I did this image for the Valentine competition. Mods wanted me to post it here and get opinions on the lower breast showing... Does it appear as nudity to you??

I'd say no

Technically, no. No nudity.

Personal opinion, I check the nudity flag when my figure has no covering over the breast but the arms are blocking the view and only the sides are showing because it's suggested. But that's just in the gallery.

No, I don't think there should be a problem at all. (: Genny PS.....Great image, BTW. (:

Don't know whether to be flattered they want our opinion or dismayed there is even a question. In a word, NO. The idea that having her 90% naked but the question of nudity depending on the bottoms of her breasts is a little strange to me but that's just my opinion. If there has to be some percent of breast showing formula or the tops or the sides etc., it's going to become a subjective nightmare. The only objective criteria you can have here is nipple/areola visible = nudity, otherwise, no. In anticipation of the next question, pubic hair/labia visible = nudity otherwise, we'll have to dig out the photogrammetry software and protractors and start measuring the percentage of mons showing as calculated from the incident angle of apex of the labia majora bisected by the slope of the hip bone connected to da thigh bone... Which remeinds me of an old line about the angle of the dangle but that's another story. Seriously though, I don't see nudity here Pizazz, but the Taliban would have rocked your world (literally) by now, so it's all a matter of opinion. BTW, the picture rocks! What lighting did you use?

Nope, no nudity. She could wear that out in public in all US states. Even Utah. Unless there are visible genitalia, rectal area, or nipple (for females) or visible genitalia, genitalia covered only by a condom, or rectal area (for males), it's not nudity. She could have nothing more than little spangly pasties and it still wouldn't be nudity. In some states nipples are even allowed for females, as it's a sexist approach to take the stance that a man can bare his chest but a woman can't, especially as breasts are no more used in procreation by a woman than in a man, just nine months afterwards.

This does NOT need a nudity button clicked... You are A-OK to run it as is :) ladynimue

Here's how I look at it: if your boss (or HR representative) walks by and sees that picture, will they admire it or scream about sexual harassment lawsuits? Putting pasties on breasts isn't really covering anything (it just looks like the nipples are discolored), nor is a thong (that's just butt floss). If it has enough material to make a decent bikini, then it's not nudity. If you need a magnifying glass to find the material, then it's nudity. Personal opinion: I'm stringent on the nudity flag, and I think there's enough there to be a non-nude pic. Cheers!

I wouldn't think it qualified as nudity either. Sexy? Yes. But, lots of sexy Valentine's day cards are made and purchased.

Now, you didn't solicit other comments but since it's for a contest, I want to try to help a bit. She looks a bit "stiff" to me. If it were up to me, I think I'd try to bend her at the waist a bit so she looked a bit more casual or natural. Best thing to do is get in that position yourself or have someone else do it and take a look.

Good luck !

 ![turkey.gif](http://www.chuck-n-michelle.net/images/turkey.gif)  Sure, you can strive to fly with the eagles but turkeys don't get sucked into jet engines.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=320688&Start=1&Artist=Gini&ByArtist=Yes

Well I certainly wouldn't call that nudity either. But the fact your image is being being put to public opinion confuses me because there is only marginally more lower breast showing in my image (see link) which WAS rejected on the grounds of lower breast showing. The posted rules do state something along the lines that no breast from the nipple down is to show . Bathing suits in Brazil, the south of France , to name but two places, show more than either of these images AND there is a valentine image posted that isn't exactly an opaque breast covering. The rules also say something about that too. So , MODS, please make up your minds !

As I stated above, this is not a problem as far as the nudity button is concerned :) Great image and good luck with the contest :) ladynimue

If pizzaz' image and the see-thru top image are acceptable , please ladynimue ,could you explain to me why my image was rejected ? I think I'm not understanding something about the rules. thankyou.

I thought the max image size was 800 x 600.

Gini's picture ought not to be rejected, either. :sheesh:

This is too funny. Exactly how many square inches of breast needs to be showing before it is nudity?

I've got my tape measure at the ready ! But actually in the TOS -"...any portion therof below the top of the nipple." Lack of consistancy here is what I take issue with.

But what about anything below the bottom of the nipple?...that's the question now. :) Reversage (which is when coverage ends below the nipple, like in that free As Shanim shirt) and underbreast (which is basically reversage in a bikini) should be clarified before this turns into another debate that have members screaming and merchants leaving. ;) And don't laugh, those are actual terms that I and a number of other people have used for describing those states of undress in the process of sorting and categorization of such imagery. ;D SnowS

Folks, please don't go off the deep end with us. Eric's putting a good deal of time into this and it's also the first Poser Forum Challenge that I've been involved with. I've just taken a look at all of the entries and there are several that don't comply with all of the rules. I've contacted Eric already and we'll get this all sorted out asap. Consistency is always an issue, and that's why we put in some very strict rules on nudity, violence etc. The more explicit we are with the rules the less room there is for inconsistency. Gini: your entry had naked breast 'below the top of the nipple' so was outside the rules. pizazz: yours does too. Whilst both of these images are fine for the galleries and yes, here in the forum too, the challenge rules are more stringent. After this first challenge is over we're going to be asking for feedback on how it went and what rule changes you feel may be in order. We may relax the nudity rule a little, but if we do it won't be by a lot. We want to keep the challenges entirely family friendly so that even yougsters might enter. I know the deadline is looming, but give us a day or so to iron things out. Please? Kevin.

OH!.....you wanted an opinion on a picture!....sorry... ....guess I should put my clothes back on, huh?.... Scarab<-feeling a draft....

I'm at a loss for words... really

Attached Link: http://market.renderosity.com/%7Epzr/backroom/challengerules.htm

Oh, I have no doubt the definitions will need tweaking. We have some time before the March challenge will start. (And EricofSD might need some tweaking too LOL). The full rules with the definitions are at the link above and available by link through the challenge page. I don't think we need to get out the rulers and measure. I've enjoyed all the images whether they were approved or not and I hope we keep this going.

..but,but...what if she has the "nipple gone" dial set to max...then,then.....it would be OK?..... Oh Crap....bringing in the sheep,bringing in the sheep,we shall come rejoicing... REV.SWAMP

I totally understood why my mermaid was rejected ( after I read through the TOS properly which I hadn't at first and it is very clear down at the bottom about what is meant by 'nudity' in this instance ) . It was just that now when I saw a couple of images that were allowed through the same nudity rules that she wasn't- well, I got a bit peeved. Didn't mean to start a rumpus - just wanted the same rules applied to all. Thankyou.

No worries Gini, sometimes things slip by us and we need a kick in the pants to put things straight ;)

I read the TOS on page two of the TOS - Put it all on one page, please. I'm just surprised that you guys are being sooo careful about pictures that are not in the gallery- you have to really know where to look to find these images. Anyway, I just posted her in the Poser Gallery - I'm going to do a V3 Male for the Valentine Challenge - DOES HIS CHEST HAVE TO BE COVERED?? (Being a smart a$$ here)

Swamp, the nipple gone dial I think would not work because the image would still have to have an opaque covering below the top of that area. Pizazz, The idea was to put the general rules/definitions on one page and the specific theme description on the challenge page. Might have overlapped on this one a bit. Good idea there.

Hmmm, I assume this means that a render that used a picture from classical art in the background would be taboo, even if Vicky were wearing a burka. They can make up whatever rules they want but when you would ban images (by this definition) that shows the amount of cleavage in the average evening dress is a little whacky, but whatever folks. I hope none of the kiddies ever watch the news and see the red carpet at the Oscars (or ever leave the house for that matter). Maybe we need special challenges for the children, a better way for them to show their work and a little less restrictive for the adults. BTW does anyone know how many children (if any) actually participate? Just curious.

Maybe if everyone was as offended by war as they were by a nipple, there wouldn't be any wars.

Hey, Chuck: The quote's supposed to be 'You can fly with the eagles, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.' B^)

Weasels? LOL I guess I read it somewhere else where two birds were contrasted.

"Maybe if everyone was as offended by war as they were by a nipple, there wouldn't be any wars." Well, Voodoo, seeing as how we're sitting on top of the world's largest reserves of silicone, I'd say be worried. If the UN gives Pamela Anderson 30 days to give up her weapons, I say turn her over.

I am no longer going to respond to this thread. I am officially at this point not going to support Renderosity challenges. It's not enough that they'e relatively pointless -- now they have the added benefit of also being full of crap.

Imackenzie- you just make me laugh ! I'm ending my night on that one. Thankyou. (still LOL ...)

You are my kind of guy!! Call it like you see it.

lmao @ voodoo & lmckenzie

why would breasts be offensive... i really hate they way a womans nude body is viewed as dirty or offensive... steps down from soap box

It's a lovely image Pizazz, certainly no nudity that I can see.

So that's what nudity looks like, and here I though it involved more skin... :)

No nudity. What difference if it's the lower, upper or both showing, so long as the nipple isn't bare. There are a number of tube tops on the street in summer that are just as revealing (more so) than this. Is the picture in good taste? Yes. It's very nice and along the lines of a 1940's WWII pinup. Racy to be sure, but not revealing. You can't even tell she has nipples. Some people may be offended by it, but then I'm offended by a lot things that most people aren't (just about any kind of violence or blood). If we have to have a definition of upper female nudity, then it should be nipples. I'm not fond of the fact that we do have to differentiate between male and female definitions of nudity. To me, it's always meant genitalia. Luckily, I don't have to worry about this. I pose female figures so badly that I'd be embarrased to post a female nude. I'm not even sure how a breast is supposed to be posed. Ah, lack of experience... (grin).

How frippin absurd can the Render'posity rules get? Great picture. Very pretty. Sure would be nice if the "powers that be" would show a bit of maturity and call it quits to these stupid half-cocked (sic) reasonings.

Look, the official forum challenges have always been 'No Nudity' if you want to look at the old rules, written before Eric or I were involved check here. We just took the time to define it this time around in the interests of consistency which is what we often get slammed for not doing.

Actually, 'osity didn't write the nudity definition. I wrote that from a nudity definition used by the statutory language in Arizona. Ok, this is interesting feedback. I'm willing to write a slightly different definition and put it to the mods and to the forum before the March challenge. I'm not willing to ditch a nudity definition. Remember, there was discussion before the challenge started. I'm sure there will be discussions of revisions after the close of this challenge.

I've seen nuns with less clothes on than that :LOL but that was at the washing station... I would think a front page banner would have to be a bit less titillating than your average pinup....we must keep the place as clean as possible...yes ??

Just as a reminder... One of the main reasons for challenges is simply to help us all learn our art better. We are forced out of our regular molds and ruts into new areas. Let's not blow this thing out of proportion and "boycott" the challenges. Of course, if you'd rather just post to the galleries, that's fine. I'm one person who has thought that the Poser forum is behind for a while (behind the Bryce guys). I'd like to see us not all get mad and screw this up over wanting to display nudity. No matter where you fall on the "Vicky in a Temple" thing, you must admit that images with nudity get more hits in the galleries. Most of us don't want to see the challenge become a challenge to see who can create the most popular image based on nudity. I agree with the mod's idea about a family entry possiblity, but I also think there are other reasons to avoid nudity in this area. I am supportive of the mods in having a definition and sticking to it. We don't agree about where the line is drawn, and we never will. But someone has to draw a line. Let's support those who agree to organize and oversee these things!

Ver nice picture, but I think it needs a side strap for the bra.

As to the above Image; if posted in the Poser Gallery - it would Not Need a Nudity Button.

However, the Poser Challenge Contest is another matter all together...And for my previous statement in this thread...

• I sincerely apologize to the Contest Mods -

The Contest Rules do state: ...or the showing of the female breast with less than a fully opaque covering of any portion thereof below the top of the nipple!

Those were the rules that the entries agreed to before entering the contest. Thus they have to apply to everyone who enters.

---

This has become a great opportunity for the Poser Forum Community to have their views heard.

Chanson made an excellent point: "I am supportive of the mods in having a definition and sticking to it. We don't agree about where the line is drawn, and we never will. But someone has to draw a line. Let's support those who agree to organize and oversee these things!"

Might I add to that... If you do not agree with the Contest Rules - Get together with the "Contest Runners" and see about changes for the Next Contest :)

Eric and Kevin have already stated that they would be open to your suggestions :)

---

So, once more I apologize to the Contest Moderators for my hasty Previous remarks.

Also, thanks to all the Poser Forum Members for your excellent input on this matter and your civil manner that you related it.

Sincerely,
ladynimue

Images with nudity may get more hits, but most of them are crap anyway.

Seems fine to me, lot of flesh on show but nothing that'd frighten the citizens

You can talk about this until you get blue in the face, of course. I'd just say : no nudity, just a pretty pic of a pretty gal :-)

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LOL, I love it! Ok, its rewrite time, I'm working on it. Will make it public mid week.