Quote - I tried for some time to get Jesse to look like the Poser 6 box, but yes, it can be done, and I can work with her.

I suppose I'll try for just as long to get Roxy to look like the Poser ten illustration, but, I do like that face.

Doric.

I believe we're using Anastasia for the box. I could be wrong but I think that's what was decided.

Yes it is Anastasia on the box. I've had her for some time.

Quote - > Quote - Is Roxie n Rex the same mesh ?

What's there polycount ?

 

They are almost the same mesh - there were some obvious changes needed to be made to Roxie because she's a lady and needed detailed lady parts. And I do mean DETAILED.

Very versatile it would seem then ;)

Quote - > Quote - Is Roxie n Rex the same mesh ?

What's there polycount ?

 

They are almost the same mesh - there were some obvious changes needed to be made to Roxie because she's a lady and needed detailed lady parts. And I do mean DETAILED.

detailed? OOoOOoOoOOooOOOoOOoOOOo seeing at that very subject was in anothet thread...that is a defo selling point.^.^

dratz.  the cp room is still with us? dubbldratz

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Quote - > Quote - > Quote - Is Roxie n Rex the same mesh ?

What's there polycount ?

 

They are almost the same mesh - there were some obvious changes needed to be made to Roxie because she's a lady and needed detailed lady parts. And I do mean DETAILED.

detailed? OOoOOoOoOOooOOOoOOoOOOo seeing at that very subject was in anothet thread...that is a defo selling point.^.^

And here's another thing that I'm not sure has been addressed, at least not completely.

We know there are a lot of texture/character creators in the community. Folks who like to create their own textures and body shapes to go along with them.

Well here's the thing. Poser Pro 2014 allows you to copy body morphs to clothing. No longer will character creators have to worry about creating a TRULY custom character that morphs the body in addition to the face. If the custom character is applied as a morph, Poser Pro 2014 users will have the ability to use the "Copy Morphs" feature that  automatically copies that morph to the clothing. So, it's kind of a game-changer in that regard as well - and there may be an audience waiting for Rex and Roxie characters right off the bat. 8-)

http://poser.smithmicro.com/poser10-poserpro2014/

See the second video down in the video gallery.

"Poser Pro 2014 users will have the ability to use the "Copy Morphs" feature that  automatically copies that morph to the clothing. So, it's kind of a game-changer . . ."

That was the first thing that popped in to my mind.  I hope those content creators skilled at custom body morph creation take that feature in to consideration.  Maybe their market will get a bit bigger as the user base with that feature increases.

Quote - > Quote - I tried for some time to get Jesse to look like the Poser 6 box, but yes, it can be done, and I can work with her.

I suppose I'll try for just as long to get Roxy to look like the Poser ten illustration, but, I do like that face.

Doric.

 

I believe we're using Anastasia for the box. I could be wrong but I think that's what was decided.

Even easier, got her too.  Off for a play now.

Doric.

I have a Fitting Room question.  Can it transfer shapes/morphs/weights between actors which don't match, given two different source figures?  A consistent problem I've been having (with Pro2012 joint/weight transfer, Wardrobe Wizard, and Morphing Clothes) is that when actors aren't consistent between the two figures they are skipped.  This may relate to naming, or to a non-standard actor having been added to the cr2 for one figure, using objFileGeom.  If I want to transfer anything for such actors I need to create a separate cr2 with a merged base file and/or matched actor naming.  Is the Fitting Room more flexible than this?  I rather hope so, given that it can handle props.  :unsure:

Quote - I have a Fitting Room question.  Can it transfer shapes/morphs/weights between actors which don't match, given two different source figures?  A consistent problem I've been having (with Pro2012 joint/weight transfer, Wardrobe Wizard, and Morphing Clothes) is that when actors aren't consistent between the two figures they are skipped.  This may relate to naming, or to a non-standard actor having been added to the cr2 for one figure, using objFileGeom.  If I want to transfer anything for such actors I need to create a separate cr2 with a merged base file and/or matched actor naming.  Is the Fitting Room more flexible than this?  I rather hope so, given that it can handle props.  :unsure:

Hope this addresses your question.

Let's say you start with a pair of pants for one character, and that character has Hip, lThigh, and rThigh groups. But you want to refit those pants to a character that has Hip, lButtock, rButtock, lThigh, and rThigh groups.

Is this the type of situation that you are describing? If so, the answer is yes. When you regroup the clothing, it will regroup it based on the groups that are present in the figure you are trying to fit.

Can we shrink wrap or retopolagy to make close using Rex n Roxie ?

Can Rex where M5 cloths ?
Can M5 where Rex's cloths ?

Iffen I'm interpreting what I saw in the video correctly, it doesn't seem to matter too much what figure the clothing was made for.  They were fitting Jesse clothes on Roxy and it looked good.  I'm thinking it will be interesting with shoes.

Doric

Quote - Hope this addresses your question. Let's say you start with a pair of pants for one character, and that character has Hip, lThigh, and rThigh groups. But you want to refit those pants to a character that has Hip, lButtock, rButtock, lThigh, and rThigh groups.

Is this the type of situation that you are describing? If so, the answer is yes. When you regroup the clothing, it will regroup it based on the groups that are present in the figure you are trying to fit.

Hi, Deecey.

I am thinking more toward weight and morph transfer than grouping, but also of possibly "layered" conforming figures.  I will try to explain.  :unsure:

Say I want to tack a genital actor onto a figure which doesn't have one.  I can build the new actor's obj file and graft it into a cr2 using objFileGeom geometry calls.  Now this extra actor is there and it needs to have morphs and joints transferred to it, for proper handling.  I don't want to regroup it, I don't want to be forced to merge it into the main figure by spawning a new base geometry file.  I just want the extra actor tacked on at the cr2 level.  The ability to do this sort of thing has long been one of the attractions of Poser for me, proving very flexible, but none of the tools will cooperate with this sort of non-standard setup.

Or say I have a conformer with multiple layers.  I want a flexible figure which combines what could potentially be three or four separate conformers, to simplify my cr2 and pz3 files.  So in the region of the hip, I have an underlying "Hip" actor which follows standard conformer setup practices, but also a second layer such as "Undies", intended to be over or under the "Hip" actor's surface.  No existing tool will process an actor such as the hypothetical "Undies".  I am hoping that the fitting room will allow me to transfer joints and morphs to such an actor without having to modify my figure setup on the geometry and/or cr2 level.

Can this sort of thing be done, or am I still operating way out there on the outskirts of crazy Poser Techie figure setups, barely to be tolerated by Poser?  :lol:

well it allways has been a pain in the ... ,when you created your own morphs and no clothes fit anymore.  WW was a possible solution, but l expect 2014 to do it so much easier. As said l can'wait.

Quote - > Quote - Hope this addresses your question. Let's say you start with a pair of pants for one character, and that character has Hip, lThigh, and rThigh groups. But you want to refit those pants to a character that has Hip, lButtock, rButtock, lThigh, and rThigh groups.

Is this the type of situation that you are describing? If so, the answer is yes. When you regroup the clothing, it will regroup it based on the groups that are present in the figure you are trying to fit.

Hi, Deecey.

I am thinking more toward weight and morph transfer than grouping, but also of possibly "layered" conforming figures.  I will try to explain.  :unsure:

Say I want to tack a genital actor onto a figure which doesn't have one.  I can build the new actor's obj file and graft it into a cr2 using objFileGeom geometry calls.  Now this extra actor is there and it needs to have morphs and joints transferred to it, for proper handling.  I don't want to regroup it, I don't want to be forced to merge it into the main figure by spawning a new base geometry file.  I just want the extra actor tacked on at the cr2 level.  The ability to do this sort of thing has long been one of the attractions of Poser for me, proving very flexible, but none of the tools will cooperate with this sort of non-standard setup.

Or say I have a conformer with multiple layers.  I want a flexible figure which combines what could potentially be three or four separate conformers, to simplify my cr2 and pz3 files.  So in the region of the hip, I have an underlying "Hip" actor which follows standard conformer setup practices, but also a second layer such as "Undies", intended to be over or under the "Hip" actor's surface.  No existing tool will process an actor such as the hypothetical "Undies".  I am hoping that the fitting room will allow me to transfer joints and morphs to such an actor without having to modify my figure setup on the geometry and/or cr2 level.

Can this sort of thing be done, or am I still operating way out there on the outskirts of crazy Poser Techie figure setups, barely to be tolerated by Poser?  :lol:

OK, now that I see where you're heading ... I THINK so (in regard to the genital prop anyway), but I will have to do a test to confirm.  But this is how I would approach it in theory ...

I would load the male character and the ... er ... "clothing" ... into the Pose Room. I would position and scale the clothing IN THE POSE ROOM in proportion to the new figure. Then I would bring it into the fitting room ("posed", so as to keep the scale of the new ... "clothing") and the only area I might try to fit are those areas that ONLY come into contact with the male model, so that they lay snug to the figure. ANd when I save it as a figure, I would add the male character's FBM's and whichever others would affect that "clothing."

OK, so when you bring it back into the Pose Room, you will now have two pieces of "clothing."  The original one, and the one that has the new character rigging. You DON'T have to regroup the model at all. Theoretically, you can keep the same group names that were present in the original model.

Now ... here's the part that I have to verify.  Seeing as you still have the original model in the scene, my guess is you can probably use the Figure > Copy Morphs From command to copy those additional "functional" morphs into the new one.  In THEORY it should work.  But I'll do some playing around to confirm.

Quote - Can we shrink wrap or retopolagy to make close using Rex n Roxie ?

---

Can Rex where M5 cloths ?
Can M5 where Rex's cloths ?

Rorr, not avoiding this question, I just don't have a lot of experience with the Genesis or "version 5" figures. (Sorry). I hope someone else can answer your question.

Quote - OK, now that I see where you're heading ... I THINK so (in regard to the genital prop anyway), but I will have to do a test to confirm.  But this is how I would approach it in theory ...

I would load the male character and the ... er ... "clothing" ... into the Pose Room. I would position and scale the clothing IN THE POSE ROOM in proportion to the new figure. Then I would bring it into the fitting room ("posed", so as to keep the scale of the new ... "clothing") and the only area I might try to fit are those areas that ONLY come into contact with the male model. ANd when I save it as a figure, I would add the male character's FBM's and whichever others would affect that "clothing."

OK, so when you bring it back into the Pose Room, you will now have two pieces of "clothing."  The original one, and the one that has the new character rigging. 

Now ... here's the part that I have to verify.  Seeing as you still have the original model in the scene, my guess is you can probably use the Figure > Copy Morphs From command to copy those additional "functional" morphs into the new one.  In THEORY it should work.  But I'll do some playing around to confirm.

Okay, great.  :thumbupboth:  Right now I'm trying to make a male Antonia character, and while I've found ways to transfer joints and morphs... the process isn't pretty.  :lol:  I would love-to-pieces any tool that would actually tolerate this sort of thing and cooperate with some of the wilder figure setups which are possible in Poser.  I do tend to grumble a lot about Poser's limitations, but I think that's generally because I am pushing the limits of what the software will accept, too much of the time.  :lol:  If Poser would embrace some of its own Poser Techie potential, the software overall would be much improved, IMO.  But, y'know.  I am out there in figure-build Crazy Land.  Ahem.

Quote - > Quote - Can we shrink wrap or retopolagy to make close using Rex n Roxie ?

---

Can Rex where M5 cloths ?
Can M5 where Rex's cloths ?

Rorr, not avoiding this question, I just don't have a lot of experience with the Genesis or "version 5" figures. (Sorry). I hope someone else can answer your question.

It's all good .Very exciting time.Can't wait for Poser 10.

Quote - It's all good .Very exciting time.Can't wait for Poser 10.

Me too! LOL

But please note that the fitting room stuff and the "copy morphs" stuff is in Poser Pro 2014.

Quote - > Quote - It's all good .Very exciting time.Can't wait for Poser 10.

Me too! LOL

But please note that the fitting room stuff and the "copy morphs" stuff is in Poser Pro 2014.

My Bad ,I'm getting Poser Pro 14.

Anyone know if zBrush Vector Maps work in Poser 10 also or just Poser Pro 14 ?

I'm not aware that 32bit vector displacement support is in either version - I'd be very happy to be wrong but I reckon I'd have noticed, it's a feature I'd love to see myself ....

We can use 16 bit tifs for displacement but vector map support for displacement is not implemented at this time as far as I'm aware. That would be in our feature list for sure.

Herd on the forums about Vector Maps that might be called Ptex.for Poser & D/S.

Does Poser have some thing called Ptex ? What's Ptex maps do ?

Quote - We can use 16 bit tifs for displacement but vector map support for displacement is not implemented at this time as far as I'm aware. That would be in our feature list for sure.

Stephan told me years ago that Firefly has always had this. You guys made the displacement input a "number" instead of a "color/vector" and that is the only reason we can't use it - backward compatibility.

The more I see and read about the fitting room, the more it looks like more hassle than the way I convert clothing at the moment. :blink:
The big advantage for me though of course would be being able to fit clothes to Anastasia.

Still wondering if the fitting room is able to deal with rigid armour, or does it shrink wrap to fit? Anyone?

There are some examples of armor fitting at RDNA now.

And a post of mine showing how is is possible that it works the way it does.

http://forum.runtimedna.com/showthread.php?78653-Why-is-the-fitting-room-giving-such-good-results-and-where-are-the-problem-area-s.

We are all humans.
All figures are the same.
Be it V4 or Posette, Alyson or Sydney, Roxie or Miki,
All figures are the same.

The discussion also opens a new way to build "one size fits all" content.

Happy Posering

My only reservations with fitting clothing on different characters is how detailed textures will hold up to these deformations of the mesh.   I've had some excellent results and some not so good with WW all these years so I suppose the fitting room will probably yield mixed results as well.    

Correct, but this time you get a lot of tools to control how the clothing goes on the figure.

Quote - > Quote - We can use 16 bit tifs for displacement but vector map support for displacement is not implemented at this time as far as I'm aware. That would be in our feature list for sure.

Stephan told me years ago that Firefly has always had this. You guys made the displacement input a "number" instead of a "color/vector" and that is the only reason we can't use it - backward compatibility.

Well hopefully we'll implement an alternate down the road if it's in there already. Something simlar to the Tangent/Object Space normal map chooser would be cool.  One more reason to cut ties to old content but I won't go into my views on that. lol.

Poser Pro 2014 looks seriously impressive. It's kind of hard waiting for it to arrive.

< paces back and forth >

Edit. Oops, forgot spell checkers don't work on this board.

Quote - There are some examples of armor fitting at RDNA now.

And a post of mine showing how is is possible that it works the way it does.

http://forum.runtimedna.com/showthread.php?78653-Why-is-the-fitting-room-giving-such-good-results-and-where-are-the-problem-area-s.

We are all humans.
All figures are the same.
Be it V4 or Posette, Alyson or Sydney, Roxie or Miki,
All figures are the same.

The discussion also opens a new way to build "one size fits all" content.

Happy Posering

I'm talking about rigid metal armour. Something like this:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/swidhelms-iron-clad-milanese/79586/

It's a lot of messing about with scaling and reshaping to fit this to one of Nursoda's characters for example. You can't use most quick conversion tools as they shrink wrap the clothing to fit (like in your example). I'm wondering whether the fitting room can handle something like this in any way?

It can, but it requires work.

Remember that you can "paint" all maps individually.
Prefit
Thighten
Smooth
Soft features
Rigid features

A quick demo will not have production quality.
It only shows the possibilities.

Attached Link: my experiments with D/S - at RDNA

hi RorrKonn

PTEX is another technology from Disney/Pixar. This time from Disney.

It does have the vector displacement you mentioned, including overhangs and folds!

What makes it complimentary to OpenSubDiv though is the non-UV based Texels which can be whatever size you need, independent of the size of poly they are based on. This will become particularly useful with the next version of OpenSubDiv which will be adaptive. 

Both OpenSubDiv and PTEX have been in the last couple of D/S Betas.

(Though PTEX has been part of 3Delight for more than 2 years.)

Quote - It can, but it requires work.

Remember that you can "paint" all maps individually.
Prefit
Thighten
Smooth
Soft features
Rigid features

A quick demo will not have production quality.
It only shows the possibilities.

Thanks for the info.

Grr, I can not edit my post any more.

Fitting room controls :

Prefit => paintable and you can stack as many prefits as you like to add.
Thighten => paintable and controllable, and with controllable poke through resistance
Smooth => paintable and controllable
Soft features => paintable and controllable
Rigid features => paintable and controllable

A quick demo will not have "production" quality.
It only shows the possibilities.
And yes, it is that easy.

Do it a few times untill you have your favorite workflow and it becomes second nature.

Quote - It can, but it requires work.

Remember that you can "paint" all maps individually.
Prefit
Thighten
Smooth
Soft features
Rigid features

A quick demo will not have production quality.
It only shows the possibilities.

I am struggling to see the benefits here to be honest..This process seems long and intensive. I can get better and quicker results using other methods. I thought the fitting room was a solution like Autofit, one click and you are done. And with sickles rigging tools the results are even better. Aren't advances in features supposed to save you time and make things simpler? A am reading at all the steps you have to take to get decent results and more and more I am less impressed. Also the example shown in the RDNA thread was not a good example at all. It totally distorted the clothing item. Unless somebody can give me a good example of what this tool can do I will remain on the ropes. I want to load in my figure, apply the clothing and get it to fit without lots of fiddling. Simple as that. If I have to manually adjust scaling and brush in smoothing and all that jazz then I will have to pass. I am all for more options, but simplicity and automation impresses me more.

While where pacing back n forth n back n forth waiting on Poser Pro 14 & a SpellChecker ;)

found out that Ptex is a walt disney thing.
http://ptex.us/
No UVs required sounds killer.

I agree the autofit in D|S works fast but it only works on genesis figures and the source figures are also restricted (only DAZ IIRC). The results are also not always pefect and you don't have any level of control to fix that. Shoes for instance are very hard to convert.

If I look at the possiblities the fitting room seems to offer, you can use any target figure and any source figure you like, and the controls are much more versatile.

Can't wait to use it!

Best regards,

Bopper.

Zev0 : I was sold on Poser now has subdivable meshes.been waiting on this since Poser 3.
and I need the weight maped riggs.

If they don't have the high end app's that does every thing then the rest of Poser Pro 14 tools are very helpful.

The other features are cool, no questions there. I am specifically talking about the fitting room. If I am to make a completey new set of custom morphs I want to know if users will be able to get their clothing to fit with ease. It's one of the reasons I have held off certain projects for Gen4 and other figures that completey change the mesh.

Quote - I agree the autofit in D|S works fast but it only works on genesis figures and the source figures are also restricted (only DAZ IIRC). The results are also not always pefect and you don't have any level of control to fix that. Shoes for instance are very hard to convert.

If I look at the possiblities the fitting room seems to offer, you can use any target figure and any source figure you like, and the controls are much more versatile.

Can't wait to use it!

Best regards,

Bopper.

I agree with you that it has a lot of features, but my main concern is how involved you might have to get in order to achieve good results. I do not see the normal hobbiest going through this everytime they want to refit a piece of clothing. It's like me setting up skin manually in the material room instead of just using EZSKIN. I was just hoping for a simpler and quicker solution. I am not doubting what it can potentially do.

Quote - I agree the autofit in D|S works fast but it only works on genesis figures and the source figures are also restricted (only DAZ IIRC). The results are also not always pefect and you don't have any level of control to fix that. Shoes for instance are very hard to convert.

If I look at the possiblities the fitting room seems to offer, you can use any target figure and any source figure you like, and the controls are much more versatile.

Can't wait to use it!

Best regards,

Bopper.

For content creaters
step 1 : ya auto fit
Step 2 : then ya send to a third party app tweek save as morph for D/S
Step 3 : send morph back to D/S
then ya do it again for each and every character.

There's nothing fast about it for content creaters.

Looks like Poser Pro 14 will make content creation a lot easier.
Then ealier versions of Poser.
I simply refused to make content for Poser before cause it was just unreal what all you had to go threw.

I've desided to make stuff for Poser and DAZ it's just simpler to make my own characters.
then I don't half to wory about all that other stuff.
So I'll make the outfits and all and the character to go along with the out fits.
Solves a lot of probleams.

Quote - > Quote - I agree the autofit in D|S works fast but it only works on genesis figures and the source figures are also restricted (only DAZ IIRC). The results are also not always pefect and you don't have any level of control to fix that. Shoes for instance are very hard to convert.

If I look at the possiblities the fitting room seems to offer, you can use any target figure and any source figure you like, and the controls are much more versatile.

Can't wait to use it!

Best regards,

Bopper.

I agree with you that it has a lot of features, but my main concern is how involved you might have to get in order to achieve good results. I do not see the normal hobbiest going through this everytime they want to refit a piece of clothing. It's like me setting up skin manually in the material room instead of just using EZSKIN. I was just hoping for a simpler and quicker solution. I am not doubting what it can potentially do.

Agreed. I don't know anything about Autofit, but I use Xdresser to convert just about anything to just about anyone and results are generally very good with not a huge amount of extra tweaking involved if you add XD fitting morphs. I'd thought that the new fitting room would be a faster and more accurate method than running items through XD, but it does actually look like more work from the videos. Admittedly probably a whole load more stable than XD though! :biggrin:

I am curious as to how the fitting room will behave with layered clothing, like socks and jackets. That said, I'm looking forward to seeing just how many miles I'll get out of that. It might give new life to some of the lesser-used figures that have little content for them.

Vilters did an example of layered clothing a few pages back

But there are some limitations.
You quickly discover how good, or "bad" existing clothing was actually build in the first place.

Most problems I see are :

Sloppy modeling, mostly in layered clothing. => that will give the fitting room a hard time.

Before the fitting room, cloth builders did not have to worry where the inner layer was going. And I have seen some poly's deep inside the figures.
Conforming does not care where the poly's are.

The fitting room does care and pushes them back out into the outer layer.

The fitting room will handle a quality clothing item fine => but it will destroy a less quality clothing and you will have to dig in, and use the fitting tools to correct.

Garbage in, garbage out.
Quality in, quality out.

Unwelded or not fully welded groups => that will open up at the weld in the default "fit" and need work with the provided tools to correct.

Clothing builders wil have to pay more attention to the quality they deliver, and that is good for everybody.

My test example was old clothing I build for another test in the past.
It is 3 layers deep, jacket over pullover over  pants, and the fitting room handled it well over the figure it was build for.

The fitting room ALSO fitted it to Roxie who is extremely short compared to my test figure.

Quote - The other features are cool, no questions there. I am specifically talking about the fitting room. If I am to make a completey new set of custom morphs I want to know if users will be able to get their clothing to fit with ease. It's one of the reasons I have held off certain projects for Gen4 and other figures that completey change the mesh.

Even without the fitting room you can fit clothes to a morphed figure with the morph brush. It now has 3 additional functions: tighten fit, loosen fit and sag. And it is available in both P10 and PP2014. In most cases the fitting will be a matter of a few seconds.

Load and conform the cloth
Open the morphbrush
Optionally give the fitting a name
Select Tighten Fit
Select target figure (cloth is source)
Set the offset margin (how tight do you want it to be)
paint over the areas which don't fit
Done

The morphbrush has now created a custom morph wich you can save with the cloth

I use it now all the time. I no longer think of which morphs are supported in the cloth.

The difference between the morphbrush and the fittingroom is that the fitting room is meant for fitting to different figures and has more funtionality. It creates new conforming clothing or creates new props. The morph brush is meant for fitting existing cloth to new moprhs

It's the fact that the Fitting Room seems to deal with the re-rigging, as well as the dimensional / shaping aspect of the fitting, that really appeals to me.

The morph brush enhancements sound very welcome too.

At present I barely entertain using the morph brush. From what is described there, e.g. by wimvdb above, I think I will be revisiting that for sure... :)

Please tell me the morphing brush has a symmetry option. I always wanted symmetry..