Everyone be careful what you download on KaZaA!! I downloaded today a victoria sex toy pack or something. Thought it was fine but it is not. When you go to install it and press install it suddenly says it is deleting all your files. I think it may have been a fake virus considering I can still get on AIM which it said it deleted. But still to be safe I'm scanning my computer. BE WARNED ALL!!!!!!!

I do not go near KazaA....ever...to much warez there. Sharen

That is a prank file that has been around for years. I first saw it back about 3 or 4 years ago on a joke file freebie site called theFreesite (now defunct). A couple years ago someone uploaded it onto Morpheus with that "Victoria sex toys" name then it found its way onto Kazaa from there.

i forgot to mention, too, that it hasn't deleted any of your files. it simply mimics the add/remove programs app from windows 95/98 but diesn't actually do anything.

Attached Link: http://user.fundy.net/stevenk/commonwealth/kazaa.htm

Beatyoursoul Renderosity galleries are a file-sharing system. I can make tracks in FruityLoops and put them up on a file-sharing system and people can download them. I'm not a Kazaa user because of the spyware crap and that I don't mean to pay for a program that is built on an open-source freeware engine (gnutella). That's a load of crap, IMO. But I'm getting really fed up with the people who say that file-sharing is illegal. I can share all of the files I have copyright on or that are in the public domain that I damned well please and it's perfectly legal. A hammer can be used to bash someone's head in. Shall we ban them?

_DODGER, if even a decent percentage of people uesed Kazaa for the purposes you state then people wouldn't get so up in arms but the fact is that it is primarily used for the Illegal distribution of Media be it music, software, or movies as I am sure you are aware. lets not use the hammer metafore but that of a gun, I don't want to ban guns but I damn well would like to see a lock put on every one, so that it can't be used indiscriminatly. Kazaa has no safeguards and there is little so far that can be done about hunting down those who trade in illegal media. hopefully the courts will give a final verdict on the verizon case soon and that will no longer be an issue.

I hope verizon wins their case, because I certainly don't want ISPs to be forced to spy on their users.

it's not a matter of spying, if an isp is given an IP adress that has been uploading Illegal media and is asked for the name and address of the user, no spying involved from the ISP. this is just the same responsability the phone company has if ther is evedence that one of their customers is doing something Illegal over the regular phone lines.

If you are using it to share legal files fine but get serious, you know the whole reason kaza is so popular is because of the warez usage whether is't for music or software. I have no use for it, and what ticks me off is we all pay for that crap in the long run. Marque

It's the same as the government spying on people's email and IMs. it's just another of our civil rights being flushed down the toilet to put money in the pockets of the rich. I agree something has to be done to stop software piracy, but not at the expense of my rights. This is America. time was when it was the greatest country in the world. But alas, all good things must end...

Renderosity galleries are not a PEER-TO-PEER file-sharing system, they are a CLIENT-SERVER file-serving system. Although Napster and KaZaA weren't made to be used to protect illegal file-sharing, guess what their main uses were/are? And I'm sure that you don't use KaZaA "because" of the spyware, but inspite of it. Spyware sends information about you through KaZaA to whomever (as the link mentions) is collecting the information; there is no opt-out button. I had Napster awhile back to "check out songs" only, many of which transformed into CD purchases (I own about 700 CDs). I also had a large stock of my own CDs as MP3s for my own listening pleasure - never made them available for download. I had my Metallica collection as MP3s on my harddrive, for my listening pleasure. Can you guess where this is going? I was banned from using Napster and threatened with possible lawsuit because I had Metallica MP3s from my purchased CDs on my system for my listening pleasure unavailable to anyone else. While peer-to-peer systems like this remain inherently flawed, I will avoid their use. Hey, if you use it for legal swapping, great, but you also have to live with the terabytes of swapped illegal files as well as possible viruses/trojans (why someone using KaZaA doesn't have a virus scanner is beyond me) and spyware. I didn't say "file-sharing is illegal" - please try to quote me on that. I said "file-sharing music, video, applications, etc." where it should be understood as copyrighten material not owned by the person distributing it. That should've been easily deduced. Sorry, KaZaA isn't a hammer, it's a child let out late at night to be with the his/her friends, not taking responsibility for any consequences of its own actions. Just like Napster, it is a facilitator of illegal or questionable behaviour, even if there is a benign usefulness to it. They tried forcing the responsibility onto Napster and where is it now?

How is it spying when someone puts it out on the net. I've got Illegal software here's my IP adress come download it? doesn't take any spying to find that out. no, Anti government, anti spying is just a smokescreen of retoric used by those who don't want to give up their right to engage in illegal activity. if you are not uploading or downloading illegal media you have nothing to fear.

(Snicker!) Dude admitted that his original intent was to download "sex toys" for an imaginary virtual (Poser) person... (Rotates finger at side of head) (Snicker!) There's a virus going around Kazaa that infects .EXE files that are in the Kazaa program's "Download" folder. Only way to get rid of the virus is to delete the entire contents of the folder. There's info at the Symantic web site about it.

if you are not uploading or downloading illegal media you have nothing to fear. << Nothing to fear other than loss of privacy rights... If you are not a criminal you have nothing to fear if the government starts doing random house searches... If iraq is not hiding weapons of mass destruction in their mosques they have nothing to fear from the UN inspectors searching mosques... There are no circumstances under which I woukld be willing to give up any of my rights...

martian_manhunter, Rights? You think you have rights? With the Millenium Act and other newly added "laws", if the government suspects that you are a terrorist or supporting terrorism or perform anything else covered in the MA, you can be arrested, incarcerated, and held without representation or trial for as long as the government sees fit. You are a non-person without any rights whatsoever. If Bush-Ashcroft-Republican Congress have their way, we'll be a theocratic dictatorship in no time flat. Canada is looking really good these days, as much as I despise cold weather. Almost time for this to be carted over to the OT forum... ;0)

Um sorry but when you advertise (which is essentially what you are doing on Kazaa when you make stuff available for upload) that you are engaging in illegal activities that has nothing to do with privicy rights. that is a public act.

Not in America. There's this obscure document called the Constitution that has all sorts of strange ideas in it, like civil rights and stuff. Including the right to privacy, so there are no circumstances under which someone can be said to have forfieted that. Even if you advertise your participation in illegal activities publicly, you still have rights that the legal authorities are obligated to respect.

Spyware can and often does mean that other data from your computer is taken. For example, html code can take your icq number, your email address, etc. If you have spyware on your machine and wonder why you're getting spam, well, wonder no more. There was a time when credit card numbers were easily obtained by packet interception and spyware. One such program is webshots which loads gator and offer companion. Its hard to clean off the system and requires a specific removal sequence. I banned webshots at the office and some of the employees continued to disregard. They reloaded after I spent days cleaning the systems. We currently receive approximately 900 spam email a day from the misconduct of two former employees and the ignorant surfing of the boss. On occasion, we don't get our outside emails because of server overload. So, spyware is very damaging and hopefully some day there will be a law about it. But so far, congress has only enacted a law that says if you're going to spam, you have to give removal info. Congress didn't say that the removal info had to work, just that it had to be given. We have a lot of non computer literate politicians out there.

martian_manhunter: Even if you advertise your participation in illegal activities publicly, you still have rights that the legal authorities are obligated to respect.

Yes you do..."You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. You have the right to be speak to an attorney, and to have an attorney present during any questioning. If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be provided for you at government expense."
:^)

So you don't mind giving up your civil rights because you think it will help reduce crime? Well then move to another country, I'd prefer that you and others like you not destroy this one (or what's left of it, anyway). I'd rather let some criminals go unpunished than let a bunch of nazis abolish my civil rights...

If you Download files that someone else has created and owns, without you paying for them is STEALING!!!! It's as simple as that!! How would you like someone stealing everything that you own??? My guess is you wouldn't!!

Sorry MM the whole civil rights thing is smoke and mirrors. If someone publicly commits a crime and there is a direct link between them and the crime (for example an IP adress) they are giving up certain rights and that is in the constitution. its called probable cause.

Some people seems to also have taken Warez matters into their own hands. I have received emails from some people saying that they have tracked fake Warez versions of my old stuff that contain viruses that diable the user. I guess they used my name cause they thought it would draw people to download. Though I have nothing to do with this I do think the idea is kinda fabulous. I always joked that an easy Warez buster was to simple upload a fake product that replaces common obj names with hi-res cubes. I know your post wasn't about warez but I thought I would mention it. Anton

Illusion is correct. That obscure document is just that, obscure. The constitution is interpreted to mean or not mean certain things. Who does the interpretation? The U.S. Supreme Court. If the Sup Ct says that the 1st amendment right to free speech does not protect defamation of character, then slander and libel are not protected by the constitution and one is liable for them. Also, read closely, the 4th amendment right against unreasonable search and seizure hinges on the definition of unreasonable. What's unreasonable? Well, its what the Sup Ct says it is. What if a police officer were to pull you over for a light out on the license plate, then pat you down, and if he feels something in your shirt pocket that crinkles and pulls it out and its rolling paper and then searches your car and opens the bags in your car and finds contraband and arrests you? Is it therefore unreasonable search and seizure to arrest you? Nope, its not. Under the auto exception, its permissible. Thei only violation might be the officer reaching in your pocket and I can assure you that a motion to suppress based on Terry v Ohio etc, has a high probability of failing. Hang your hat on that obscure document without reading the mile of shelf space interpreting that document and you're in for a surprise. Yup, the Sup Ct decides what you can and cannot do based on your Constitutional rights, and guess what, here's the rub... not one of you ever voted for a sup ct judge. But I digress. Don't do kazaa. Don't do warez. And if folks think Miranda will protect them after public admissions, think again. Miranda was watered down a lot since the days of Jim Miranda and his Arizona case. Rules of evidence currently allow miranda violations to be heard by a jury. Ok, I'll stop now.

Stealing does not mean giving up your rights. And uploading viruses to "punish" warez users is criminal, just as bad as warez. Sorry, Anton, but you have just discredited yourself by expressing approval of the idea. (would you also poison a pack of cigarettes to catch a cigarette thief? Or rig a safe to explode if anyone tries to open it?) I hope Daz doesn't agree with you. I'd hate to have to quit buying from them...

again you harp on rights, it is not a right to commit a crime in the united states. and the authoritys have the right to investigate a crime if there is probable cause.

Martian, Chill out and back off. I'm entitled to my opinion. And I think thieves deserve whatever they get. Fight with someone else. I personally don't care who you buy from. Anton

Actually, the RIAA and MPAA have been pushing for legislation to allow them to do just that - upload viruses-infected files, hack, and other potentially harmful activities to punish warez users. I donot believe this has been actually allowed yet, but it would basically make it legal for these organizations to "sabotage" files on or break into p2p networks in order to protect their copyrights. It is sad and, to be brutally honest, a failure on both sides (but in no way condoning theft of copyrighted materials).

Show me where the constitution says they have the right to spy on people or use Verizon as a KGB to gather information... Do you also think the Government's new Homeland security thing is good, too? Spying on your neighbors because they are "suspicious" (Civil rights are disappearing at an alarming rate, and now you want to give the government more power by forcing the ISPs to give them people's personal data. Tell you what. You send your personal data to Big Brothwer if you think it's so important, and while you're at it give Tom Ridge your email password too, but I intend to leave the worlds with all the civil rights I came into the world with...

Anyone who uploads viruses should be punished by forfieture of the copyrights they were trying to "protect"...

Someone mentioned Webshots and I often receive email that someone sent me a webshot email card from there. Does this mean if I go to the site I can get a virus or spywear? Sorry if I sound a bit dumb. Warm Regards, Nancy Deer With Horns (SophiaDeer)

No, you would have to download and install the webshots software to get the spyware.

Ok thanks!

The Constitution is out of date and so are our laws!

Martain, you want to know where the constitution says the gov't can spy on you? Try article 1 section 8 on the congressional power to provide for the general welfare of the United States. Don't believe that that section means the gov't can spy on your computer? Go read sup ct law about wiretap, investigation, and evidence admission and look at the omissions in the wiretap act. That's the definition of providing for the welfare of the people. George Orwell was a bit early in his prediction, but necessarily wrong.

I'm sure that you don't use KaZaA "because" of the spyware, but inspite of it Actually, you're not sure of fuckin' anything. I don't use Kazaa at all. However, under this concept that 'because a high percentage use it for illegal purposes' we should do the following: - ban Rolling papers. More people use them to roll spliffs than to roll cigarettes

• ban alcohol (again). A high percentage of beer drinkers are underaged
• ban VCRs. A high percentage of people use VCRs to copy videos for their friends
• ban CD Burners -- you want to cut down no people warezing, stop them from being able to burn collection CDs
• ban usenet -- I'll bet you a huge portion of the trafic on usenet newsgroups is illegal stuff in the alb.binaries heirarchy
• ban OCR software. a large percentage of the use of OCR software is in scanning books for distribution
• Ban FTP -- a lot of FTP traffic is illegal software
• Ban http -- oops, there goes Renderosity again -- but huge amounts of warex are distributed over http
• Ban floppy discs -- you all kno that these little doohickeys can be used to share files, right?

Verizon doesn't have the right to protect known warez violators. This little piece of paper you're all talking about doesn't guarantee the right to privacy -- that's a common misattribution. It guarantees you the right to not have your house or a locked metal box searched without a warrant. It guarantees the right for your home not to be used as barracks. That's about it. Don't rely on the constitution to protect privacy -- to be honest, I'd think Americans would have learned by now not to rely on the constitution at all. If someone is under reasonable doubt they should, not doubt, be investigated. However, the responsibility for the illegal activity doesn't lie in the hands of Kazaa for providing a means anymore than it lies in the hands of Verizon for providing a means. IMO, software piracy is unethical and illegal, but it's not stealing. It's IP piracy. Stealing means that the thief got something for nothing and the victim lost that something and it out the cost of it and the use of it. Piracy means that the pirate got something for nothing and the victim lost control of the distribution of his or her creation and didn't receive money for it. This may indicate a loss of money but is a much smaller percentage than the loss of an actual item because the majority of people who acquire the illegal data or software wouldn't have paid for it either way. There's also a loss in time and development costs that in order to survive will force the ompany or individual who is the victim towork harder and faster to keep up and remain competitive in the marketplace, and to create security features to protect their right to control and profit from the distribution of their creations. There is a difference. Software piracy is illegal and unethical, but it's not theft. Theft would be hacking into the DAZ site, downloading a model, and then deleting it off their server and somehow deleting any backups which are, I'm sure, not all stored online. In other words, theft would most likely require breaking into the DAZ offices and would require stealing something that has not been sold (otherwise I'm sure DAZ cuold contact someone they have a strong relationship with that has purchased the product and retrieve a final copy, if nothing else). I'm not saying this to defend software piracy, but to prevent those of you who refer to it as theft from weakening your own argument by misattributing the damage it causes. The only real similarity is that the perpetrator gets something without paying. To anyone else who reads this thread: I'm only a DAZ broker and I do not represent DAZ, but as a result I have spoken with people at DAZ and I don't get the impression that the company itself would support using virii as a means to stop warez. Not only would that be illegal, it would also cause a huge amount of damage to the reputation of the company itself regardless of who the intended victims are. As I said, I don't speak for DAZ, I'm just trying to clarify that Anton, as far as I know, doesn't speak for DAZ either in this curcumstance, and while the company is opposed to warez, I haven't had any indication that they would be in favour of distributing trojan horses in any way, even secretly, if that were at all possible.

I don't think Warez is hurting the movie/music industry at all. Here's an example for you: I personally used Kazaa to download a copy of Spiderman, I watched it & enjoyed it so much I took the whole family to the cinema to see it twice & have since bought a copy on DVD the day it was released. My point is if I hadn't seen the "illegal" copy I probably wouldn't have bothered with it in the first place thus making the movie company money by using kazaa.

what about icq? it now has a shared files folder ( icq2003a ) that allows anyone in your contact list to download thhhose files. that is p2p service. that means warez, according the the entertainment industry. oh, wait ,they can't go after icq, it's owned by...AOL to much money behind them "mother rapers...father rapers" Arlo Guthrie Alice's Resturant.

Eric, http://mailwasher.net freely downloadable app, that can blacklist, delete and bounce the spam, freeing up your server for real email ( donations for further development of this app are gratefully accepted, but not required )* * from mailwasher website

Did you ever stop to think that someone might be taking a list of names of people who publicly admit to engaging in piracy?!

C1rc1e: While you may have spent money on the movie, there are maybe 19 others who downloaded it, watched it, and didn't. The question -- and this one is theoretical because there are no statistics to examine, no known facts -- is out of you 20 people, who wouldn't have spent money on it anyway? Look at it this way -- assuming that you represent 5% of people who pirate things, the situation thus lies like this: 5% -- pirated movie and then spent money on the movie 95% -- pirated the movie and then didn't spend money on the movie Now if that piracy wasn't possible, it might have gone like this: 100% -- couldn't pirate the movie and never spent any money on it Which would mean that you actually helped the movie industry. However, the following is just as likey true: 95% -- didn't pirate it and didn't watch it 5% -- didn't pirate it, but on a day off had nothing to do, decided to go see a movie, and didn't pass spider-man because they'd already seen it This division means that your argument simply means that the same thing happened that would have happened without piracy involved. That one out of twenty may not have been you but it would, in those circumstances, have been someone. Now, there's one thing -- downloading a whole movie takes time and patience. Someone who's willing to wait on a huge movie download demonstrates showing interest in the movie. Therefore it's even more likely that the following division would have taken place: 30% -- didn't pirate, and so had to buy the DVD and/or go see the movie 70% -- didn't pirate and decided not to spend money on the movie anyway which represents 25% of the pirating community that would have willingly, if grudgingly, paid for the movie. Out of them, perhaps half would have decided that they didn't like it (not likely with Spider-Man, but we're deliberately erring in the safe half of things) and thus felt ripped off by paying to see a movie they didn't like. However, thet's the nature of creative works. You pays your money, you takes your chances. Notice there is no clause in that old syaing for 'you don't pays your money, you still takes your chances'. This is also why we have reviews, critics, and the little 'I have seen this movie and would like tocomment on it' button on IMDB. According to Kevin Smith, the Internet serves two main purposes: looking at naked people and bitching about movies. If 'movies' is expanded to include all populat media, then it would be likely a good idea for Renderosity to create a forum specifically for the review of any marketplace items. Renderosity already has the naked people half of things covered, even if those people are virtual. By this, I don't mean the product showcase forum. That may be part of it's expressed intended purpose, but really, I think that it's just what its title implies -- a showcase. In the forum I have in mind, you would not be able to comment on your own creations. Anton couldn't mention the Egyptians or V3, and I couldn't mention the Dungeon Lighting Kit or my Scarecrow. Or, perhaps we could mentuion them, but not post images of them and nothing more than a 'What do you think of my thing?' type message or tips/solutions/workarounds for people who have mentioned issues. I'm not going to go into whether it's ethical to deliebrately hurt the music or recording industries (the latter certainly has little effect on the musicians themselves, as Courtney Love discovered in a specch a few years back after she figured out how to use her calculator), but I can guarantee you that many of us in the Poser content industry are barely scraping by. I'm finally getting close to my wife's Petco reptile specialist wages with my sales on DAZ. Renderosity never even approached that. There's a big dot-com crash still going on -- this is the 1929 of the Internet, and for many similar reasons -- and, as a result, many of is are becoming artists of one sort or another because when it comes down to it, the Bohemians are the survivors of ecomomic crises least affected. Hurting us is, trust me, in no way ethical; even if you don't like me and want to hurt me, hurting us as a whole is way in the 'wrong' zone. I'll agree that the 'sampling' approach to piracy isn't as bad as the 'screw you I don't wanna pay' approach. But both have problems and both are very illegal.

EricofSD: "Illusion is correct. That obscure document is just that, obscure."

Me: Hey...I was just making a joke! 8^o

See...MM said: "Even if you advertise your participation in illegal activities publicly, you still have rights that the legal authorities are obligated to respect. Then I said "Yes you do..."You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. You have the right to be speak to an attorney, and to have an attorney present during any questioning. If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be provided for you at government expense."
:^)

Damn! I knew I should have put a snicker in there!

I agree with you dodger, it wasn't the right thing to do but you have to make mistakes to learn from them :) Filesharing would be big $$$ business if these companies got their act together & used the technology instead of wasting all their money & time trying to shut it down. I'm not trying to justify stealing, that's what it amounts to really. Going back to Poser stuff on these p2p networks, there's no point in downloading anything as you'd never be able to use it publicly & where's the fun in rendering something to have it sit on your harddrive only being seen by you?

c1rc1e: You're right on on that one. If creators worked out a way to make reasonable profits selling online or selling access and sharingthe profits in a fair way (fair not meaning even, but meaning with the correct portion of profits going to the corect people who are diong the best or most work) then we'd be a lot closer to IP laws that make some sense, because those IP laws would have to be designed around an entirely new model. Pay-to-access sites like Poserworld are a bit closer to that sort of thing. The Platinum Club seems to be approaching it too. The best way to beat pirates, I think, is to beat them at their own game. Internet connections and bandwidth costs money. Servers are already paying for that, be they pirate sites or not. Usenet services generally charge users beyond a certain point. Further, getting things 'from the source' guarantees that no one has tempered with the contents. I'm actually building a robot right now that I intend to do an amazing job on and want to try selling it -- a fully posable standalone figure -- for five dollars a pop. I'm going to announce it as an espiriment in marketing this way, too. The only reaosn I'm doing $5 is because Renderosity won't do less and DAZ already has a droid figure. I simply want to see how far it will go at such a low price. The fact is, once I've made back the time I am spending on it, I'm only making profits. If I can sell something low enough to generate higher volume in sales and thus cover the difference, there might be less of a 'trickle' effect once the initial sales gush wears off in a week. I'm using the term 'gush' loosely here, as I recently learned what 'gush' really means over at DAZ. No offence, PTB -- the sales were just amazing in difference. Then again, the bar is higher and the customers know that. I can only hope that when combined with my presence there, the lower costs here will boost the sales and the confidence in my work -- which is always getting better as I learn and discover new things and tricks and techniques.

Mind you, I should add that it's not the recording artists resisting the whole MP3 and filesharing thing -- it's the record industry itself, most of which can't carry a tune and thinks boy bands are a pretty neat idea. Under the changes that almost necessarily have to take place, such giant organisations will go the way fo the dinosaur rather quickly, and they know it. They will have to get jobs working off their own skills rather than the skills and popularity of others. They will also lose control of their chunk of the media, and such control is, quite literally, power.

hey I think boy bands are a neat thing too (buried up to their necks in sh*t) ;) I can almost imagine the record execs trying to sing & dance, they might do a bit better than these boy bands as a novelty thing. Daz have the right idea with the stuff they sell, top quality at low prices is always a winner :)

Sometimes I wish I could just tell everyone who's arguing for pointless reasons to shut up and get along :)

I actually use cigarette papers to roll cigarettes, go figure. How weird. I never have used kazaa or any other P2P software because I'm frankly not at all interested in MP3s, which is what most of that is. If I want a model that isn't available freely, or already in my too extensive model library, I'll model it myself. But the courts just made it okay for the various big business people to sue kazaa. The problem was that it isn't based in the US, so they claimed the US courts had no jurisdiction. The courts have disagreed with that, so I suspect kazaa is not long for this world. Which doesn't really matter since for every P2P that dies 3 more start to replace it. I do, however, have friends that use kazaa and there definitely ARE viruses in the system. As far as thievery and warez and shit, I can only be responsible for my own actions. I don't have the time or inclination to worry about what other people do.

bonesructure: The US courts can sue Kazaa all they want. If Kazaa doesn't show up and doesn't pay up, then it doesn't really matter a lot. I doubt if most countries will attempt to extradite an entire company for contempt of US courts and I doubt if it will be considered a big enough deal to pull a Norayega.