I have a question about a "follow morph" set up. 

I'm finishing up the morphs for the L'Homme genital prop for giving him foreskin options.  There will be a total of 22 morphs for various states of "hardness" (default, 45º and full 90º) included is the Head Size dial as I'm sure folks will want that to be available for making their imagined "look" to be there.  I'm a little confused though as to how to go about setting up the morph to follow when engaged.My hope is to have appropriate foreskin morphs slaved to the Head Size dial so that various dialed sizes of the Head Size will cause my head size foreskin morphs to follow more accurately to what ever size of the head is dialed. 

If not then Head Size morphs will only work / look good with Head Size 2.000 dialed up because that's the size I used to build my morphs from.  As it is all 22 of these morphs are set up to only be manual right now. 

I'm not sure about the other morphs but the Head Size morph seems to need this extra care added but if there is no help then that's fine too!I also set up categories in both the Body and Shaft sections so it will be less confusing.  Seeing 22 morphs just looks messy and confusing to me!

These options will be included in my upcoming Ryota character pack for L'H.  Asian's don't really believe in the whole circumcised thing so creating this character I wanted to honor their beliefs or non beliefs in this barbaric practice so I have to figure out how to do that. 

Anyway, I would appreciate help in figuring out how to create a "follow morph" for the Head Size dial and my various Head Size foreskin morphs so they can work nicely with that dial.

Thanks so much

Richard 

22 morphs you say?

Small potatoes lol. I jest :)

Anyway, Crosstalk morph.

If the control dial is in the body of L'homme (it could simply be an empty dial with a name) and you have a morph in the shlong that you want to be controlled by that dial in LH... Name the target morph in the dingus identical internal name to the controller dial internal name. Now when you conform the meatus oblongota with follow morphs checked in properties of the conformer and spin that dial in LH it will activate that morph in the pyongyang at an equal value. That is provided you created the controller as an empty morph dial rather than a valueParm dial (create new master)... create new master may work but I always use an empty morph dial so I wouldn't know. You can do this with most dial functions, scales etc, providing it's set up right.

Similar process for creating morph follow dials in clothing. Create a morph in the clothing that matches a morph shape in the figure and give it the same internal name as that of the morph in the figure.

IIRC, I'd have to look through my files, I've created dials that work vice versa, a dial in the conformer controlling a dial in the conformee, so that's possible too.

If you want to rename a dials internal name you can do that in properties tab. You may have to rename the slaves of that master likewise for neatness sake. Sometimes, rarely, the name will revert to it's original name. You can make it stick by by saving again or overwriting a file, depending on what your doing.

As an observation I was always under the impression that Rendo's market frowned upon overly elaborate gens stuff... I've seen exceptions of course. Chocolate's Haru, Arduino's Young V4, etc... I don't think Satanica Inc ever had anything here...

And La Femme DOES have control chips down yonder.

Just makes me curious why the X bundle for PE is only at 'rotica... maybe it was the illustrated pdf or something... too overt.

Re-reading through the description of what you want to do here it seems like you don't actually want to create a cross talk thing. Seems more like you want to set up a dependency dial relation between 2 different, or multiple different dials, controlled by an over master (for lack of a better word) in the same figure.

The question is do you know how to set up a dependency?

Basically.

Create new master.

Toggle edit dependencies in that new master dial. This will bring up the editor.

Click start teaching and set the new master dial to 1. Don't hit enter, just click outside the number field on the palette and the value will be entered,  do this for every value you enter.. So now your master is set at 1.

Go to one of the dials you want controlled by this master. Set it to 1. Repeat for all the dials you want controlled by this master.

Return to the master dial and set as 0.

Return to all the controlled dials and set at 0.

Stop teaching.

If you want a master dial that  controls something at -1 also, it could be anything, another morph for instance, make sure you always return to 0 as a key, and then to -1. So don't just jump from 1 to -1. This might not be a necessary step in such a situation, but that's how I do it. It's a small step.

You can get fancy with values greater than or less than 1 controlling things also, blends and such. Activating a New JCM beyond a certain rotation point, etc.

Set desired limits and tracking scale in the dials settings. 0.02 is a standard tracking scale that's snappy. 1 is a very fast dial. ON/OFF almost.

Try to keep all your names between masters and slaves consistent. And whatever you do don't have multiple untitled morphs. Consistent naming helps narrowing down issues with complex dial set ups and makes things less confusing when sorting through tons of morphs for injection export.

Hiya,

Yes, your third post was the one I was referring too.  I really hope my pack doesn't fail because I'm releasing MUCH NEEDED morphs for the genital conformer, that's weird.  I know that DC released a genital's options pack with some very S&M sort of things for it so I THINK I'm OK there.  I mean if not then Renderosity wouldn't be honoring or adhering to an entire cultures belief that circumcised genitals are not necessary!  

Anyway, yes, I have used the dependencies editor before with mixed results.  I just don't use it all that much so it's still confuses me about how to start.  

Like do I set the Head Size morph to 2.000 first and enable the Dependencies Editor from that morph or go down to my morph and start the whole process from that starting point? 

From the starting point.

Click edit dependencies on the morph. Start teaching. Set the morph to 2. Go to a dial you want to link and set a value. Those are now linked with the head size as master. Don't forget to set head size at zero and then the linked to 0 and stop teaching when you're done.

In the above example you're not creating a new master but simply causing head size to master whatever dials you linked.

Unless you want head size to always activate that particular morph(s) it's best to create a new master that links head size with a particular morph. This is much more flexible and less invasive then attaching all or nothing to head size.

So

New master

Start teaching

Set new master to 1

Set head size to 2 (or whatever)

Set another morph to whatever value

0 new master and slaves back out. Stop teaching.

When I get home from work I'll set up some dials similar to what you want to do if it's still not clear.

Thanks so much.  So confusing to this old duff!  LOL 

Ok. Have some free time now.

Unfortunately I don't have L'Homme and his dingus. So I had to improvise with Antonia... or as she is appearing here as AntDingus.

(Texture wip mine, hand painted, and the sculpt specifically for this demo)

AntDingus has 3 morphs and I'd like to blend 2 of them with one dial in the least invasive way to the existing dials.

Head_Nozzle

Lovin' Vein

And Kaiju

I want a dial that mixes Head_Nozzle with Kaiju at once so I click one of the little white right pointing triangles and choose the Create New Master command...

This creates a new empty valueParm dial which I name Kaiju Head_Nozzle

This also brings up the keyed tab of the dependency editor with Kaiju Head_Nozzle ready to be set up. I'll start setting up my master dial by clicking Start Teaching and entering 1 in the dial on the editor or on the master dial that's been added to the parm palette, either works

I then go to the parm palette and set both Head_Nozzle and Kaiju to 1, remember to click outside the number field on the palette to enter rather than hitting the enter key. Apparently there's a bug with enter.

You'll notice that a new row of values appear above the number fields of the parms. This indicates a driven value in a dependency.

I then set the New Master to 0 and set Head_Nozzle and Kaiju to 0

I click Stop Teaching.

Now when I dial my new Kaiju Head_Nozzle to 1 it will cause both of the slaved morph dials to activate at an equal value. Dependant slaves.

Set desired limits and tracking speed in dial setting

If you mess up you can remove dependencies from your master by selecting the dependant parameter in the dependency editor and clicking remove selected...

So if I wanted to remove Kaiju and switch it to Lovin' Vein I'd select Kaiju in the dependant parameters field, remove selected, click start teaching, set the master to 1 and set Lovin'  Vein to one, back all out to 0 and click stop teaching. Lovin' Vein will now dial with Head_Nozzle when the master is spun. You'd probably want to rename the master, again in settings, to Head_Nozzle Lovin' Vein of course.

As far as I can tell there is no way to delete a valueParm(new master) dial from within Poser. Not so with a morph dial, which can be deleted by the Delete Morph command. I always use an empty FBM dial (remaining only in the body actor) to set up as a master, but that's another topic.

HAHAHA  You are a nut and unusually cruel to Antonia for this demonstration but very helpful and I enjoyed this very much.  Thank you!  LOL 

PS, she must have allot more geometry than L'Homme does, esp on the genital conformer, you got allot of nice detail into her nose.  The default penis shape is quite good, excellent actually.  What's your modeling program of choice?  I use ZBrush but even in that brilliant program you have only so much you can do to a pretty low poly object! 

No, It's just a welded prop subdivided 4 levels. Subdivision morphs are too wonky and a PITA for a demo, even with odf's subd exporter.

Actually still kind of low poly for real detailing, plus not dynamic tesselation or dynamesh so large scale movements obviously introduce irregular edge flow making things more tricky. Theyre simple sculpts to morphs really, very quickly done.

I use Mudbox, Blender, and Zbrush for sculpting. I just recently dumped my 3DCoat subscription, probably Zbrush too but I like some of the plug ins. I kind of hemorrhage money in subscriptions, but I have less vices than I used to. The hobby is important to me, wine and women not so much any more.

I prefer sculpting and painting in Mudbox. It's probably my favorite piece of software for this kind of Poser work. Blender would be second. Obviously apples and oranges really.

While that worked it didn't do what I was HOPING it was going to do.  I guess what I was hoping for was when the foreskin was enabled that the Head Size morph would cause the foreskin morph to follow along so that if the Head Size set to 1.000 would cause the foreskin morph to set at the right size around that size.  I created the morph at the full Head Size of 2.000 so if I reduce the Head Size to 1.000 the foreskin morph looks odd.  

So is there a way to make that work?  I've found that setting the foreskin morph to say .760 will give a very acceptable look to Head Size set to 1.000

I'll take a look at what you describe above after work and see if I can come up a solution. Probably not best to have morphs reach full value at 2, unless for a very specific reason. I'll have more time and attention to ponder your words later.

I tried to like Mudbox but I just didn't take to it.  So dropped the subscription. I too have 3DCoat and as much as I want to support the author considering he's from the Ukraine and has had a mess to deal with living there with all that war crap going on I just don't use that any more.  ZBrush first, Blender, oh how I'd love to get into that more but being older with my mind not retaining info like it used to when I do learn something in Blender and then go to use it again a month later or what ever it's slipped away and if I've not made notes about the process I either give up and go back to ZB or bother folks with questions again.  I saved your info above in a PDF so no excuses there!  LOL 

Thanks for all your help by the way, very much appreciated!  

Set the foreskin morph to .760 and export the involved actors as OBj with only include existing groups in polygon groups checked. Before doing so make sure all rotations and other morphs are 0 in the conformer. This will bake 0.760 as full strength value 1 when you load as fbm via figure: load fbm on the conformer.

Recreate your dependency.

Or you can simply recreate the dependency but this time set the foreskin at 0.760, head at 1, master at 1. This doesn't account your 2 value on head size though. You should have all your morphs operate default max 1 really. You could bake out the result at 2 as a returning 1 as described above though. By having all these differing values as default natural you're making things unnecessarily complicated.

I'll post a quick demo of what I'm talking about when I get home.

Ok.

I just spent about a half an hour typing a bunch of things. And in the midst of all that decided a different approach. Here it is.

You should have created your fit morph around the natural scale limit value of Head Size, which is 1. Not 2.

When you create a morph and it is returned to you in Poser as morph target, what's it's natural parameter value matching the morph you created?

1

You created your fit around value 2. Now it won't fit value 1.

Recreate the morph around Head Scale value 1, it very much more than likely will fit at value 2 when it is dialed to 2 also. That's the way this works. If it isn't perfect at value 2, highly unlikely, it's infinitely easier to fix it with a difference morph added to the dependency. Any other unnecessarily complex hoop jumping trying to backtrack it to fit at value 1 from 2 will more than likely result in morph telescoping.

Do it the right way to start, this is a potential product after all.

Let me know how it goes, if there's still a problem the fix is VERY easy.

*"morph telescoping."

In theory, thinking of a solution that might work trying to shoehorn what is basically a reverse deformation. That's how I'm seeing this.

I can already predict that you will be confused by what I'm telling you. Let me try to explain it a little more clearly.

Let's say you have a morph. At 0 value none of the vertices are being influenced. Moving up to 1 the morph gradually appears, growing toward its determined form which will be reached at 1.

Moving beyond 1 the morph becomes stronger influencing the vertices often to an exaggeration of the it's natural determined form. Sometimes, with morphs that mimic scaling or were created with scaling this can work out well. Morphs aren't the same thing as scales though.

So what happens when you dial a morph backwards from one to 0? The morph is subtracted, gradually reverting to the objects default form.

The foreskin morphs you created aren't mimicking a scale, they're a very specific form you've created. If you created your foreskin forms around the non default morph shape that is occuring in Head Scale at 2, dialing it back to one isn't a following along reverse to perfect fit, it's a subtraction. Basically erasing the morph.

Now if you had created it at 1, the morph would grow to fit along to value 2. It's an increase in strength. Sometimes a fix is needed but usually the results are pretty close, depending. Especially if it's a fit to a morph that's mimicking scaling. Dialing it back to 1 would return it to its default morph shape, which is a perfect fit as you designed it, not a subtraction.

Make sense?

I suck at math BTW, and am only going by what I see in practice. Anyone with more knowledge here that sees something in error with my logic please correct me.

MATH?  What's math?  LOL  

What I did was just set up the morph as you see above in my screen shot and set the Peek-a-Boo foreskin morph to .7600 and the Head Size to 1.000 so I have two morphs.  Seems easier.  I was out most of the day doing errands and just came home about an hour ago.  My internet went out, thank you XFinity so I thought better just go out and get stuff done and now it's all up and running again.  So I guess the Head Size morphs will just be two morphs per morph you see above.  The setting of dependencies is allot easier for me to grasp from how you presented it so I think I'm good for now.  I'll look over you other notes above and see if there is more I can glean from it to improve things.  

Thanks again!  

Oh and the Head Size morph is set to 2.000, I didn't expand that, it came set up that way from whomever made the conformer and it's morphs.  

Glad you got it working, I'm off the hook lol.

Take care.

LOL  NEVER!