind if you rip it out, although I suppose CP does. :)

As has already been stated, it takes up valuable screen space and it doe take up memory if accidentally clicked on when entering the setup room. It also would be nice if the tabs themselves took up less valuable screen space.

One tab is valuable screen space? I can see wanting to remove the whole row of tabs, but given the row is there no matter what, one tab isn't going to give you any space back that you can use.

Anyway - it is still in P8, and I don't know to remove it. I operate at 1920x1280 and with the new layout in P8, I feel like my pose window is too big. I don't need it so big, but it's huge.

Quote - ...with the new layout in P8, I feel like my pose window is too big. I don't need it so big, but it's huge.

now, see, if your not gunna show us, you just need to keep that sort of comment to yourself.

:P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P

:D

Quote - Anyway - it is still in P8, and I don't know to remove it. I operate at 1920x1280 and with the new layout in P8, I feel like my pose window is too big. I don't need it so big, but it's huge.

I am running that on both of my monitors & I don't think it is too big at all.

Oh, and thanks for all of the work you did for the OSX version, I really appreciate it.

Quote - One tab is valuable screen space? I can see wanting to remove the whole row of tabs, but given the row is there no matter what, one tab isn't going to give you any space back that you can use.

Anyway - it is still in P8, and I don't know to remove it. I operate at 1920x1280 and with the new layout in P8, I feel like my pose window is too big. I don't need it so big, but it's huge.

Well see, you assume that everyone has that large of a display area. I'm running at 1440x900 which is the max I can go on my 22 inch monitor. Some people are still limited to 1024x768 (My Laptop for instance).  

I wouldn't want the tabs removed, but it would be nice to be able to resize them down a bit from thier current size. The ability to move them would also be nice to have. I'd prefer having them on the side opposite the Library pullout window instead of across the top.

I am hoping that the handling of GI calculations will not bog down my machine. I tried that script (linked to a few pages back) to access GI through Poser Pro. It was horrendously slow. I was trying just a demo that was 658 X 658 (my usual studio window size), and after two hours, it had only gotten down the forehead of my demo figure which is about two render rows (bucket size 50). It was insane! I stopped it and decided that I'd just play with IBL until Poser 8 is in my hands.

I used the content tabe to load from zip for awhile and always found the content pardice thing anoying, and slow. I just unzip to pp now as it works better.

For some of us especially after the way they acted awile back when they cut off rendo and RDNA were not happy with them.
Also I buy almost nothing from CP this is part of the anoyance. if we could change it to our prefered vender of our choice it would be more useful, but face it CP sux most of the time ( note this is my opinion ) Some people like it. to each there own!

bagginsbill - Would you be willing to do a few more test renders to show how GI responds in low light situations?  If you would, please, use the three sided box setup you used back on page 20, but change the spotlight to a point light with your ISF shader, and have the light intensity at the box opening start at 50% for the first render, then 25% for the second, then 12.5% for the third (and on for as many as you are willing to do and would make sense).

Thanks!

Quote - bagginsbill - Would you be willing to do a few more test renders to show how GI responds in low light situations?  If you would, please, use the three sided box setup you used back on page 20, but change the spotlight to a point light with your ISF shader, and have the light intensity at the box opening start at 50% for the first render, then 25% for the second, then 12.5% for the third (and on for as many as you are willing to do and would make sense).

Thanks!

Well now. That's an interesting request. Technically, with Poser 8 you do not need my ISF light shader.

Second, how it displays low light will depend on how you set another new feature. No, it is not gamma correction.

But I will see if I can show some examples.

Quote -

This is with GI.

Notice how the hidden ball is now lit, instead of completely black. Notice that the sides of the little boxes are no longer black. Notice that the wood is color bleeding onto the white props.*

Now,,, this snapped my head up. Poserlight is gone.  I wonder how good the gallery will look  this fall..

You kidding me :)
NLGIR*_NVIATWAS_WCBAPS**!

*Nicely Lit Global Illuminated
** With Color-Bleeding And Proper Shadowing!

That's what! :) :)

scarlock:

I didn't quite set up exactly as you asked, but this should be good enough. I got started with a certain setup at 80% and I just kept going from there. If you really, really want to see a more controlled example, you need to tell me exactly where you want the light as well, because distances over which a given % amount of falloff occurs depends highly on the actual distance to begin with.

Anyway, here is 80% intensity, but not at the front. For reasons I won't explain, P8 ISF reference distance is not adjustable, and is always 1 PNU, or about 103 inches. This is behind the back wall of the wood box. The light is 50 inches from the tall white box.

Oh my!

Could we see this with V4 and a known texxxture!

Quote - Heheh, dlfurman.

scarlock:

I didn't quite set up exactly as you asked, but this should be good enough. I got started with a certain setup at 80% and I just kept going from there. If you really, really want to see a more controlled example, you need to tell me exactly where you want the light as well, because distances over which a given % amount of falloff occurs depends highly on the actual distance to begin with.

Anyway, here is 80% intensity, but not at the front. For reasons I won't explain, P8 ISF reference distance is not adjustable, and is always 1 PNU, or about 103 inches. This is behind the back wall of the wood box. The light is 50 inches from the tall white box.

So there is Inverse Square Falloff with lights now, but it is set as fixed (as opposed to having to fake it because it wasn't there before IIRC).

There is always Poser 8 SR1 or 9 to "fix" that right?

Quote -
I didn't quite set up exactly as you asked, but this should be good enough. I got started with a certain setup at 80% and I just kept going from there. If you really, really want to see a more controlled example, you need to tell me exactly where you want the light as well, because distances over which a given % amount of falloff occurs depends highly on the actual distance to begin with.

Anyway, here is 80% intensity, but not at the front. For reasons I won't explain, P8 ISF reference distance is not adjustable, and is always 1 PNU, or about 103 inches. This is behind the back wall of the wood box. The light is 50 inches from the tall white box.

It's better than good enough.  That shows exactly what I wanted to see and all I can say is WOW!

Thanks for doing the renders.

Can you say anything else about the new feature that influences low light?

GNDV4, with GND shaders, stock, no baggins tricks.

I think we have a new acronym - NVIABWAB - naked Vickie in a box, with a ball. Gotta have the ball or its just a NVIAB.

Quote -
So there is Inverse Square Falloff with lights now, but it is set as fixed (as opposed to having to fake it because it wasn't there before IIRC).

There is always Poser 8 SR1 or 9 to "fix" that right?

It's not fixed as in you can't change the intensity. I just mean that the value you put in the dial is at a fixed distances, 1 PNU. In my ISF shader, I let you choose the specific distance you wanted the intensity to be at. What I mean by that is that every ISF light has every possible intensity somewhere. There is a distances where it is 80% and a distance where it is 2%, regardless of what value you put on the light intensity. The "reference distance", as I called it, is the distance where the dialed intensity actually is.

By the way, I'm not sure what you meant by "fake it" because the ISF shader I wrote before P8 works correctly, no fakery, all the way back to Poser 5. The implementaiton in P8 is identical to what my ISF shader does, except it doesn't offer to let you specify the intensity reference distance. That is always 1 PNU. So if you want 50% at 60 inches, you'll have to do a little math.

Don't worry, I'll make a P8 ISF reference distance shader. This will still let you specify the reference distance, but you will no longer have to enter any coordinates. That's the beauty of having it built in. When you move the light, the origin of the falloff (where distance is 0 and intensity is infinite) is automatically updated.

Yes. Always turn it on. Or you'll get this.

Hmmm....

Attention, Ladies and Gentlenerds. Do not be alarmed. That sound you hear is only the copious amounts of drool splatting to the floor over the new lighting abilities. The ship is not sinking. No one has opened the cargo bay and freed the toddlers to run amuck and gleefully upchuck. Any whimpering you hear is due to poor souls girding their loins to do battle with their SO's and/or accountants, and should not affect the smooth performance of the machine. There is no spoon.
That is all.

It's looking more and more as if P8 will be able to generate image quality high enough to be useable in tandem with other apps renderers. 

Well, I said they need to bring their A game this time, and so far it's looking good :)

My remaining reservations:

• The quality of the included figures (reasonable poly counts/better rigging than past figures - Miki 2 should be the gold standard, except for the man-hands and high polygon count)
• The amount of control over quality/speed in GI renders
  *  Joint editing/setup room stability

Quote - > Quote -

So there is Inverse Square Falloff with lights now, but it is set as fixed (as opposed to having to fake it because it wasn't there before IIRC).

There is always Poser 8 SR1 or 9 to "fix" that right?

It's not fixed as in you can't change the intensity. I just mean that the value you put in the dial is at a fixed distances, 1 PNU. In my ISF shader, I let you choose the specific distance you wanted the intensity to be at. What I mean by that is that every ISF light has every possible intensity somewhere. There is a distances where it is 80% and a distance where it is 2%, regardless of what value you put on the light intensity. The "reference distance", as I called it, is the distance where the dialed intensity actually is.

By the way, I'm not sure what you meant by "fake it" because the ISF shader*** I wrote*** before P8 works correctly, no fakery, all the way back to Poser 5. The implementaiton in P8 is identical to what my ISF shader does, except it doesn't offer to let you specify the intensity reference distance. That is always 1 PNU. So if you want 50% at 60 inches, you'll have to do a little math.

Don't worry, I'll make a P8 ISF reference distance shader. This will still let you specify the reference distance, but you will no longer have to enter any coordinates. That's the beauty of having it built in. When you move the light, the origin of the falloff (where distance is 0 and intensity is infinite) is automatically updated.

What I meant is what you clarified in your comment (see my bold-italic-underline above). ISF was NOT bulit in POSER lights UNTIL you wrote one. Now its there, but with the "feature" you mentioned.

Quote - Hmmm....

Attention, Ladies and Gentlenerds. Do not be alarmed. That sound you hear is only the copious amounts of drool splatting to the floor over the new lighting abilities. The ship is not sinking. No one has opened the cargo bay and freed the toddlers to run amuck and gleefully upchuck. Any whimpering you hear is due to poor souls girding their loins to do battle with their SO's and/or accountants, and should not affect the smooth performance of the machine. There is no spoon.
That is all.

It's looking more and more as if P8 will be able to generate image quality high enough to be useable in tandem with other apps renderers. 

Oh NO! not the spoon again! hehehehe

 Thanks BB, for your time and renders.  Poser 8 is looking really nice.

take care
 

One of the problems with Poser is that we could never load something like this www.cornucopia3d.com/purchase.php . I wish they could fix Poser to do this. Now, alot of people would say it use UVE if I wanted to load something this like that but I'm partial to using Poser. Alot of people aren't interested in Poser doing complex scenes and only interested in loading some simple background model along with a figure and the figure being the main focus of the image. No wonder any company that owns Poser hasn't expanded it capabilities.

Quote - Hmmm....

Attention, Ladies and Gentlenerds. Do not be alarmed. That sound you hear is only the copious amounts of drool splatting to the floor over the new lighting abilities. The ship is not sinking. No one has opened the cargo bay and freed the toddlers to run amuck and gleefully upchuck. Any whimpering you hear is due to poor souls girding their loins to do battle with their SO's and/or accountants, and should not affect the smooth performance of the machine. There is no spoon.
That is all.

It's looking more and more as if P8 will be able to generate image quality high enough to be useable in tandem with other apps renderers. 

other apps renders? names please.

thank you

BB the ISF lights are now in poser 8. but are spot lights now automatic ISF or can we change it back to no-ISF.

Everything in Poser 8 is, by default, the same as Poser 5 unless you change it. Create a light, and it behaves like an old light from 1997.

ISF is only turned on if you turn it on.

My suggestion for building scene lighting: Create a number of modern-style lights and save them in your library. Do not add lights interactively with the light gadget. Instead, add a new light from your library. This way, all the settings you think should be there by default will be exactly how you want it.

Here's another tease: Inverse-square and Constant are not the only falloff options.

Aha... we have a variable exponent fall-off, perhaps? To simulate non-point light sources?

I just changed your ISF shader to do that.

linear / quadratic weighted?

Inverse linear.

Quote - > Quote - Hmmm....

Attention, Ladies and Gentlenerds. Do not be alarmed. That sound you hear is only the copious amounts of drool splatting to the floor over the new lighting abilities. The ship is not sinking. No one has opened the cargo bay and freed the toddlers to run amuck and gleefully upchuck. Any whimpering you hear is due to poor souls girding their loins to do battle with their SO's and/or accountants, and should not affect the smooth performance of the machine. There is no spoon.
That is all.

It's looking more and more as if P8 will be able to generate image quality high enough to be useable in tandem with other apps renderers. 

other apps renders? names please.

thank you

In my case, I'm thinking specifically about Vue Infinite. The lighting models were sufficiently different that it was next to impossible to composite or matchmove output from the two together in any kind of inobvious way. Now its looking as if Poser will have enough options that a successful composite won't be betrayed by misaligned hotspots, differences in GI granularity, and other assorted issues. With the network rendering P7Pro has, when the features of 8 get folded in there, a little careful setup work should allow you to green screen a Poser render into a Vue render.....

Can Vue generate an equirectangular camera projection of the scene? If so, you can just load that on my environment sphere and composite direclty in Poser.

If Vue can make equirectangular images, some of the clouds and mountains I've seen from Vue, rendered as e-sphere compatible images, would be really cool things to use as lighting and backgrounds for Poser.

in Vue you can render out directly an equirectangular image .

so you can for exampel create clouds and a sun. you can position the camera above the clouds. and then in the render settings you create  an equirectangular image of the clouds. 

 NVIABWAB <<<<<<

A NEW STANDARD!!!! Gotta love it!

Where's the sword? :lol:

Quote - Sometimes you just have to take the bull by the horns.

Is that what the young people are calling it these days? I'm so out of step with the slang of the new generation...

:biggrin: :lol: :biggrin:

I like it. I feel dumb. I should have put the sword in myself.

No doubt you are impressed with my Speed Racer shader.

Bill would only be impressed by it if you abbreviated it to SRS :P

Quote - > Quote - I realize you're trying to be ironic, but that's a pretty dumb example.

No, I'm serious. I LIKE the Poser interface. I LEARNED on the Poser interface. D/S may be the greatest 3D app ever made, but it already frustrates me when I open it up because I don't recognize any damn thing. So give me something I'm used to. Let me learn at a nice pace and if I see something that might be better, let me swap that out.

Everybody I ever talk to about DS raves about the better interface. and all they ever do is dump on Poser's. But Poser's interface is pretty intuitive for me. I remember doing renders the very first day I got it. I've never rendered a damn thing on D/S primarily because I can't even figure out where the library is and how to get content into it, much less out of it.

I think it's harder for a Poser user to migrate to D|S way of doing things, BECAUSE we are so used to it's interface, not because the interface is so great....LOL. Because it's not.

Laurie

Dale B,

Another reason I like working with Vue is that is has the ability to specifically control lighting influence for each light. You want just someone's face lit, and no other characters, you can add a point light, and set it's influence just for that character's face. With Poser, I must use multiple renders and compositing in post to get this level of precision. I will not ask Bagginsbill to breach confidentiality by commenting on this feature. But I will simply state that I will be examining P8's documentation carefully to see if this feature is enabled in the new program. If not, I confess I will be disappointed. No demands for a pony. No tantrums. Probably will still get 8 (I have 7 Pro now) but will simply know that Poser will still have to be used more as part of a compositing system, rather than a standalone program - which is what Vue is for me now.

Quote - Dale B,

Another reason I like working with Vue is that is has the ability to specifically control lighting influence for each light. You want just someone's face lit, and no other characters, you can add a point light, and set it's influence just for that character's face. With Poser, I must use multiple renders and compositing in post to get this level of precision. I will not ask Bagginsbill to breach confidentiality by commenting on this feature. But I will simply state that I will be examining P8's documentation carefully to see if this feature is enabled in the new program. If not, I confess I will be disappointed. No demands for a pony. No tantrums. Probably will still get 8 (I have 7 Pro now) but will simply know that Poser will still have to be used more as part of a compositing system, rather than a standalone program - which is what Vue is for me now.

this will not be in poser 8 from what i know.
its something that would be very good in poser. for example for hair. you want to use raytraced shadows but with hair you will geta very long render. you could do a new light that is only for the hair and use DM shadows. they are fast and subtle for hair.

Quote -

I think it's harder for a Poser user to migrate to D|S way of doing things, BECAUSE we are so used to it's interface, not because the interface is so great....LOL. Because it's not.

Laurie

I totally agree with you. While there has been the odd occasion when I have wished that Poser's way of inputting and positioning lights objects etc was the same as other programs (mainly for matching for compositing etc), I've always found it fairly easy to use. DS on the other hand, I've tried to get along with it, but my mind must be locked into the way that Poser works. I've said that the first version of Poser I had was version 3, but thinking back I'm sure I had a copy of Poser 1 or 2 that came free on a magazine disk. I wasn't really into 3d art back then, and from what I can remember the figures were almost like a "stuffed cushion toys" or "Thumb-Thumbs (1) with faces". Not that human looking at all. It took quite a while to get used to the interface then, but I must have. Now I find it quite intuative.

(1) Watch "Spy Kids"