I have a question about the reference manual for Poser 5. In chapter 12 adding clothing, "1 Return to the Pose room and open the Library palette. Select Figures>Clothing-Conforming>Clothing-P4 Female, and add the Bikini Top by single-clicking it then clicking the Apply Library Preset button. The bikini top appears behind the figure. By default, this new figure (Poser treats conforming clothing like figures) is selected." Now this is the weird part. When I click on Apply Library Preset, figure 1 disappears, but when I click on Create New Figure it works all the way through. My question is this: Is this a typo or is there something wrong? Ive also noticed in this manual they walk you through the Hair Room then switch to the Pose Room and leave you hanging. When you switch from the Hair Room to the Pose Room the view is still on face camera. I found it easier to conform in main camera view. Another thing I noticed, the manual refers to the Display Controls running from left to right. Mine are arranged from top to bottom. This software is truly amazing, but the reference manual from my stand point is less then desired. Is this a result of, lets hurry up and get this product out there? Or is there something wrong? Looking forward to your answers.

I too experienced the disappearing figure when I tried to add the bikini top. But I figured it out as you did. I don't think the manual is a result of "lets hurry up and get this product out" more than it is of poor editing. I have had several 3d applications manuals for different products that have had the same problem. Poor editing. I found that the tutorials on the Curious Labs website don't suffer from this problem. And I totally agree with you, Poser 5 is indeed amazing!!!

I dont have Poser 5 yet, but in P4 you can Alt-Click the title the Display controls and it will change from vertical to horizontal...

The Poser 5 manual is just plain useless or unreliable. I found so many mistakes that I gave up on it.

i still read up on it as theres so much to learn in p5 that you cant take it all in one sitting. especially since the tutorials on new p5 technology are limited and far-between.

The manual is actually pretty good when it's accurate. The problem is that when a release schedule is hustled, the documentation is the first casualty. In order to have a printed manual, the text must be finished and 'ready to ship' (to the printer) at least a month before it needs to be added to the package. Add to that the lead time to get the package manufactured and assembled, and you've got the manual representing the state of the program a good two months before it shipped, plus whatever wishful thinking was still not functional yet. In Poser's case, those two months were crucial. There are undocumented functions, and functions documented in classic computerese (you know, like "Use File > Save to save files" and "The Hierarchy Editor edits hierarachies." And inaccuracies, of course, which would have been caught if an editor had actually checked the program against the documentation. When documentation is weak, there is a whole string of culprits to examine, and the trail usually leads to the market bigwig who said, "Futch the documentation; I want revenue."

Well, now I know my computer isnt going on the blink. It seems that the disappearing figure happened to a few people, thats a relief. (I mean that its not my computer that is messing up.) Its a shame that the documentation is not totally accurate, it would of made this software a perfect 10. I agree with mick The manual is actually pretty good when it's accurate. But when it is not accurate, it leaves you bewildered. I havent even got to the functions buttons yet. Im still on chapter 12. Is there anything else I should be aware of for future reference? It would help me to know what sections to be aware of. I already know the word apply can be deceiving, in Adding Clothing, Chapter 12. Perhaps I can look for a tutorial on the sections that have a discrepancy, and make an educated guess. Thanks for your help.

Manuals are always tricky for all the reasons that mickmca states - not that I'm defending any of them. But as Poser 5 wasn't working when it shipped, imagine what state it must have been in when the manual was released to press? While it's not a particularly good manual, particularly for reference use, I'm somewhat surprised it's as close to the actual product as it is :-O I have never been able to figure out why, with all the other cost cutting (off-shore development, rushed integration, skipped testing, premature release) Poser 5 has a PRINTED manual. Manual books are EXPENSIVE, printing, shipping and the time elemnet mickmca refers too. Would have made much more sense to just have a PDF version - could have had at least 1 month's more editing, and resulted in more "instant cash" return to boot. True the PDF version posted to CL's site was a little more up-to-date, but mostly fixes reported by the EVM not actual editing to ensure consistency with the product work. But then there are many things I don't understand about Poser 5's gestation, and probably never will...

I believe the press creates a lot of hype around a product, and causes a company to rush a product to get the promotion. Magazines (the press) pushing to find out about all the bells and whistles a product has to offer, so the public know what is coming. But by doing this, hype creates rush, and the consumer is stuck holding the short end of the stick. I have trouble trying to figure out marketing concepts today too. I have not had any big problems with Poser, but in the past with other companies I have had problems with customer support. (Dose this sound familiar?) You have a problem, and you call customer support. You dial the customer support number, and receive a automated answering service. You push this button, and that button to direct your call to receive the appropriate information. When you are finally directed to a real person, you fined they are foreign and hard to understand. At this point, the question I have is; How did this person get into the position of customer support? Never mind all the frustrate ion you go through to direct your call to get the support you need. Now you have to deal with a person you cant understand. To me this is not support, this is a deterrent. So, figuring out marketing concepts today is a bit of a understatement. Printed manuals is something I cant understand also, to everybody out there. Save a tree, and go digital. The time and expenses invested into printed manuals is wasteful. If companies wish to save money, this is a good place to start. Sorry about going off the subject, but these are things I wanted to comment on.

My understanding about Poser 5 was that Curious Labs was going to take the time to finally get it right. That meant doing the program from scratch, rather than trying to fix someone else's mistakes or fixes. That meant totally rewriting the manual to make it worth something. Instead we have Poser 5 with agressive copy protection that was suddenly dropped with no real explanation. (Was the copy protection causing instability in Poser 5?). We got Poser 5 which may finally be "right" several months after the program was released in the PC version. We get a printed manual that is no better than the Poser 4 manual. I prefer printed manuals to Adobe Acrobat manuals. I like to sit the book down on the desk, read and do something. I can't read a manual on screen and use the program at the same time.

I can only speculate if their copyright protection was causing instability in Poser 5. With the introduction of Python script, (and its freely distributed on the internet). I dont feel their trying to be aggressive on copyright issues. I believe it will open up doors for web development. As far as preferring a printed manual over a .PDF, that would be a matter of preference. Seems to me youre the type of person that can read and do at the same time. I have a friend that is like that. Me, I dont pick up on things that fast. What I do is open the program I wish to learn, and minimize it to the task bar. Then Ill open up the PDF file. Now there both on the task bar, one click on either one will bring that program up on the desktop. I find this easier than thumbing through a printed book. Dont get me wrong, I like to read a good book, especially at bed time. But, when Im on a computer I like to keep in the digital domain. Again, this is really a matter of preference. I just feel that printed manuals are out dated, not to mention that their balky and heavy. Why carry all that weight around, when you can place all that data on a CD? At the same time, being environmentally conscious.

I've found the best way to pickup something is to actually do it while I'm reading. Too often you do not see pictures in the manual to illustrate a point, command, etc. Too often the writer is not actually capable of providing a good written description. In fact it appears many manuals are written by people who are indeed not using the program when they are writing about it. Perhaps that explains why so many manuals are useless. You wouldn't find so many mistakes if the author was actually "writing and doing" at the same time. A good tutorial author will do just that. If you use an "on-screen" manual, you have a couple choices. You can shrink each screen so you can see both at the same time. Or you can click back and forth between the manual and the program. I don't like either of those choices. Yes, that is a personal preference.

Pictures are a great way to illustrate a point. To bad they are not used more then they are. As the old saying goes, A picture is worth a thousand words. Even the computer became more popular, when the graphical interface came about. The basics of communication started with pictures thousands of years ago. To some people though, it is a lesser form of communication. Myself, I like to keep learning simple. You make a good point, if more authors did write and do at the same time. I do believe we would have better manuals. Even if they would do what they write. At least then they may catch their mistakes, like the disappearing figure. There is one more choice for on screen manuals, although more expensive. You can use two monitors, and span two applications. It would only be worth the added expense, if a person does a lot of multitasking. Sorry it took so long to get back to you, its been busy lately.

Thanks for your great response. I know what you mean about being busy. I spent the past two days in the Hospital Emergency Room. And heck, I haven't been able to touch Poser for a month or more.

I hope it is nothing serious, I wish you a speedy recovery. I trust you will get back to Poser soon. Good Luck

Just a kidney stone which is not yet eliminated. Oh, and I won't have my own computer till I get a job and get mine back. That means no Poser till then, and I'm going nuts. I hate using someone else's computer. I have determined to buy a laptop as soon as I have enough money. It's easier to find room for a laptop!