As the poser community has grown, it has become more diverse/chaotic. The era of everyone using Poser 4 and buying from DAZ is over. With the community split between Poser 4 and 5, and buying items from a variety of sources, it seems what was once standard isn't any more. Which leads me to this question; If you bought a texture/character set, would you expect there to be a bump map and alternate texture with makeup included? If these weren't part of the set, would you still buy it? What if a bump map was included, but no instructions on how to apply it in Poser 5? I ask these questions based on my own experience and research. I'm especially wondering about the bump map, considering they can't be applied with mat poses in P5 and theres no universal consensus on how to apply skin bumps in P5.

Bump maps can be applied in P5 with MAT poses, if you use a python MAT-writer script. Or you could make a P4 mat pose with it and use MPE3 to convert it to a P5 file. If I'm going to buy a set, then I want a bump map with it, given that my thing is realism.

I addressed this question several months ago here and in the product forum. The majority consensus then was that the experienced users don't want bump maps. They use a generic bump they have created or prefer to make their own. The inexperienced users were happy with a bump map unless they were on dial-up connections. I have stopped supplying bumps in most V3 and M3 character textures in order to include multiple texture maps for additional effects. I have received no complaints or requests for bumps since then. Maybe people are changing their minds. It is a very valid question that needs to be revisited often to assure buyers are getting the best value. Especially with photo composite skin textures becoming more prevalent, the file sizes of textures are growing larger and larger. Do people want more texture variations available or a single texure with better bump file options?

A GOOD bump map can really add a lot of realism to a rendered skin even if the original texture is extremely realistic and well made. I was shocked to read a statement made by one of the better known realistic texture makers who said something like "Bump maps are not required because of the high quality of my maps." As far as I am concerned that statement is either sheer arrogance or shows a lack of understanding about the rendering process and how highlights and shading can be really improved by good bump maps. Granted, bump maps are no substitute for detailed textures, but in the rendering process they play an entirely different role, but can still enhance an otherwise less detailed texture. They really "shine", however when applied to the spectral aspects of the skin especially the "sheen" or "wet look" which at best, will appear "oily" or "plastic" if a bump map is not used. With that said, the question of whether to include bump maps with a product would depend on the quality of the map, and whether or not it fulfilled its role properly. If the bump map is just a grasyscale of the texture that has had the contrast boosted a bit, then I'd say keep it out - we don't need it. Likewise if it is nothing more than a lot of noise, you can keep that too. But if it is made carefully to affect the skin surface with realistic pores and micro-wrinkles then I definitely want it. Examples of good bump maps are the ones that come with the 3rd Gen Mill figures from DAZ - they are outstanding. The bump maps that came with earlier figures are less appealing, but marginally adequate. The bumps that come with the typical 3rd party texture are usually worthless which is why most people would say that they can be omitted. So to the texture makers I'd say, if you take the time to create a good bump map, I'd definitely pay a bit more to get it. If not, you can leave them out cause I got a couple of good ones that I do like, but small details like scars or pock-marks don't line-up with anything except the texture they are made for, so it is not an ideal marriage - just better than a crappy bump by a long shot.

Include the bump map. Since it's only b/w you can really compress it, to keep the download size more reasonable. In P5 of course you could just link from the original texture to the bump channel and set the dial to whatever level looks best.

I learned a lot of good texturing techniques from the "3D Texture Workshop" book printed by Komodo Press. In that book's method, the bump map is ESSENTIAL to the process; the texture map is based off of it, instead of the "usual" method where the bump map is just the texture grayscaled. Done with the bump-first method, they look FABULOUS together, and there is a definite quality jump when both are used.

So, a good bump map is indeed necessary. It's particularly necessary in Pro Pack and Poser 5 (whereas I don't feel it worked so well in Poser 4, which actually faked in bumps rather than using true bump mapping).

On the other hand, if you're not going to do the bump map well, just keep it. In fact, if you're not willing to do good work, just keep the entire set; we've got enough mediocre, thanks. That's not directed at anyone, and I certainly don't want to insult anyone. It's just that, frankly, the marketplaces are spilling over with texture sets of the same average quality. At this point, if an artist isn't going to do one that's exceptionally good, or exceptionally cheap, I feel they're wasting your effort. Their time is too precious to be buried in the crowd.

Message edited on: 06/15/2004 19:37