Sorry about the tabloid headline ;-) - but the subject of Poser Units seems to crop up every now and then, with a great deal of speculation and often erroneous conclusions. Fortunately Poser 5 helps answer some questions regarding Poser Units, and dispels many of the prevailing myths about measuring objects in Poser. In addition to helping Poser 5 users, I think this information will be invaluable to Poser 4 users as well. I've borrowed the idea for this tutorial from Dr. Geep (who has made some great and entertaining tutorials), so I hope you enjoy my variation on his idea.

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Useful and entertaining - thanks!

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yup it applies to poser4 too...in my last thread about this a day or so ago i came to the same conclusion,but didn't post it.while looking for a system scale for 3dsmax that matched poser's...i used dr.geeps measurement prop,and imported it into max,at 100%,the system scale that makes it exactly the nine feet it's supposed to be is, 1unit = 8.333 feet...the extra third of a foot is from who knows where,possibly an error in the size of the prop or possibly inacuracies in poser itself...

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rodzilla - It can be confusing sometimes - because poser does not export the "Scale" information (ie: the fact that 1 unit = whatever). So when you import a poser object in another 3D app, you must tell it what the scale is - if you tell it the wrong thing (or don't specify at all), you will get results that may SEEM to prove your theory, but in fact are erroneous. I will illustrate this discrepancy and show you why Geep's theory is unfortunately wrong in the next couple of pages. Geep's numbers are CLOSE so they SEEM OK to the casual observer. But if he were correct, then Michael's height would be over 6' 3" (maybe in his DREAMS!). As I have said, this is no longer a debate because CL has made it readily apparent in Poser 5 since you can see the "real" dimensions directly on the transform dials. We should really stop spreading a myth now that we know better. If Poser 5 says that 1 Poser Unit = 8 feet then that's good enough for me (but I will go on to prove it if there is still doubt).

no i don't have a problem with an eight foot unit,it's pretty close to what i measured...and like i said my own measurement depends on the assumption that a known object really is the size it sez it is[geeps scale prop]if it's not,well then there's no foundation is there?however,in the absence of the info you've just provided in this thread it was about the best i could do for a "known quantity"...

Ronstuff, Saying that Dr Geep's theory is wrong and proving it with the latest information from CuriousLabs is perfectly ok. Theories stand in the absence of better data. However, why do you have to imitate his tutorial style, layout, and buttons? Couldn't you have been original enough to come up with your own format for presenting information??? Carolly

I kinda agree with hauksdottir ronstuff. I don't want to sound like a knob because you've done a good jod with your layouts, but that's Dr.Geeps thing. The purpose of this site is promotion and enhancement of your own style. I think you should present your ideas in a way that leaves your prints, not someone elses. Geep's earned that. I feel like a jerk for having said that, but I'd also probably feel like a jerk if I hadn't. I guess the point is that no matter what I did, I'd feel a jerk either way. This really sucks. I didn't come here wanting to feel like a jerk but now, for me, it's too late.......

You'r absolutely right, rodzilla, and I hope you don't take my comments as criticism. A lot of talented people have arrived at similar conclusions, because scale is a purely relative thing. In doing this investigation, I have taken care to verify my hypothesis from many different perspectives, and have come upon many interesting facts along the way. At the very least, it is fun to explore, so stay tuned... And for those who don't know any better, I will add that I have borrowed Geep's style because I admire it and because it is appropriate. I've added a few personal touches of my own, but please don't read any other meaning into it. I think Geep knows how much I appreciate his work without any 3rd party translators. I do not intend this tutorial as a "Challenge" to Geep - on the contrary it is more of an appendix to what he has done so well. As you will see, the lessons here should add to the many insights he has already provided rather than contradict them.

I do have one problem with an 8-foot unit. The problem is importing and resizing--it can lead to unpleasantness due to rounding off decimal places. I'd rather have a poser unit be 200 cm, myself, more leeway for meaningful digits.

Let me corect that, I'd rather have 100 poser units be one meter.

well i dunno geep,i've just been playing with figuring this out the last few days,my comments are not meant to disparage your's or anyone's work,but as for who's scale is right?i really think it depends on what figure you're using!?!fer instance...if you stand posette against your scale in p4 she's roughly 5'10" a little taller than average,but ok for a "fashion model"...v3 on the other hand stands about 6'2" by your scale in p4,not impossible,but definately above average and pretty danged tall for a woman.if there's two standards she's obviously built with the other smaller scale in mind.i wonder is posette shorter in p5?i guess she must be,unless they "adjusted" her.sigh...why couldn't they just have used a standard 1:1 scale like 1 unit=1 foot or 1 meter in the first place.what the hell is up with 8 feet?!?or even worse 8.3 !?!?who's wacko idea was that anyway?

Mr Ronstuff.. you leave Michael's height alone... I like him tall!

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Here's the next installment. Stay tuned if you want to separate the fact from the speculation, because I have the evidence to back me up. The truth is that when people use 100 as a factor for scaling between Poser and other apps (especially if those are using INCHES as the scale units) they are very close to reality which is that 1 PU equals 96 inches. As far as exporting from Poser you COULD use ANY number to scale inside another program, as long as you use the INVERSE of that number when you export back to Poser - it will come back EXACTLY the same size as when it was exported. The problem arises when you use the internal scale in a modeling program (inches is typical) to create an ORIGINAL model and then export THAT to Poser using the "100's rule" when you should be using the "96 rule". It will come into Poser just a bit smaller than it actually should - we have a lot of 3D tables and chairs in freestuff that look like kiddie furnature to prove it! As I have said before - no offense is meant to anyone, but the facts speak for themselves.

Good work, Ron. If only everyone could make information so accessible and entertaining... there would STILL be people complaining about it. Never mind. :-) I used to use the 1PU = 100" rule simply because it made calculation very easy for the hard of thinking - but now Curious Labs have told us what the standard is, why not use it? It makes good sense when measured against the Poser folk; and if it doesn't suit, well, everything's relative isn't it?

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Does P5 really come with a better default head morph and texture for P4 Male?

It comes with Don, who is better than the P4 male, but not as good as Mike

I've gotta see this!

Yes, but the pics above ask how tall the P4 man is. I have no idea whose mesh was subdivided to make the universal P5 mesh, or whose heights were used (were the P4 heights reused?).

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Needless to say, these things take a lot of time, so please forgive me for not responding to questions just yet. I WILL get back to all of those with questions that are on the topic, but that will probably be tomorrow. Thanks again for the chance to make this presentation.