Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?ForumID=12398&Form.ShowMessage=2014853

I never liked the ratings system, so I don't enable them.

I've thought the ranking was pointless for a long time. I haven't ranked or allowed rankings for over a year. I think the only way to improve the ranking is to scrap it. Maybe go over to a 1 to 10 system. I think people are less likely to give 10's all the time.

we actually had a 1-10 system, and everyone got 9's or 10's..;) for those who can take criticism, it's not a problem, it's just there are some who can't even take it..and boy, do they let you know it..;) I haven't rated anyone's picture in quite some time..but I only comment on stuff I like, or creative misspellings, or..;)

Interesting. I'm thinking of sites like hotornot where the 1 to 10 system works quite well. Or maybe those people are just brutally honest and we're just too nice.

I must confess here. I am aware that people can get very upset, so I've kind of taken the old addage, "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all," to heart. There are some artists that I comment on almost every time, and they are terrific, so I'm pretty safe. I don't comment on quite a few for the two obvious reasons: a. I cannot possibly take hours every day to comment on every image in the galleries and b. I don't really like the image. However ... If I get a sense that the artist truly wants a critique that is honest, no matter how harsh, particularly if this person truly is looking for comments on particular problems, then, if I feel like I (who am extremely far from perfect myself) can come up with something that is helpful, I will tell the artist about a problem or something I personally don't like about the image in question. I would be in favor of a 1-10 rating, too. However, I likely wouldn't give any rating at all, if it were an image that I would give less than a 5 or 6.

I think that's a good point. I only comment only pictures I think are really good (or in some cases have not given credit where it's due), so there's no opportunity for me to rank "could do better".

I tend to comment either because I really like the image, or because I genuinely feel I could say something useful (not often because I have a good grasp of 3d tools and lighting theory, but poor ability to apply it to the artistic....)

I agree with waldomac. I've given constructive criticism to artists before and they generally tell me to take a flying f**k. So, I've stopped giving criticisms all together other than artistic comments concerning what appeals to me in the pic. If I don't like a pic I don't comment. Pure and simple.

I usually 'sugar coat' it..point out a minor fix, scaling, etc., and tell them it's a good render, and to keep making them..so far it's worked 98% of the time..;)

Well... when I post an image I very much appreciate the constructive crits.... I have thought about this over and over again. I think that the TOS needs a statement in it that basically says... constructive crits are to help not to hurt or degrade ones pic, and that there will be no retaliatory activity to receiving a constructive criticism...including hateful PM's etc. I think that people that send hateful PM's back to people that leave a constructive crit are very, very insecure and small minded. So if any of you ever feel the need to criticize my work..... have at it. I can handle it with no problem. And I would be appreciative to it as well. 8)

I'm with Swade, I don't mind my pics critiqued at all. Perhaps I've overlooked something in one of my images, or it could be better in a certain way. It doesn't mean that I will redo the pic, I might be really happy with it. But I think everyone can benifit from constructive crits. Sometimes I give crits to those I know pretty well, but not to those I don't. I too have gotten the mad IMs -- so I don't comment on those pics at all now.

I once got an irate IM because I didn't comment on a picture. There was a new guy who joined us and posted a few good pieces and I made nice comments on how much I liked his work. Then I happened to miss one and I got an IM from him asking what was wrong with that image. He was moaning because I HADN'T posted a comment at all!

Sorry. I've been misreading it for over a year. I thought it said *ankings.... (Spent too much time in the Posew Gallewy, I s'pose...) Cheers, Diolma

lol if i like an image i give ex elend, lol at 41 i dont need someone teach me how to judge others.

I can understand where you are all coming from. As a new user to bryce i like to get constructive criticism on my work and i like getting a rating to see what people think of it. if that rating is low or high it doesn't matter to me, but hey each to their own i say :)

I'd almost rather get something critical, in the positive sense, than "great render". While I do appreciate that someone took the time to type "great render" I probably already thought it was or I wouldn't have put it in my gallery in the first place. :) The actual rankings me less since almost everyting that has been ranked in my gallery has received "excellent" but I don't think I have ever cracked the hot 20. For me the comments that count are either suggestions or comments on the viewers response to the work, how it makes them feel or think etc...

If you hint at it, and you want a crit, I'd be happy to help out. Just the same, I'll avoid the flame, Cuz I hate to see you pout.

It doesn't really matter what type of ranking system is used. It's the people using it. I visit another site that currently uses a 1-10 ranking and they were discussing changing to R'osity's method. People mostly give images a "10" over there. I think it's the same anywhere you go. I'm not a frequent poster, either in a forum or on images I view, but when I do decide to post on someone's pic, I try to politely point out what looks wrong to me. I try to avoid subjective issues, like "that ship would be better with more guns" since I know the artist may very well have WANTED it that way. But it seems to me that any ranking system is only as flawed as the people using it. This is not to say that everyone abuses it, but certainly quite a few do, or topics like this wouldn't keep appearing here and other places.

I think people would be more honest if the rankings were broken up somehow, instead of just one big generic one. I'm sure there are some images that might have a higher rating for the subject, yet poor execution and vice versa. Being able to rate an image on various criteria would allow somebody to fairly say "I like the story and composition, but the lighting and rendering quality are just sub par." without being singled out by saying that in their comments.

Justn_Otherguy, you stated that you politely point out what looks wrong to you. I would accept constructive criticism like yours on any of the images that i do. That is the idea of posting our WIPs on this forum so others can say what looks wrong to them, god if i posted half the images i have done in my gallery i would get laughed at because of the way they looked :)

I feel the Ranking issue is just on the same par with comments that are left. When a person submits a comment, one can pretty much tell what kind of ranking they would give it just by the words they left. So the ranking thing is just redundant in my opinion so I don't use it.

I think that this place used to have a 1-10 ranking system for images, but due to the complaints and wishes of its members (I think that was the reason) it changed to the word based ranking system thats around now.

I think rating and comments and all don't really directly give you a good view on what people think of the images I create. I usually just get a much better view on that when I compare the number of comments and ratings and views of different images I made. If I get above average ammount of views and/or ratings and/or comments then apparently my image was one of the better once I made, if I get less then I usually get on average, then apparently it wasn't really everything people would've expected from me.

I think that rankings are silly. That's all. Tell me how to make my pictures better, that's what I want to know.

As an apology to my previous post in this thread, may I say that I agree totally with shadowdragonlords post. I don't post anything in the galleries, because I don't think my (rather few) efforts are good enough. If I did I'd want to get constructive criticism, not ranking. (Since I want to get better...) Cheers, Diolma

hey, don't let that 'good enough' stuff stop ya..I post ever-thin' I make (and it shows..;) and these poor sufferers have been kind enough to point me on the straight and narrow..;) If you're unsure, call it a 'wip'..;) hey, can't have too much art out there..

I understand where you guys are coming from on this, but, at the same time, it sure is nice once in a while to post a work and not get ripped to shreds. An "excellent" is pretty encouraging. I agree with pakled: I'd like to at least see works from people like Diolma who are hanging back because they're not feeling like they've gained sufficient skills to post. Not that it would bother me all that much now, but I remember when I was first starting out and I actually thought about posting something that I'd worked many, many hours on. I was new and wanted very much to improve. I felt halfway decent about the work and finally posted it. However, the responses I got were harsh, condescending, and, frankly, not all that helpful. It was a long time before I posted any work of mine again, simply because I thought I must be a total no-talent doofus whose efforts were completely useless. For those of you who know me, and, in fact, know me to be a total no-talent doofus whose efforts actualy are completely useless, you'll know that I'm over it. :) I post now every now and then to Renderosity, which is much more friendly than other communities I've been on. I hope the works are well received, and I would like to know if they can be improved in a way that would make them much better. But, perhaps more importantly, I try to encourage some of the more newby artists now and then who are making great strides and who genuinely seem to want to know how to improve. As to ranking, I'm not sure how that really helps, but I guess an "excellent" and a pat on the back could be pretty encouraging, based on my newby experience. I actually do 3D work now that is for professional publication, and, whereas I don't claim to be a genius at this, I'm gaining new skills every day and my work is actually looking OK. When it comes to Renderosity, I'm pretty much here for the fun of it and to share works and experiences with other artists (not that I would put myself in that category exactly). I'd much rather log on here and gain skills through encouragement than through peevish rips from jerks who think they've got the tiger by the tail. I think we should challenge each other and maybe even talk a little slap now and then, but I think most of us are probably here because we like being here. If people are tactful, I totally agree that constructive criticism is highly valuable. Some of us lack tact. I just think we need to be careful how we word things. That said, these IMs people keep mentioning from people who get mad if they say things, even in a tactful way, that are not just blatant praise, ignore them. Don't comment on their work; let them feel self-important and just let their skills stay stagnant. They deserve nothing more or less. I've NEVER seen anyone comment on my work that was less than considerate at Renderosity, so I think we all have the wherewithal to be encouraging AND spark improvement in one another. Have a great night, all.

Dialoma....
First off.... I am with Pakled. Don't hide your work. Bring it on. Bring it here first. We will help you out with everything you need/want help with. You have seen good help in this forum. So don't be shy with us here. If you create a piece of art... it is good enough. 8)

I think I was like you till I finally had the courage to post an image. It was not a bad experience. I got honest crits and that is what made me feel ok about posting my images. I am no Picasso. LOL... far from it, very far from it. Probably will never be able to compare. But the key is ... I...love...art. 8) The people in this forum have been very supportive and willing to help me to become a better artist and take note of things I once upon a time had never really paid attention to. This is what the constructive crits are supposed to be for I think.

Constructive crits can be... uplifting, enlightening, encouraging, honest, challenging, humbling, eye opening, strengthening, insightful and more. But a constructive crit should never be abusive and the recipient of the constructive crit should never attack the one making the crit.

And yea.... rankings are silly....even though I do leave them enabled on my images. I may change that. I just want to be better than I am at my art and can only get better if I have honest input from viewers.

I am with you and SDL.... I don't care for the rankings either. I want the crits for the same reason SDL and you have stated.... simply, it can help me to improve my technique and/or explore new/different techniques. We are all human and miss things. We are not perfect. So an honest criticism is good for us.

This is a very helpful forum and that is why I am still here. Of all the forums I have been a member to.... the Bryce Forum at Renderosity has been by far the most helpful to me. 8)

So far... the only forum that's ever been helpful to me, Swade! I didn't even know the difference between a "forum" and a "thread" before I came to renderosity, and I've been doing graphic design since before the 'net even existed...!

I guess I'm in for a bit of a spanking; my last piece got a 'needs touchups' which, if not the lowest ranking, must be close. If, in fact it had needed touchups, it would have been nice to know what they were..;) I needed to clean house anyway (I try to keep my postings under 150, and I was at 148..;) so, no biggie. You can tell me I suck, but tell me why..;)