LuxPose is a Poser plugin in development which will export Poser scenes to LuxRender to be rendered. It is still in the alpha stages, but the programmers are making terrific progress. Feel free to ask questions. This is a huge undertaking by some very generous programmers and is dependent on feedback from the Poser community. It's one of those "everyone contributes" sort of things ;o).

The active programmers are: odf, adp001 and bagginsbill.

LuxRender is a free, unbiased render engine with realistic lighting.

You may post your general questions here and hopefully get them answered in a more timely manner than you would in the monster thread ;o).

Laurie

To answer a question that might pop up, LuxPose works beautifully with dynamic clothing, even now in the alpha stages. Just run your sim before export.

What the alpha does not have currently (that I can think of off the top of my head):

Full material support. Bagginsbill is working busily at it. Some will convert, like Blinn and specular, but not much else currently.

Full lighting support. BB is also working on that as well.

Camera control. BB has most of it ironed out, but it's still not completely there. Seems to work mostly fine with Poser 7 users. Poser 8 and 2010 users may see some differences.

An integrated GUI. There is a basic one you can use, but you have to set it up and it has only the most basic features.

Laurie

What does "unbiased" mean in the context of a render engine?

Quote - What does "unbiased" mean in the context of a render engine?

From Wikipedia:

"In computer graphics, unbiased rendering refers to a rendering technique that makes no assumptions or approximations in computing an image. In the real world, light interacts with the surroundings in complex ways, and light rays can reach the viewer via an infinite number of paths. Conventional (biased) renderers make a number of approximations in order to complete the rendering process in a reasonable amount of time. Unbiased renderers make no such approximations and take into account all possible paths and interactions of light. Consequently, an unbiased renderer can never finish rendering, but produces increasingly better images as time progresses. Given enough time, unbiased renderers can produce extremely photo-realistic images that surpass the quality of those produced by a biased renderer."

Using that description, Poser's Firefly is a biased renderer.

Laurie

Thanks Laurie.

YW. Wiki always explains it better than I can ;o)....lol.

Laurie

.

Quote - > Quote - What does "unbiased" mean in the context of a render engine?

From Wikipedia:

"In computer graphics, unbiased rendering refers to a rendering technique that makes no assumptions or approximations in computing an image.

Unfortunately, that's not what unbiased means, Wikipedia is wrong (polygons themselves are already an approximation, by that definition all rendering is biased). A much better (and accurate) explanation is here: www.cgafaq.info/wiki/Bias_in_rendering
or if you like an explanation in video, watch this presentation from Alexander Keller:
nvidia.fullviewmedia.com/siggraph2010/01-dev-alexander-keller.html

Thanks Stewer :o).

Laurie

Many questions are answered from http://luxrender.net
No, not Poser related, but you get an idea of what Lux is capable to do. From realistic lights up to realistic reflections, transparencies, caustics and what else. 

Here's a question. The LUX renders I'm seeing of "things" seem very real and excellent. Better than what I typically see from Poser. However the people I've seen rendered seem flat and not as good as some renders from Poser. Even on the LUX web site, I don't see many people rendered. Maybe it's me or maybe when BB get's the shaders to transfer over that will fix the problem. What do you think?

Straighten me out LaurieA....

Bagginsbill is working on the shaders and materials conversions. I don't know what he has planned for skin, but since that's his specialty, I assume he does have something in mind. I don't know for sure though. You'd have to ask him.

And as for skin, I agree with you. No figure models that I've seen so far look all that stellar. Nice, yeah - okay, yeah, but not great ;o). The one thing I have noticed is that you can see many more fine details. Hopefully that currently dull skin will change.

Laurie

Okay, so it wasn't just me....We'll wait and see what BB can do....Thanks

This all looks very interesting, but way over my head Im sure.  I'll sit back and watch as this comes along... I do like the looks of what I have seen so far. ;)

Quote - Here's a question. The LUX renders I'm seeing of "things" seem very real and excellent. Better than what I typically see from Poser. However the people I've seen rendered seem flat and not as good as some renders from Poser. Even on the LUX web site, I don't see many people rendered. Maybe it's me or maybe when BB get's the shaders to transfer over that will fix the problem. What do you think?

One thing is, most textures in Poserworld are made for the pure Poser lighting system. Real good skin in Lux will come out if textures are made to go with the light. And if SSS is available for Lux :)

In the meantime we have to go what we have. Except a few are clever and start creating texturesets for a render engine like Lux.

Will all this Lux stuff run on a Macintosh too? Seems we always get left out in the cold.

If you'd like to test, by all means, try out the alpha and let the programmers know if it works or not ;o). The link to the most current version is the link in adp001's signature, right above your post...lol.

Laurie

Holy Smoke that was a fast download! Is the render engine in there too?? The instructions seem simple enough. It can't be this easy, can it?

Quote - Holy Smoke that was a fast download! Is the render engine in there too?? The instructions seem simple enough. It can't be this easy, can it?

No, Luxrender is not included...lol.

Check the wiki page for any info you might need. See the link in my signature ;o).

BTW, if anyone else would like to test, it's sort of an open beta - except it's still alpha....lol.

Laurie

Where are the renders going to be posted?  In a thread here?  Or is there a thread already?

well there's here the old thread
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2807395

then there's the new Dev thread www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php

and the Wikipage www.renderosity.com/mod/rrwiki/index.php/LuxPose

Quote - Will all this Lux stuff run on a Macintosh too? Seems we always get left out in the cold.

It will run perfectly on a Mac, luxrender is open source, it works on Linux/BSD/Mac/Windows, and the exporter is written in Python, so it too will run anywhere. :)

 Woo hoo!  downloading now  : )

Ooops! Spoke too soon...

LuxRender_v07-Install_OSX_universal_intel.dmg
The operation couldn't be completed. (SafariErrorDomain error 2.)

rumpplesnitz!

scratches head

Attention: Sometimes a texture shows up in Poser, but not in Lux. If this happens to you, have a look in the logfile from Lux (GUI tab). The texture that could not be found is marked in red. If the pathname of this texture starts with "Runtime/", this is a relative path Poser can handle but Lux not (does simple not know where on your drive Poser is). 

This will be changed in the upcomming versions of LuxPose.

Quote - Attention: Sometimes a texture shows up in Poser, but not in Lux. If this happens to you, have a look in the logfile from Lux (GUI tab). The texture that could not be found is marked in red. If the pathname of this texture starts with "Runtime/", this is a relative path Poser can handle but Lux not (does simple not know where on your drive Poser is). 

This will be changed in the upcomming versions of LuxPose.

My tests with Poser 8 show that the path will be wrong if it was wrong in the file Poser loaded and the display style was not set to texture shaded. If it's set to texture shaded, Poser will go and find the textures and after that the export has the correct path.

So my idea is to change the display style for all actors, then do scene.DrawAll() and revert the style changes...

I exported an old scene with P8 after rendering with Firefly.  The texturepath was not complete (starts with Runtime/,,,,). Don't know exactly when this happens. But because it is easy to check and correct most texturemaps, this should be no big story. 

To be really sure, a row of pathnames should be added to the GUI to search for textures in case one couldn't be found in Posers runtime. No automatic search, but path-hints.

Are you sure the textures that were missing were used by firefly? What's search depth set to? 
For me textures are fixed after firefly export or texture shaded preview. At least with all the old scenes I tried. When a texture was missing in the export it didn't exist or search depth prevented Poser to find it.

While trying to test the texture resolving in Poser 6, I found out that the current code is not Poser 6 compatible:

Quote - Traceback (most recent call last):
File "", line 67, in ?
File "P:Poser 6RuntimePythonposerScriptsworkersParameters.py", line 12, in ?
class exdict(dict):
File "P:Poser 6RuntimePythonposerScriptsworkersParameters.py", line 34, in exdict
def get(self, key, default=None, force=False):
NameError: name 'False' is not defined

Back to 0 and 1?

And the export path is not the correct path. Poser 8's last path is the one where the script was run, Poser 6's last path is the one the pz3 was loaded from...

Quote -
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "", line 74, in ?
File "P:Poser 6RuntimePythonposerScriptsworkersParameters.py", line 97, in read
raise RuntimeError, "configfile not found: %s" % file
RuntimeError: configfile not found: P:renderssusicompleteAIRLuxPosedatadataOut.bbm

scene.ResolvePendingTextures() (Poser 7 & 8) resolves the references fine for me...
It should be run before the export.

Quote -

Using that description, Poser's Firefly is a biased renderer.

Firefly is an out-and-out bigot :P It's getting better, though. Back in the poser 4 days, it was blatantly racist O_o

Quote - While trying to test the texture resolving in Poser 6, I found out that the current code is not Poser 6 compatible:

Quote - Traceback (most recent call last):
File "", line 67, in ?
File "P:Poser 6RuntimePythonposerScriptsworkersParameters.py", line 12, in ?
class exdict(dict):
File "P:Poser 6RuntimePythonposerScriptsworkersParameters.py", line 34, in exdict
def get(self, key, default=None, force=False):
NameError: name 'False' is not defined

Back to 0 and 1?

I can't speak for ADP and BB, but I'm currently not testing in Poser 6. I'd like to get this thing going with not too many distractions. I'm trying to avoid special syntax that simply wouldn't work in Python 2.2, though (such as generator expression), so if we really want to support P6 later on, it shouldn't be too hard to do that by adding a few aliases (False = 0; True = 1 etc.) and "from future import"s and maybe replacing or emulating some of the newer Poser API calls.

Too technical for this thread? looks nervously at LaurieA

i have a question.  a lot of current lighting setups use IBL to account for ambient light.  but LuxRender doesn't need the fake.  how does IBL get handled?  should we do anything with it before converting?

Quote - Will all this Lux stuff run on a Macintosh too? Seems we always get left out in the cold.

The Reality plugin for Lux for Daz|Studio was developed on a Macintosh by Pre-A-3D. So, I hope there's going to be a Poser plugin that works on a Mac. (Haven't bought the Reality version. Just reading about it in a DAZ Forum.)

Quote - > Quote - Will all this Lux stuff run on a Macintosh too? Seems we always get left out in the cold.

The Reality plugin for Lux for Daz|Studio was developed on a Macintosh by Pre-A-3D. So, I hope there's going to be a Poser plugin that works on a Mac. (Haven't bought the Reality version. Just reading about it in a DAZ Forum.)

as stated - Luxrender is already availble for Mac. Luxpose as a python script written for Poser should run with no problems, but if you do find problems please report back to the thread so we can fix it.

thanks!

Quote - i have a question.  a lot of current lighting setups use IBL to account for ambient light.  but LuxRender doesn't need the fake.  how does IBL get handled?  should we do anything with it before converting?

LuxRender supports IBL, so nothing needs to be done as long as the appropriate conversion is made.

I know no one really  knows, but is there any approximate date when LuxPose will be ready?

How much will it sell for? Does anyone know even an approximate price?

I'm not complaining about any of this, just eager to know.

well it'll be ready when it's ready..

as for cost...

nothing.
nada.
zip.

oh ok. send the devs some fruitbaskets and beer. thats it.

 Oh, wow! You're doing this much work for no pay? I'm willing to pay. Really. That would probably keep development going for a future version. I know that LuxRender is free, but the plugin is taking time and effort, and I think those should be rewarded.

(The plugin over at DAZ is not free. Haven't bought it, just reading about it.)

Quote -

Too technical for this thread? looks nervously at LaurieA

LOLOL....the floor is yours sir ;o).

Laurie

Quote -

Back to 0 and 1?

No. 

try: True
except:
    True=1
    False=not True

helps.

Quote -  Oh, wow! You're doing this much work for no pay? I'm willing to pay. Really. That would probably keep development going for a future version. I know that LuxRender is free, but the plugin is taking time and effort, and I think those should be rewarded.

(The plugin over at DAZ is not free. Haven't bought it, just reading about it.)

Hopefully we can set up some sort of donation page or site for them. At least that's what I'm hoping anyway ;o). Yes, they do deserve to be compensated. But none of them have asked for it. So it's on us then to make sure they get something ;o).

They are doing this (I assume) in the spirit of the folks who created the other free exporters for LuxRender. And because no one person is doing it all, they aren't burdened by the work ;o). But they all deserve anything we can give them. Even if it IS only a fruitbasket and beer...lol.

Laurie

Quote - scene.ResolvePendingTextures() (Poser 7 & 8) resolves the references fine for me...
It should be run before the export.

Thanks Dizzi. I'll add your findings to the code.
To have a correct runtimepath for P6 I'll add a fixed path if a version lower than 7 is found.

Want to say it here again: This is an open project anbody can contribute.  Code, descriptions, images, whatever.

If you feel you have to pay for the exporter, pay with your contribution.

Quote - While trying to test the texture resolving in Poser 6, I found out that the current code is not Poser 6 compatible:

Thanks, dizzy.

I have a piece of code able to cheat Poser Python. So all included libs are sure they work with any Poser version I like :)

But somebody has to find out what to catch and/or replace.

I can post the code here if you wish.

Quote - > Quote - i have a question.  a lot of current lighting setups use IBL to account for ambient light.  but LuxRender doesn't need the fake.  how does IBL get handled?  should we do anything with it before converting?

LuxRender supports IBL, so nothing needs to be done as long as the appropriate conversion is made.

I'm experimenting with IBL for a while. I'm able to use jpeg and openEXR for IBL. Really more imressive in Lux then in Poser. With HDR* images you dont need a light for highlights. You only need an additional light if you need significant shadows for your scene. Or if you're using LDR** images like a jpeg.

*) HDR = High Dynamic Range
**) LDR = Low Dynamc Range

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - i have a question.  a lot of current lighting setups use IBL to account for ambient light.  but LuxRender doesn't need the fake.  how does IBL get handled?  should we do anything with it before converting?

LuxRender supports IBL, so nothing needs to be done as long as the appropriate conversion is made.

I'm experimenting with IBL for a while. I'm able to use jpeg and openEXR for IBL. Really more imressive in Lux then in Poser. With HDR* images you dont need a light for highlights. You only need an additional light if you need significant shadows for your scene. Or if you're using LDR** images like a jpeg.

*) HDR = High Dynamic Range
**) LDR = Low Dynamc Range

Thanks for that adp! I'm adding that to the FAQ on the wiki page as we speak ;o).

Laurie

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - > Quote - i have a question.  a lot of current lighting setups use IBL to account for ambient light.  but LuxRender doesn't need the fake.  how does IBL get handled?  should we do anything with it before converting?

LuxRender supports IBL, so nothing needs to be done as long as the appropriate conversion is made.

I'm experimenting with IBL for a while. I'm able to use jpeg and openEXR for IBL. Really more imressive in Lux then in Poser. With HDR* images you dont need a light for highlights. You only need an additional light if you need significant shadows for your scene. Or if you're using LDR** images like a jpeg.

*) HDR = High Dynamic Range
**) LDR = Low Dynamc Range

Thanks for that adp! I'm adding that to the FAQ on the wiki page as we speak ;o).

Laurie

This is wonderful, LaurieA! I have my own lector/corrector now :)
Thank you!

Dizzi,

can you please post which Python version P6 has? I've no copy installed anymore.

Im working on a first compatibilty layer. 

poser 6:
print sys.version_info
(2, 2, 0, 'final', 0)
 

Quote - Thanks Dizzi. I'll add your findings to the code.
To have a correct runtimepath for P6 I'll add a fixed path if a version lower than 7 is found.

 
Some more testing reveals:
 When doing a render with the Poser 4 renderer in Poser 6, the texture references get replaced with the ones Poser used for rendering (everything else I tried did not work, like setting preview mode, preview rendering,...)
So I'd suggest to just tell the Poser 6 users that they should just start a small render of the scene (1x1 pixels). It's probably easier to provide a script to do that than to do anything else. The user can than save the document with the correct paths - if Poser picked the correct ones ;-) and Poser and Lux would then use the same image data :-).

Quote -
Thanks, dizzy.

I have a piece of code able to cheat Poser Python. So all included libs are sure they work with any Poser version I like :)

But somebody has to find out what to catch and/or replace.

I can post the code here if you wish.

Well, I'd rather prefer to stay away from Poser 6 (did I really ever use that thing? ;-)). But if some Poser 6 user speaks up here, I would probably do the Poser 6 testing/correcting.

Dizzi,

I think we sould go with this talking about compatibility things to another place.  What about Laurie's Forum at her "Peanuts Gallery"? She offered a closed forum for dev-talk to the Lux developers. Or just open another thread here.