hiya i've narrowed it down to these two cameras...but i was curious about a few things. since there are few camera shops around here (boo), i haven't really been able to get my hands on the cameras to answer my own questions. sorry if these questions are common knowledge ;) i'm still a horrible newbie to all this. my 1st question is about taking pictures... i've heard that you can only use the viewfinder to take pictures... that the screen doesn't work like other smaller digital cameras. not that it makes a huge difference to me.. i just found that a little odd. the other question is directly about the Canon 20D... i've heard and read reviews saying that the screen is hard to view in the sunlight but the Nikon D70 is alot easier to see. this might be a bigger problem for me, because there's nothing i hate more then trying to angle the screen or hide in shadows trying to see what i'm doing. i know these seem like little things.... but i'm trying to get a camera that i will be happy with and be able to take decent pictures for a while and will be able to use for (hopefully) more then just a year or 2. thank you for any help.

ok so first question : Yes you can only see what you shoot through the viewfinder. It's because it's a DSLR Second question: Yes it can be hard on every cam, but I had never trouble with my EOS 10D.If the light is very bright than you turn into your own shade and you can see ervything fine.

1. 3dguy has illustrated it perfectly...you can only use the screen for menu items and review of pictures already taken. 2) The screen IS hard to see in bright light (certainly was on my D70)...I suspect it will be the same regardless of brand name. Do some more research on sensor dust issues for all DSLR cameras (See my threads below)....if you are not prepared to live with it (or clean it), it may not be the camera for you. That is why I returned five D70's to Nikon.

ah thank you for the help :) yes i read some of the posts about the sensor dust... it worries me a little... gradient may i ask if you decided to keep the D70 after sending them back? or did you decide to go for another camera?

@moonrose: I have returned all the D70's...and am back to shooting film slr's for the time being. The dust issues appear to be similar with all Dslr brands and as a result I am still waiting on the sidelines for either a somewhat more dust free sensor system...or an easier/reliable cleaning method. I will say that if you only shoot f5.6 or less with a non uniform backround the dust does not show up as much....it is when you are at f16 and a nice blue sky when the dust bunnies make their appearance. I also know many folks here probably think I am making a big deal about the dust...but for me $1500+ is a lot of money... and I had expected to get a CLEAN high quality product from the factory. The thought of wiping a sensor at my own risk every month or so did not appeal to me.... For more info on this and to help you decide, you can go to dpreview and punch in your favorite camera brand and search for "dust".

Further note; I find it a bit ironic that there is such emphasis placed by folks on lens quality, ccd sensor size/quality...yet at the same time they are 1) willing to live with dust spots that need to be cloned out of images, and 2) at the same time they will not accept a dead sensor pixel that is in fact much smaller than a dust spot and can also be cloned out.... Would you be happy with a brand new lens that exhibited a "spot" on every film image you took? Not me....but you can clone it out they would say...lol!

@gradient I don't know about the D70's but I think you rally make a big deal out of it. I have my Canon 10 D for two years now and had never really problems with dust ! I cleaned the sensor once but that was after a trip in the desert. Yes the camera should be clean whn you get it ;-). But than if you treat it carefully I don't see any problems. And I shoot in f5,6 but also often in f16 or f38 with long exsporure. I thinkl more important is to keep your lenses clean! But ok everybody has his own oppinion and for me I could never imagine going back to my old Leica, even if it's a fantastic film camera.

I agree with neverfinder. While having 5 new cameras with dust seems very very unlucky, I have been shooting with my Digital Rebel now for 4 months. I have cleaned the sensor once. Cleaning the sensor really should be no more than taking a bulb and blowing the dust off. I think of it as just part of cleaning my camera. If you get some stubborn dust then you might have to wipe the sensor, which is not as hard as most people make it out to be. I don't accept dust spots, I check my camera every couple of weeks, if I have them I clean the sensor by blowing the dust off. Not much more trouble than cleaning a lens and worrying about scratching it. I would clone out dust spots if I got one, just as I would if I got a spot on the front of my lens. Bottom line is I personally thing the advantages of digital are worth the 5 minutes it takes me to clean my sensor.

Attached Link: http://science.howstuffworks.com/camera.htm/printable

{{{*As a side note: I am reposting 3DGuy's posting to this thread - as his previous posting contained HTML coding with a direct link to another site's image - we encourage outside linking - but, please do so as an actual link to the web site - ... not as an image source insert link [which runs into copyright problem issues] - thanks so much - Dee-Marie*}}}

Below is the text from 3DGuy's previous post - thank you 3DGuy for the great information!

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The reason you can't use the screen to shoot is demonstrated here:

{{{Please click on the above link to the How Does Stuff Work web site, for details and images on how a camera works. }}}

Except where it says "Film" in a dSLR the sensor is there. As you can see, the film/sensor is completely in the dark until you press the button. Then the mirror flips up and the shutter opens.

Previously posted by 3DGuyMessage edited on: 01/31/2005 09:58

Apologies for the TOS violation :) Anyhow, here's a another picture which is not hotlinked.

Hi 3DGuy - Just for the record - you were not given a TOS violation :) However, let me help to clear this matter up. To avoid copyright problems when referencing an image that you did not take - OR - that you did not take and Do Not have permission to use. 1. Please ONLY post a LINK to that image :) It is a copyright infringement violation [not just a Renderosity TOS problem] to post an image into a thread that is not your image, or that you do not have written permission to use. 2. Thus, it is also a copyright problem when you embed HTML image source code into your thread. Hope this helps to clear up this matter :) Thanks again 3DGuy for your postings, I know you are just trying to being helpful and supportive with the image postings. Please repost the above thread with a "link" to the image - not the actual image :) I would have included the image link - but I could not find the page that it was listed on. Thanks so much Dee-Marie

Aargh.. why is that image deleted from my last posting? It's not the copyrighted image from HSW. I edited that image myself and thus I'm fully qualified to upload it here. I give up.

Attached Link: http://www.newcamerashop.com/

so it seems it will be a personal case by case for the dust issue. i guess when i do end up buying a camera i'll have to see if it will be a problem for me. ____________ since camera shops around here are few and far between i've been looking around online. of course there are the reliable sites that people know are trustworthy... but i can't resist the urge to at least look at the cheaper sites. of course it makes me nervous... they make me wonder why they're so much cheaper then the other sites... i was wondering if anyone has done business with or know of someone who's bought something from this site. (plus if anyone knows of good sites i'm open to looking at those too :)

Attached Link: http://heim.ifi.uio.no/~gisle/blog/index.php?p=18

Did a Google on NewCameraShop and red flags popped up everywhere. See link for an example. 17th Street Photo, B&H and Adoramma are all online stores that I have order from with no problems.

A few things to be cautious about: 1)Don't know where you live but some of these cameras offered online are so called "grey" market...in other words there is NO warranty. Also if you live in Europe (for example) and buy a USA camera...warranty is only valid in the USA. 2)I think it would be a lot easier to return the camera if necessary if it was purchased in a storefront type store. 3)Please try out (touch, feel, snap a few shots) with the camera you select BEFORE buying. A reputable shop should let you take a few test shots with it before taking it home. 4)Make sure that the shop has a seven or 10 day product return period. Good luck!

Yes good point gradient. Each of the on-line stores have a return policy if you are not happy. I live in a small city in Mississippi, there are no camera stores within 100 miles. So I have to rely on on-line stores for most of my purchases, though I do visit a camera shop in Jackson, MS and purchase something every time I go.