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Photography F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2024 Nov 13 3:04 pm)
Subject: My entry for... the Hot-20 !!!
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Your image is SUPERB Michel! I will certainly vote for it! First, i agree with you that Gerhard's gallery is outstanding. I LOVE his work, and i do vote for most of his images. i do NOT agree with you that 4 powerline images is too much. if that's what he wishes to upload, then why not? it's his gallery, and i think he should post whatever he likes. Secondly, like you, i also turned off the ranking button. i don't see the point since none of my images ever got anything other than "excellent." I just don't care about Hot 20. I don't care about ranking buttons. I don't care how many votes my images get. i have no intention of trying to get RR to change that system because precisely because i just don't care about any of it. I enjoy getting comments. i like funny comments and serious comments. i love it when people give me advice and suggestions on how to improve my images. what i care about is becoming a better photographer. votes and Hot 20 don't tell me how to improve my skills. that's why i don't care about it i guess. i find it to be worthless. i'm not trying to invalidate your feelings. i'm just telling you mine. i'm sorry the voting/Hot 20 is troublesome to you. i don't have the answers. :( ...and thank YOU for your friendship and talent, Michel! peace, sheila
what should i say. i didnt want the powerlines images in the hot 20, on the other side of course i am happy.it would be a great idea for disabling the vote button.really i am very happy to get so much from my images in the hot 20, but there are so many other excellent images from various artists here who deserves to be in the hot 20 too. when there is a button for disable, i will use it. not on every of my postings but for some. regards gerhard
I'm not even going to go there, excellent shot, I too must admit I have been out today shooting these powerlines, and that is thanks to Gerhards inspiration.
There are so many "Best" photographers in R'osity I would never be able to say I have a number one pick. The Hot 20 issue has been dragged around in every forum.We all know what makes it work and I hope that this Photography crowd can stay risne above the attitude directed towards it. That is one reason I liked this section of the website so much. Seems no one really minded the controversy surrounding it. We also have a Gallery of the Week that I'm going to be making sure everyone gets to be in it at one point or another (as Misha did). I think everyone has heard that expression...don't sweat the small stuff...etc
"The happiness of a man in this life does not consist in the
absence but in the mastery of his passions."
my two cents about it (please forgive my english): I think the "top 20 thing" is right and i works well, but in my opinion is the beahviour of the people here in RR that is a bit strange. I mean, I have another online gallery that is much more "free" for judgement. Let me explain: I think here on RR there's a sort of gentlemen's agreement that says "do not say bad things on other people pictures". I dunno why but I truly feel that kind of sensation when reading people's comments about my work or on other's one. And I do the same! I mean sometimes I feel "forced" not to express my personal opinion on an image just because it would be "not friendly enough for RR"... And so, when I dont like a picture I just avoid commenting on it. But I really think that this is wrong! Because I, among others, would need to have the bad things pointed out on my work in order to improve... otherwise... where would be the point in showing them? Just to read a bunch of "excellent" or "great shot" or whatever without any other comment? But a community is made of people and the behaviour of a community is made by the behaviour of its members! So my suggestion is to change our way of commenting by using all the "tools" we got here from ugly to excellent and by pressing the vote button for the most captivating, original, unique or technically perfect pictures we see around here. That way the top 20 should start to work again. I don't know how many people shall follow my line, but I'm telling you I'm starting right now. ;) Thanks to GiMi53 for putting the issue out. It made me reflect on this point...
My humble opinion....many are Hot...without the Top 20...it reminds Me of "The Old Boyz/Girlz Club"...and those constantly writing vote is simply beyond Me. It is like "Payola" ...or ...I voted for You...now that I state that in Publiiiiiiiiiick...You can *vote for Me ;] As for all the nice Comments...well...try saying something that is not what the Artist wants to hear....You may just pick the "wrong" Artist...an example...I once made a light hearted Comment on someone's "Ant" Macro....only to receive abusive emails, which frankly shocked Me...so...I avoid "Stranger Danger"...and would only be critical (if I was Professional enough to Critique in the first place) to Folk I sort of know. I have seen Members become very upset...and leave the Site due to Critique....and...I often wonder....how many think they are actually in a Position to Critique.....bah,,,I could tell You more about how to Cook an Omelette, than do a good Compo. So...for Me...the Hot20 is not worth even looking at...as it means zilch to Me....and is on about the same level as the Ranking and the vote....salute
Lol - greeaaat! One of my favorite controversial subjects, the Top 20.... he he - every time this comes up I manage to pi... erm, annoy someone..... But not today. Today I merely agree that the very system of Top 20 is open to this happening, and as long as people are consistantly good they will attract a loyal following. One thing I think we excel at in the photography gallery, is when people get inspiration from an artist and post similar style pictures, those followers don't turn on the new pictures as being 'wannabes'. Anyways, rant over, and no matter what the scoring system is or how it works, the same thing happens for good or bad. (",)
i can critique your omelette, Tedz!!!! :) Now THAT i know something about! i am not on the same playing field as the rest of ya'all, so Hot 20 and votes don't matter to me. I guess if i had to describe my photography it would go under the heading "Trying Like Hell to Become a Mediocre Photographer!" Well, my ultimate goal is to become an excellent photographer/artist, but for now, i take baby steps! Doug, i like your philosophy..."don't sweat the small stuff." For me and my life, that's important. Here's a philosphy i like as far as trying to improve myself and in regards to competition: "Don't bother just to be better than your contemporaries or predecessors. Try to be better than yourself." --William Faulkner Anyway, that's why i spend time here in the forum. i want to better myself. I want to improve my skills. I don't need a Hot 20 or votes to tell me if I'm getting better. All i ask is for ya'all to be honest with me when giving me feedback. i really do value that. I can learn from that. I can't learn from a vote or a ranking. For other people though, voting/ranking is important. I'm not trying to take that away from anyone or discount their feelings or opinions. It's just not something that matters to me.
So I go to the Top 20 looking for some nice shots of powerlines and ...........................................................not one there !
Oh well I have your one here top satisfy my needs - nice shot GiMi53
Message edited on: 02/23/2005 13:43
And every one said, 'If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve,---
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!'
Far and few, far and few, Are the lands where the Jumblies
live;
Their heads are green, and their hands are blue, And they went to
sea in a Sieve.
Edward Lear
http://www.nonsenselit.org/Lear/ns/jumblies.html
I'm defiantly with Tedz on the critique thing; whilst I am happy to receive critique (as long as it is constructive) I am wary to say too much unless I have built an understanding with the said artist and know that they are happy to receive my opinion. I am by my nature a tell it how it is guy, that works well in real conversation, but online IMO intentions can get misinterpreted and may be offensive to some people, which is not what I want. For me RR or any other photo art site for that matter is to gain feedback and to share my work and some of my favourite locations form my lovely land that I have made my home. Some of the locals here call me the honouree Scotsman, and that I am proud of.
I pretty much agree with the majority of the sentiments here. I don't really care about getting votes or the ranking my work gets. What I care about are the comments that are left so I know how my image has effected someone. And I am also looking for comments on how to possibly improve an image as well, as long as their are constructive and not just, "This sucks!" ;o) Sure, it feels nice to see someone liked and image enough to V for it, but until that system is somehow overhauled, I'm not going to worry too much about it. I do check the Hot20 to see what work is in there because it really does represent some of Renderosity's best. But as many of you point out, there is a lot of other worthy work in the galleries as well. My hope is that the system will eventually be tweaked so that we get a better cross section of artists and their work, and not just those that are popular--as deserving as their work may be.
I have a gallery on Renderosity because I like the sense of community and friends I have made. I have an outlet to show my photos and get feedback. That's why I am here.
The boss is looking over at me so I better get back to work, just wanted to add my 2.
TwoPynts (Kort)
Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations
I know that, and you know that...but I doubt he'd see it that way. ;^] Thanks. "The rung of a ladder was never meant to rest upon, but only to hold a man's foot long enough to enable him to put the other somewhat higher." -Thomas Henry Huxley, biologist and writer (1825-1995)
Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations
thank you Kort, its a wonderful dedi and you made me very happy. i have deleted the serie because i wanted to have this 4 places in the top 20 for other artists here at RERO t showing there work. maybe i will post a collage with all the images of this serie. you are wonderful friends. i love this RERO family. !!!!!!!! #:O) !!!!!!!!!!! there isnt a best photographer or artist on RERO. i really love to do my images thats all. there is no contest. ************* HUGZ *********************************
Thank YOU Gerhard. It isn't a contest, but there are artist and people of character who do influence me here, and you are certainly among them. :) Looking forward to that collage!
Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations
Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=891824&Start=1&Artist=GiMi53&ByArtist=Yes
"In Life, as in Photography, things look much
brighter, once you remove the lens
cap"
well imo, just reading this through cold...
almost looks like an insult hidden behind a tribute but i understand the complaint...
just seems a bit unnecessary...
if you'll look in the community center & [search] for "hot 20"
you'll find long discussions on the subject...
changes are coming for the hot 20... was just posted there again today... so we can put this behind us & concentrate on making better art & photography
& yes, free speech... yadda, yadda...
certainly not trying to start anything here :]
Message edited on: 02/24/2005 02:43
Wondering what happened, so jumped in.
I agree with most of you!
- Gerhard is a great artist.
- Some members are voting for every "...." (maybe most of them don't know that LOL)
Look around the writer and their names here and now.
Where are the people, which it concerns?
Don't look into the hot 20 box and you will have no probs! ;o)))
Message edited on: 02/24/2005 06:55
I can see a few solutions for all this. I don't think that you should say that this feature (Hot 20) is useless and that we shouldn't care about it. I think this was a great idea but, like any great idea on this web site, it's just misused. The idea to promote a small set of images seems to be pretty good as it helps anybody who needs a source of inspiration or just some examples of "how to manage a beautiful (or creative) picture". In a way, it pushes all of us a bit higher, that's good. The idea to let people decide by themselves which one should be presented also seems excellent. I love this, this is the basis of democracy. The only problem is that the main part of the members just use it as a kind of "convenience" or "politeness" or even worse, as Tedz said, as a way to say "Now you must do the same for me!" This, of course, breaks the complete mechanism which doesn't have any meaning at all today. I think we could change this very very easily: Just one vote per people per day!!! As soon as as you have done your "daily" vote, the label on the button turns to "change my vote: I prefer this image!" (if you want to change your choice) but you cannot have more than one entry per day. This would not solve the "electric lines" trouble but, at least, it would reduce the kind of behaviour we are all complaining about. You could also make a limitation on the number of pictures per author in this list. My opinion is that 1 is quite enough. (I mean one at the same time). You could also imagine a "delay": You cannot be displayed in the Hot20 if you have been there within less than x days! Another suggestion: As this web site is (partly) under the responsability of "moderators" you could give them the ability to fill a list of caracters strings saved in your DB like V, VOTE!, VVV, etc... Perform a string comparison on any comment entry and just cancel the vote if the comment contains one of this strings. That would make this voting system "anonymous", as you wanted it to be, in the beginning. Of course, they would imagine infinite new combinations every day !ETOV, VOOTE, etc... But if the moderators spend just a few seconds every time to append the list, I think we would obtain some good results very quickly. My opinion is that we should keep this feature but it really needs to be improved... This is your work, programmers! As this is also my job, I know that any suggestion I made here can be done very quickly and easily!
First and foremost.. when doing photography.. what l like comes first how l present and the emotions l feel when taking the shot.. and the personal self expression..and setting goals to learn and learn off others.. as call gerhard mr logilogu.. l,ve found him a perfect example of what one can achieve..an inspiration..and the top 20 really is just for fun.. a nice fun element to the whole forum..also found so many marvellous photographers with in renderostiy... genuine people who wish to teach and help others like myself.. gerhard has encouraged along with so many of you...jimry. who grabed hold of my work back in august.. and placed me on the right road taught me pov and dof.. and various other function.. since then so many have encouraged to many to name.. this forum is a family. lets encourage each other and support.. which l know is your main aim gimi.. hugs.. and your telegraph pole is superb... renderosity is one of the best communities on the net.. lets grow together...:) hugs
I Discovered the secret of the sea in mediation upon the dewdrop ... Sand and Foam Gibran
<a href="http://www.soulofharmonyphotographics.org/">Visit My Website</a>
Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=892039&Start=1&Artist=TwoPynts&ByArtist=Yes
Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations
cindy, you said what i didn't have the guts to say. I've been debating all day whether to post this or not. decided what the He_l. i got the feeling that there was a hidden insult behind that tribute. perhaps i am wrong about it, and i very well may be, but nonetheless, that's the impression i got. perhaps i shouldn't say that. i dunno. i'm the kind of person who doesn't like to make waves....doesn't like to rock the boat. but i decided to say what i felt. i also made a decision NOT to vote publically anymore. I vote for images i like and that really impress me. They may not always be the best technically, but if an image really affects me on an emotional level i'll vote for it. i'm tired of it being insinuated that people who vote a lot are just looking for votes in return. so from now on, no one will know what i vote for. And maybe i'm not "discriminating" enough when it comes to voting. oh well. i really don't care. As long as RR has this system of voting, i will continue to vote the way i do. i'm gonna look at the images i wanna look at and vote for the images i wanna vote for. and the comments i leave...i'll say what's in my heart. i hope that suggestions for hot 20 (or possibly hot 40) will be voiced in the community center as Cindy suggests. i think that's where you might have a chance of getting changes to occur. this subject will probably continue to have a lot of controversy around it and be debated. i'm not gonna be a part of these discussions anymore because i just don't find it interesting or worthy of my time. i already spent way too much time and energy involved in this discussion. the rest of ya'all can join together and figure out all this voting and hot 20 crap. personally, i'm perfectly happy here at RR, and i don't care about that stuff. i have nothing more to say on the subject of voting, Hot 20, rankings, etc. i'm tired of the subject. at least I've said my mind and ya'all can discuss it 'till the cows come home. me...i'm gonna just keep workin' on my images and trying to become a better photographer.
I dont think there was anything personal behind GiMI53 post and least of all an hidden insult. Nobody here I think is judging logiloglu's art: we all agree he's one of the best photographers around here. But his works (in the hot 20) were a perfect example to explain the problems connected with this system. In my opinion a hot 40 instead of the hot 20 would not change anything as the ranking system would be exactly the same. None of my picture has ever been in the hot 20 but I've been many times in the "last week in the gallery" thread. Now it comes my question: why do we need such a thread if we can make the top 20 work? I think the point of the hot 20 should be exacly the one of the above mentioned thread... Am I wrong?
no Nasht, you're not wrong... or Pimpotin on making the hot 20 work...
just how many of the gallery members are going to see this, let alone change the way they vote?
my point was... this problem has been discussed to death in other forums & the community center,
the community center is the best place to offer suggestions since it affects ALL of RR, not just the photo gallery
the mods & admin are really going to do something to hopefully fix it
Message edited on: 02/25/2005 09:31
Pim- I have looked at your work- it is quite good. But as artists, aren't we always looking for ways to expand & improve our works? That's what an online community should be. NOT who can get the most "brownie points" by being in the "most popu;ar... er- I mean hot 20." I think some of these people in here should take a look at other galleries (especially "PHOTOSIG"), the vast majority of these would either be ignored or have harsh CRITIQUES written on them. I have started to post more in there. Why? Because I want to improve as a photographer and "cool shot" sometimes doesn't cut it as to what I would do to improve. It's a shame that there are many great artists on here that can get discouraged because of lack of recognition while mediocrity passes them by.
I believe it has been suggested that this be taken to the Community Forum....there You will get a wider Gallery feed back....here...nothing can be done....though they may not tolerate the Masturbation side.....as it is out of context, with the Subject....so....why not take it to where, perhaps there is a Remedy....the Thread has become a farce.
oh Lordy .. just going through e-mails from R.R..how did the discussion develop in to self pleasure..and agree with tedz out of context..plus just noticed lm in the top 20..(( proves miracles can happen)) but promise you typing with both hands..and also to say.. agree with deviousmoose..who cares about the top 20 lifes to short... was always lead to believe the hot top 20 is just a fun element of the forum..now disengaging e-mails from this duscussion as my in box is over loaded.... hugs to all.. nikki nikki
I Discovered the secret of the sea in mediation upon the dewdrop ... Sand and Foam Gibran
<a href="http://www.soulofharmonyphotographics.org/">Visit My Website</a>
It's not that we care so much, but if there is gonna be that feature, why not make it work right? I will again say I think it could be a good tool, instead of having to go through the entire gallery which I unfortunately don't have time to do. I know, I know, we are moving on... ;o)
Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations
Uhmmmmmmmm... I wasnt intending on being freudian when I said "self satisfaction." I was wondering how it got interpreted that way. My meaning of that was actually similar to a self praise, boasting, pride.... etc...... A feeling of grabndeur. I would hope that the majority took it the way I intended.
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This is my entry for the [ Hot-20](http://www.renderosity.com/gallery.ez?Hot=Yes&Sectionid=8&HotHelp=Y) ! ;~)) Please understand me well : Gerhard ([logiloglu](http://www.renderosity.com/homepage.ez?Who=logiloglu) is the best photographer in the gallery, absolutely no doubt about that and Im sure you all will agree ! Im a big fan of Gerhards wonderful postings, enjoy them every day and more than often I vote for his images. But four times the powerlines (although they are all beautiful) dont you think it is too much and kind of depressing for the other superb shots, waiting for your votes? Im definitively not jealous ! Im not posting to receive a ranking (there also people do not discriminate enough Whats wrong to receive a Great or a Good + some hints to improve ? I was so tired to get an Excellent on my postings that now I dont activate the ranking button anymore.) Im just sad for all the artists in this gallery that for sure also deserve a vote Is the Hot-20 a game for some selected people ? Once more, please understand me well just an opinion to improve the community life. Thanks anyway for your friendship and talent ! :~) Ceci est ma proposition pour le [ Hot-20](http://www.renderosity.com/gallery.ez?Hot=Yes&Sectionid=8&HotHelp=Y) ! ;~)) Mais comprenez-moi bien : Gerhard ([logiloglu](http://www.renderosity.com/homepage.ez?Who=logiloglu) est sans contestation le meilleur photographe de cette galerie je suis certain que vous serez tous daccord ! Je suis moi-me lun de ses plus grands admirateurs, ses photos menchantent chaque jour et je vote pour ses images plus souvent qulordinaire Mais 4 fois les lignes ectriques (par ailleurs vraiment superbes) vous ne trouvez pas que cest un peu trop, que cela est drimant pour toutes ces autres magnifiques photos qui attendent aussi votre vote ? Ne croyez pas que je sois jaloux ! (Je ne poste pas pour recevoir une cotation (ici aussi on exage Oest le proble de recevoir un Great ou un Good + des conseils pour samiorer ? Je suis dailleurs tellement fatigude me voir attribuer un Excellent que jai didde ne plus activer cette option) Je suis juste triste pour tous ces artistes qui mitent autant votre vote Est-ce que le Hot-20 est un jeu pour une minorit? Encore une fois, comprenez-moi bien. Jadore Renderosity et cest juste une opinion pour, je lespe, amiorer encore la vie de cette communautQuoi quil en soit, Merci pour votre talent et votre amiti! :~)"In Life, as in Photography, things look much brighter, once you remove the lens cap"