Whenever I'm really tired- and it usually happens in the morning just before I wake up, when I'm between the sleep and awake states -but more towards awake, like 75% conscious, I move my head around. And I can see with my eyelids closed. I can't really force myself to properly SEE... but the room does move around with my natural eyesight, even though my eyelids are shut. I can't really explain it properly, but I swear it happens, and I KNOW for sure that I can SEE... 100% sure that what I'm looking at with my eyes closed and 'imagining' is EXACTLY the image I would have if my eyelids were open. Any explanations to this? Drac

2nd sight, 'natch.. or good spatial skills..;)

I can hear voices if the noise in the room at night is quiet. Can't stand it, sometimes I swear I've heard them speak in a foreign language. I have also felt like I can see things, its different from dreaming. Just weird brain stuff I figure, the voices never talk to me. :-D (wishes to remain anonymous)

Don't know for sure. You may be sleeping with your eyes open. I've seen two other people do it. One swore she had her eyes closed and saw nothing of the room and its contents but rather the beach she was dreaming about. Your subconcious sees and thinks "I'm dreaming, therefore this must be the dream". On the other hand, My wife got a serious infection in Mexico as a teenager. She wound up in the hospital and after a big shot of linkacin, flat-lined on the table. She swears she rose up above the table and looked down on her own body. She had 360 degree vision too. The nurse brought in the paddles to shock her and she thought "that's going to hurt" She swears she jumped back in and said "Wait, I'm back" just a second before the heart monitor started beeping again. If you could have a picture put into your room after you're asleep and see it before you wake up, it could tell you if you are remembering or seeing. If you wear eveshades and still see it it could tell you if this is true second sight.

It could be remote viewing, wich is a paraphycologic phenomenon. Some scientific research has been done on that (milliondollar business actually back in the times of the cold war), but there wasn't any scientific theory on how it worked. Just that it works. And some results where truly amazing. Or your brain has it's surroundings stored and knows what you're supposed to see. Just like you can walk down the stairs in your own home with your eyes closed without falling. I know for sure that the human brain is capable of reproducing imagery with enough detail to make it look real. It's even possible to think up realistic visuals without reference. I do it myself all the time. The experience that electroglyphs wife had is called 'uittreding' in dutch. I don't know what it's called in english. It's when the soul/ghost/mind however you want to call it temporarily get's out of the body. Some people also experience it when they go to sleep. I've had a strange experience too. I was 4 years old and we had a bunch of magazines stored in my room temporarily. I couldn't read a word at 4 years old, but I dreamed I got up and read the magazines. The creepy thing is that after I woke up next morning I could tell my parents what I read. And everything I dreamed was actually in those magazines. And it wasn't information I could have gotten by just looking at pictures. From a scientific point of view I couldn't have known what was in those magazines, because I couldn't read, but I just knew. I don't remember lot's of things from when I was 4, but I know for sure this happened. When something makes a big impression on my memory never failes me.

paraphycologic = parapsychologic Difficult word to spell right :)

Believe it or not drac, I have experienced similar things, and quite recently too. And Ang, I have heard voices late at night in the still quiet. What I would like to know is if anyone here has experienced "shadow people" phenomena. I'll be sitting at my monitor Brycing, quite often late at night, when I'll see a dim grey form move just on the edge of my peripheral vision. Of course when I turn my head to look at it directly, it disappears. I don't know why, but this seems to happen more frequently as of late. I had my eyes checked just recently and no problems there, and I swear that the most psycho-tropic "drug" I've indulged in lately is Ornlu's grass!

I've got that shadow people thing all the time. It happens late at night, because you're tired and you don't pick up everything the way you would do if you where 100% fit. Usually when you're working late at night you'll have a little light from your monitor and from your desklight or somethig, but the area around you is darker. The result is that you see reflections of yourself in a poster or a window or a door just at the edge of what you can see. When you look you get more detail and your brain sees it's not a seperate object.

Ang I've experienced several similar to yours. Went to the highland games for the first time and heard bagpipes for three days straight. Going down the interstate a couple of hours and 100 miles later I was still faintly hearing them. Do you go from a lot of talking to nothing very quickly? The brain really does need time to adjust.

Yes, electro. It is most often like being in the murmer of a crowd. Occaisionally I can pick out words or shorts phrases. All nonsense really. But when I heard the the conv that sounded like a foreign language it was different, it seemed more defined and less like a crowd. It just amused me to no end to think the voices wouldn't even talk to me in a language I could understand. Ang

I have to leave for my night job, when I get home tonight, I want to post a couple of my de ja vue experiences I had as a kid, they were quite powerful and scarey ones.

There are so many things we cant explain, and why should they not be real. A couple of years ago, in my old flat, i heard a couple of women discussing in the living room. The funny thing is, that i was in the bedroom, and no one else were present in the flat. I went to the living room about 2-3 seconds later, and...empty. Makes you wonder...

Maybe you have fans stalking you Rochr :P

danamo... I too experience the "shadow people". I would like to think it was like Rayraz said, in that it is a reflection of myself that I am seeing; but there is nothing for me to be reflected in when I see these "shadow beings". The only place my reflection could possibly be seen is in my monitor. Otherwise my image would have to be reflecting off wood surfaces. And I know that doesn't happen. lol Quite eerie to say the least. Ghosts? Poltergeists? who knows. heh heh heh.

Maybe its the Dream People... :)

could be a side effect of Bryce addiction..:)

I know what you mean Swade! I have a lot of tapestries and drapes where I "Bryce", and very few reflective surfaces, and come to think of it, my cats have reacted to these shadow people too. I also would prefer Ray's explanation!

I have some eerie things that have happened to me too Ang! A couple of real-life ghost stories. Maybe I should wait and tell them around Halloween. It's just around the corner.

I tend to put a lot of this down to brain hiccups. Our brains are designed to make sense of things. When we see a person or object we imediately try to recognise and classify them. Once we determine who they are we decide how we are going to respond. We don't try to re-recognise them and occasionally get suprised if we started with the wrong recognition. So the brain hiccups or swallows down the wrong pipe. We get a memory shoved back into the visual processor instead of where its supposed to go. Suddenly, we realise there is something new to recognise, but it's already gone. Brain fishes around and trys to assign a value to it. And yes I have experienced it! When I was 4years old late in the afternoon I saw a teenage boy and girl walk arm in arm throught the wall of my bedroom as if up a flight of stairs. I sat up on the bed but they stayed in position. They took one, two, three steps with the color faiding and them growing darker with each one. By the third they had completely faded. Another time when I was high school age I was looking in the mirror of the bathroom and saw myself walk past the doorway behind me out of the corner of my eye. The doppelganger gave me an evil grin and stuck his tounge out. I even turned and went to the doorway, but no one was in the room. If any of these spoke, hung around, or ever seemed completely solid for a fraction of a second more I would believe something else. Theres just always room for doubt.

Crazy stuff, you guys... It's strange but I'm sure there's some statistical link to the greater amount of para-psychotic events going on in our worlds, as "artists", compared to a group of less creative people! I walk in Shadows, and Dream like a madman at times, and quite lucidly. One side effect of Bryce addiction (like the Spice in DUNE!) is that sometimes I dream in ridiculous 3D environments, where there is no up or down, and where the world wraps INSIDE a sphere instead of on the outside... Sometimes my dreamworlds are all Escher-esque and inverted and ridiculous... But back to what Drac was talking about, I've had the opposite happen to me. When I was a crazy kid, one night while experiencing LSD I realized I could turn my eyes off. While they were open. Yep, complete darkness even in sunlight. I can still do it, and it's been ten years since that initial event. I wish I could do it to my ears, but NOT being alert all the time could prove fatal, in this world gone mad...

how about this? were just all too artistic that sometimes we go crazy? is that good or what? ehehehe actually when i work late at night i here voices too! especially when somebody forgot to turn off the tube... ehehehe seriously drac... your fine just a little in betweener i guess... im such a drag im shutting up now

lol@EYECON

"were just all too artistic that sometimes we go crazy" That has to be it EYECON... 8D There just is no other real explination... lol

ya mean too much absinth?..;) (probably spelled wrong..;) Hearing voices in a crowd is called 'the cocktail party effect'..hey, all I can do is play by ear..;)

As a young child I used to have to lay down on the couch before the bus came, I would feel very "strange" not exactly sickish. My mother thought it was me being nervous about school but it wasn't that kind of feeling. Once when I was sitting at the kitchen table the rooms around me suddenly filled up with people, which was a very upsetting thing to have happen. I don't think it lasted long at all. I've always assumed it was some sort of flashback to when we had a house full of people for the housewarming party, but it also gave me the same "odd" feeling. I outgrew the strange feeling and then experienced it again when I was 15. Ok don't want to get too personal here but the feeling hit me again each time I got a certain monthly event, and it was a feeling like this is wrong, I'm not supposed to be experiencing this, if that makes any sense. Then like before, I got used to things and the feeling went away. The only thing I can say is that it felt alot like the feeling I would get when I had deja vu. I've got a ghost story too! Laying in bed and I see this whitish not very tall person walking towards my door coming straight from my brother's room. So I assumed it was him. I said something to him and he didn't answer me, and I continued to say stuff to him and got mad. Well I know this wasn't a dream because my mother heard me and yelled up. When I told her what was going on she came up and found my brother sound asleep in his room, and no sign of whoever I saw turn and go into the spare room. To this day I will never sleep with my bedroom door open. That was over 30 yrs ago. Ang

Whew! I don't blame you Ang! That is a scarey story! Is there anyone else in your family that has had a similar experience? The women on my mum's side are all a bit "fey". Couldn't get away with anything naughty as a child 'cause they'd know about it in advance. They would get visions of an impending death, even if that loved one was on the other side of the world.

Nope, I've thankfully never gotten premonitions. But several times I have come across places that I'd only seen in a dream before. Oh and Shadow, I hate when I get caught up inside a video game in my dreams. It gets so confusing because I am inside the game while its being played. My dreams are almost always pleasant so I am surprised at this other thing that happens to me. Just before falling asleep if I let myself drift I can see what feel like visions but they are usually violent. Like an arrow shot threw someones head, stabbings, horrible stuff that the minute I see it I shake it off and don't let myself go there again. There is no explaining the way the brain works I guess. I do love my Lucid dreams, and so much fun when I realize I'm dreaming too. :-D

Ang, I had the same kind of experience when I was in my late teens or early twenties. I was lying in bed looking out of my darkened bedroom into the lit hallway. I thought I saw my sister come down the stairs, but her "head" wasn't well defined, as though she had on a space helmet or a fish bowl. Next thing I knew the figure (who I guessed by then wasn't really my sister) came in through my bedroom door towards my bed, until it was at the side of my bed, looking down at me, head still undefined. I couldn't tell if it was an alien or a ghost, or something else entirely. I freaked out and started kicking at it, but I couldn't seem to move. In a blink (perhaps I was startled "awake?"), the figure was gone, and I was alone in my room, kicking at nothing and frightened half to death.

Hmmm, dream or alien abduction?

Attached Link: An alien abduction would explain my worldview, for instance.

lol i too have a ghost story if any one wants to hear it....lol (gotta love render time) as a teenager, maybe 15-16 yrs old, we went to a church camp every year for a retreat. this cam was set on an old farm, 3 miles from nowhere, at the top of a mountain...lol anyhow, one day i woke up and fel tlike something was watching me....following me everywhere.... followed me the 1 1/2 hour drive home, and still, felt like i was being watched and followed. about a week later, the group got together again, and i started talking about how weird i felt, and the one girl that slept in the bunk beside mine told me this story. she woke in the middle of the night, not feeling well, and rolled to get out of bed, as she did , she saw two figures standing near my bunk. one was a farmer, and the other a girl about 6 with no head. the figures just stood there watching me sleep for about an hour or so till she fell back asleep. (freaky huh?) BUT i'm the type that lovessss ghost sotries, and once i found out why i felt like i was being watched (cause i was) i started talking to them...lol before y aknow it, the feeling went away. SCARY thing is, i researched that camp, and over 100 years ago, a farmer owned the ground, and his young daughter was killed in an accident. lol i like ghosts and all, but i never really did go back to stay the night again....maybe was growing out of that stage in life, maybe was my instincts saying, she CANNOT have MY head!! lol JenC

April, if they offer you a ride, I hope you decide to stick around here instead(I get a big kick out of your aliens, and your other work too! :-) @ JC 01- Jen, that is another very cool and scarey story. I wonder if we "grow" out of being able to see these things, or we're "talked out of them?

i honestly think, if we sat, and let all the possibilties of our mind work as it has the potential to, we would see alot more then just ghosts. todays society has so many preconceptions and ideals that one must follow to be in the "norm" that i feel we are "talked" out of those beliefs. why do so many children have imaginary friends? without even ever knowing that others do, still, they have them. it's not something they see in other kids, (as lots are too embarassed to admit it outside the house) or rarely see on tv. yet as they grow older and learn that imaginary friends are "imaginary" and not real, the brain starts to process..."not real....not there"....and soon.....the friend dissapears, only to live on with other children. JenC

The aliens thank you, danamo! :-D

Did a ouija board once when I was 15, that was pretty scary, especially when we got the kid from next door who had been killed in a motorcycle accident. I was pretty sceptical at first, like is he pushing it etc. But we were round a friends sisters house. He had an arguement and stormed off. Later his mom called saying she needed to speak to him. Nobody new where he was, we asked the board who said Chip shop. I rode out on my bike and met him coming the other way with a bag of chips. This guys sister was addicted to doing these, but had some real wierd stuff happen. Like the time she was in the bathroom and her laundry basket fell over and the clothes appeared to be pulled out by unseen hands.

I don't believe in ghosts like dead people. I think whitish ghosts you hear about are actually angels. I'd like to think of unrecognizable ghosts as demons wich go away if you get upset, because that's when they reached their goal. I like to think there's a god and a devil and they have their followers. As long as I stay on the good side the bad side can't hurt me. But that'll never be a problem, because I like helping people and being nice and I hate being angry or do bad things. I used to be really scared of aliens when I was younger. I never remember seeing them now. I would dream about Xenomorph from the movie Alien. I'd have nightmares about them, but at the end of the nightmare I'd have a Zenomorph as pet. That was when I wouldn't be scared anymore and the dream got boring and I woke up. Actually I quite liked those scary dreams. I do sometimes think I see someone, but then I realize I'm actually seeing myself. It's the emotions I pushed away. Remember the image I made recently of a room with a table and chair with a rose in a vase on the table? It's one of the places I like to go to in my mind. I can just stand there looking from the exact same spot as seen in the render and after a while I see a dark figure sitting on the chair being really depressed. I can't actually see the figure, but I just know it's there. The figure is the part of my mind where all the bad emotions I suppressed over the years are. I never knew that untill recently. I usually leave that place before I recognise who the figure is, but I decided once to wait and find out if my mind knew who the figure was, so I did one step forward and suddenly the figure turned and looked at me. I recognized my own face, only really develish and like it had been dead for months. Naturally I got really scared and I snapped back into reality. But unlike when I went to that room I was just extremely angry. I've never ever been so angry in my life before. It was just this great dense explosion of agression. I just had to hit something, so I punched at the wall as hard as I could for 5 minutes. I punched so hard that little pieces of dust and plaster came down from the edge of the ceiling. After I was done I was so tired I couldn't lift my arms. Luckily no-one was home at the time so no-one noticed it. My hands hurt for 3 weeks. But after that I felt lot's better. Like all the negative emotions I stored over the years are finally just gone. I never see the figure anymore when I go to that room.

ouija board and other things like that can be very dangerous. In some cases people got insane and sometimes they get in coma or can't move their body anymore even though their brain and nervous system is still fully intact. I might sound like some old priest from the middle ages, but I think such games are develish.

I'm sure glad you had that wonderful catharsis Ray, also glad you didn't permanently damage your hands. You must have incredible visualization abilities!

I think that many, but not all "ghosts" are actually a natural phenomenon akin to a tape loop. Many famous hauntings are ones in which a "spectre" is observed doing the same action, in the same place, at a certain time of day under similar conditions. When you consider that we are bio-electric creatures, and that everyplace on earth has an electro-magnetic field, it is not beyond the realm of possibility that certain places could be "imprinted" with a magnetic echo of a person, or in some cases an animal. Think of all the power inherent in strong emotions!

I agree with you about Ouija boards Ray, I won't even touch them anymore!

"You must have incredible visualization abilities!" I have to make sure to always remember when I'm daydreaming otherwise I get all confused and mix both worlds up. Usually that's no problem, but every once in a while I think I did something and I actually didn't do it for real, only in my head, but my mind is convinced it actually happened.

I've had 'out-of-body' experiences. Started when I was very ill with plurasy (Lung infection) I was laying on the bed asleep when I sat up and then found myself floating toward the door. I put my head through the (closed)door and I could see the hallway. At that point I panicked and was suddenly back on the bed. Since then I've had loads of these, but they're always at night and I find it's too dark to see, so I reach for the light switch and panic because I can't make the lights come on. That's when I find myself back in bed.....I just wish I could control it..........

All of this is just due to the Matrix re-setting :-)

When my daughter was two I had this 3little pigs mask for Haloween. I'd put it on and she'd howl. Take it off and she'd giggle. It was like "there's daddy now". I put it on and off half a dozen times but she never made the connection that it was still me. I found out this type of reasoning doesn't fully develop until about age six. My point is, there are things she saw that she just couldn't perceive. It's not that big a leap that there might be things going on around us that we just haven't been built to notice. We also get trained from an early age about what's real. I think Verne wrote a story called "in the Country of the Blind" . Its about a mountain climber that stumbles on a shangra la filled with blind people. He decides that he's going to prove what a wonderful thing sight is. He winds up tripping and stumbling because the homes have no windows. He can't hear people's hands or sleves rustle well enough to take food from them. Finally the townsfolk decide to put out his eyes to heal him of his delusions. That's human nature, don't be different.

I just wrote my ghost story and it got lost somewhere in the ether. So I'll write it out again later and post it. I knew I should have copied it first, DOH! Catlin

I never met my mom's dad, he died shortly before I was born, and I've never seen any pictures of him either, there aren't any, but when I was about 2 years old I walked into my room and there was this man standing there. Now I don't remember the conversation very well, but I described him and our conversation to my mom a little while later and she became absolutely convinced that I'd seen my grandfather. I don't know if it was or not, but I do know that someone was there, and Ray, I'm sure it was no angel or demon, and I'm pretty sure it wasn't a living man because no one came in or out of the house. There's another strange thing that happens to me all the time. It's like deja vu, except that the moment that I can remember happening before happened in a dream. It'll be little pieces of a conversation, the exact way people are standing in a place I've never been before, little unimportant things like that which can last from just a fraction of a second to several minutes. These little bits of time will match perfectly little pieces of dreams that I had forgotten until just that instant, but I can also remember the context of that moment in the dream which will be completely different from reality. More recently I've even remembered thinking in the dream, "this is another one of those deja vu things again," accompanied by the (much hazier) recollection of another earlier dream, and I wonder how often I've lived these moments in my mind. It's like I can predict the future, but it's only with completely useless moments and I only know that I knew what would happen after it already has.

"I found out this type of reasoning doesn't fully develop until about age six." I found that out at age 4. We have something called 'Sinter Klaas' in the Netherlands. It's about the same story as Santa, only Sinter Klaas comes from spain and he arrives to give gifts a few weeks before Santa. Anyway, at age 4 I recognized that the 'Sinter Klaas' at school was actually one of the teachers. I didn't say anything, because the other kids still thought it was real and I didn't want to spoil it for them, but it was then that I realized that it was all fake. My brother and sister took a few more years to find that out. I think I already was a quick learner back then. BTW, Jules Verne is one of my favourite writers. Catlin, looking forward to your ghost story :) this thread is so much fun.

Attached Link: http://www.fantasticfiction.co.uk/etexts/y3800.htm

When I was 11 I went to a summer camp with a friend. One day we were taken out on a visit to a stately home, it consisted of a massive house and gardens and a gatehouse. As we walked up the drive towards the house my friend and I stopped to pick some flowers outside the gatehouse while the others walked ahead. When we stood up again we saw a well built man in country style clothes, with his hands on his hips and laughing at us. We thought he looked odd but hurried on to catch the others. We were shown around the rooms of the house and in one of the rooms was a portrait of a previous owner of the estate. At this point my friend and I stated that we had seen this man by the gatehouse and the guide told us that was not possible because he had died more than 100 years ago. He then went on to tell us that the man had found his wife in a liason with the gamekeeper so he killed them both, then killed himself. He also told us that others had seen him and when he did appear it was always by the gatehouse either because he was trying to leave or because that's where he murdered his wife and her lover. I think it was probably the later. That was the first time I ever had an experience like that but I've had others since then. I may tell you more later............... Catlin

This is also why I think that these apparitions are people who have been recorded by the surrounding rocks because their emotions were so high or they really didn't want to die or couldn't accept what was happening to them. Catlin

Whew Catlin, that was a good one! I've never seen a ghost, but I've heard and "felt" them.

A few years back I was working at a large retail store and became good platonic friends with an older woman who also worked there. We ended up becoming roommates because we trusted each other, and we were both "neat-freaks". We moved into a nice large townhouse apt. on a peaceful tree-shadedstreet. One hot and muggy day I came home from work to find that all the windows were closed and the apartment felt as hot as an oven. I walked up the stairs to my room in order to open my windows. As I started up the second flight I walked right into a zone of cold so intense that I got"goose-bumps", and I shivered involuntarily. I thought perhaps my roommate had gotten home before and turned on an air conditioner, but she arrived home shortly after I did. I told her about the cold spot and she said she had felt the same thing before. Several times after that we both experienced that "cold-zone",and so did our guests! One day my roommate's daughter and her best friend stopped by for a visit. The daughter's friend brought along her little girl,age 4, and she contentedly played with a doll and a toy truck as her mother talked. After a while the girl looked up and asked "if the little boy could come down and play". My roommate asked her,"what little boy"? The little girl replied,"the little boy who just walked up the stairs"! Another friend of mine had a wife who worked in the city records division.She was able to establish that a little boy had died there, by falling down the stairs.

Thats an excellent example of how young children are more receptive to seeing things than us adults! Creepy too.

Hi Many years ago when my brothers and I were quite young I was left in charge of my brothers(being the eldest) while my mother went to the shops. Well we heard noises as you do while we were playing (the house relaxing etc) I went and looked up stairs and well I didn't see anything in the shadows at the top of the stairs but I knew someone/something was there but I didn't really feel frightened. Some years later my younger brother and I were talking to Mom and Dad when I mentioned about the 'boggit' who lived on the stairs. The conversation just stopped (awkward silence) then my brother turned around and said that he was glad that I'd said that because he thorght he might have been crazy. He said that he'd known 'it' was there for years too. (I had never said anything to either of my brothers about this because I thought it might scare/frighten them!) The funny thing was sometime later my little brother left home under a bit of a cloud as it were and I remember starting down the stairs to see him off when I kind of walked into an area of deep sadness , a bit like a fog bank, walk in walk out just where 'he' lived! So I guess I was looking after my brothers all those years but our friend was looking after us all! Dave Funny thing was that