Anna Adult 2005 L3 Stand Alone Deformer Kit By wyrmmaster What is going on here!!! I thought we had a TOS for products, I thought some time ago things were worked out what was and was not acceptable. This surely cant be right. Even in the Requirements: Laura 3 from the Millennium Kids - Young Teens and Young Teens Morph Pack this is a CHILD for gods sake!! Have things like common decency gone out the window? Is this been allowed because they know it might make a buck or two? If your going to have rules then make the rules applicable to everyone, Or is this one rule for some and one rule for everybody else.

i agree 100 % with you!!! If they have rules it should apply to everyone. And yes. I thought the same when I saw the requirements were the mil kids. I was thinking I thought you weren't "allowed" to adultify these.

er.... Now I know nothing about this product. But if it changes the mesh to look adult what is your problem? It's no different than how V3 and The new kid models are built off the same mesh.

Message edited on: 03/11/2005 13:31

ok, ask any merchant what they are allowed to produce. Do you see anything like this for the GIRL here? no, why because she was felt to be underage. Even though she is a 'Toon' therefore she should not be touched with 'embelishments' or certain types of 'Lingerie'. Although you will find a certain merchant doing 'Lingerie' for her, and i know some merchants are not pleased about it. Now if the GIRL is not to be touched because she's 'underage' then what's happening here?? If you want to make an adult character then use Vicky.

"Do you see anything like this for the GIRL here?" Umm, no, because GIRL already has the requisite breast morphs. "therefore she should not be touched with 'embelishments' or certain types of 'Lingerie'" Whatever you do, do not go to Renderotica. (insert evil grin here.) BTW, "GIRL" was never determined by any authority (if there is even such a thing as an authoritative body on mesh maturity determinations) to be "underaged", save by one fellow (nearly a year ago) whom I had to correct on that note. "i know some merchants are not pleased about it." Can't please everybody... :? I'll make it simple: The PT Milgirl and Laura figures have far improved joints and mesh arrangements over their "adult" counterparts. Therefore, it is often easier and more productive to build or buy the morphs required to turn the default mesh into a more adult-proportioned figure. Some of the best artists can do it without the viewer even knowing where the mesh came from. There is also the fact that before Stephanie Petite, there was no relatively easy way of portraying petite women w/o a lot of effort and work, at least compared to simply up-sizing a PT Milgirl (V2) mesh. /P

I just went and looked at the product, and I see nothing amiss. It's just a utility set to modify an existing mesh. You use it on a unimesh to convert it from a young shape to an adult shape. A fairly specialized purpose. To imply anything wrong in this? Once the product is used, it's no longer a "CHILD, for god's sake!" (to quote post one above), it's an adult shaped mesh. If anything it'd make a character less objectionable on the grounds you imply. The product pics don't even show a before-and after shot, so it's not even a particularly suggestive ad. "I was thinking I thought you weren't "allowed" to adultify these." Don't know why you'd think that, but a misconception is scarcely a foundation on which to condemn an overall fairly innocuous product. I agree with Berserga on this.

"With these morphs, Laura could be just a short adult, but she could also turn into an oversexualized child." With the right modelling program, I can turn a spatula into an oversexualized child. (shrug) Just because the possibility is there shouldn't mean that one always assumes bad intent on the part of the maker. Otherwise one would have to walk around assuming that every woman on the planet is a possible prostitute (something I really wouldn't want to do myself...) /P

I think, myself, that it is like taking a photograph of a child and manipulating it to look like an adult.

Kitty If you talk to some of the merchants we know, they will say the same thing... money talks... they are not going to look at a product from one of there top sellers in the same way we are. It was proved a while ago with the offensive nameing of some of his products. Its just not worth it...

Any figure can be turned into virtually anything.

We also have products which do the reverse: I.E. transform V3 into a teenager.

I don't have a problem with this.

As for the Laura model being "controversial" -- I have a suggestion. Why don't we simply make it illegal to produce a 3D mesh in the form of a person under the age of 18 -- any mesh at all?

That should smooth over the issue nicely. Problem solved: no muss, no fuss.

Of course, such a move would put a cramp into the style of people that like to do scenes with children/teens playing, families, etc.......but that's OK.

Poser -- Adults Only. Including the models.

I think its an intersting concept personally. Laura's mesh is nicer to work with than V3 or S3 and she would make a lovely young adult.

1. Laura is a 3d mesh.
2. Laura is based on the DAZ unimesh which has been used to produce the Freak, David, Vicky, Steph etc.
3. This is meerly another adaption of that unimesh.

Would people please get real! This is NOT CHILD ABUSE.
This is a modeller giving you further options for the unimesh system.
When you use any model, unimesh-based or not YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT YOU PRODUCE.
If you produce child porn with Victoria, the Mill Girls or Laura, or any of the morph transfer systems, you are responsible, and not the guy who brings you morphs and magnet systems which allow you to do that.
GROW UP AND TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR OWN ACTIONS!
End of rant.

Surely though if a person brings out a product that enables a character to be morphed into an image which could be classed as child porn is just as much to blame as the person who buys the product. Just my humble opinion and not a rant :O)

I (as most people here with any experience of Poser) can take any mesh and use magnets, scaling and modelling programs to turn that mesh into a child. This system turns a "child mesh" into an adult one, giving a NEW ADULT MESH. Christ, all he has done is give you a new ADULT model. If you have so many proiblems with this go slam DAZ, they created a nude child mesh in the first place. It is up to people how they use and intend to use that mesh. Believe you me CHILD PORNOGRAPHERS are not interested in these magnets!

Oh dear, I see the dead horse has been resurrected. And slightly reincarnated too. (If you don't get it, hop on over to Daz & ask Rortiz ;-) There's a similar product to "adultify" Luke, for the same reasons as with Laura -- the mesh is better than Vicky's or M3's. I've seen some beautiful images of GROWN UPS WHO ARE OBVIOUSLY OVER THE AGE OF CONSENT WHEREVER YOU MAY LIVE made using it. With and without clothes. This does NOT mean the morph set is an instant K*y Pn generator, any more than the knife I buy at Walmart is going to make me a serial killer instead of a turkey carver come next Thanksgiving. Please, please, let the moribund equine rest in peace.

Seems a lot of people are either missing my point or just plain ignoring it 'I thought we had a TOS for products, I thought some time ago things were worked out what was and was not acceptable.' My point.... Normal ranting can now be continued.

Unfortunately child pornography is everywhere. Including in the world of CG art. This is the whole reason why I never post my childrens pics on my website. Because there are people out there who will take advantage of any way or form to make an image where CG or RL into something evil. It's a sick world we live in and the world is full of evil people. The internet just brings them all that lil closer together.

It's unfortunate -- but this subject tends to lead to mass hysteria these days.

If it's "for the children" -- then it's got to be good.

Many, many politicians ram through terrible pieces of legislation by loudly proclaiming that they are doing this "for the children!!!!!!!!"

For a politician, it's as good of an excuse as any. And who would dare to question anything that's good for children? Even if it actually has nothing to do with kids at all............

Like I said earlier -- we should simply make 3D representations of children and teens illegal.

Clearly, that would solve all of the problems.

We are dealing with a mesh and magnets. Where exactly in the TOS does it say that a set of magnets to produce an ADULT model is gainst the TOS. Hey, how about if I produce a set of magnets and morphs to turn the MILL HORSE into a NUDE WOMAN, are you going to get upset and claim that that is BESTIALITY because she has genitals derived from a horse. GET REAL!

Just out of curiosity, I went over to the marketplace and took a look at the product. It's not something that I'll buy. The resulting adult character is much too 'toon-like to fit my taste. I don't like 'toons. But, based upon the previews, I'd say that she looks very much the young adult. I'd guess early 20's. Hardly a child.

Ok Let me explain my angle on this, there is a product by Netherworks called Teen eXpansion for Laura this produces an older character. I have no problem with this at all, Ive even got it and its a very good product. This one however I feel oversteps anything some people would call decent or acceptable.

If the TOS aim is to stop products that could be used to create CHILD PORN, Renderosity should BAN all Laura-related products, because ALL of them can be used and adapted in the production of child porn. And add all GIRL products, most of the characters and mophs for Victoria and Steph, any of the "shaven pubic" texture maps and a hell of a lot more.

Message edited on: 03/11/2005 16:10

this thread is making my head spin. Laura is a mesh, not a real girl. There is no TOS dealing with turning a childlike 3d model into a more mature looking 3d model, or against the converse. There are real things one can worry about in today's world. For pity's sake, if morphing a 3d model can get your blood pressure up, what does the evening news do?

Look......

Trying to anticipate every potential misuse of something that people can conceivably misuse.....leads to a conclusion of shutting down everything in order to prevent the possibility of some things.

People that are determined to misuse any given software tool aren't going to be stopped from doing evil things merely by forbidding the sale of the software tool to everybody else -------

Doing so would be another example of the "DO SOMETHING!" disease that so many people have these days.

Just do something -- anything -- and then we can all feel good that we've "done something".

Sorry....but such ultimately empty gestures accomplish nothing at all towards solving any problems in the real world. And they restrict others from doing perfectly legitmate work in the process.

And one more thought, I think Blackhearted, and many more, are going to be extreemly annoyed with you! NIA et al!

Message edited on: 03/11/2005 16:13

Are you saying it's okay for netherworks to make Laura's boobs larger, but It's not ok for wyrmmaster to do the same thing? Why the double standard?

Ahh but the point is being totally missed. If I had attempted to release this product (or 99% of the merchants here for that matter) it'd of been shot down faster than the speed of light. I know for a fact that another merchant has a pack coming out that is based on the Laura mesh, looks adult, but because it's based on the Laura mesh promos had to adhere to the "no child nudity" rule. Money talks, us merchants know that. Make r'osity lots of money and you can release whatever in the hell ya want. It doesn't affect me one way or the other but this appears highly hypocritical to me ~shrug~ Not even going into the child pornography thing cuz it is polygons and pixels. I do believe David's complaint is more with the uneven application of the rules depending upon how much money you make the 'sity.

" This one however I feel oversteps anything some people would call decent or acceptable."

Far too many folks out there deciding for me what is "decent and acceptible". This isn't afghanistan you know. -_- Viva la boobies!

Message edited on: 03/11/2005 16:17

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=402865&Start=1&Artist=Penguinisto&ByArtist=Yes

Make r'osity lots of money and you can release whatever in the hell ya want If that's the case, then why have they stopped selling the bondage sets that were offered here until a few months ago? Those items were among some of the top sellers in the marketplace.

There's still plenty in the marketplace ;)

Thanks for the link, Peng. Nice character.

"I do believe David's complaint is more with the uneven application of the rules depending upon how much money you make the 'sity." For the same token, Renderosity should remove all products for "the Girl", just in case such controversies arise, don't you think? Why just ban products for Laura, why not the GIRL? I believe the crack down on faeries images have already begun. I can smell and hear the four horsemen... The end is near...

Well if there are double standards operating at Rendo, good luck to wyrmmaster for smashing the mould.

Message edited on: 03/11/2005 16:25

Storm 'I think Blackhearted is going to be extreemly annoyed with you' I actually know him well :) JVRenderer ' Are you saying it's okay for netherworks to make Laura's boobs larger, but It's not ok for wyrmmaster to do the same thing?' you didn't read my post well 'This one however I feel oversteps anything some people would call decent or acceptable.' if you think producing something that looks like the airbags have gone off in your car and bares no relation to real life is fine........

"I can smell and hear the four horsemen... The end is near..." Yep, and they're all riding on skeletal nags, too.^^ ;-)

So, would this mean we need to ban Morph Manager? I mean Gee, I can transfer all of V3 morphs to Laura, I can do the same with V2 over to Mil PT. Most of the fairies you see here have some of the adult morphs transfered to other mesh. You know, not all of us need big breasted women. I find it easier to morph Laura to a young adult than down sizing V3 to look like one.

"Storm 'I think Blackhearted is going to be extreemly annoyed with you' I actually know him well :)" Well than David you will be familiar with his products for the PT girl and understand what I am saying because, by the same token, you are attacking his products. "This one however I feel oversteps anything some people would call decent or acceptable." So it is OK for Backhearted to turn the PT girl into a sexy miniscule vamp and not OK for wyrmmaster to produce magnets that MIGHT allow you to do the same with Laura?

JVRenderer For the same token, Renderosity should remove all products for "the Girl", just in case such controversies arise, don't you think? Why just ban products for Laura, why not the GIRL? Take a look at PoserPros sometime, you will find there are a lot of things there that were here for the GIRL. Why are they there? because the violated the TOS when they altered them for the merchants some time ago. But it seems perfectly ok for some merchants why? because they make money so Rendo turns a blind eye.

"...if you think producing something that looks like the airbags have gone off in your car and bares no relation to real life is fine..." So Neftoon and HER are evil now too? Cripes, we're rapidly running out of acceptable mesh here, y'know? /P

Look, David_Amos, I don't have Laura, and I don't intend to buy Laura. You, however, own Laura and even Netherworks' Teen Xpansion pack. You even claim Netherwork's pack is a very good product on thread 23. I won't question you what you use them for. You are the one kicking and screaming that Wyrmmaster has overstepped your versions of 'decency'. What point did I missed here, tell me. JV

" because the violated the TOS..." yes and no. The TOS was altered allegedly because of PayPal concerns about erotic-looking clothing and products. There isn't all that much erotic about airbag titties, yo? /P

The abuse of children is wrong and evil. And all images that portray the abuse of children are wrong and evil.

Anyone disagree in here with those statements.......? Show of hands.......? No one disagrees..........?

What about making an image that features a character with a large chest that looks to be 22-23 years old? Got a problem with that...........?

I don't. Except to say that if it's a 'toon, then I'll ignore it.

Penguinisto So Neftoon and HER are evil now too? Ok show me exactly where i said this was evil? i've not mentioned that at all, from my first post 'Have things like common decency gone out the window?' that and the double standards when it comes to the way some merchants are treated it what i'm on about. So come on! tell me where i've said any of this is evil!

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone...

thwack oops. Sorry, it slipped.

holy right wing conservatism... can we back up about 5 years, please ? ART ART...ARTISTS...CREATIVENESS...OPEN MINDED

::munch::munch:: Popcorn, anyone?

Byrdie " ::munch::munch:: Popcorn, anyone?" Got any Coke going with it?

Nah, Pepsi's better. Diet of course, got enough calories from the hot butter, I don't need any more from all that sugar.