Could somebody post a picture rendered in Pose4 and Vue4, so I can see the difference? Thanks.

Ummm....dumb question, but why don't you check the Vue and Poser galleries? Lots of selection there; and in Vue gallery, a lot of images with Poser characters and props in them.

I read somewhere that Vue renders faster and better than Poser. So I would need to see a comparison of the same Poser character,scene. Not just one render in Vue.

A strange question to me too. Poser and Vue are not the same type of programs. The import option in Vue for Poser scenes is there to offer more possibilities to Vue users not to simply render Poser scenes. So i think to compare the two regarding render speed does not make a lot of sense. When you import a Poser scene only the geometrical information (including materials/textures) is imported. No camera no light settings etc. So you have to do that again. And maybe you have to manipulate the materials too because each program reacts a little different here (the difference between opening and importing). So what you gain (iff Vue is faster) i think you are losing because you have to do extra work. What is sure is, that in the combination of Vue and Poser you gain a lot more creative options and possibilities so your images will be a lot "richer" - not saying that everything isnt possible in one program. I think we had a similar discussion here before (differences in rendering between Poser and Vue) - with some examples. Maybe you try to find those discussions via search.

I am new to Vue. In fact, I am still waiting for my software to arrive. I wanted to have a look at this forum to meet other Vue users and generally to see what I can learn. I think your answers to ming's question were a little harsh. I don't think it is a dumb question and even if you thought it was, you should have a little restraint and common courtesy not to say so! The question is legitmate and sensible. Although, Vue and Poser are completely different programs, a lot of people will use them for the same thing - that is to render 3d images containing 3d characters and vegetation etc.. There are a lot of people, myself included, that use Bryce just for the render machince and more creativity options over Poser. I am sure this is the case for Vue users as well. While the render times will be affected by lights, atmosphere, models, textures etc.. it is perfectly OK to ask for a comparison. I don't think just looking at the galleries of the software is a comparison! You definitely need the same scene to compare. With the Poser image, it may well be minus vegetation or other specific Vue features but that is what can be taken into account when making a comparison. I would want to do that if I am making a buying decision. Well, just my thoughts on the matter. Hope you aren't all so rude and treat newbies to this forum as you have ming. Diane

Thanks Diandra, but these weenies don't bother me. I'll just ask in the Poser forum. They're much more knowledgable...and polite.

Only to be sure. Was i inpolite? And if, sorry. The problem is - to be honest - that we had this discussion several times, ending always the same. Somebody found a situation where Poser rendered "better" or different than Vue. And then the result was "Poser is the better program!", "Why have i bought it" etc etc. I am not fighting and i dont want to improve that Vue is the best program in the world. But if you use a software package, you should be clear about what you want to do with it. Example. I am a professional designer. Minimum 1000 times i had the discussion why it is not possible to print 5000 copies from Word or PowerPoint files. These programs are simply not made for professional print porcess. And if now someone comes to me asking this - and is not a paying client - i react a little stronger as i should, sometimes. This here is the same. Try to ask the question "What is better, Bryce or Vue" and you will even see a lot more harsh reactions. Here and probably in the Bryce forum. If i stepped onto someones carpet, sorry again. Walther

I think it is just that you may well have had the discussion a 1000x but someone who is new to this forum or indeed, digital art, 3d or whatever, may not know that! If you are fed up with answering the same question, don't answer it. Leave it to someone who is more "helpful" and/or sympathetic to newbies. :) Like you said, if this question comes up, the best way is to explain the difference between the 2 programs and their basic functions. If you have examples of comparison than that is great, if not, just a simple explanation will suffice. I was more upset at the general implication that one is "stupid" or "dumb" to ask such a question. It does us all good to remember what it was like when we first came across new software, media or whatever. It isn't easy and everyone has their own learning pace. Some need help, others thrive by working it all out for themselves but are then very good at helping others!

Just to finalize that. In the header we do have here a section FAQ saying, "Please read first for tutorials & all common questions". There you find for example a lot about Vue versus Bryce, Vue and Poser etc. Maybe you try to have a look there. If you want me, i can try something for you Poser versus Vue. BUT, i am using Poser only to prepare things for Vue, so i am not very used to create whole scenes there and second, my computer where everything is on is dead at the moment. Hopefully it will be back alive tomorrow but we will see. If you want further "support" write me an instant message and start discussing via that way - if you dont mind.

Pardon me, but I was NOT being impolite. All ming asked was "Could somebody post a picture rendered in Pose4 and Vue4, so I can see the difference? Thanks." If I misunderstood him, apologies to him. And I didn't say his question was dumb; I was simply implying that maybe I was asking a dumb question by asking if he had checked the galleries. I have NEVER, EVER been rude or unkind to anyone in any of the forums or galleries here. Neither has wabe. In fact, wabe goes out of his way to help me and other users here. You can ask the forum moderator and any of the other regulars here. ming explained in post number 3 of this thread exactly what he was looking for. If he is still interested, he can post here and I will be glad to post a side-by-side comparison for him. I regularly use Poser figures and props in Vue and there are some definite differences in lighting, etc.

Fair enough, I apologise to you both. I misunderstood your posting, as I read it, the tone of your answers were not, imho, helpful but instead, had an air of impatience to them. Sorry!

Incidentally, here are a few Poser/Vue links. The first one may be of particular interest. http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=1093305 http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=1258481 http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=1190676 http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=1120974

I have tried to do a simple render with about the same lighting in Poser and Vue. It's not perfect. You can do better, but my time, right now, is spear. Guitta

I did a few renders showing the transition Vicky makes going from Poser to Vue. I hope this can answer a few of the questions that come up here in the Vue forum from time to time. Vicky 2 is wearing the RDNA Beach Baby texture, Neftis hair, and the Essentials bathing suit. I think pose is by Fyrene (?). #1 - Vicky with a Vue default sky background in Poser. Lights are DAZ Global Lights (I'm not too good with lighting in Poser.) #2 - Vicky strolls over to Vue with default sunshine atmosphere three. Yikes! Ugly! Got to do a bit of fine tuning. #3 - In atmosphere editor, turned light towards sunlight and away from ambient light. Also brightened up light a bit, and softened shadows to about 70%. Skin looks a lot better. But what's up with that bathing suit? #4 - In material summary, clicked on Vicky's head, lips and skin; changed highlight color to white, highlight intensity down; adjusted highlights on hair; loaded glass material for eyeball. Poser material for bathing suit is a strange reflective material; I'm not very good at that, so changed it to plain procedural colors. Looks ok. After adjusting lighting and materials, Poser figures can look wonderful in Vue. The Vue examples here are only with sunlight; if you work with different lights, like Thomas does, you can achieve even better renders. Further tweaking with the highlights on Vicky's skin will get you closer to the pale tone of her flesh in Poser, as well as changing color of the lighting. Hope this helps people to see how great Vue does with Poser figures. (Re-posted in this thread at Gebe's request)

Love number 4, Djeser!! Really really nice! Diandra, the problem is that the question is unanswerable. Please don't make assumptions about whether an answer is helpful or not. The fact is that the two packages are totally different and have different purposes. And lighting is the key. There is no way that a scene can be rendered in Poser and in Vue and give results that would show anything more than a specific example of lights in Poser vs a specific example of lighting in Vue. The only appropriate method of determining the differences is to see what's possible in both programs. Thus sending Ming to both the Vue and Poser galleries is actually the most helpful response.

Thanks djeser, this helps a lot. Seeing two different pictures doesn't help,Spit. I see peoples' Poser renderings, using Vue all the time. They say the lighting is better and it renders faster. The lighting is what I wanted to see. That's one of the secrets of a realistic picture. That is why I needed to see a side by side example. Thanks again everybody.

Ming, I don't think you understand. All you are seeing here is examples of what specific people did with their lighting in Vue and their lighting in Poser in this specific instance. What you are I may do might be totally different. In Vue it's easier to add and manipulate the lights and you have more control. But in Poser there are hundreds of light sets available to start with. It's what the user does with them that's important. And whether one is 'better' than the other is irrelevant because it depends on the user. And 'speed' is relative as well.

The best Poser lighting (25 or 30 lights) takes FOREVER to render. You'll see in all the galleries, that the most realistic pics don't use Poser for rendering. Poser lighting, no matter what the skill of the artist, doesn't match up to other programs. That is why I'm looking for an alternative renderer.

You're welcome, ming. Actually, you both have made good points. I think Guitta's example more closely illustrates difference between the two as far as a more exact replica of the Poser lighting is concerned. I do see Poser images with extremely good lighting in them; I personally find lighting in Poser very difficult to get to grips with. Not that I'm that much better in Vue, but I find Vue is easier to work with as far as creating/placing/editing various lights. Maybe one of our lighting masters here can speak to that. As far as the render image in Vue, the things for me that crank up render time are reflections, particularly. So I tend to be careful when using that. There are a lot of different options in the render settings window, which I find easier than in Poser 4. I've had some renders take a long time, but that is due to the amount of trees, etc, I have in the image. One of my recent images (The Pasture) took a couple of hours to cook, as I did selective antialiasing on the tree leaves. One thing that I like about using Vue vs Poser is the 4-window view you have (top, sides, front) of your scene, and how easy it is to rack-and-stack objects in your scene, group them, and move them around. Anyhow, that's my 2 Euro-cents worth.

Awesome! Thanks a lot Djeser, for that small tut. That also clears up my curiousity about your awesome poser work on your image "mirror".

nice one Djeser, could you send me the phone number of #4? :-))) I thinbk i said right in the beginning of this discussion. You cant really compare, too much depends what you are doing with the progs. And what you want/need to do. ming, have you tried the demo version of Vue? Maybe playing with that could give you a flavour how the program will suit you. I only am not sure about the import of Poser thingies into the demo version.

Wow, I must say that V looks very good in Vue. It is the same with Bryce. It takes a lot of fiddling but worth it in the end. I understand Vue handles poser files a lot better than Bryce is able to. I will look forward to having a go! ~Diane